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    • By Jim_Alaska in Jim_Alaska's Sermons & Devotionals
         33
      Closed Communion
      James Foley
       
      I Corinthians 11:17-34: "Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse. For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it. For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you. When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's Supper. For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken. What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not. For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread: And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me. After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me. For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do show the Lord's death till he come. Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep. For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged. But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world. Wherefore, my brethren, when ye come together to eat, tarry one for another. And if any man hunger, let him eat at home; that ye come not together unto condemnation. And the rest will I set in order when I come."

      INTRODUCTION

      Historic Baptists, true Baptists, have believed in and still believe in closed communion. Baptists impose upon themselves the same restrictions that they impose on others concerning the Lord’s Supper. Baptists have always insisted that it is the Lord’s Table, not theirs; and He alone has the right to say who shall sit at His table. No amount of so called brotherly love, or ecumenical spirit, should cause us to invite to His table those who have not complied with the requirements laid down plainly in His inspired Word. With respect to Bible doctrines we must always use the scripture as our guide and practice. For Baptists, two of the most important doctrines are Baptism and The Lord’s Supper. These are the only two doctrines we recognize as Church Ordinances. The Bible is very clear in teaching how these doctrines are to be practiced and by whom.

      We only have two ordinances that we must never compromise or we risk our very existence, they are Baptism and The Lord’s Supper.

      The moment we deviate from the precise method God has prescribed we have started down the slippery slope of error. True Baptists have held fast to the original doctrine of The Lord’s Supper from the time of Christ and the Apostles.

      Unfortunately, in this day of what the Bible describes as the age of luke warmness, Baptists are becoming careless in regard to strictly following the pattern laid out for us in Scripture. Many of our Bible colleges are graduating otherwise sincere, Godly and dedicated pastors and teachers who have not been taught the very strict, biblical requirements that surround the Lord’s Supper. Any Bible college that neglects to teach its students the differences surrounding Closed Communion, Close Communion and Open Communion is not simply short changing its students; it is also not equipping their students to carry on sound Bible traditions. The result is men of God and churches that fall into error. And as we will see, this is serious error.

      Should we as Baptists ignore the restrictions made by our Lord and Master? NO! When we hold to the restrictions placed upon the Lord’s Supper by our Master, we are defending the "faith which was once delivered to the saints" Jude 3.

      The Lord’s Supper is rigidly restricted and I will show this in the following facts:

      IT IS RESTRICTED AS TO PLACE

      A. I Corinthians 11:18 says, "When ye come together in the church." This does not mean the church building; they had none. In other words, when the church assembles. The supper is to be observed by the church, in church capacity. Again this does not mean the church house. Ekklesia, the Greek word for church, means assembly. "When ye come together in the church," is when the church assembles.

      B. When we say church we mean an assembly of properly baptized believers. Acts 2:41-42: "Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers."

      The church is made up of saved people who are baptized by immersion. In the Bible, belief precedes baptism. That’s the Bible way.

      Acts 8:12-13, "But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women. Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done."

      When we say properly baptized, we mean immersed. No unbeliever should take the Lord’s supper, and no non-immersed believer should take the supper. Those who are sprinkled are not baptized and cannot receive the supper. The Greek word for baptize is baptizo, and it always means to immerse.

      "In every case where communion is referred to, or where it may possibly have been administered, the believers had been baptized Acts 2:42; 8:12; 8:38; 10:47; 6:14-15; 18:8; 20:7. Baptism comes before communion, just as repentance and faith precede baptism".

      C. The Lord’s Supper is for baptized believers in church capacity: "When ye come together in the church," again not a building, but the assembly of the properly baptized believers.

      D. The fact that the Lord’s Supper is a church ordinance, to be observed in church capacity, is pointed out by the fact that it is for those who have been immersed and added to the fellowship of the church.

      E. The Lord’s Supper is never spoken of in connection with individuals. When it is referred to, it is only referred to in reference to baptized believers in local church capacity I Cor. 11:20-26).

      I want to quote Dr. W.W. Hamilton,

      "The individual administration of the ordinance has no Bible warrant and is a relic of Romanism. The Lord’s Supper is a church ordinance, and anything which goes beyond or comes short of this fails for want of scriptural example or command".

      “The practice of taking a little communion kit to hospitals, nursing homes, etc. is unscriptural and does not follow the scriptural example.”

      IT IS RESTRICTED TO A UNITED CHURCH

      A. The Bible in I Cor. 11:18 is very strong in condemning divisions around the Lord’s table. For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
      19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
      20 When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's supper.

      There were no less than four divisions in the Corinthian church.
      I Cor. 1:12: "Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ."

      Because of these divisions, it was impossible for them to scripturally eat the Lord’s Supper. Division in the local church is reason to hold off observing the Lord’s Supper. But there are also other reasons to forego taking the Lord’s Supper. If there is gross sin in the membership we do not take it. Here is scriptural evidence for this: 1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our Passover is sacrificed for us:
      8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. 9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
      10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. 11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

      B. At this point, I want to ask these questions: Are there not doctrinal divisions among the many denominations? Is it not our doctrinal differences that cause us to be separate religious bodies?

      IT IS RESTRICTED BY DOCTRINE

      A. Those in the early church at Jerusalem who partook "continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine" Acts 2:42. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

      B. Those that do not hold to apostolic truth are not to partake. This means there is to be discipline in the local body. How can you discipline those who do not belong to the local body? You can’t. The clear command of scripture is to withdraw fellowship from those who are not doctrinally sound.

      II Thes 3:6: "Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us."
      Rom. 16:17: "Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them."
      To commune together means to have the same doctrine.
      II Thes. 2:15: "Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle."
      II John 10-11: "If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."

      C. Some Baptists in our day have watered down this doctrine by practicing what they call “Close Communion.” By this they mean that they believe that members of another Baptist church may take communion with us because they are of the same beliefs. Once again, this is unscriptural.

      The welcome to the Lord's Table should not be extended beyond the discipline of the local church. When we take the Lord’s Supper there is supposed to be no gross sin among us and no divisions among us. We have no idea of the spiritual condition of another church’s members. If there is sin or division in the case of this other church’s members, we have no way of knowing it. We cannot discipline them because they are not members of our church. This is why we practice “Closed” communion, meaning it is restricted solely to our church membership. 
      So then, in closing I would like to reiterate the three different ideas concerning the Lord’s Supper and who is to take it. 
      Closed Communion = Only members of a single local church. 
      Close Communion = Members of like faith and order may partake. 
      Open Communion = If you claim to be a Christian, or simply attending the service, you may partake. 
      It is no small thing to attempt to change that which was implemented by our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. 
      Mt. 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. 
      Many of our Baptist churches have a real need to consider the gravity of the act of observing The Lord’s Supper. It is not a light thing that is to be taken casually or without regard to the spiritual condition of ourselves or our church.
      1Co. 11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.

       28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.

       29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

       30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

Way Of Life - Bill Gaither's Disobedience To God's Word


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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Another Baptist history book I enjoyed was "What Hath God Wrought" by Dr. William P. Grady. The subtitle of the book is, "A Biblical Interpretation of American History".

Oh, I have heard of that book John.  I believe my in-laws have it.  I have to get my hands on it and read it soon.  Thanks for the suggestion, brother.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Oh, I have heard of that book John.  I believe my in-laws have it.  I have to get my hands on it and read it soon.  Thanks for the suggestion, brother.

 

I just noticed the other book you suggested.  I haven't heard of that one.  Sound like a really great historical account of American Christianity.

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  • Advanced Member

I am a Christian first, and a proud IFB, second.  I know for a fact the the Baptists can trace their roots back to the early church as mentioned in the Book of Acts, where 3,000 souls were saved an added to the church.  This was prior to Pentacost. 

The Roman government and the Roman Catholic Church were murderers in those days.  They referred to the early Christians, as "Anabaptists" b/c they refused infant baptism, as it is not Biblical.  The Roman Emperor, Constantine, a pagan initiated the sacrament of "Infant Baptism."  Constantine was a pagan, like his dad.  His mother, Helena, was a Hebrew Christian.  My IFB church, along with other Independent Fundamental Baptist Churches hold strongly to the church doctine as stated in the Book of Acts.  Anabaptists were fed to the lions, slaughtered, had their heads chopped off, were tarred and feathered as they gave their lives to Jesus Christ.  The Baptist name has been around a very long long time.  There are various types of Baptists, as well.  In fact, before this country was founded, the Sephardic Jews (dark skinned Jews who immigrated from Spain), the American Indians... who were part Asian, and the Primitive Baptists lived on American soil before Columbus discovered America..  It is the Baptists that founded America.  Baptist, world history, is quite phenominal... as well.  Baptists are also the largest Christian denomination in America.  While Islam is the fastest growing religion, many Muslims are coming to Christ daily.  The Vatican claims that the RCC has the most members.  They do not.  They are going by the numbers of "infant baptisms" as all Roman Catholics, fall away Roman Catholics, and Roman Catholics who have been saved... have their names recorded in the Vatican records.  Back to Baptists.  I have mentioned this a few times before, but a good book to read is called, "AMERICA in Crimson Red" by Dr. James Beller.  Brother Beller is a IFB pastor and historical writer of Baptist history.  Baptists shed their blood and lives on American soil.  Also, another great writer is a man named, William J. Federer.  He wrote a Book called, "America's God and Country."  Brother Federer has a wonderful historical program on T.V. called, "Faith in History."  You don't need Satelite T.V. to watch his program.  It is a wonderful walk through American Christian history.   

This is all so incredible! Never heard that before.  Baptists founded America??? I have been attending an IFB church now for 6 years and I've heard some things I've never heard before.  Baptists are not protestant, music is not worship, if you don't tithe, you're under a curse, women can 't even pray in a service, baptists go all the way back to John the Baptist, and the autonomy of the local church.  It's all pretty hard to believe.  And, I think whether I believe that or not, it won't have any effect on eternity.

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Baptists definitely were not Protestant.  Protestants were those who came out of the Catholic church, protesting against it.

Baptists were never part of the Catholic Church.

Depending on the style of music, I would have to say it is worship but either worshiping God or a false god or satan himself.

The curse for not tithing was upon Israel.  There is no Scripture that says one will be cursed today for not tithing.  We cannot be cursed today for not keeping the Law (which tithing was a part of, and which was abolished by Jesus Christ)

Women can pray in a service.  Paul told the saints at Corinth that when a woman prayed or prophesied she must have her head covered though.

Baptist's cannot trace their roots back to John the Baptist.  They may like to think the do, but they can't.trace back to John the Baptist.  John was a Levite.  The Levitical genealogy was destroyed in 70 A.D..  No one can trace back to John for this reason.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I don't believe it is correct to say that Baptist "founded" America - that is a stretch.  I believe it is more accurate to say that the Baptists had an extremely strong influence during the formative days of America, and played an important role during the Revolutionary Era.

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I don't believe it is correct to say that Baptist "founded" America - that is a stretch.  I believe it is more accurate to say that the Baptists had an extremely strong influence during the formative days of America, and played an important role during the Revolutionary Era.

Correct - as well as great influence on the Constitution, with particular emphasis on the Bill of Rights.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

This is all so incredible! Never heard that before.  Baptists founded America??? I have been attending an IFB church now for 6 years and I've heard some things I've never heard before.  Baptists are not protestant, music is not worship, if you don't tithe, you're under a curse, women can 't even pray in a service, baptists go all the way back to John the Baptist, and the autonomy of the local church.  It's all pretty hard to believe.  And, I think whether I believe that or not, it won't have any effect on eternity.

 

Now be sure to remember just because you've not heard of something does not mean its not true.

 

I've been a Baptist by choice since 1961 & I have not heard everything, & when something new comes along I check it out before believe or unbelieving.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I don't believe it is correct to say that Baptist "founded" America - that is a stretch.  I believe it is more accurate to say that the Baptists had an extremely strong influence during the formative days of America, and played an important role during the Revolutionary Era.

 

True.

 

In early American the Baptist were persecuted.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Maybe we should just call ourselves Christians and let the chips from the outside world fall where they may.

I have been saying that all along...somewhere on this forum.  :-)

 

Acts 11:26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

We're Baptists by distinction and conviction.  Everyone who believes IN Jesus Christ calls themselves Christians, even JWs, Mormons and Catholics and especially those false converts at the rock-n-roll churches.  

 

To further distinguish ourselves as Bible believing Baptists from all the liberal baptists we call ourselves, generally speaking, Independent, Fundamental, Soul-Winning Baptists!

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

We're Baptists by distinction and conviction.  Everyone who believes IN Jesus Christ calls themselves Christians, even JWs, Mormons and Catholics and especially those false converts at the rock-n-roll churches.  

 

To further distinguish ourselves as Bible believing Baptists from all the liberal baptists we call ourselves, generally speaking, Independent, Fundamental, Soul-Winning Baptists!

Well then that's why I say I am a Christian and go to an IFB church.  I think my point is that I am Christian first or a "believer." I'm probably gonna get stoned here but I don't agree with every single thing the IFB church teaches.  I don't think there is one single church on this earth that teaches 100% accurate truths.  Even reading posts on this forum on different topics, all the Baptists here can't seem to agree with each other.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I believe we need to be careful not to let "labeling" baptists destroy us from within. We have IB (Independent Baptist) and IFB (Independent Fundamental Baptist) and

OFIFB (Old Fashioned Independent Fundamental Baptist). Needless to say there will be more coming down the road. Maybe we should just call ourselves Christians and let the chips from the outside world fall where they may.

 

Your welcome to set by quietly letting the false teaches lead many souls to Hell & let all of them continue on their evil path, that's exactly what Mr. Billy Graham has done while teaching everyone possible to do the same never pointing out their false teachings, while wishing them God speed.

 

But as for me I will try as best I can to hold to God's way proclaiming His truths to all possible as did Peter & the others, Ac 5:29.

 

We are to stand only on God's truths, warn of false teachers, & warn the false teachers if possible & we will be held accountable by Our Savior.

 

The Bible is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works, 2 Timothy 3:16,17.

 

We have no example in the Bible where Jesus nor His twelve set quietly letting the chips fall wherever, no, they spoke truth & warned everyone they could.

 

If Jesus had of done as you say the world would not have hated Him.

 

A quote I've place in our bulletin for this Sunday.

 

         What It cost To be Faithful
 
  It cost Abraham the yielding up of his only son.
  It cost Esther the risk of her life.
  It cost Daniel being cast into the den of lions,
  It cost Shadrach, me shack, and Abednego being put in a fiery furnace.
  It cost Stephen his life by stoning.
  It cost Peter a martyr’s death.
  What does it cost you? Or does it cost you nothing?

 

And may I add to the quote above, what price have you paid for being faithful to our Lord? If you set quietly by letting chips fall where they may there will be no cost.  Thank goodness everyone did not do that way, if they did I would more than likely along with many others be lost in my sins on the road to Hell never having heard of Him.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

As Bro Matt has made clear many times, one doesn't have to attend an IFB church to be IFB. Plus, I've also pointed out to you that I'm a member of the IFB church whose IFB pastor baptized me many years ago.

 

You certainly make a lot of assumptions. Your declaring that attending a nondenominational church makes me prejudice is a very prejudicial statement in and of itself. In your declaration your wrongly prejudge myself, and in your ignorance (it's true meaning, not a slur) you prejudge a church you know nothing about. In casting such disparaging comments you are casting our Baptist pastors in an ill light, as well as my IFB pastor which fully, without reservation, endorses that nondenominational church and her Baptist pastors.

 

You have yet to even come up with an answer as to how my post put down IFBs. Yet you make a baseless charge and then proceed to attack my character, the character of a church you know nothing about, and three fine Baptist pastors.  

 

I'm not going to debate this with you, I told you that every time you point out only Baptist & I see it, I will point it out.

 

So please, when I do, please try not to put words in my mouth that I did not say trying to carry what I've state to places I did not point to.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I'm not going to debate this with you, I told you that every time you point out only Baptist & I see it, I will point it out.

 

So please, when I do, please try not to put words in my mouth that I did not say trying to carry what I've state to places I did not point to.

You attack for no reason and are inconsistent in your stance on the matter.

 

If you wish to point out every time I mention Baptists, you are free to do so. As this is a mostly Baptist site and I'm a Baptist I'm going to be mentioning Baptists rather often.

 

Don't forget that Billy Graham is a Baptist, as is Charles Stanley, as was Adrian Rogers, Charles Haddon Spurgeon, John R. Rice, Curtis Hutson, Hyles and so many others; along with Paul Chappell, Shelton Smith, me and you and several others right here.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I believe you are right. I think it is prideful to say any one church has everything all together.

 

Think about this, God gave us His Word, & He told us to:

 

2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

 

Study it to show our self approved to Him so that we can rightly divide the word of the truth.

 

He also told us.

 

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
 
This Word he has given us in the Holy Bible is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
 
There is not many right ways. Things that are different are not the same. All churches cannot be right if they teaching all sort of different teachings.
 
And Jesus told us very plain.
 
Joh 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
 
That His Father is seeking those that will worship Him in spirit & truth.
 
And if you will notice Jesus & His called pointed out false teachers, & hoped by pointing to the truth they would stop teaching doctrine of man for commandments of God & at the same time warning the saved not to follow the false teachers.
 
Mr 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
 
The large majority of churches in this country teaches that man is saved by works, baptizing, being a member of a certain church. When its a Bible fact there's only one way to be saved, & its by grace though faith in Jesus Christ, not of self, not of works.
 
As for me I will warn as many people as I can, not out of pride, out of dedication to my Father, & Savior, & not wanting any to go to Hell, & I sure do not want to wish false teachers God speed nor encourage then in their false teachings.
 
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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Replying to above posts....God gave us the the Bible...not commanded us to become Baptists.  There are saved in many denominations because it is a a matter of the heart not what we label ourselves.  As far as Peter goes, he had to publicly be rebuked by Paul because of hypocrisy not wanting to eat with gentiles because they weren't circumcised, even though he knew better and had nothing to do with salvation but was worried about what "man" thought.  So, even in the early church there was hypocrisy and by those who walked physically with Jesus.   

Edited by LauraJones
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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Well then that's why I say I am a Christian and go to an IFB church.  I think my point is that I am Christian first or a "believer." I'm probably gonna get stoned here but I don't agree with every single thing the IFB church teaches.  I don't think there is one single church on this earth that teaches 100% accurate truths.  Even reading posts on this forum on different topics, all the Baptists here can't seem to agree with each other.

 

You must be referring to your church because there is no IFB Church as a denomination.  Some are little more than cults (not Baptist anymore), others have gone the way of the emergents (not IFB anymore) and many cling to the King James Bible and teach and preach their members from it.  The enemies of the Baptists have themselves said that we are the ones who most closely follow the Scriptures for all matters of faith and practice.

 

You're right, there is not yet one local church that 100% accurate because there are no 100% perfect people yet.  

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

You must be referring to your church because there is no IFB Church as a denomination.  Some are little more than cults (not Baptist anymore), others have gone the way of the emergents (not IFB anymore) and many cling to the King James Bible and teach and preach their members from it.  The enemies of the Baptists have themselves said that we are the ones who most closely follow the Scriptures for all matters of faith and practice.

 

You're right, there is not yet one local church that 100% accurate because there are no 100% perfect people yet.  

Baptist is a denominational name. If not, then all IFB churches are nondenominational churches.

 

Only two IFB churches in this area still use the KJB. One has chosen to die out with its elderly members (the youngest members are in their 60s) rather than welcome new folks into their church; the other has chose to move in a more ecumenical and "seeker friendly" direction. 

 

Indeed, while not 100% (none can attain such in this world) perfect, there are yet many biblically sound Baptist churches with good pastors endeavoring to be faithful to the Word, serving Christ.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

You must be referring to your church because there is no IFB Church as a denomination.  Some are little more than cults (not Baptist anymore), others have gone the way of the emergents (not IFB anymore) and many cling to the King James Bible and teach and preach their members from it.  The enemies of the Baptists have themselves said that we are the ones who most closely follow the Scriptures for all matters of faith and practice.

 

You're right, there is not yet one local church that 100% accurate because there are no 100% perfect people yet.  

My church says they're not a denomination.  They are not under a hierarchy.  However, I don't recall saying they were but that there were saved people in many denominations.  I don't have to call myself a Baptist or any other name to prove I am a Christian.  That's one of the things I don't agree with.  I don't believe the KJV is the only preserved English translated Bible.  Out of respect for this forum and its rules, I post KJ if I use scripture but I use different translations in my studies as well as KJ and have not found discrepancies yet.  Nothing of significance that changes the meaning of what is being said.  Bibles are still being translated today in other languages for other countries so why can't we have new translations from the English language that was used in the 1600's?  And the wearing of skirts?  How ridiculous to say that a women is dressed modestly because they wear a skirt.  Even unsaved women do that so how do you make the distinction?  Our style of clothing has changed, our language and our music.  Some of the Baptist churches need to get out of past eras.  One of our women's classes was on homemaking.  I felt like I was in a 1950's home economics class.  I need some meat, but unfortunately one can only go to whatever churches are available in the area.

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    • Razor

      “Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to reform (or pause and reflect).”
      ― Mark Twain
      · 0 replies
    • Razor

      “Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to reform (or pause and reflect).”
      ― Mark Twain
      · 1 reply
    • Razor

      Psalms 139 Psalm 139:9-10
      9. If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; 10. even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy righthand shall hold me. 
       
      · 0 replies
    • Bro. West  »  Pastor Scott Markle

      Advanced revelation, then...prophecy IS advanced revelation in the context of the apostles.
      I really do not know where you are going with this. The Bible itself has revelations and prophecies and not all revelations are prophecies.
      Paul had things revealed to him that were hid and unknown that the Gentiles would be fellow heirs.
      How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words, Eph 3:3-9
      And I do not mean this as a Hyper-dispensationalist would, for there were people in Christ before Paul (Rom. 16:7). This is not prophecy for there are none concerning the Church age in the O.T..
      Israel rejected the New Wine (Jesus Christ) and said the Old Wine (law) was better, had they tasted the New Wine there would be no church age or mystery as spoken above. to be revealed.
      It was a revealed mystery. Sure there are things concerning the Gentiles after the this age. And we can now see types in the Old Testament (Boaz and Ruth) concerning a Gentile bride, but this is hindsight.
      Peter could have had a ham sandwich in Acts 2, but he did not know it till later, by revelation. But this has nothing to do with 1John 2;23 and those 10 added words in italics. Where did they get them? Did the violate Pro. 30:6 Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar. Where did they get this advance revelation? Was it from man, God or the devil?
        I just read your comment and you bypassed what I wrote concerning book arrangement, chapters being added and verse numberings and such. There is no scripture support for these either, should we reject these?
      Happy New Year
      · 0 replies
    • Bro. West

      Seeing it is Christ----mas time and I was answering question on Luke 2:33 concerning Jesus, Mary and Joseph . I thought it would be fitting to display a poem i wrote concerning the matter.
      SCRIPTURAL MARY

      I WALK NOT ON WATER NOR CHANGE IT TO WINE
      SO HEARKEN O’ SINNER TO THIS STORY OF MINE
      I, AM A DAUGHTER OF ABRAHAM SINNER BY BIRTH
      A HAND MAID OF LOW ESTATE USED HERE ON EARTH
      MY HAIR IS NOT GENTILE BLOND, I HAVE NOT EYES OF BLUE
      A MOTHER OF MANY CHILDREN A DAUGHTER OF A JEW
      FOR JOSEPH MY HUSBAND DID HONOUR OUR BED
      TO FATHER OUR CHILDREN WHO NOW ARE ALL DEAD
      BUT I SPEAK NOT OF THESE WHO I LOVED SO WELL
      BUT OF THE FIRST BORN WHICH SAVED ME FROM HELL
      MY FLESH SAW CORRUPTION MY BONES THEY DID ROT
      MY PAPS ARE NOT HOLY SO TRUST ME NOT
                                               2
      WHEN I WAS A VIRGIN UNKNOWN BY MAN
      THE ANGEL OF GOD SPOKE OF GOD’S PLAN
      FOR I HAD BEEN CHOSEN A FAVOUR VESSEL OF CLAY
      TO BARE THE SON OF THE HIGHEST BY AN UNUSUAL WAY
      FOR THE SCRIPTURE FORETOLD OF WHAT WAS TO BE
      SO MY WOMB GOD FILLED WHEN HE OVER SHADOW ME
      BUT THE LAW OF MOSES DID DEMAND MY LIFE
      WOULD JOSEPH MY BETROTHED MAKE ME HIS WIFE
      I THOUGHT ON THESE THINGS WITH SO NEEDLESS FEARS
      BUT A DREAM HE RECEIVED ENDED ALL FEARS
      MY FLESH SAW CORRUPTION MY BONES THEY DID ROT
      MY PAPS ARE NOT HOLY SO TRUST ME NOT
                                              3
      THEN MY SOUL DID REJOICE IN GOD MY SAVIOR
      HE SCATTERED THE PROUD AND BLESS ME WITH FAVOR
      O’ THE RICH ARE EMPTY, THE HUNGRY HAVE GOOD THINGS
      FOR THE THRONE OF DAVID WOULD HAVE JESUS THE KING
      BUT BEFORE I DELIVERED THE MAN CHILD OF OLD
      CAESAR WITH TAXES DEMANDED OUR GOLD
      TO THE CITY OF DAVID JOSEPH AND I WENT
      ON A BEAST OF BURDEN OUR STRENGTH NEAR SPEND
      NO ROOM AT An INN, BUT A STABLE WAS FOUND
      WITH STRAW AND DUNG LAID ON THE GROUND
      MY FLESH SAW CORRUPTION MY BONES THEY DID ROT
      MY PAPS ARE NOT HOLY, SO TRUST ME NOT
                                                  4
      MY MATRIX WAS OPEN IN A PLACE SO PROFANE
      FROM THE GLORY OF GLORIES TO A BEGGAR’S DOMAIN
      SO WE WRAPPED THE CHILD GIVEN TO THE HEATHEN A STRANGER
      NO REPUTATION IS SOUGHT TO BE BORN IN A MANGER
      HIS STAR WAS ABOVE US THE HOST OF HEAVEN DID SING
      FOR SHEPHERDS AND WISE MEN WORSHIP ONLY THE KING
      BUT HEROD THAT DEVIL SOUGHT FOR HIS SOUL
      AND MURDER RACHEL’S CHILDREN UNDER TWO YEARS OLD
      BUT JOSEPH MY HUSBAND WAS WARNED IN A DREAM
      SO WE FLED INTO EGYPT BECAUSE OF HIS SCHEME
      MY FLESH SAW CORRUPTION MY BONES THEY DID ROT
      MY PAPS ARE NOT HOLY SO TRUST ME NOT
                                               5
      SO THE GIVER OF LIFE, THE ROCK OF ALL AGES
      GREW UP TO FULFILL THE HOLY PAGES
      HE PREACH WITH AUTHORITY LIKE NONE BEFORE
      PLEASE TRUST HIS WORDS AND NOT THE GREAT WHORE
      HER BLACK ROBE PRIEST FILL THEIR LIPS WITH MY NAME
      WITH BLASPHEMOUS PRAISE, DAMMATION AND SHAME
      THERE ARE NO NAIL PRINTS IN MY HANDS, MY BODY DID NOT ARISE
      NOR, AM A DEMON OF FATIMA FLOATING IN THE SKY
      THERE IS NO DEITY IN MY VEINS FOR ADAM CAME FROM SOD
      FOR I, AM, MOTHER OF THE SON OF MAN NOT THE MOTHER OF GOD
      MY FLESH SAW CORRUPTION MY BONES THEY DID ROT
      MY PAPS ARE NOT HOLY, SO TRUST ME NOT
      6
      FOR MY SOUL WAS PURCHASED BY GOD UPON THE CROSS
      FOR MY SINS HE DID SUFFER AN UNMEASURABLE COST
      I WILL NOT STEAL HIS GLORY WHO ROSE FROM THE DEAD
      ENDURING SPIT AND THORNS PLACED ON HIS HEAD
      YET, IF YOU WISH TO HONOR ME THEN GIVE ME NONE AT ALL
      BUT TRUST THE LAMB WHO STOOL IN PILATE’S HALL
      CALL NOT ON THIS REDEEMED WOMAN IN YOUR TIME OF FEAR
      FOR I WILL NOT GIVE ANSWER NEITHER WILL I HEAR
      AND WHEN THE BOOKS ARE OPEN AT THE GREAT WHITE THRONE
      I AMEN YOUR DAMNATION THAT TRUST NOT HIM ALONE
      MY FLESH SAW CORRUPTION MY BONES THEY DID ROT
      MY PAPS ARE NOT HOLY, O’ SINNER TRUST ME NOT

                       WRITTEN BY BRO. WEST
       
      · 0 replies
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