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         14
      Closed Communion
      James Foley
       
      I Corinthians 11:17-34: "Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse. For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it. For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you. When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's Supper. For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken. What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not. For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread: And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me. After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me. For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do show the Lord's death till he come. Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep. For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged. But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world. Wherefore, my brethren, when ye come together to eat, tarry one for another. And if any man hunger, let him eat at home; that ye come not together unto condemnation. And the rest will I set in order when I come."

      INTRODUCTION

      Historic Baptists, true Baptists, have believed in and still believe in closed communion. Baptists impose upon themselves the same restrictions that they impose on others concerning the Lord’s Supper. Baptists have always insisted that it is the Lord’s Table, not theirs; and He alone has the right to say who shall sit at His table. No amount of so called brotherly love, or ecumenical spirit, should cause us to invite to His table those who have not complied with the requirements laid down plainly in His inspired Word. With respect to Bible doctrines we must always use the scripture as our guide and practice. For Baptists, two of the most important doctrines are Baptism and The Lord’s Supper. These are the only two doctrines we recognize as Church Ordinances. The Bible is very clear in teaching how these doctrines are to be practiced and by whom.

      We only have two ordinances that we must never compromise or we risk our very existence, they are Baptism and The Lord’s Supper.

      The moment we deviate from the precise method God has prescribed we have started down the slippery slope of error. True Baptists have held fast to the original doctrine of The Lord’s Supper from the time of Christ and the Apostles.

      Unfortunately, in this day of what the Bible describes as the age of luke warmness, Baptists are becoming careless in regard to strictly following the pattern laid out for us in Scripture. Many of our Bible colleges are graduating otherwise sincere, Godly and dedicated pastors and teachers who have not been taught the very strict, biblical requirements that surround the Lord’s Supper. Any Bible college that neglects to teach its students the differences surrounding Closed Communion, Close Communion and Open Communion is not simply short changing its students; it is also not equipping their students to carry on sound Bible traditions. The result is men of God and churches that fall into error. And as we will see, this is serious error.

      Should we as Baptists ignore the restrictions made by our Lord and Master? NO! When we hold to the restrictions placed upon the Lord’s Supper by our Master, we are defending the "faith which was once delivered to the saints" Jude 3.

      The Lord’s Supper is rigidly restricted and I will show this in the following facts:

      IT IS RESTRICTED AS TO PLACE

      A. I Corinthians 11:18 says, "When ye come together in the church." This does not mean the church building; they had none. In other words, when the church assembles. The supper is to be observed by the church, in church capacity. Again this does not mean the church house. Ekklesia, the Greek word for church, means assembly. "When ye come together in the church," is when the church assembles.

      B. When we say church we mean an assembly of properly baptized believers. Acts 2:41-42: "Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers."

      The church is made up of saved people who are baptized by immersion. In the Bible, belief precedes baptism. That’s the Bible way.

      Acts 8:12-13, "But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women. Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done."

      When we say properly baptized, we mean immersed. No unbeliever should take the Lord’s supper, and no non-immersed believer should take the supper. Those who are sprinkled are not baptized and cannot receive the supper. The Greek word for baptize is baptizo, and it always means to immerse.

      "In every case where communion is referred to, or where it may possibly have been administered, the believers had been baptized Acts 2:42; 8:12; 8:38; 10:47; 6:14-15; 18:8; 20:7. Baptism comes before communion, just as repentance and faith precede baptism".

      C. The Lord’s Supper is for baptized believers in church capacity: "When ye come together in the church," again not a building, but the assembly of the properly baptized believers.

      D. The fact that the Lord’s Supper is a church ordinance, to be observed in church capacity, is pointed out by the fact that it is for those who have been immersed and added to the fellowship of the church.

      E. The Lord’s Supper is never spoken of in connection with individuals. When it is referred to, it is only referred to in reference to baptized believers in local church capacity I Cor. 11:20-26).

      I want to quote Dr. W.W. Hamilton,

      "The individual administration of the ordinance has no Bible warrant and is a relic of Romanism. The Lord’s Supper is a church ordinance, and anything which goes beyond or comes short of this fails for want of scriptural example or command".

      “The practice of taking a little communion kit to hospitals, nursing homes, etc. is unscriptural and does not follow the scriptural example.”

      IT IS RESTRICTED TO A UNITED CHURCH

      A. The Bible in I Cor. 11:18 is very strong in condemning divisions around the Lord’s table. For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
      19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
      20 When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's supper.

      There were no less than four divisions in the Corinthian church.
      I Cor. 1:12: "Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ."

      Because of these divisions, it was impossible for them to scripturally eat the Lord’s Supper. Division in the local church is reason to hold off observing the Lord’s Supper. But there are also other reasons to forego taking the Lord’s Supper. If there is gross sin in the membership we do not take it. Here is scriptural evidence for this: 1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our Passover is sacrificed for us:
      8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. 9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
      10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. 11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

      B. At this point, I want to ask these questions: Are there not doctrinal divisions among the many denominations? Is it not our doctrinal differences that cause us to be separate religious bodies?

      IT IS RESTRICTED BY DOCTRINE

      A. Those in the early church at Jerusalem who partook "continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine" Acts 2:42. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

      B. Those that do not hold to apostolic truth are not to partake. This means there is to be discipline in the local body. How can you discipline those who do not belong to the local body? You can’t. The clear command of scripture is to withdraw fellowship from those who are not doctrinally sound.

      II Thes 3:6: "Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us."
      Rom. 16:17: "Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them."
      To commune together means to have the same doctrine.
      II Thes. 2:15: "Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle."
      II John 10-11: "If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."

      C. Some Baptists in our day have watered down this doctrine by practicing what they call “Close Communion.” By this they mean that they believe that members of another Baptist church may take communion with us because they are of the same beliefs. Once again, this is unscriptural.

      The welcome to the Lord's Table should not be extended beyond the discipline of the local church. When we take the Lord’s Supper there is supposed to be no gross sin among us and no divisions among us. We have no idea of the spiritual condition of another church’s members. If there is sin or division in the case of this other church’s members, we have no way of knowing it. We cannot discipline them because they are not members of our church. This is why we practice “Closed” communion, meaning it is restricted solely to our church membership. 
      So then, in closing I would like to reiterate the three different ideas concerning the Lord’s Supper and who is to take it. 
      Closed Communion = Only members of a single local church. 
      Close Communion = Members of like faith and order may partake. 
      Open Communion = If you claim to be a Christian, or simply attending the service, you may partake. 
      It is no small thing to attempt to change that which was implemented by our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. 
      Mt. 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. 
      Many of our Baptist churches have a real need to consider the gravity of the act of observing The Lord’s Supper. It is not a light thing that is to be taken casually or without regard to the spiritual condition of ourselves or our church.
      1Co. 11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.

       28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.

       29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

       30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

The Cross And How Jews Perceive It: Sharing Messiah With The Jewish People


LindaR

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​You are using a bit of creative license with this thinking.

​No, it's called applying context to what's written. The context isn't referring to Old Testament prophets; it's referring to those who were alive at the time of the writing of Ephesians...hence the "now" in Ephesians 3:5.

​Actually: 

 
Matthew 2:23 Read whole chapterSee verse in context
And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene.
Matthew 5:12 Read whole chapterSee verse in context
Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.
Matthew 5:17 Read whole chapterSee verse in context
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Matthew 7:12 Read whole chapterSee verse in context
Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.
Matthew 11:13 Read whole chapterSee verse in context
For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
Matthew 16:14 Read whole chapterSee verse in context
And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets.
Matthew 22:40 Read whole chapterSee verse in context
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

​Don't read this as though I'm being sarcastic, because I'm not. Can you not see the context of those verses? Do you not see how often "the law" is also mentioned in those verses? Is "the law" also part of the church?

The prophets AND the law foretold and pointed to Christ. Christ fulfilled (and will fulfill) what was foretold. While I believe beyond any doubt that God's true prophets were saved, there is nothing in the verses that you've given above or any other scripture that I've seen indicating that the Old Testament prophets were part of the church. The church was future according to the Lord Jesus Christ's own words. 

Look at the order...

Ephesians 2:20
And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

  1. Jesus Christ - the chief cornerstone...it began with him, and without him, it wouldn't exist.
  2. apostles - mentioned before prophets. 
  3. prophets - mentioned after apostles.

If we're talking about a foundation, a literal foundation has to be laid correctly. You can't put a part of a literal foundation in the wrong order or the foundation will fail...as will the building it supports. Christ is the most important part...the chief cornerstone. That's where a literal foundation starts too...at the cornerstone.

If I dig a footing...lay a cornerstone...then begin to build the rest of the foundation...

I can't put the mortar before the block...or the rebar before the block...or the block first, then cover it with mortar, then lay rebar on top of that...no, I have to follow an order to have a firm foundation.

In our scriptural foundation, Christ is the most important part...the chief cornerstone. Next mentioned is the apostles...THEN prophets are mentioned. The Old Testament prophets came BEFORE the apostles, yet prophets are mentioned after the apostles in the foundation. That's because the context of being built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets are referring to prophets alive at the time of Paul's writing...not Old Testament prophets.

Ephesians 3:5
Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

 

 

 

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The prophets AND the law foretold and pointed to Christ. Christ fulfilled (and will fulfill) what was foretold. While I believe beyond any doubt that God's true prophets were saved, there is nothing in the verses that you've given above or any other scripture that I've seen indicating that the Old Testament prophets were part of the church. The church was future according to the Lord Jesus Christ's own words. [in this discussion I am not saying they are.] 

Look at the order...

Ephesians 2:20
And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; [yes! look at the order.]

  1. Jesus Christ - the chief cornerstone...it began with him, and without him, it wouldn't exist.
  2. apostles - mentioned before prophets. 
  3. prophets - mentioned after apostles.

If we're talking about a foundation, a literal foundation has to be laid correctly. You can't put a part of a literal foundation in the wrong order or the foundation will fail...as will the building it supports. Christ is the most important part...the chief cornerstone.[which goes on top of the foundation.] That's where a literal foundation starts too...at the cornerstone.

[I was a carpenter for 25 years, so I know a bit about laying block for a structure (cornerstone) to be built upon a foundation.]

If I dig a footing...lay a cornerstone...then begin to build the rest of the foundation...[your footer is the foundation for the cornerstone.]

I can't put the mortar before the block...or the rebar before the block...or the block first, then cover it with mortar, then lay rebar on top of that...no, I have to follow an order to have a firm foundation. [exactly!]

​Um, the cornerstone is usually set on something we would call the foundation. Some a footer. The building aspect of your thoughtline is not correct.

Now the verse saying that Christ is the foundation is a good one to use, but a cornerstone was placed on something. The Law was our school master till Christ came, hence the foundation. 

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​Um, the cornerstone is usually set on something we would call the foundation. Some a footer. The building aspect of your thoughtline is not correct.

Now the verse saying that Christ is the foundation is a good one to use, but a cornerstone was placed on something. The Law was our school master till Christ came, hence the foundation. 

​Okay...

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[I was a carpenter for 25 years, so I know a bit about laying block for a structure (cornerstone) to be built upon a foundation.]

​...you might want to investigate what a cornerstone was (and its place in a foundation) in biblical times.

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Where I am we don't use any cornerstone, except in a ceremonial sense.

Our "cornerstones" are often around eye level, well above the "foundation" and several courses up in the wall.

 

Just because you don't understand what a biblical cornerstone is doesn't negate the truth.

Biblically, the foundation is based off the cornerstone and the whole building - beginning with the foundation - is referenced to that point. 

The cornerstone is the first thing placed, in a biblical sense.

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The foundation is the corner stone, they didn't have concrete. Concrete is man-made corner stone. When you build the forms for the concrete it must be started at the corners so the foundation is square. 

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​...you might want to investigate what a cornerstone was (and its place in a foundation) in biblical times.

​How about the Lord himself? Matthew 7 says -

24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.

26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.

 

You will notice that a building of any sort has a foundation, the same now as in the 'Bible times'. 

The scriptures are 'for' our day, and have nothing 'outdated' in them that can't be seen.

How do you think we 'got the idea' of how to build a proper 'building'?

Experience - from a thousand generations. [And that happens to go way back in 'bible times'.]

 

A house, for example, does have a 'cornerstone'. The first block laid to start the base of our structure

commonly called a foundation. But that base needs to be placed upon something 'stable' to ensure

that the structure placed upon the base will stand the 'test of time' and endure 'to the end'.

 

The house includes the 'cornerstone', and the firm 'rock' that it is placed upon confirms that stableness.

If you build a 'foundation' upon sand, there is no way it will stand.

 

Looking at the Lord's words here you will also observe that he said his words are what make that foundation the 'rock'.

 

"whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them - built his house upon a rock"

"every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not - built his house upon the sand"

 

 

And I believe the scriptures clearly teach that the O.T. books are the foundation to which God himself placed

the 'cornerstone' of the Christ of God, Jesus, the Son of God, and our Savior.

 

15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?

16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.

17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

 

If the Lord Jesus did not fulfill all that the scriptures said of him, he would not be the 'rock'.

The 'cornerstone' needed to be placed upon the foundation of the 'prophets' and what they said about the coming Messiah.

 

Examples?

 

                Matthew 1:22 Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,

 
        Matthew 2:15 
And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son.
        Matthew 2:17 
Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet, saying,
        Matthew 2:23
And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene.
        Matthew 4:14 
That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying,
        Matthew 5:18 
For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
        Matthew 8:17 
That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, Himself took our infirmities, and bare our sicknesses.
        Matthew 12:17 
That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying,
        Matthew 13:14 
And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
 
Matthew 13:35
That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world.
Matthew 21:4 All this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying,
        Matthew 24:34 
Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
        Matthew 26:54
But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be?
        Matthew 26:56
But all this was done, that the scriptures of the prophets might be fulfilled. Then all the disciples forsook him, and fled.
        Matthew 27:9 
Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet, saying, And they took the thirty pieces of silver, the price of him that was valued, whom they of the children of Israel did value;
        Matthew 27:35 
And they crucified him, and parted his garments, casting lots: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, They parted my garments among them, and upon my vesture did they cast lots.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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The foundation is the corner stone, they didn't have concrete. Concrete is man-made corner stone. When you build the forms for the concrete it must be started at the corners so the foundation is square. 

​No.

The block/cornerstone was to be squared, not the footer/concrete it was placed upon,

or as the scriptures teach, the 'rock'. (see above post, where the Lord says a wise man builds his house upon.)

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Okay...but you're missing out on a lot of things by not seeing how things were done during the time when the Bible was written...aka - Bible times. Some things were done much differently (back in Bible times), and without knowing or understanding that, one will miss a deeper meaning or truth. Same as with some of the wording in the Bible...if you apply modern-day meanings to them, you get the wrong meaning and message. 

Bible times, Bible times, Bible times...

​Looking at the Lord's words here you will also observe that he said his words are what make that foundation the 'rock'.

"whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them - built his house upon a rock"

"every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not - built his house upon the sand"

​No...that's not what the Lord Jesus Christ said. You left out parts of those verses.

Matthew 7:24 and 26
24   Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

26   And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

 

The Lord is comparing those who hear and obey (his sayings) to a wise man who builds his house upon a rock...and a foolish man who builds a house upon the sand. That says nothing of what you stated that it says.

Both the wise and the foolish men heard his sayings...

...the difference is that the wise heard AND obeyed; the foolish heard but DIDN'T obey. He's not saying that his words are the foundation or the rock...he's saying that a man who hears and obeys his sayings is wise and, that man (not Christ's sayings) is LIKE a man who builds upon a rock.

Bible times, Bible times, Bible times...

 

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Okay...but you're missing out on a lot of things by not seeing how things were done during the time when the Bible was written...aka - Bible times. Some things were done much differently (back in Bible times), and without knowing or understanding that, one will miss a deeper meaning or truth. Same as with some of the wording in the Bible...if you apply modern-day meanings to them, you get the wrong meaning and message. 

Bible times, Bible times, Bible times...

​No...that's not what the Lord Jesus Christ said. You left out parts of those verses.

Matthew 7:24 and 26
24   Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

26   And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

 

The Lord is comparing those who hear and obey (his sayings) to a wise man who builds his house upon a rock...and a foolish man who builds a house upon the sand. That says nothing of what you stated that it says.

Both the wise and the foolish men heard his sayings...

...the difference is that the wise heard AND obeyed; the foolish heard but DIDN'T obey. He's not saying that his words are the foundation or the rock...he's saying that a man who hears and obeys his sayings is wise and, that man (not Christ's sayings) is LIKE a man who builds upon a rock.

Bible times, Bible times, Bible times...

 

​You obviously are not seeing what I say, or mean. I know what he is referring to. I was just pointing out he used a proper mode of building in his teaching that was commonly known IN biblical times.

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​No...that's not what the Lord Jesus Christ said. You left out parts of those verses.

​I think you should reread this part. As the verses are complete above where you are quoting, and it is obvious what I was doing.

I was just picking out the important parts of the verses that I wanted you to see as a comparison. Surely you see that.

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Okay...but you're missing out on a lot of things by not seeing how things were done during the time when the Bible was written...aka - Bible times. Some things were done much differently (back in Bible times), and without knowing or understanding that, one will miss a deeper meaning or truth. Same as with some of the wording in the Bible...if you apply modern-day meanings to them, you get the wrong meaning and message. 

​Uh, could you be a bit more clear on what you mean?

I just showed you where the Lord used a commonly known way of building a structure in his example of believers versus non-believers in Matthew 7.

How much more info do you need?

Do you have a verse or verses that explain the Bible times way of building?

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​I think you should reread this part. As the verses are complete above where you are quoting, and it is obvious what I was doing.

I was just picking out the important parts of the verses that I wanted you to see as a comparison. Surely you see that.

​In humble honesty...no sir, I don't see that. When I read what you said...in the words that you said, what was obvious to me was obviously something different than what was obvious to you.

We are going around and around here, so this will be my final reply. As you believe that what you said was obvious, I believe the following is obvious.

1. The church was future according to the Lord Jesus Christ's own words...

Matthew 16:18
And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

2. The church was built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets...

Ephesians 2:20
And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

3. Those prophets were not the Old Testament prophets...

Ephesians 3:5
Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

4. The early church was given those prophets by the Holy Spirit; being a prophet was a gift of the Holy Spirit.

1 Corinthians 12:28
And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.

Ephesians 4:11
And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

See...there are the apostles AND prophets...the first two listed, and they are the foundation upon which the church was built.

5. The fact that the early church had prophets is evidenced by...

  • Acts 11:27-30
  • Acts 13:1-3
  • Acts 15:32

 

 

 

 

 

 

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​In humble honesty...no sir, I don't see that. When I read what you said...in the words that you said, what was obvious to me was obviously something different than what was obvious to you.

​So, um, you don't have verses to show proper Bible times building instructions?

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1 Kings 7:9 All these were of costly stones, according to the measures of hewed stones, sawed with saws, within and without, even from the foundation unto the coping, and so on the outside toward the great court.
10 And the foundation was of costly stones, even great stones, stones of ten cubits, and stones of eight cubits.

They didn't use a footer. 

In modern times the concrete footer must be square when its poured or the blocks will not have a proper foundation. If you have a footer that is 99' across at one end and 100' across at the other then the blocks will be hanging off the footer on the short end. And when the inspector arrives it will all get torn down and repoured. 

I hope this helps and doesn't cause more confusion. 

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

1 Kings 7:9 All these were of costly stones, according to the measures of hewed stones, sawed with saws, within and without, even from the foundation unto the coping, and so on the outside toward the great court.
10 And the foundation was of costly stones, even great stones, stones of ten cubits, and stones of eight cubits.

They didn't use a footer. 

In modern times the concrete footer must be square when its poured or the blocks will not have a proper foundation. If you have a footer that is 99' across at one end and 100' across at the other then the blocks will be hanging off the footer on the short end. And when the inspector arrives it will all get torn down and repoured. 

I hope this helps and doesn't cause more confusion. 

​And they put those stones on what?

Rock. (we make our own, called footers.)

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