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"make your calling and election sure"


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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

This was taken from an article by a Calvinist, teaching 'perseverence of the saints'. It is, I believe, from the RSV(Revised Standard Version). Notice the wording in the last sentence of each and tell me if you notice a subtle but drastic difference in meaning between this and the KJB.

2 Peter 1:10 (RSV?)"Therefore, brethren, be the more zealous to confirm your call and election, for if you do this you will never fall; so there will be richly provided for you an entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ."


Here is what the King James says ....
2 Peter 1:10-11
10Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
11For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

I know this could be in the wrong forum, but it has to do with the security of the believer.
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This was taken from an article by a Calvinist, teaching 'perseverence of the saints'. It is, I believe, from the RSV(Revised Standard Version). Notice the wording in the last sentence of each and tell me if you notice a subtle but drastic difference in meaning between this and the KJB.


Here is what the King James says ....
2 Peter 1:10-11
10Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
11For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

I know this could be in the wrong forum, but it has to do with the security of the believer.

Hartstrings, what subtle but drastic difference do you see between these passages? Both are saying that believers should make sure they are saved, because if they're saved, they will never fall from grace, but rather be granted an entrance into heaven, the eternal kingdom of the Lord. Those who believe in the perseverence of the saints (or "once saved, always saved") use this passage as one foundation for that belief. A person who is truly, surely saved will never fall, but will surely be granted entrance into heaven.
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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
Hartstrings, what subtle but drastic difference do you see between these passages? Both are saying that believers should make sure they are saved, because if they're saved, they will never fall from grace
Making "your calling and election sure" has absolutely nothing to do with making sure you are saved. Actually, it is speaking about Christian maturity [bible]2 Peter 1[/bible]. "Calling and election" is not referring to obtaining salvation; it speaks of duty and service. This passage is talking about adding to your faith, growing to maturity and serving God, thereby being fruitful, not falling into sin, and getting rewarded for it in Heaven.



This is saying you will be given "an entrance"...if you do thus and so
2 Peter 1:10 (RSV?)
"Therefore, brethren, be the more zealous to confirm your call and election, for if you do this you will never fall; so there will be richly provided for you an entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ."



And this one is referring to WHAT KIND of entrance you will be given....
2 Peter 1:10-11 KJB
10Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
11For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
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This is saying you will be given "an entrance"...if you do thus and so



And this one is referring to WHAT KIND of entrance you will be given....
2 Peter 1:10-11 KJB
10Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
11For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

I may be dense, but I'm still not seeing the difference between the two. Here they are side by side, with grammar/syntax indicated.

"an entrance": This word is the subject in both versions.
"will be provided"/"shall be ministered": These are the verbs. They mean the same thing.
So far, we have (in subject/verb order) "An entrance will be provided (or shall be ministered)."

Now, we have the adverbs (not adjectives describing "what kind of" entrance). They are richly and abundantly (and there, in the RSV). Again, these words are synonyms, both describing HOW the entrance will be ministered/provided. HOW will the entrance be ministered/provided? Richly/abundantly. Again, neither one of these words are adjectives describing what kind of entrance.
With these words added, we have the following:
An entrance (subject) will be provided/ministered (passive verb) richly/abundantly (adverb).

Then, we have the prepositional phrases, telling to whom this entrance will be ministered, into where the entrance is, and whose kingdom is being entered:
unto you (KJV)/for you (RSV)
into the everlasting kingdom (KJV)/into the eternal kingdom (RSV)
of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ (both versions)

So, what we have (in subject/predicate order) is the following:
An entrance (subject) will be provided/ministered (passive verb) richly/abundantly (adverb) unto you/for you (prep phrase) into the everlasting/eternal kingdom (prep phrase) of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ (prep phrase).

The grammar and syntax appear to be exactly the same, and communicate exactly the same thing. I'm not sure how you think one conveys a different meaning than the other. The word so, which you underlined in the KJV, is also found in the RSV. It is the conjunction that begins the clause. It is found in both versions, and performs the same function, although the words are in different order. (The subject comes before the verb in the KJV, and the subject comes after the verb in the RSV. But both are saying the same thing. The word so is in the same place, at the beginning of the clause.)
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  • 2 weeks later...
  • Advanced Member

I think its kind of humorous to see a Calvinist quote scripture that falls in line with the thousands of verses that demonstrate the irrefutability that salvation is up to the believer's choice to accept or reject. According to Calvin we can't make sure of anything cause we're too dead to do any "makin sure" and have to let God "make" it sure for us.... cute circular logic....

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
I'm afraid I don't see much difference between the two, sir.
God bless,
Crushmaster.


Well, I read it again and it just looks fishy to me. I'll just stick with the King James.

Here are some quotes from the same article on "perseverence of the saints".........

Election is unconditional, but glorification is not. There are many warnings in Scripture that those who do not hold fast to Christ can be lost in the end.


There is a falling away of some believers, but if it persists, it shows that their faith was not genuine and they were not born of God.
God killed Annanias and Saphira for lying to the Holy Ghost, and He was about to kill the man in 1 Corinthians who "had his father's wife", and old Brother Lot down in Sodom wasn't doing too much perseverence either.

Then he says this....
l John 2:l9, "They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out, that it might be made plain that they all are not of us." Similarly, the parable of the four soils as interpreted in Luke 8:9-l4 pictures people who "hear the word, receive it with joy; but these have no root, they believe for a while and in a time of temptation fall away."

The fact that such a thing is possible is precisely why the ministry of the Word in every local church must contain many admonitions to the church members to persevere in faith and not be entangled in those things which could possibly strangle them and result in their condemnation.


While he is claiming that he, as a Calvinist, believes in Eternal Security, I think what he really means is that Eternal security does exist for the "elect"; but each member or non-member of that "elect" cannot be 100% sure if his own personal security until he has "persevered to the end" to "final salvation". Does that sound like he's teaching people to fully trust Christ and take God at His word? Doesn't to me.

The Bible never teaches "perseverance of the saints"..the word, in that context does not even appear. But it does teach spiritual growth, sanctification, and overcoming the world.

"Election", as I understand it, means chosen or established for a purpose. The Lord Jesus Christ is "elect".

"Predestination" simply means that the end, or destiny of "the elect" is comformity to the image of Christ.
If you are born again, that is your destiny and there is nothing you can do or not do to make it happen or prevent it.

"Foreknowledge", simply means God knows everything that will happen, before it happens.....as I understand it, simply means that the institution of "the elect", and their destiny, was designed, decreed, and determined in eternity past. In other words, the process and the outcome of the whole thing is of His design and will not take Him by surprise.. Yes, God knew each individual who would and would not be saved, but it is your choice whether you want to submit to God and become a part of His great and wonderful plan. God even knows if you will choose, but He gives you the choice.

When you respond positively to wooing power of the Holy Spirit, submit and give your heart to God, call on the name of Jesus in repentence and faith....Jesus will come into your heart and dwell there forever. At that moment, you also become one of those who are "chosen for service" ; that's now your purpose and your job. You become part of "the big picture",. And also at that moment your destiny is sealed, you become one of those who WILL be conformed to the image of Christ. In my finite and feeble mid, that's how I understand it.
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  • 3 months later...
  • Advanced Member

John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Who can come to Jesus?

John 6:64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
Again I ask, "Who can come to Jesus?" Many disciples left because of this teaching.
John 6:66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away? 68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.

That teaching was not popular in Jesus day, any more than it is today. Many 'disciples' left, but the true disciples persevered.

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
They hath everlasting life, not they will have. If they can lose it how can it be everlasting?

When Paul and Barnabus preached to the Gentiles, who believed and were saved?

Acts 13: 48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Who can come to Jesus?



"John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me."

All men are drawn by God at some point. They can resist that though.
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Romans 1:16 I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to ever one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. (then see ...) Romans 10 :13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. (then see...) Ephesians 2: 8, 9 & 10 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. (then still ...) Romans 11:5 & 6 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace. And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work. (then ...) Galatians 3:2&3 This only would I learn you, Recieved ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh? (then now see..) Ephesians 1 : 12, 13 &14 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation in whom also, after that ye believed ,ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possesion,unto the praise of his glory. (now just me saying!!!) Please read Ephesians Chapter 3 to the end you will be so blessed! (Actually I want to say read Romans, Galatians, Ephesians, Phllippians, Colossians and all the way thru to Hebrews !!) Just read His Word. Really Read His Word and you will know Really Know your His, bought by Him and you couldn't earn your salvation so you cann't keep yourself saved! He does!! Eph. 4:30...ye are sealed unto the day of redemption. His by Grace

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
.........When Paul and Barnabus preached to the Gentiles, who believed and were saved?

Acts 13: 48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.


1. Do a study of the word "ordained". It doesn't mean what you think.
Try a Middle English dictionary. Also look up the Greek word it was translated from. The Greek word "tasso" is also translated as "addicted" in the King James Bible. With me so far? 1 Corinthians 16:15

2. Understand that, in the ancient world, same as now, people prepared and planned expecting full well to obtain eternal life. For example: Egyptians embalmed bodies and placed belongings, even food, into tombs in preparation for the afterlife. Some pharaohs had pyramids built, which took decades to construct, because they thought they would live forever. These people were lost and didn't know the true and living God, yet they were "fixed", "determined", "set", on having eternal life. Read Mark 10:17

3. Understand also that some people lived for today, even as now. Atheists today, say they beleive the grave is the end. I heard one of my college instructors say he did not WANT to live forever. The Bible also says "the fool hath said in his heart there is no God"; so we know there were athiests then too. They are NOT ordained "set" on getting eternal life.

4. So those Gentiles who were "fixed", "set", on living forever, beleived on the Lord Jesus Christ. They were "addicted", if you will, to the prospect of living forever.

5. Acts 13: 48 DOES NOT say "God" did any ordaining; to say so, is to add to the word of God. These were people who "ordained" themselves . They were simply "set", "ordered' "fixed" "determined" to have eternal life...."addicted" to it......Just like the pharaohs were.

Study the original meaning of the word "ordained".
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  • Advanced Member

I'm sorry but I'm left a bit confused! Are you concerned about "everyone thinking they are recieving life eternal" ? God's word says...Ephesians 2:2 & 3 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lust of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. OR Are you concerned that you could lose your salvation? God's word says...Phillipians 1: 6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ: (Now only my words!) I've read your post several times and you wanted me to find the meaning of "ordained" in ACT 13:48 "ordained" here it means " to appoint because of their decision" according to my notes from my Pastors teaching in S.S.. He's a trustworthy and lovingly leads the flock not behind us pushing us. Did you know that's what a sheep butcher does to the flock? It pushes them to their death!! I just learned that so I had to share! Anyway, that's why Jesus say's to follow Him! He's the sheeperd is alway's looking over the flock keeping them safe even when they run off on their own. He always goes and get's them. They never get mixed in with another flock at the end of the day because when he calls for His sheep they come knowing His call! I just thought how really exciting that is to know for me! Sure hope this helps!! If not , explain to me what's concerning you and I'll try to help. In Christ's love His by Grace




1. Do a study of the word "ordained". It doesn't mean what you think.
Try a Middle English dictionary. Also look up the Greek word it was translated from. The Greek word "tasso" is also translated as "addicted" in the King James Bible. With me so far? 1 Corinthians 16:15

2. Understand that, in the ancient world, same as now, people prepared and planned expecting full well to obtain eternal life. For example: Egyptians embalmed bodies and placed belongings, even food, into tombs in preparation for the afterlife. Some pharaohs had pyramids built, which took decades to construct, because they thought they would live forever. These people were lost and didn't know the true and living God, yet they were "fixed", "determined", "set", on having eternal life. Read Mark 10:17

3. Understand also that some people lived for today, even as now. Atheists today, say they beleive the grave is the end. I heard one of my college instructors say he did not WANT to live forever. The Bible also says "the fool hath said in his heart there is no God"; so we know there were athiests then too. They are NOT ordained "set" on getting eternal life.

4. So those Gentiles who were "fixed", "set", on living forever, beleived on the Lord Jesus Christ. They were "addicted", if you will, to the prospect of living forever.

5. Acts 13: 48 DOES NOT say "God" did any ordaining; to say so, is to add to the word of God. These were people who "ordained" themselves . They were simply "set", "ordered' "fixed" "determined" to have eternal life...."addicted" to it......Just like the pharaohs were.

Study the original meaning of the word "ordained".
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in ACT 13:48 "ordained" here it means " to appoint because of their decision"


The word "ordained" basicly means "set". One can be 'set' to something without being appointed. I used to hear the old folks say things like "he's 'set' in his ways". Someone who is set in his ways is difficult or almost impossible to change....he is ordered or established or 'fixed' to a habit, lifestyle, or frame of mind....just like an 'addict'. It is possible to "appoint" someone else to a certain responsiblity, lifestyle, task, whatever; this is pretty much how we use the word "ordained" today. But the Bible does NOT say that the people in Acts 13:48 were "appointed" by anybody. It simply says they "were "ordained". Ordained by who? It doesn't say. They were 'set'. Set to what? Eternal life.

And, no, a saved person cannot lose their salvation.
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Thank goodness! I was afraid you were woried about losing your salvation! Your sue on that Amen!!! Yet I don't understand what your trying to tell me you belive in "ordained " meaning "set" to you here. I read the verse with your diffinition and I'm not understanding what your trying so hard for me to understand! Please explain ok? I still stand by "ordained" here means "to appoint because of their decision" because my Pastor always proves scriptue with scipture. I haven't studied this after your post I read yesterday but I will as soon as I have a bit of time!!




The word "ordained" basicly means "set". One can be 'set' to something without being appointed. I used to hear the old folks say things like "he's 'set' in his ways". Someone who is set in his ways is difficult or almost impossible to change....he is ordered or established or 'fixed' to a habit, lifestyle, or frame of mind....just like an 'addict'. It is possible to "appoint" someone else to a certain responsiblity, lifestyle, task, whatever; this is pretty much how we use the word "ordained" today. But the Bible does NOT say that the people in Acts 13:48 were "appointed" by anybody. It simply says they "were "ordained". Ordained by who? It doesn't say. They were 'set'. Set to what? Eternal life.

And, no, a saved person cannot lose their salvation.
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