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         33
      Closed Communion
      James Foley
       
      I Corinthians 11:17-34: "Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse. For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it. For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you. When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's Supper. For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken. What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not. For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread: And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me. After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me. For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do show the Lord's death till he come. Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep. For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged. But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world. Wherefore, my brethren, when ye come together to eat, tarry one for another. And if any man hunger, let him eat at home; that ye come not together unto condemnation. And the rest will I set in order when I come."

      INTRODUCTION

      Historic Baptists, true Baptists, have believed in and still believe in closed communion. Baptists impose upon themselves the same restrictions that they impose on others concerning the Lord’s Supper. Baptists have always insisted that it is the Lord’s Table, not theirs; and He alone has the right to say who shall sit at His table. No amount of so called brotherly love, or ecumenical spirit, should cause us to invite to His table those who have not complied with the requirements laid down plainly in His inspired Word. With respect to Bible doctrines we must always use the scripture as our guide and practice. For Baptists, two of the most important doctrines are Baptism and The Lord’s Supper. These are the only two doctrines we recognize as Church Ordinances. The Bible is very clear in teaching how these doctrines are to be practiced and by whom.

      We only have two ordinances that we must never compromise or we risk our very existence, they are Baptism and The Lord’s Supper.

      The moment we deviate from the precise method God has prescribed we have started down the slippery slope of error. True Baptists have held fast to the original doctrine of The Lord’s Supper from the time of Christ and the Apostles.

      Unfortunately, in this day of what the Bible describes as the age of luke warmness, Baptists are becoming careless in regard to strictly following the pattern laid out for us in Scripture. Many of our Bible colleges are graduating otherwise sincere, Godly and dedicated pastors and teachers who have not been taught the very strict, biblical requirements that surround the Lord’s Supper. Any Bible college that neglects to teach its students the differences surrounding Closed Communion, Close Communion and Open Communion is not simply short changing its students; it is also not equipping their students to carry on sound Bible traditions. The result is men of God and churches that fall into error. And as we will see, this is serious error.

      Should we as Baptists ignore the restrictions made by our Lord and Master? NO! When we hold to the restrictions placed upon the Lord’s Supper by our Master, we are defending the "faith which was once delivered to the saints" Jude 3.

      The Lord’s Supper is rigidly restricted and I will show this in the following facts:

      IT IS RESTRICTED AS TO PLACE

      A. I Corinthians 11:18 says, "When ye come together in the church." This does not mean the church building; they had none. In other words, when the church assembles. The supper is to be observed by the church, in church capacity. Again this does not mean the church house. Ekklesia, the Greek word for church, means assembly. "When ye come together in the church," is when the church assembles.

      B. When we say church we mean an assembly of properly baptized believers. Acts 2:41-42: "Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers."

      The church is made up of saved people who are baptized by immersion. In the Bible, belief precedes baptism. That’s the Bible way.

      Acts 8:12-13, "But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women. Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done."

      When we say properly baptized, we mean immersed. No unbeliever should take the Lord’s supper, and no non-immersed believer should take the supper. Those who are sprinkled are not baptized and cannot receive the supper. The Greek word for baptize is baptizo, and it always means to immerse.

      "In every case where communion is referred to, or where it may possibly have been administered, the believers had been baptized Acts 2:42; 8:12; 8:38; 10:47; 6:14-15; 18:8; 20:7. Baptism comes before communion, just as repentance and faith precede baptism".

      C. The Lord’s Supper is for baptized believers in church capacity: "When ye come together in the church," again not a building, but the assembly of the properly baptized believers.

      D. The fact that the Lord’s Supper is a church ordinance, to be observed in church capacity, is pointed out by the fact that it is for those who have been immersed and added to the fellowship of the church.

      E. The Lord’s Supper is never spoken of in connection with individuals. When it is referred to, it is only referred to in reference to baptized believers in local church capacity I Cor. 11:20-26).

      I want to quote Dr. W.W. Hamilton,

      "The individual administration of the ordinance has no Bible warrant and is a relic of Romanism. The Lord’s Supper is a church ordinance, and anything which goes beyond or comes short of this fails for want of scriptural example or command".

      “The practice of taking a little communion kit to hospitals, nursing homes, etc. is unscriptural and does not follow the scriptural example.”

      IT IS RESTRICTED TO A UNITED CHURCH

      A. The Bible in I Cor. 11:18 is very strong in condemning divisions around the Lord’s table. For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
      19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
      20 When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's supper.

      There were no less than four divisions in the Corinthian church.
      I Cor. 1:12: "Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ."

      Because of these divisions, it was impossible for them to scripturally eat the Lord’s Supper. Division in the local church is reason to hold off observing the Lord’s Supper. But there are also other reasons to forego taking the Lord’s Supper. If there is gross sin in the membership we do not take it. Here is scriptural evidence for this: 1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our Passover is sacrificed for us:
      8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. 9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
      10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. 11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

      B. At this point, I want to ask these questions: Are there not doctrinal divisions among the many denominations? Is it not our doctrinal differences that cause us to be separate religious bodies?

      IT IS RESTRICTED BY DOCTRINE

      A. Those in the early church at Jerusalem who partook "continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine" Acts 2:42. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

      B. Those that do not hold to apostolic truth are not to partake. This means there is to be discipline in the local body. How can you discipline those who do not belong to the local body? You can’t. The clear command of scripture is to withdraw fellowship from those who are not doctrinally sound.

      II Thes 3:6: "Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us."
      Rom. 16:17: "Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them."
      To commune together means to have the same doctrine.
      II Thes. 2:15: "Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle."
      II John 10-11: "If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."

      C. Some Baptists in our day have watered down this doctrine by practicing what they call “Close Communion.” By this they mean that they believe that members of another Baptist church may take communion with us because they are of the same beliefs. Once again, this is unscriptural.

      The welcome to the Lord's Table should not be extended beyond the discipline of the local church. When we take the Lord’s Supper there is supposed to be no gross sin among us and no divisions among us. We have no idea of the spiritual condition of another church’s members. If there is sin or division in the case of this other church’s members, we have no way of knowing it. We cannot discipline them because they are not members of our church. This is why we practice “Closed” communion, meaning it is restricted solely to our church membership. 
      So then, in closing I would like to reiterate the three different ideas concerning the Lord’s Supper and who is to take it. 
      Closed Communion = Only members of a single local church. 
      Close Communion = Members of like faith and order may partake. 
      Open Communion = If you claim to be a Christian, or simply attending the service, you may partake. 
      It is no small thing to attempt to change that which was implemented by our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. 
      Mt. 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. 
      Many of our Baptist churches have a real need to consider the gravity of the act of observing The Lord’s Supper. It is not a light thing that is to be taken casually or without regard to the spiritual condition of ourselves or our church.
      1Co. 11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.

       28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.

       29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

       30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

When Is A Non-Baptist A Baptist?


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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I always find it funny when someone who is not a Baptist says they are just the same as a Baptist.
It seems that lots of people think they are just like a Baptist but not many Baptists would agree with them.

I have had many people over the years say they are just the same, but a bit of talking shows they are not Baptist on many things.

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I guess you'd need to define what you mean by Baptist. I figure if someone holds to Baptistic beliefs, then they're a Baptist. Whether or not they're an IFB is another question entirely. There're certainly tons of people that go to 'Baptist' churches that we would disagree with on a lot of issues - but they would still count themselves as baptists, and they may well be so.

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I'm pretty dogmatic about this subject, prOBably bordering on unbending.

 

To me if someone is not willing to take the name Baptist, they are not a Baptist. They can say they are the same all they want, but part of being a Baptist is a willingness and even eagerness to identify with the church that Jesus built.

 

Now some may say that Baptists have not always been called by this name, and they would be correct. But for us today Baptist denotes not only a specific system of belief, but also identifies us as the true churches that have existed since the time of Christ and the Apostles.

 

Some have called me narrow minded for this stance, but that's ok because "narrow is the way."

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Jesus built the Baptist Church?

Can't find that in the Bible.

Jesus' never attached a denominational name on His Church.

 

If He didn't build it then you better find another church!!!!

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I'm pretty dogmatic about this subject, prOBably bordering on unbending.

 

To me if someone is not willing to take the name Baptist, they are not a Baptist. They can say they are the same all they want, but part of being a Baptist is a willingness and even eagerness to identify with the church that Jesus built.

 

Now some may say that Baptists have not always been called by this name, and they would be correct. But for us today Baptist denotes not only a specific system of belief, but also identifies us as the true churches that have existed since the time of Christ and the Apostles.

 

Some have called me narrow minded for this stance, but that's ok because "narrow is the way."

So you are saying that only churches today that have the name Baptist in it are the only true churches? How about other countries where the naming of churches may be different? The church of christ claims that for a church to be true, it cannot have a certain name in it, it has to be in the Bible, are you going along that line of reasoning?

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So you are saying that only churches today that have the name Baptist in it are the only true churches? How about other countries where the naming of churches may be different? The church of christ claims that for a church to be true, it cannot have a certain name in it, it has to be in the Bible, are you going along that line of reasoning?

Brider doctrine.  Their Church claims to be the Bride of Christ, while others are just guests.  LOL

Thought... John was a Baptist.  From what I see in Scripture, John didn't point to his own religion... he pointed to Christ.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I will recommend a very good book on the subject. You can read it and any others you wish, but make an informed decision on what you believe.

You need to have a better reply that "Jesus was not baptized by John the catholic, or John the Methodist, but by John the Baptist!"

I'm surprised that no one has brought up the BAPTIST acrostic yet.

 

The book, by Evangelist Mike Gass, is called: "A Glorious Church"  subtitled: "A study of the origin, identity, heritage, and integrity of the new Testament Church."

Its published by Striving Together Publications, from Lancaster Baptist Church, Lancaster CA. And most of you know its pastored by Paul Chappell.

 

The crux of the book is that Jesus did establish a called out assembly, gave it a mission, and that a line of churches throughout history has strived to maintain a pure bride of Christ.

 

There is only two times in the gospels that Jesus said he finished something. We all know He finished our redemption on the cross, but in the gospel of John 17:4, Jesus says he finished the work that God has sent him to do. What was finished? If our salvation was finished on the cross, it couldn't have been done in John 17:4.

Answer that question and I personally believe you will be 99% done with your study of the origin of the church.

 

Did Jesus call his work a Baptist church? Nope. Did Jesus establish what we could call a church? Yes. Just as we firmly believe that God has perfectly preserved his Word, He has also guided The church throughout the ages.

 

For me, and this is just my belief the origin of the church started with Jesus and the Baptist church is the closest to that church that I have found. Your mileage may very.  You may be a landmark or separatist, or secessionist, and even Anabaptist. Which ever you prefer to be, make sure you can back it up with scripture and prayer, with lots of study having been done.

 

 

Dr. ROBerson

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Remember SFIC, Judas was just a person, not the whole called out assembly.

 

We all have saved and unsaved members in our churches.

 

It's the responsibility of the pastor to be on point through the power of the Holy Spirit to lead the church, and for every believer to do the same.

 

 

 

Dr. ROBerson

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I also believe the Baptist Church to be the closest. But closest does not necessarily mean on point.

Close is good when it comes to horseshoes and hand grenades. But suppose close doesn't work for our Lord? Remember, Judas was close... but lost.

 

You said book full with these two lines

 

After 30 years and living all over the world I have yet to see a real New Testament Church.

 

The closest I have seen are missionary works in central and south america but absolutely zero in the states.

 

The NT Church Operating guide and standards are in the Book of Acts. If anyone knows of one like in the Book of Acts, please share the info.

 

The 7 day a week Church where dying to the world and sharing all things common is the standard, praising God and worshipped all day, working to provide for the whole body and not our own ambitions in this nasty world and for entertainment would go out soulwinning.

 

The Amish maybe? Nah, they get the sharing all things part down but are clueless to the rest.

 

We get the soulwinning down pretty good but are clueless to the rest. Seems even the most fundamental Churches are over adminstered and run like corporations.

 

I know we are all set in our ways and American culture to change now and I certainly won't be starting a church myself but can't stop but wonder why noone notices that this maybe why we are so stagnant.

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  • Members

The thing is, many things taught in,not just our Baptist churches, but also in churches of other denominations as well, don't line up with Scripture.

Even in the Baptist faith, there are many varying belief systems and practices between many different sects or branch..

So, which is closest? Primitive? Southern? Missionary? Landmark? I'm sure you get the point.one church teaches unless you get baptized in their branch, you are not Christ's Bride. (Reeks of self-righteousness, in my opinion) Another teaches one is a member of the Bride if one is saved. Others say other things must be done.

They can't all be right.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

My church is a New Testament church from what I understand that to mean. Our church is not stagnant. It may be small but so is the town. One by one we gain new Christians hungry for the word of God.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

who is Peter preaching too?

 

For a hint see the underlined

Ac 2:5 ¶ And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heavenJews from every country
 6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.
 7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
 8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?
 9 Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia,
 10  Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes,
 11 Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.
 12 And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?
 13  Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine.
 14 ¶ But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea (Jews), and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:
 15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
 16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;
 17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
 18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
 19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
 20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:
 21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.
 22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
 23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
 24 Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it.

 

Peter continues by quoting a Jew named David
 25 For David speaketh concerning him, I foresaw the Lord always before my face, for he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved:
 26 Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also my flesh shall rest in hope:
 27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
 28 Thou hast made known to me the ways of life; thou shalt make me full of joy with thy countenance.
 29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.
 30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne;
 31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.
 32 This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.
 33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
 34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
 35 Until I make thy foes thy footstool.
 36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
 37 ¶ Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
 38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Is this the Gospel which Paul preached? I thro not.
 39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children( the promises are to the Jews), and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
 40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generationIs this the gospel of of Grace taught by Paul?
 41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.  3000 Jews according to the context.

 

Who is Peter talking too?

 

Ac 3:1 ¶ Now Peter and John went up together into the temple at the hour of prayer, being the ninth hour.
 2 And a certain man lame from his mother's womb was carried, whom they laid daily at the gate of the temple which is called Beautiful, to ask alms of them that entered into the temple;
 3 Who seeing Peter and John about to go into the temple asked an alms.
 4 And Peter, fastening his eyes upon him with John, said, Look on us.
 5 And he gave heed unto them, expecting to receive something of them.
 6 Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk.
 7 And he took him by the right hand, and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength.
 8 And he leaping up stood, and walked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, and praising God.
 9 And all the people saw him walking and praising God:  Who are the people in the temple?  Only Jews are allowed in the temple.

 10 And they knew that it was he which sat for alms at the Beautiful gate of the temple: and they were filled with wonder and amazement at that which had happened unto him.
 11 And as the lame man which was healed held Peter and John, all the people ran together unto them in the porch that is called Solomon's, greatly wondering.
 12 ¶ And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel (These spoken too are Jews), why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?
 13 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of JacOB, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go.
 14 But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;
 15 And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.
 16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.
 17 And now, brethren, I wot that through ignorance ye did it, as did also your rulers.
 18 But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he hath so fulfilled.
 19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come (when is the times of refreshing? and why is it their sins wont be blotted out until then, but mine sins are already blotted out?) from the presence of the Lord;  Is this the gospel of Taught by Paul that you and I believed?
 20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you what exactly is being preached about Jesus and who preached it?
 21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things (when is the restitution of all things?), which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
 22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you. who are the fathers, the brethren and you?  These are Jews of course.
 23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.
 24 Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days.
 25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.  who are the children of the prophets, and the fathers?  Jews again
 26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquitiesIs anyone saved by turning away from their iniquities?

 

again who is Peter speaking too?

 

Ac 4:1 ¶ And as they spake unto the people, the priests, and the captain of the temple, and the Sadducees, came upon them, They were in the temple preaching and the captains and the saddcees (who don't beleive in the ressurrection) heard them.  Jews are being spoken too again.
 2 Being grieved that they taught the people, and preached through Jesus the resurrection from the dead.  the people are Jews OBviously.
 3 And they laid hands on them, and put them in hold unto the next day: for it was now eventide.
 4 Howbeit many of them which heard the word believed; and the number of the men was about five thousand.  them are the Jews who heard.  and what was the word they believed on?  It was not the Gospel Paul preached or what you as Independent Baptist believed?  it is a gospel of their resurrected king and messiah, the Christ, coming for his kingdom to which they are encouraged to not only beleive (like we are today) but to repent, be baptised, that in the coming of the Lord they will receive the blotting out (forgiveness of their sins) unlike you and I who HAVE NOW the forgiveness of our sins Eph 1:7, and we needed not to repent of our iniquities but only that we turn to God the repentance Paul taught when he said in Act 17:30 and 26:20.

 

Again and again we see at the time just after Christ Ascension the church is a solely Jewish one either by birth (why one must be born again) or Gentile by conversion to which afterwards they are considered a JEW if in fact there were any Gentiles at Peters preaching in the temple.  My point is you must identify which church to know that the church Peter preached to was of the circumcision and God added to it many Jews and Jewish converts.

 

So we must ask, Which Gospel is being preached?  remember we have not heard Peter say once that CHRIST DIED FOR OUR SINS which Paul said was the gospel he got from Chris himself.

 

It would seem that it was that Christ was of the line of David and is their King, their messiah.  this is what was being preached it is what was earlier preached by Peter the eleven and the 70/72 during Christ earthly ministry.  and this belief was paramount to the coming kingdom had the leadership of the Jews not rejected God the Holy Ghost in Acts 5. We see three times in the Scriptures that the Jews, represented by their leadership, rejected God the father in the OT, God the Son in the Gospels and God the Holy Ghost in Acts 5.

 

OBservation goes a long way in determining who, what, why, when, where, which and how, these are the tools for understanding the preserved interpretation of God's words as found in the Authorized Version. All scriptures is for our learning but not all for our current church doctrine, which church is as important as which Gospel.

 

Ok, now we have some info at our fingertips the church here of baptized believers first of the Gospel preached by John the baptist and some being baptized by John known as the baptist.  which church was john the baptist baptizing?  A Jewish church it would seem and the early church that peter continued could be called a baptist church.  but the gospel is not the gospel of the baptist church today.  So there is no way anyone could claim that their lines go back to John the baptist because they are teaching a different Gospel than John the baptist, Jesus Christ and Peter.

 

Hence no baptist church today can claim John the baptist is of their line and that they are the TRUE church because they are preaching two different gospels.

 

hence what is going on in this thread is nothing more than the carnality of men striving to say I am of one group over another.

 

1Cor 1:12 Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.
 13 Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

 

1Cor 3:1 ¶ And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
 2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.

 3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
 4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?

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AVBB:

This idea of two gospels - one for the Jews and one by Paul for the Gentiles - is unBiblical, heretical nonsense. There is no division. Peter and Paul are not speaking different gospels. How could they? The center of everything they both said is Christ, and He is the one that inspired all the scriptural writings that bear record of their words. There is no separate gospel for the Jew and for the Greek; God deals with both the sane way. Romans 10:10-13; Colossians 3:10-11.

I find it interesting that you emphasize Acts 3:19, but seem to skip over the previous few verses which explain the faith in Jesus as the Son of God that those unbelieving Jews needed for their salvation. The mechanism of salvation has not changed through the ages. Read Romans 4-5 and you will see this. But then, I'm sure you have read it, and OBviously reject its conclusions.

I reject your idea of multiple churches/a changed gospel as heresy. I reject it based on the clear reading of Scripture in Ephesians 4:4-6.

You have been given many second chances in this board despite your poor attitudes, behavior and questionable doctrines. You will not be given any further.

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    • Bro. West

      Seeing it is Christ----mas time and I was answering question on Luke 2:33 concerning Jesus, Mary and Joseph . I thought it would be fitting to display a poem i wrote concerning the matter.
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