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The 144,000 Jewish Evangelists And The Great Harvest Of Souls In The Tribulation


beameup

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No, I don't think sitting in that rocker, blanket in place, with my Bible open to Revelation and the TV tuned to the news and a prophecy report newsletter at my side with do! :blink:

 

I was saved in 1981. As are most folks when they are first saved I had a great hunger to learn more of the Lord and His Word and grow in the Lord. At some point I came upon much of the prophecy focused stuff, much of it from the 70s, and then I kept adding more to it throughout the 80s and into the 90s.

 

The end time prophecy preachers and authors were all certain they were right, the end was just around the corner, probably this year or next, and they showed how the Bible clearly spoke about the Soviet Union and the Communist Bloc. They told of how the Bible spoke of the fall of America under President Carter and the rise of Iran at that time and both meant the end was at hand.

 

Then Reagan became president, Iran fell from the headlines, their stories changed. Later the Soviet Union collapsed, the Communist Bloc was gone and they scrambled to create new "certain" books of how the end would be. Then Saddam became the focus, but eventually he was killed and the stories changed yet again. Today most of them are saying they see "the war on terror" in the Bible and what they once ascribed to the Soviet Union they now place on "terrorist Islam".

 

There were even those who did calculations and came to the conclusion that Ronald Wilson Reagan was numerically 666. Meanwhile some others declared the birthmark on the Russian leader Gorbochev's head was the mark of the beast.

 

That's all just the tip of the iceberg, as it were, because there were so many other things put forth with just as much certainty as those today proclaim.

 

Now there has come a backlash where we have many who were raised hearing all these things who now have grown so skeptical they have little to do with Christianity or they have wrote it off entirely. There are many who grew up on "The Late Planet Earth" who bought into it so completely that once they could finally see how wrong the book was they grew greatly disillusioned. And yet another generation is going through much the same thing from the "Left Behind" mania.

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No, I don't think sitting in that rocker, blanket in place, with my Bible open to Revelation and the TV tuned to the news and a prophecy report newsletter at my side with do! :blink:

 

I was saved in 1981. As are most folks when they are first saved I had a great hunger to learn more of the Lord and His Word and grow in the Lord. At some point I came upon much of the prophecy focused stuff, much of it from the 70s, and then I kept adding more to it throughout the 80s and into the 90s.

 

The end time prophecy preachers and authors were all certain they were right, the end was just around the corner, probably this year or next, and they showed how the Bible clearly spoke about the Soviet Union and the Communist Bloc. They told of how the Bible spoke of the fall of America under President Carter and the rise of Iran at that time and both meant the end was at hand.

 

Then Reagan became president, Iran fell from the headlines, their stories changed. Later the Soviet Union collapsed, the Communist Bloc was gone and they scrambled to create new "certain" books of how the end would be. Then Saddam became the focus, but eventually he was killed and the stories changed yet again. Today most of them are saying they see "the war on terror" in the Bible and what they once ascribed to the Soviet Union they now place on "terrorist Islam".

 

There were even those who did calculations and came to the conclusion that Ronald Wilson Reagan was numerically 666. Meanwhile some others declared the birthmark on the Russian leader Gorbochev's head was the mark of the beast.

 

That's all just the tip of the iceberg, as it were, because there were so many other things put forth with just as much certainty as those today proclaim.

 

Now there has come a backlash where we have many who were raised hearing all these things who now have grown so skeptical they have little to do with Christianity or they have wrote it off entirely. There are many who grew up on "The Late Planet Earth" who bought into it so completely that once they could finally see how wrong the book was they grew greatly disillusioned. And yet another generation is going through much the same thing from the "Left Behind" mania.

I was joiking in my statement to you.  I know that wouldn't be you, John.

My husband has said almost the same thing.  He was saved when he was 14, and he is in his early mid 40's now.  When the Obama hysteria started, my husband went over almost exactly what you wrote above with me.  He even said that the Rapture was supposed to be in the Clinton years.  Well, we know that didn't happen.  Joe is adament about not speaking prophecy to people, b/c the world needs the Gospel, not talk of End Times.  He believes the world is laughing at believers for all this talk.  In fact, statistically speaking, people are not saved out of Bible prophecy.  Give out the Gospel of John and Romans to people, to plant seeds to be harvested by the Lord.  Go out soul winning, when the church is doing it.  People are hungry for the Word of God.  In fact, my church was out soul winning in my city a few months ago.  One citizen complained, so the city called my pastor.  We have our attorney working on it.  We believe that the Lord wants us to continue walking the streets, handing out John and Romans and giving Bible tracts and invitations to our church.  We believe it is Satan that is standing in the way.  I know it is, b/c everywhere I go in town, I witness to the lost.  They want to hear about Jesus Christ.  Talk about End Times scares people.  The news is enough for them.  They need the Word of God to bring them to salvation. 

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No, I don't think sitting in that rocker, blanket in place, with my Bible open to Revelation and the TV tuned to the news and a prophecy report newsletter at my side with do! :blink:

 

I was saved in 1981. As are most folks when they are first saved I had a great hunger to learn more of the Lord and His Word and grow in the Lord. At some point I came upon much of the prophecy focused stuff, much of it from the 70s, and then I kept adding more to it throughout the 80s and into the 90s.

 

The end time prophecy preachers and authors were all certain they were right, the end was just around the corner, probably this year or next, and they showed how the Bible clearly spoke about the Soviet Union and the Communist Bloc. They told of how the Bible spoke of the fall of America under President Carter and the rise of Iran at that time and both meant the end was at hand.

 

Then Reagan became president, Iran fell from the headlines, their stories changed. Later the Soviet Union collapsed, the Communist Bloc was gone and they scrambled to create new "certain" books of how the end would be. Then Saddam became the focus, but eventually he was killed and the stories changed yet again. Today most of them are saying they see "the war on terror" in the Bible and what they once ascribed to the Soviet Union they now place on "terrorist Islam".

 

There were even those who did calculations and came to the conclusion that Ronald Wilson Reagan was numerically 666. Meanwhile some others declared the birthmark on the Russian leader Gorbochev's head was the mark of the beast.

 

That's all just the tip of the iceberg, as it were, because there were so many other things put forth with just as much certainty as those today proclaim.

 

Now there has come a backlash where we have many who were raised hearing all these things who now have grown so skeptical they have little to do with Christianity or they have wrote it off entirely. There are many who grew up on "The Late Planet Earth" who bought into it so completely that once they could finally see how wrong the book was they grew greatly disillusioned. And yet another generation is going through much the same thing from the "Left Behind" mania.

John,

 

I was saved in 1955 at the age of 6. By the age of 13 I was studying bible prophecy.

 

2 Peter 3:10-14

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

 

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

 

12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

 

13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

 

14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

 

 

 

Understanding bible prophecy should cause Christians to work diligently for the night is coming.

 

I have been working for Jesus most of my life. I am not perfect though. In my 20s I cooled off. I warmed back up in my thirties and have been striving for the last 30 some years. I am a Gideon, deacon, Sunday school teacher and a businessman who pays for bible based radio and tv commercials for Jesus even though I love bible prophecy. So don't imply we who love bible prophecy, are not working for Jesus diligently.

 

I believe you are also working for Jesus diligently. Some have different callings.

 

Jude 1:22-23

21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

 

22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:

 

23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

 

Some will get saved because of the love of God and some will get saved because of  the fear of God.

 

At 6 years old I understood that I was a sinner and going to a burning hell if I didn’t repent and accept Jesus. Some will get saved if you tell them about prophecy. My friend did.

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But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them,
as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

 

Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.
For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night.
But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love;
and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.
For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
 
1 Thess 5:1-9  We are instructed to be aware of events occurring in the world, and prophetic scriptures.
Just because someone "writes a book", that does not relieve you of the personal responsibility to study yourself.
 
These Bereans were more noble than those in Thessalonica,
in that they received the word with all readiness of mind,
and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
Acts 17:11
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The work begun by "The Twelve" Jewish Apostles, as recorded in Acts, never was completed - they never "reached out" to every tribe, tongue, and nation.

Matthew 24 remains unfulfilled.  That is the purpose of the Tribulation - that Israeli Jews might fulfill the Great Commission by preaching (once again)

the Gospel of the Kingdom.  The last approximate 2,000 years have been a hiatus, a "parenthesis" in prophecy, in order that the Pauline Gospel of Grace be

spread to the Gentiles.  That is why Matthew 24 mentions specifically the "abomination of desolation" spoken by the Prophet Daniel.  Without a third Temple

there cannot be any "abomination" by the antichrist.  Clear evidence indicates that Revelation was written near the end of the first century and is yet future.

 

Scofield details the four different Gospels in his notes to Rev. 14. That seems to be the origin of that line of interpretation.

 

 

14:6  And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,

gospel

Gospel. This great theme may be summarized as follows:

I. In itself the word Gospel means good news.

II. Four forms of the Gospel are to be distinguished"

(1) The Gospel of the kingdom. This is the good news that God purposes to set up on the earth, in fulfilment of the Davidic Covenant 2 Samuel 7:16 a kingdom, political, spiritual, Israelitish, universal, over which God's Son, David's heir, shall be King, and which shall be, for one thousand years, the manifestation of the righteousness of God in human affairs. (See Scofield "Matthew 3:2") .

Two preachings of this Gospel are mentioned, one past, beginning with the ministry of John the Baptist, continued by our Lord and His disciples, and ending with the Jewis rejection of the King. The other is yet future Matthew 24:14 during the great tribulation, and immediately preceding the coming of the King in glory.

(2) The Gospel of the grace of God. This is the good news that Jesus Christ, the rejected King, has died on the cross for the sins of the world, that He was raised from the dead for our justification, and that by Him all that believe are justified from all things. This form of the Gospel is described in many ways. It is the Gospel "of God" Romans 1:1 because it originates in His love; "of Christ" 2 Corinthians 10:14 because it flows from His sacrifice, and because He is the alone Object of Gospel faith; of the "grace of God" Acts 20:24 because it saves those whom the law curses; of "the glory" ; 1 Timothy 1:11 ; 2 Corinthians 4:4 because it concerns Him who is in the glory, and who is bringing the many sons to glory Hebrews 2:10 of "our salvation" Ephesians 1:13 because it is the "power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth" Romans 1:16 of "the uncircumcision" Galatians 2:7 because it saves wholly apart from forms and ordinances of "peace" Ephesians 6:15 because through Christ it makes peace between the sinner and God, and imparts inward peace.

(3) The everlasting Gospel Revelation 14:6 . This is to be preached to the earth-dwellers at the very end of the great tribulation and immediately preceding the judgment of the nations Matthew 15:31 . It is neither the Gospel of the kingdom, nor of grace. Though its burden is judgment, not salvation, it is good news to Israel and to those who, during the tribulation, have been saved ; Revelation 7:9-14 ; Luke 21:28 ; Psalms 96:11-13 ; Isaiah 35:4-10 .

(4) That which Paul calls, "my Gospel" Romans 2:16 . This is the Gospel of the grace of God in its fullest development, but includes the revelation of the result of that Gospel in the outcalling of the church, her relationships, position, privileges, and responsibility. It is the distinctive truth of Ephesians and Colossians, but interpenetrates all of Paul's writings.

 

While few of the contributors to the forum acknowledge their debt to Scofield for their theology, I think it likely that when it became necessary to establish the "fundamentals of the faith" Scofield became the standard one-volume commentary issued to & by the Bible colleges. (I understand free issue.) His teaching & his errors thus became widely accepted by Bible-believing Christians, & are obviously still very strongly held.

 

One extraordinary assertion is that the everlasting Gospel "is neither the Gospel of the kingdom, nor of grace." Presumably also it has nothing to do with "the everlasting covenant" as Scofield has no notes for that reference. (Heb. 13) His very strange thinking is evident on this forum.

 

Paul wrote of the Gospel preached to Abraham (Gal. 3) - but why does Scofield not consider that to be preaching THE Gospel (as Paul refers to it.)

 

20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant, 21 make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen. (Heb. 13)

 

Gal. 3:Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness. Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

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John,

 

I was saved in 1955 at the age of 6. By the age of 13 I was studying bible prophecy.

 

2 Peter 3:10-14

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

 

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

 

12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

 

13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

 

14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

 

 

 

Understanding bible prophecy should cause Christians to work diligently for the night is coming.

 

I have been working for Jesus most of my life. I am not perfect though. In my 20s I cooled off. I warmed back up in my thirties and have been striving for the last 30 some years. I am a Gideon, deacon, Sunday school teacher and a businessman who pays for bible based radio and tv commercials for Jesus even though I love bible prophecy. So don't imply we who love bible prophecy, are not working for Jesus diligently.

 

I believe you are also working for Jesus diligently. Some have different callings.

 

Jude 1:22-23

21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

 

22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:

 

23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

 

Some will get saved because of the love of God and some will get saved because of  the fear of God.

 

At 6 years old I understood that I was a sinner and going to a burning hell if I didn’t repent and accept Jesus. Some will get saved if you tell them about prophecy. My friend did.

 

Brother, Eric... I am not saying that no one has ever got saved with Bible prophecy.  I am saying that "most" people get saved when presented with the gospel alone, not prophecy.

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Brother, Eric... I am not saying that no one has ever got saved with Bible prophecy.  I am saying that "most" people get saved when presented with the gospel alone, not prophecy.

Candlelight,

 

I was talking to John81. He finds little value in watching for the signs given in bible prophecy. I was trying to explain to him that a person can be both interested in prophecy and a soul winner. You have always been kind and encouraging.

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Candlelight,

 

I was talking to John81. He finds little value in watching for the signs given in bible prophecy. I was trying to explain to him that a person can be both interested in prophecy and a soul winner. You have always been kind and encouraging.

Oh, Okay.  I like Bible prophecy, however, I got too caught up with it last year.  I am taking a break from it for awhile.  Thank you, brother.  You are also kind and encouraging.  :)

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There IS little value in watching for signs. We know Christ is going to return. We know He could return at any time. Therefore we should be busy about the Father's business. There is no need to look for signs.

John,

What you said is true. But the signs are not for the appearing or rapture. The significance of the signs are that since the day of the Lord is coming soon the appearing of Christ must be even sooner. For me that is exciting like waiting for Christmas for children.

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Eric: But the signs are not for the appearing or rapture. The significance of the signs are that since the day of the Lord is coming soon the appearing of Christ must be even sooner. For me that is exciting like waiting for Christmas for children.

"Appearing", "rapture", "day of the Lord", "Christmas" ... are there different signs for the various events on your calendar? And what action do you take when you see a specific sign, other than continuing to serve the Lord? Many people have got excited, even written books & made films which have got others excited - a bit like Narnia - always winter, but never Christmas. But, Jesus actually warned that all the events now interpreted as "signs" were NOT!

 

Mat. 24:And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world? And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many. And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. All these are the beginning of sorrows.

 

The work begun by "The Twelve" Jewish Apostles, as recorded in Acts, never was completed - they never "reached out" to every tribe, tongue, and nation.

Matthew 24 remains unfulfilled.  That is the purpose of the Tribulation - that Israeli Jews might fulfill the Great Commission by preaching (once again)

the Gospel of the Kingdom.  The last approximate 2,000 years have been a hiatus, a "parenthesis" in prophecy, in order that the Pauline Gospel of Grace be

spread to the Gentiles.  That is why Matthew 24 mentions specifically the "abomination of desolation" spoken by the Prophet Daniel.  Without a third Temple

there cannot be any "abomination" by the antichrist.  Clear evidence indicates that Revelation was written near the end of the first century and is yet future.

 

Mat. 24:Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name’s sake. 10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. 11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. 12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. 13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

 

So, you believe that the Gospel of the Kingdom has NOT been preached for the last 2,000 years, presumably from the time when Stephen was martyred & Cornelius converted. But if, as you assert, the Gospel preached during the present age - the age of the "Pauline Gospel of Grace" - then this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations is NOT being preached, so the end CANNOT come.

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