Echoes Through The Ages

[1Timothy115]

Do you think the scriptures below show any relationship to the United States today, how?

Proverbs 17:15 He that justifieth the wicked, and he that condemneth the just, even they both are abomination to the LORD.

Proverbs 18:5 It is not good to accept the person of the wicked, to overthrow the righteous in judgment.

[John81]

There is no doubt America not only tolerates wickedness but now embraces wickedness, promotes wickedness and works to thrust wickedness upon others.

Wickedness is not only promoted here in America, but America exports wickedness abroad. American porn floods the world. Perverse American music and movies flood the world. When it comes to governmental matters, the American government pushes feminism, abortion and acceptance of homosexuality in countries that don't already embrace these.

At the same time efforts are underway to diminish and silence true Christianity in America and to ignore it elsewhere. Meanwhile, false religions are given support, even when these false religions persecute Christians.

As all this goes on most Americans think they are better than others, they are filled with pride. In their arrogant pride they dare proclaim or sing "God bless America" as if God owes it to us. How sinful to ask God's blessings upon our wickedness! How much more we should be dropping to our knees with our eyes filled with tears of repentance asking God to forgive us, to create in us new hearts and to turn those hearts to following Him.

[Covenanter]

I do not think any nation is significant in the New Covenant/Gospel age.

However, if the authorities in a nation acknowledge God & seek to act according to his laws, & allow free preaching of the Gospel & conversion, etc, then such a nation is likely to know God's blessing. The converse applies.

[John81]

I do not think any nation is significant in the New Covenant/Gospel age.

However, if the authorities in a nation acknowledge God & seek to act according to his laws, & allow free preaching of the Gospel & conversion, etc, then such a nation is likely to know God's blessing. The converse applies.

Agreed. I don't think any particular nation is "above" any other, but all nations are equal with regard to what brings about blessings or cursings.

[1Timothy115]

I do not think any nation is significant in the New Covenant/Gospel age.

However, if the authorities in a nation acknowledge God & seek to act according to his laws, & allow free preaching of the Gospel & conversion, etc, then such a nation is likely to know God's blessing. The converse applies.

Do you know of a nation that fits all the criteria you mentioned above?

[HappyChristian]

Do you know of a nation that fits all the criteria you mentioned above?

America did, once upon a time.

[John81]

America did, once upon a time.

Once upon a time, just as with ancient Israel, and just as with ancient Israel, it would seem our blessings are running out and cursings are multiplying. How long before America is crushed under the weight of her own wickedness?

[JerryNumbers]

Right on, America once did, but not now, this nation is stepping away from God quite fast while making sins against God legal. Sad, America does not understand what happens to the one that mocks God.

Ga 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

America will not be happy about what she reaps.

[Ocracoke_Pelican]

I think those verses are certainly both relevant. This subject makes me think more about "itchy ears" and 2 Timothy: 1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; 2 preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long-suffering and doctrine. 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 and they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

Boy. If that doesn't describe what I am seeing in my little corner of the nation nothing does.

The Americans with "itchy ears" are beginning to outnumber the Americans who filter questions of "right” and “wrong” through the Scriptures. Those with itchy ears want to hear that sinfulness is not sinfulness any more. And their number now include leaders and members of many churches who are picking and choosing which parts of Scripture to believe -- or worse yet, making up their own religion and selling it like snakeoil to those who are searching for the light.

And those itchy-eared folks, both inside and outside of churches, have escalated their demands. They now not only want to saturate society with open sinfulness but are now insisting (through laws and public education) that everyone conform their opinion to the "new norm" and agree that sinfulness is okay. Good grief!

This is one more step toward silencing Christians.

[Guest]

I think those verses are certainly both relevant. This subject makes me think more about "itchy ears" and 2 Timothy: 1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; 2 preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long-suffering and doctrine. 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 and they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

Boy. If that doesn't describe what I am seeing in my little corner of the nation nothing does.

The Americans with "itchy ears" are beginning to outnumber the Americans who filter questions of "right” and “wrong” through the Scriptures. Those with itchy ears want to hear that sinfulness is not sinfulness any more. And their number now include leaders and members of many churches who are picking and choosing which parts of Scripture to believe -- or worse yet, making up their own religion and selling it like snakeoil to those who are searching for the light.

And those itchy-eared folks, both inside and outside of churches, have escalated their demands. They now not only want to saturate society with open sinfulness but are now insisting (through laws and public education) that everyone conform their opinion to the "new norm" and agree that sinfulness is okay. Good grief!

This is one more step toward silencing Christians.

Your "little corner" is very similar to all the corners I've been in lately. So, what is the result of a nation which behaves itself in these ways?

[Ocracoke_Pelican]

Your "little corner" is very similar to all the corners I've been in lately. So, what is the result of a nation which behaves itself in these ways?

My first expectation is that God will turn His face away from our nation and allow it to continue its fall to the logical end - which I imagine as Hell on earth.

My second expectation is that God will punish America. The Bible has many examples of God punishing the evil we choose over Him through our free will – beginning with throwing us out of the Garden. The great flood and Sodom and Gomorrah. Is God already punishing America? We are busy letting the evil within our borders drive out everything Godly and letting it rot our people’s minds -- and God is allowing the evil outside our borders to assemble in ways to allow them to easily do America harm. The situation makes me imagine God has raised His mighty hand in preparation to give us the slap we surely deserve.

Now the question seems to be are we doing what God wants Christians to do in these circumstances in America? Are we outnumbered and that is why we seem to be ineffective? Or are we doing it wrong? Why does it seem that it was it so easy to keep most of America Christ-centered up until the 1950’s or so? The people we elected 60 years ago all seemed to agree about what was right and what was wrong because, for the most part, they based it upon Biblical principles. Not so now.

[Bro Jim]

Mt 7:3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

Mt 7:4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?

Mt 7:5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

Lu 6:41 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but perceivest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

Lu 6:42 Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye.

Amazingly what we see elsewhere and neglect looking at self. Not you mind you but others, right? Do we really want a change in America, or any other "Christian" nation, then it must begin at the house of God.

1 Peter 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?


Not popular preaching but just exactly what is needed.

[John81]

Mt 7:3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

Mt 7:4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?

Mt 7:5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

Lu 6:41 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but perceivest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

Lu 6:42 Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye.

Amazingly what we see elsewhere and neglect looking at self. Not you mind you but others, right? Do we really want a change in America, or any other "Christian" nation, then it must begin at the house of God.

1 Peter 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?


Not popular preaching but just exactly what is needed.

So true and yet so few are willing to do what is necessary individually. It's far easier to "vote pro-life" and think that's all that's needed, or maybe invite a friend or family member to church once or twice a year, or to put a "fish" decal on your car than it is to actually pursue personal holiness as commanded in Scripture.

Being born again is "easy", actually following Christ as Scripture commands is a task that requires daily attention and actually requires that we take our committment to Christ seriously, lay down our own desires and obey the will of God and the commands of Christ. Out of a 24 hour day just how much time do we spend in dedicated pursuit of growth in Christlikeness through reading, studying and meditating upon the Word, in time specifically for prayer, engaging in this and similar efforts with other believers, either in small groups, with a Christian friend or at church?

[Bro Jim]

How many churches have Wed. night corporate prayer meeting instead of Bible study. And I don't mean a 30 min prayer time before the Wed. night service, I mean a whole church wide prayer meeting that is over when the Holy Spirit is done. There was a time when the church came together to pray, which has fallen away to bible study, youth meetings, missionary societies, etc, etc. Meet, Greet, Eat, and Beat it.

[Ocracoke_Pelican]

Mt 7:3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

Mt 7:4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?

Mt 7:5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

Lu 6:41 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but perceivest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

Lu 6:42 Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye.

Amazingly what we see elsewhere and neglect looking at self. Not you mind you but others, right? Do we really want a change in America, or any other "Christian" nation, then it must begin at the house of God.

1 Peter 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?


Not popular preaching but just exactly what is needed.

I hadn't thought about the church being the place to begin change. It does make sense, doesn't it? I visit a lot of churches and can't remember the last time I heard a sermon that asked me to examine myself and what's truly in my heart. The very first charge hurled at a Christian by the unsaved is the accusation that we are hypocrites. Easy to turn into a hypocrite if we aren't examining ourselves on a regular basis. Have to include myself in the group that doesn't spend enough time looking inside. Going to put that into my daily routine.