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    • By Jim_Alaska in Jim_Alaska's Sermons & Devotionals
         14
      Closed Communion
      James Foley
       
      I Corinthians 11:17-34: "Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse. For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it. For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you. When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's Supper. For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken. What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not. For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread: And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me. After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me. For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do show the Lord's death till he come. Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep. For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged. But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world. Wherefore, my brethren, when ye come together to eat, tarry one for another. And if any man hunger, let him eat at home; that ye come not together unto condemnation. And the rest will I set in order when I come."

      INTRODUCTION

      Historic Baptists, true Baptists, have believed in and still believe in closed communion. Baptists impose upon themselves the same restrictions that they impose on others concerning the Lord’s Supper. Baptists have always insisted that it is the Lord’s Table, not theirs; and He alone has the right to say who shall sit at His table. No amount of so called brotherly love, or ecumenical spirit, should cause us to invite to His table those who have not complied with the requirements laid down plainly in His inspired Word. With respect to Bible doctrines we must always use the scripture as our guide and practice. For Baptists, two of the most important doctrines are Baptism and The Lord’s Supper. These are the only two doctrines we recognize as Church Ordinances. The Bible is very clear in teaching how these doctrines are to be practiced and by whom.

      We only have two ordinances that we must never compromise or we risk our very existence, they are Baptism and The Lord’s Supper.

      The moment we deviate from the precise method God has prescribed we have started down the slippery slope of error. True Baptists have held fast to the original doctrine of The Lord’s Supper from the time of Christ and the Apostles.

      Unfortunately, in this day of what the Bible describes as the age of luke warmness, Baptists are becoming careless in regard to strictly following the pattern laid out for us in Scripture. Many of our Bible colleges are graduating otherwise sincere, Godly and dedicated pastors and teachers who have not been taught the very strict, biblical requirements that surround the Lord’s Supper. Any Bible college that neglects to teach its students the differences surrounding Closed Communion, Close Communion and Open Communion is not simply short changing its students; it is also not equipping their students to carry on sound Bible traditions. The result is men of God and churches that fall into error. And as we will see, this is serious error.

      Should we as Baptists ignore the restrictions made by our Lord and Master? NO! When we hold to the restrictions placed upon the Lord’s Supper by our Master, we are defending the "faith which was once delivered to the saints" Jude 3.

      The Lord’s Supper is rigidly restricted and I will show this in the following facts:

      IT IS RESTRICTED AS TO PLACE

      A. I Corinthians 11:18 says, "When ye come together in the church." This does not mean the church building; they had none. In other words, when the church assembles. The supper is to be observed by the church, in church capacity. Again this does not mean the church house. Ekklesia, the Greek word for church, means assembly. "When ye come together in the church," is when the church assembles.

      B. When we say church we mean an assembly of properly baptized believers. Acts 2:41-42: "Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers."

      The church is made up of saved people who are baptized by immersion. In the Bible, belief precedes baptism. That’s the Bible way.

      Acts 8:12-13, "But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women. Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done."

      When we say properly baptized, we mean immersed. No unbeliever should take the Lord’s supper, and no non-immersed believer should take the supper. Those who are sprinkled are not baptized and cannot receive the supper. The Greek word for baptize is baptizo, and it always means to immerse.

      "In every case where communion is referred to, or where it may possibly have been administered, the believers had been baptized Acts 2:42; 8:12; 8:38; 10:47; 6:14-15; 18:8; 20:7. Baptism comes before communion, just as repentance and faith precede baptism".

      C. The Lord’s Supper is for baptized believers in church capacity: "When ye come together in the church," again not a building, but the assembly of the properly baptized believers.

      D. The fact that the Lord’s Supper is a church ordinance, to be observed in church capacity, is pointed out by the fact that it is for those who have been immersed and added to the fellowship of the church.

      E. The Lord’s Supper is never spoken of in connection with individuals. When it is referred to, it is only referred to in reference to baptized believers in local church capacity I Cor. 11:20-26).

      I want to quote Dr. W.W. Hamilton,

      "The individual administration of the ordinance has no Bible warrant and is a relic of Romanism. The Lord’s Supper is a church ordinance, and anything which goes beyond or comes short of this fails for want of scriptural example or command".

      “The practice of taking a little communion kit to hospitals, nursing homes, etc. is unscriptural and does not follow the scriptural example.”

      IT IS RESTRICTED TO A UNITED CHURCH

      A. The Bible in I Cor. 11:18 is very strong in condemning divisions around the Lord’s table. For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
      19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
      20 When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's supper.

      There were no less than four divisions in the Corinthian church.
      I Cor. 1:12: "Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ."

      Because of these divisions, it was impossible for them to scripturally eat the Lord’s Supper. Division in the local church is reason to hold off observing the Lord’s Supper. But there are also other reasons to forego taking the Lord’s Supper. If there is gross sin in the membership we do not take it. Here is scriptural evidence for this: 1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our Passover is sacrificed for us:
      8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. 9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
      10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. 11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

      B. At this point, I want to ask these questions: Are there not doctrinal divisions among the many denominations? Is it not our doctrinal differences that cause us to be separate religious bodies?

      IT IS RESTRICTED BY DOCTRINE

      A. Those in the early church at Jerusalem who partook "continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine" Acts 2:42. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

      B. Those that do not hold to apostolic truth are not to partake. This means there is to be discipline in the local body. How can you discipline those who do not belong to the local body? You can’t. The clear command of scripture is to withdraw fellowship from those who are not doctrinally sound.

      II Thes 3:6: "Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us."
      Rom. 16:17: "Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them."
      To commune together means to have the same doctrine.
      II Thes. 2:15: "Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle."
      II John 10-11: "If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."

      C. Some Baptists in our day have watered down this doctrine by practicing what they call “Close Communion.” By this they mean that they believe that members of another Baptist church may take communion with us because they are of the same beliefs. Once again, this is unscriptural.

      The welcome to the Lord's Table should not be extended beyond the discipline of the local church. When we take the Lord’s Supper there is supposed to be no gross sin among us and no divisions among us. We have no idea of the spiritual condition of another church’s members. If there is sin or division in the case of this other church’s members, we have no way of knowing it. We cannot discipline them because they are not members of our church. This is why we practice “Closed” communion, meaning it is restricted solely to our church membership. 
      So then, in closing I would like to reiterate the three different ideas concerning the Lord’s Supper and who is to take it. 
      Closed Communion = Only members of a single local church. 
      Close Communion = Members of like faith and order may partake. 
      Open Communion = If you claim to be a Christian, or simply attending the service, you may partake. 
      It is no small thing to attempt to change that which was implemented by our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. 
      Mt. 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. 
      Many of our Baptist churches have a real need to consider the gravity of the act of observing The Lord’s Supper. It is not a light thing that is to be taken casually or without regard to the spiritual condition of ourselves or our church.
      1Co. 11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.

       28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.

       29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

       30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

America In The Bible


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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Why I wrote “America’s Last Warning”

 

 

Jeremiah 20:8-9

8 For since I spake, I cried out, I cried violence and spoil; because the word of the LORD was made a reproach unto me, and a derision, daily.

9 Then I said, I will not make mention of him, nor speak any more in his name. But his word was in mine heart as a burning fire shut up in my bones, and I was weary with forbearing, and I could not stay.

 

Many say America is not in the bible, but I say we are their in the darkness from Revelation 16:10

10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,

 

when the sun stands still in the heavens over Israel before Armageddon.

Habakkuk 3:10-13

11The sun and moon stood still in their habitation: at the light of thine arrows they went, and at the shining of thy glittering spear.

12 Thou didst march through the land in indignation, thou didst thresh the heathen in anger.

13 Thou wentest forth for the salvation of thy people((Israel)), even for salvation with thine anointed((Saints)); thou woundedst the head out of the house of the wicked, by discovering the foundation unto the neck. Selah.

 

America will come from the end of the earth when the judgment by fire happens when the heavens are darkened over Israel Isaiah 5:24-30. We will carry away a remnant of Israel to the other end of the earth. It will be on the wings of a great eagle Revelation 12:13-14.

 

Revelation 12:13-14

13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

 

 

When God puts a hook in the jaw of Russia from the far North, he will call us from the other side of the earth.

 

Jeremiah 6:22-23

22 Thus saith the LORD, Behold, a people cometh from the north country, and a great nation shall be raised from the sides of the earth.

23 They shall lay hold on bow and spear; they are cruel, and have no mercy; their voice roareth like the sea; and they ride upon horses, set in array as men for war against thee, O daughter of Zion.

Now that 1,250,000 Jews have gone to Israel from the Russian north, the Jews in the daughter of Babylon are to go home too!

 

Zechariah 2:6-7

6 Ho, ho, come forth, and flee from the land of the north, saith the LORD: for I have spread you abroad as the four winds of the heaven, saith the LORD.

7 Deliver thyself, O Zion, that dwellest with the daughter of Babylon.

 

There are about 6,000,000 Jews in Israel. There are about 6,000,000 Jews in American and about 3,000,000 Jews spread around the rest of the world.

I believe America is the daughter of Babylon and future home of the antichrist.

 

America repent while you can the judgment is written down.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

That's a whole lot of speculation. There seems to be a pretty fair amount of ignoring or dismissing of the previous use of terms in Scripture, that point to other people and places, which you use to speculate about America.

 

Also, if one wishes to consider historical Christian views regarding these verses, they were not seen as pointing to America. It wasn't until recently that a few started trying to fit America into the Bible.

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That's a whole lot of speculation. There seems to be a pretty fair amount of ignoring or dismissing of the previous use of terms in Scripture, that point to other people and places, which you use to speculate about America.

 

Also, if one wishes to consider historical Christian views regarding these verses, they were not seen as pointing to America. It wasn't until recently that a few started trying to fit America into the Bible.

John the solar eclipse over Israel is described in many day of the Lord passages.

 

God will send a permanent solar eclipse before Armageddon to judge the antichrist kingdom. It will cause a 200 mile shadow on Israel and darkness on America.

 

Revelation 16:10-11

10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,

11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.

 

Isaiah 13:9-11

9 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

 

Isaiah 16:1-5

1 Send ye the lamb to the ruler of the land from Sela to the wilderness, unto the mount of the daughter of Zion.

 2 For it shall be, that, as a wandering bird cast out of the nest, so the daughters of Moab shall be at the fords of Arnon.

3 Take counsel, execute judgment; make thy shadow as the night in the midst of the noonday; hide the outcasts; bewray not him that wandereth.

4 Let mine outcasts dwell with thee, Moab; be thou a covert to them from the face of the spoiler: for the extortioner is at an end, the spoiler ceaseth, the oppressors are consumed out of the land.

 

(((Jesus the Lamb will sit on the throne in the kingdom)))

5 And in mercy shall the throne be established: and he shall sit upon it in truth in the tabernacle of David, judging, and seeking judgment, and hasting righteousness.

 

Isaiah 24:21-23

21 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the LORD shall punish the host of the high ones((Satan)) that are on high, and the kings of the earth upon the earth.

22 And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited.

23Then the moon shall be confounded, and the sun ashamed, when the LORD of hosts shall reign in mount Zion, and in Jerusalem, and before his ancients gloriously.

 

Habakkuk 3:11-13

11The sun and moon stood still in their habitation: at the light of thine arrows they went, and at the shining of thy glittering spear.

12 Thou didst march through the land in indignation, thou didst thresh the heathen in anger.

 

(((Armageddon)))

13 Thou wentest forth for the salvation of thy people, even for salvation with thine anointed; thou woundedst the head out of the house of the wicked, by discovering the foundation unto the neck. Selah.

 

Joel 3:14-16

14 Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision: for the day of the LORD is near in the valley of decision. 15 The sun and the moon shall be darkened, and the stars shall withdraw their shining.

16 The LORD also shall roar out of Zion, and utter his voice from Jerusalem; and the heavens and the earth shall shake: but the LORD will be the hope of his people, and the strength of the children of Israel.

 

Amos 8:9

7 The LORD hath sworn by the excellency of JacOB, Surely I will never forget any of their works.

8 Shall not the land tremble for this, and every one mourn that dwelleth therein? and it shall rise up wholly as a flood; and it shall be cast out and drowned, as by the flood of Egypt.

9 And it shall come to pass in that day, saith the Lord GOD, that I will cause the sun to go down at noon, and I will darken the earth in the clear day:

 

JOB 38:13-15

12 Hast thou commanded the morning since thy days; and caused the dayspring to know his place;

13 That it might take hold of the ends of the earth, that the wicked might be shaken out of it?

14 It is turned as clay to the seal; and they stand as a garment.

15And from the wicked their light is withholden, and the high arm shall be broken.

 

Habakkuk 3:11-13

11 The sun and moon stood still in their habitation: at the light of thine arrows they went(from view), and at the shining of thy glittering spear.

12 Thou didst march through the land in indignation, thou didst thresh the heathen in anger.

13 Thou wentest forth for the salvation of thy people(Israel), even for salvation with thine anointed(Saints); thou woundedst the head out of the house of the wicked, by discovering the foundation unto the neck. Selah.(To Armageddon)

 

 

 

Isaiah 60:1-2, 19-20

1 Arise, shine; for thy light is come, and the glory of the LORD is risen upon thee.

2 For, behold, the darkness shall cover the earth, and gross darkness the people: but the LORD shall arise upon thee, and his glory shall be seen upon thee.

 

 

 

19The sun shall be no more thy light by day; neither for brightness shall the moon give light unto thee: but the LORD shall be unto thee an everlasting light, and thy God thy glory.

20Thy sun shall no more go down; neither shall thy moon withdraw itself: for the LORD shall be thine everlasting light, and the days of thy mourning shall be ended.

 

 

(((The permanent solar eclipse over Israel will continue through the kingdom age.))

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

That's what you THINK these mean but that's not exactly what Scripture says and you leave out the many other possibilities of what these mean.

 

As a theory it's something to consider but it's not fact as you present it.

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This country as a whole will not repent.  She has no need of God when she has all the material goods, entertainment and people like Nancy Pelosi, Barack OBama and John Boehner to look after them from Washington.

 

She had her last chance in 2008 and after that she went over the cliff.  God let her have the rulers she deserves.  They had the Constitution but the people wanted mOB rule instead. 

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This country as a whole will not repent.  She has no need of God when she has all the material goods, entertainment and people like Nancy Pelosi, Barack OBama and John Boehner to look after them from Washington.

 

She had her last chance in 2008 and after that she went over the cliff.  God let her have the rulers she deserves.  They had the Constitution but the people wanted mOB rule instead. 

 

America has rejected God and his laws. We have killed over 50,000,000 unborn babies. We are storing up wrath.

 

2Thessalonians 2:6-12

6And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

 

11And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

12That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

 

America is the most evangelized nation on earth and will be the most deluded by the antichrist's lie. God will send the antichrist to America first. Daniel 11:39-40 tells us that the antichrist will do his will in the most strongholds before he divides Israel and the end time wars start.

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I do not consider nations named in OT prophecy are specific nations relating to future end times, though you might like to consider references to "the isles" as referring to the British Isles - a nation with great significance in the fight against the RCC & the spread of the Gospel.

 

However, I submit that the most important nation - the only significant one - is the holy nation of believers. Peter shows that the promise to Israel is fulfilled in the holy nation of believers, aka the church.

Ex. 19:Now therefore, if ye will OBey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: and ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

 

1 Peter 2:But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light: 10 which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not OBtained mercy, but now have OBtained mercy.

 

We are a "called out" people - the people of God - called out of every nation. Kindred refers to the tribes of Israel.

Rev. 5:And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; 10 and hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

 

The Christian war is not against specific nations or human enemies but against our spiritual enemies:

Eph. 6:10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might. 11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. 13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

That's a whole lot of speculation. There seems to be a pretty fair amount of ignoring or dismissing of the previous use of terms in Scripture, that point to other people and places, which you use to speculate about America.

 

Also, if one wishes to consider historical Christian views regarding these verses, they were not seen as pointing to America. It wasn't until recently that a few started trying to fit America into the Bible.

John and EKSmith,

 

Some end time prophecies could not be understood till people and countries moved into position.

 

Daniel:8-10

8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?

9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.

10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

 

Ezekiel 38:10-13

10 Thus saith the Lord GOD; It shall also come to pass, that at the same time shall things come into thy mind, and thou shalt think an evil thought:

11 And thou shalt say, I will go up to the land of unwalled villages; I will go to them that are at rest, that dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates,

12To take a spoil, and to take a prey; to turn thine hand upon the desolate places that are now inhabited, and upon the people that are gathered out of the nations, which have gotten cattle and goods, that dwell in the midst of the land.

13Sheba, and Dedan, and the merchants of Tarshish, with all the young lions thereof, shall say unto thee, Art thou come to take a spoil? hast thou gathered thy company to take a prey? to carry away silver and gold, to take away cattle and goods, to take a great spoil?

 

 

Russia and her allies will come to take a spoil in Israel? What spoil? Now we know that Israel has vast gas and shale oil reserves. Who would have guessed that Saudi Arabia and Israel would be allies?

 

America is one of the colonies of Tarshish called a young lion. That could not be understood till America exited.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

How is America a colony of Tarshish? Tarshish was located in Spain and it wasn't the Spanish who colonized America.

 

Russia has vast natural resources. It would take much more than the prospect of gaining some gas or oil in Israel for them to take on such a huge logistical war against Israel. The Soviet Union was in a far better position to invade Israel than is the Russian Federation.

 

Sheba and Dedan were of the Arabian desert region, and just like Tarshish, didn't colonize America. There is no way in which America is a "young lion" of any of these.

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Tarshish is England.  Tarshish means, "Land of Tin."  England was known for tin makers, bringing their goods to English ports, thus fitting this description.

 

13"Sheba, and Dedan, and the merchants of Tarshish, with all the young lions thereof, shall say unto thee, Art thou come to take a spoil? hast thou gathered thy company to take a prey? to carry away silver and gold, to take away cattle and goods, to take a great spoil?" ~ Ezekiel 38:13

England is the lion and all English speaking countries connected with her are "the young lions."  They would be, the USA, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and New Guinea.  

Spain is not associated with the lion, and her young lions (cubs). 

 

 

 

During the first phase of Armageddon, Russia will invade Israel.  They will come on horseback, to Israel, as the Euphrates River is drying up.  Russia is filled with Muslims.  And, Muslims love their horses.   God will send them back to Syberia.  Then, the "Kings of the East" will attack Israel.

'Gog and Allies Attack Israel', 'Judgment on Gog', 'The Burial of Gog' - Ezekiel 38-39

Notice verse 39:1

"THEREFORE, thou son of man, prophecy against Gog, and say, Thus saith the Lord of GOD; Behold I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Me'-shech (Moscow) and Tu'-bal (Lenengrad). ~ Ezekiel 39:1

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Tarshish was located in southwestern Spain. Sheba and Dedan were located in Arabia. According to Easton's Bible Dictionary, and other sources, Tarshish means "the sea coast".

 

While the meaning of "young lions" isn't totally agreed upon, many believe this refers to other trade cities in the region. The leaders of these are interested in what Gog is up to as Gog will be passing through or near their land and they hope for profit.

 

None of these point to England or America.

 

At this time, the Russian Federation isn't filled with Muslims. The old Soviet Union had many Muslims in her southwestern area but these were set free with the break up of the Soviet Union and now consists of their own nations to the southwest of Russia. The Muslims left in Russia are few and in the region of Chechnya where there are more, they are a thorn in Russia's side as they engage in terrorism and Russia is forced to expend great amounts of time and treasure keeping them from causing more trouble.

 

While I've not looked into it recently, I know that as late as the last part of the 20th century Russia still maintained cavalry units in their military.

 

As to the drying of the Euphrates, most all prophecy books I've read on this matter point to this as having to do with the "kings of the east", most often suggested to be China, and not Russia. One book pointed to specific damns which had been built which could be used to clear the way for hordes of Chinese to pass through.

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Tarshish was located in southwestern Spain. Sheba and Dedan were located in Arabia. According to Easton's Bible Dictionary, and other sources, Tarshish means "the sea coast".

 

While the meaning of "young lions" isn't totally agreed upon, many believe this refers to other trade cities in the region. The leaders of these are interested in what Gog is up to as Gog will be passing through or near their land and they hope for profit.

 

None of these point to England or America.

 

At this time, the Russian Federation isn't filled with Muslims. The old Soviet Union had many Muslims in her southwestern area but these were set free with the break up of the Soviet Union and now consists of their own nations to the southwest of Russia. The Muslims left in Russia are few and in the region of Chechnya where there are more, they are a thorn in Russia's side as they engage in terrorism and Russia is forced to expend great amounts of time and treasure keeping them from causing more trouble.

 

While I've not looked into it recently, I know that as late as the last part of the 20th century Russia still maintained cavalry units in their military.

 

As to the drying of the Euphrates, most all prophecy books I've read on this matter point to this as having to do with the "kings of the east", most often suggested to be China, and not Russia. One book pointed to specific damns which had been built which could be used to clear the way for hordes of Chinese to pass through.

I have a CD called, "America in the End Times" by the evangelist that led me to Christ.  Unfortunately, one of my SIL's borrowed it, so I don't have it to review.  I vividly remember him saying that Tarshish was England, though.  Tarshish does mean, "Land of Tin."  England's ports were trading places, years ago, for the tin makers.  England IS the "lion", and all countries I mentioned, including America, are the "young lions, or cubs" of England.  All these countries aided Israel at one time and are found in the study of eschatology.  The scriptures speak for themselves.  

In the future, Russia will be aligning with Saudi Arabia.  They will be allies with another.  That is where the Muslims come into play.  

"And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts of armour, even a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords." ~ Ezekiel 38:4

15  And thou shalt come from thy place out of the north parts, thou, and many people with thee, all of them riding upon horses, a great company, and a mighty army:  16  And thou shalt come up against my people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee O Gog (see countries below), before their eyes.  17  Thus saith the Lord GOD; Art thou he of whom I have spoken in old time by my servants the prophets of Israel, which prophesied in those days, many years that I would bring thee against them?  18  And, it shall come to pass at the same time when Gog (the chief prince of Me'-shech - Moscow and Tu'-bal - Lenengrad shall come against the land of Israel, saith the Lord GOD, that my fury (judgment) shall come upon in my face.  19  For in my jealousy and in the fire of my wrath have I spoken, Surely in that day there shall be great shaking in the land of Israel." ~ Ezekiel 38:16-19

The Euphrates River, will bring in Russia armies allied with Saudi Arabia.  After the first bloody battle, God will send them back to Siberia.  Then, the "Kings of the East", China and other Asian countries will invade Israel, in the second part of Armageddon.

One should never underestimate Russia's military power, especially since they will become buddies with Saudi Arabia in the End Times.


 

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I have heard the America "Eagle" Russian "Bear" theory since I was in grade school (that's a long time ago). I've also heard arguments that the Antichrist will come out of Arabia (these are the least credible IMO). I have also seen good studies that place the AC out of the European Union. I personally lean towards the EU theory but am far from dogmatic about it. People far more knowledgeable than I argued out the credibility of each of these theories for many years with little gain towards any theory; and as it has nothing to do with salvation or my scriptural OBedience, I won't argue the point.

 

Having said that, here are some references I have had on hand that give some information on the word Tarshish. There is no support for the British Isles in either reference:

 

From Strong’s Hebrew Dictionary:

 

תַּרְשִׁישׁ Tarshiysh tar-sheesh'

prOBably the same as 8658 (as the region of the stone, or the reverse); Tarshish, a place on the Mediterranean, hence, the ephithet of a merchant vessel (as if for or from that port); also the name of a Persian and of an Israelite:—Tarshish, Tharshish.

 

8658:

תַּרְשִׁישׁ tarshiysh tar-sheesh'

prOBably of foreign derivation (compare 8659); a gem, perhaps the topaz:—beryl.

 

From the Jewish Encyclopedia:

Tarshish appears to have had a considerable trade in silver, iron, tin, and lead (Jer. x. 9; Ezek. xxvii. 12). It gave its name, besides, to a precious stone which has not yet been satisfactorily identifiedSee Gems). The Targum of Jonathan renders the word "Tarshish" in the prophetical books by "sea," which rendering is followed by Saadia. Moreover, the term "ships of Tarshish" is rendered by Jewish scholars "sea-ships" (comp. LXX., Isa. ii. 16, πλοῖα θαλαρρης). Jerome, too, renders "Tarshish" by "sea" in many instances; and in his commentary on Isaiah (l.c.) he declares that he had been told by his Jewish teachers that the Hebrew word for "sea" was "tarshish." In Isa. xxiii. 1 the Septuagint, and in Ezek. xxvii. 12 both the Septuagint and the Vulgate, render "Tarshish" by "Carthage," apparently suggested by Jewish tradition. Indeed, the Targum of Jonathan renders "Tarshish" in I Kings xxii. 48 and Jer. x. 9 by "Afriḳi," that is, Carthage.

 

Josephus ("Ant." i. 6, § 1), apparently reading "Tarshush," identifies it with Tarsus in Cilicia. This identification was adopted by Bunsen and Sayce ("Expository Times," 1902, p. 179); but it seems from Assyrian inscriptions that the original Hebrew name of Tarsus was not "Tarshush." Bochart (in his "Phaleg"), followed by many later scholars, identifies Tarshish with Tartessus, mentioned by Herodotus and Strabo as a district of southern Spain; he thinks, moreover, that "Tartessus" is the Aramaic form of "Tarshish." On the other hand, Le Page Renouf ("Proc. Soc. Bibl. Arch." xvi. 104 et seq.) refutes this theory, declaring besides that Tartessus never really existed. Renouf's opinion is that "Tarshish" means a coast, and, as the word occurs frequently in connection with Tyre, the Phenician coast is to be understood. Cheyne (in "Orientalische Litteraturzeitung," iii. 151) thinks that "Tarshish" of Gen. x. 4, and "Tiras" of Gen. x. 2, are really two names of one nation derived from two different sources, and might indicate the Tyrsenians or Etruscans. Thus the name may denote Italy or the European coasts west of Greece.

 

Personally, where I see America in the Bible is in references like Isaiah 59:2 - 15

 

Isaiah 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.

Isaiah 59:3 For your hands are defiled with blood, and your fingers with iniquity; your lips have spoken lies, your tongue hath muttered perverseness.
Isaiah 59:4 None calleth for justice, nor any pleadeth for truth: they trust in vanity, and speak lies; they conceive mischief, and bring forth iniquity.
Isaiah 59:5 They hatch cockatrice' eggs, and weave the spider's web: he that eateth of their eggs dieth, and that which is crushed breaketh out into a viper.
Isaiah 59:6 Their webs shall not become garments, neither shall they cover themselves with their works: their works are works of iniquity, and the act of violence is in their hands.
Isaiah 59:7 Their feet run to evil, and they make haste to shed innocent blood: their thoughts are thoughts of iniquity; wasting and destruction are in their paths.
Isaiah 59:8 The way of peace they know not; and there is no judgment in their goings: they have made them crooked paths: whosoever goeth therein shall not know peace.
Isaiah 59:9 Therefore is judgment far from us, neither doth justice overtake us: we wait for light, but behold OBscurity; for brightness, but we walk in darkness.
Isaiah 59:10 We grope for the wall like the blind, and we grope as if we had no eyes: we stumble at noonday as in the night; we are in desolate places as dead men.
Isaiah 59:11 We roar all like bears, and mourn sore like doves: we look for judgment, but there is none; for salvation, but it is far off from us.
Isaiah 59:12 For our transgressions are multiplied before thee, and our sins testify against us: for our transgressions are with us; and as for our iniquities, we know them;
Isaiah 59:13 In transgressing and lying against the LORD, and departing away from our God, speaking oppression and revolt, conceiving and uttering from the heart words of falsehood.
Isaiah 59:14 And judgment is turned away backward, and justice standeth afar off: for truth is fallen in the street, and equity cannot enter.
Isaiah 59:15 Yea, truth faileth; and he that departeth from evil maketh himself a prey: and the LORD saw it, and it displeased him that there was no judgment. 

 

Having said that, America certainly looks like an appealing place for the Anti-Christ. Perhaps he'll have a vacation home here...maybe in Hawaii  :biggrin:

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The books I have, and that I've read, as well as web searches, all point to Tarshish as being in Spain. While some have speculated some references to Tarshish might have meant ancient Carthage, most reject that and point to Spain.

 

Russia does have a mighty military but at present many factors would prevent them from being able to undertake an invasion in the Middle East.

 

At this time Saudi Arabia and America are close allies. Should the Saudi royalty lose control of Saudi Arabia there could be a shift in political alliances.

 

As it currently stands, Russia is trying to thwart Muslim terrorism in her borders while attempting to keep peaceful relations with the Muslim nations on her southwestern border. Russia has had long ties with Syria but if the current government falls that could see an end to that. Russia also has business ties with Iran. Even this, however, has been a potential prOBlem for Russia as other Muslims don't like the branch of Islam Iran follows, and some Arab Muslims don't fully trust the Persian Muslims.

 

China is in the process of modernizing her military and building a deep water navy they expect to be able to not only compete with the American Pacific fleet, but to be able to overcome them. They are doing this with American money we pay them as interest payments on all the money we borrow from them so we can give it away as we try to get the world to go the American way.

 

When end of days arrives, all will unfold in accord with the will of God.

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My opinion about the end times, for what it's worth (prOBably exactly 2 cents).  The U.S. as a world power will not be a player in the big events in the prophecies of the end times.  The U.S. Which has gotten overly proud and arrogant, has taken on more than it can chew and will attempt to take on more.  It will disappear as a world power thus enabling the rest of the world to do what they will as far as Israel and the Middle East is concerned.  I don't really spend a lot of time trying to figure out the exact movers and shakers in the end time . . . . got enough on my plate now.   I'll let the Lord handle the rest.

 

God bless,

Larry

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John and Linda,

 

Tarshish is a tribe not a place.


Isaiah 23

1 The burden of Tyre. Howl, ye ships of Tarshish; for it is laid waste, so that there is no house, no entering in: from the land of Chittim it is revealed to them.

2 Be still, ye inhabitants of the isle; thou whom the merchants of Zidon, that pass over the sea, have replenished.

3 And by great waters the seed of Sihor, the harvest of the river, is her revenue; and she is a mart of nations.

4 Be thou ashamed, O Zidon: for the sea hath spoken, even the strength of the sea, saying, I travail not, nor bring forth children, neither do I nourish up young men, nor bring up virgins.

5 As at the report concerning Egypt, so shall they be sorely pained at the report of Tyre.

 

6 Pass ye over to Tarshish; howl, ye inhabitants of the isle.

 

7 Is this your joyous city, whose antiquity is of ancient days? her own feet shall carry her afar off to sojourn. (((coming back)))

8 Who hath taken this counsel against Tyre, the crowning city, whose merchants are princes, whose traffickers are the honourable of the earth?

9 The LORD of hosts hath purposed it, to stain the pride of all glory, and to bring into contempt all the honourable of the earth.

 

10 Pass through thy land as a river, O daughter of Tarshish: there is no more strength.

 

When Tyre was defeated her people went to her mother.

 

History tells us that they went to Carthage. Carthage had colonies in Tyre, the Island of Roads, Spain and England. When Carthage was conquered by Rome all her colonies were assimilated.

 

America is a colony of the Western Roman Empire and Tarshish. America is one of the young lions of Tarshish.

Edited by Eric Stahl
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Yes, Scripture is clear that Israel stands alone, not one nation is, ever has been or ever will be a true friend of Israel. God desires that Israel look to Him alone.

 

If this century plays out, with the Lord not returning before the end of this century, there is a very good chance America will no longer exist before the end of the century. Everything is in place for the collapse of America during this century. Ironic that America seems to be following very much in the footsteps of Rome. America has overextended her military, put far too much treasure into things around the world rather than tending to matters at home, has allowed herself to be overrun by immigrants that hold to very different values and religious leanings and hold more to their home countries rather than desiring to become Americans, and the PC crowd has worked hard to demonize traditional America, white Americans and biblical Christianity, all while pitting minority groups against everyone else as they are told over and over again how they deserve to have it all, even at the expense of others. All of this plus a crippling debt which we have nearly hit the point where we will only be able to pay on the interest, not the principle at all.

 

The idea that America is some extension of the Roman Empire is pure speculation and very weak at that. By the "logic" used to come up with who is or isn't some part of the Roman Empire, most nations on earth could be fit into that box. Not to mention that Rome didn't inherit anything in England as a result of the defeat of Carthage and Tarshish in Spain is considered a Phoenecian, not Carthaginian city.

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Yes, Scripture is clear that Israel stands alone, not one nation is, ever has been or ever will be a true friend of Israel. God desires that Israel look to Him alone.

 

If this century plays out, with the Lord not returning before the end of this century, there is a very good chance America will no longer exist before the end of the century. Everything is in place for the collapse of America during this century. Ironic that America seems to be following very much in the footsteps of Rome. America has overextended her military, put far too much treasure into things around the world rather than tending to matters at home, has allowed herself to be overrun by immigrants that hold to very different values and religious leanings and hold more to their home countries rather than desiring to become Americans, and the PC crowd has worked hard to demonize traditional America, white Americans and biblical Christianity, all while pitting minority groups against everyone else as they are told over and over again how they deserve to have it all, even at the expense of others. All of this plus a crippling debt which we have nearly hit the point where we will only be able to pay on the interest, not the principle at all.

 

The idea that America is some extension of the Roman Empire is pure speculation and very weak at that. By the "logic" used to come up with who is or isn't some part of the Roman Empire, most nations on earth could be fit into that box. Not to mention that Rome didn't inherit anything in England as a result of the defeat of Carthage and Tarshish in Spain is considered a Phoenecian, not Carthaginian city.

 

John,

Israel’s Allies

 

The antichrist will be an ally of Israel till he and the 10 kings devour the whole earth. Then Antichrist will go into the temple and say he is god. Israel will reject him. At the middle of Israel’s last week of years, the antichrist will call the armies to Israel to take Jerusalem.

 

Daniel 9:27

27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the OBlation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

 

When God puts a hook in the Jaw of Russia and draws her and her allies to Israel, He will also raise a great nation or tribe from the other side of the earth to help Israel.

 

Jeremiah 6:22-26

22 Thus saith the LORD, Behold, a people cometh from the north country(((MaGog))), and a great nation (((Tarshish)))shall be raised from the sides of the earth.

23 They shall lay hold on bow and spear; they are cruel, and have no mercy; their voice roareth like the sea; and they ride upon horses, set in array as men for war against thee, O daughter of Zion.

24 We have heard the fame thereof: our hands wax feeble: anguish hath taken hold of us, and pain, as of a woman in travail.

25 Go not forth into the field, nor walk by the way; for the sword of the enemy and fear is on every side.

26 O daughter of my people, gird thee with sackcloth, and wallow thyself in ashes: make thee mourning, as for an only son, most bitter lamentation: for the spoiler shall suddenly come upon us.

 

 

Ezekiel 38:13-16

13 Sheba, and Dedan, and the merchants of Tarshish, with all the young lions thereof, shall say unto thee, Art thou come to take a spoil? hast thou gathered thy company to take a prey? to carry away silver and gold, to take away cattle and goods, to take a great spoil?

14 Therefore, son of man, prophesy and say unto Gog, Thus saith the Lord GOD; In that day when my people of Israel dwelleth safely, shalt thou not know it?

15 And thou shalt come from thy place out of the north parts, thou, and many people with thee, all of them riding upon horses, a great company, and a mighty army:

16 And thou shalt come up against my people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes.

 

The antichrist will take Jerusalem at the middle of the last week of years determined upon Israel, but he will be her ally till then.

 

Revelation 11:1-2

1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

Edited by Eric Stahl
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