Repentance as a wordly pastime

[MaxKennedy]

Repentance found the world over.

Admit you can't do it, and Jesus Christ already paid the price on the cross.
He stands at the door knocking.

"The sorrow of the world produces death"

Roman Catholics
http://www.diocese-sacramento.org/vocations/faqs_priest.html
I’m not that “holy.” Can I still be a priest if I’m not very holy?
Holiness (to be like Jesus) is a lifetime endeavor for every person in every vocation.
Don ’t worry if you don’t see yourself as very holy right now. God will form you
slowly, day by day and week by week, so that you will be ready to be His instrument
when the time comes. But for now, use the sacrament of Penance at least once a month.
Repent of your sins, receive the sacraments, and pray every day. You will
be surprised at how Christ-like you can become!

Jews
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/repentence.html
Maimonides on Repentance
"What constitutes complete repentance? He who is confronted by the identical situation
wherein he previously sinned and it lies within his power to commit the sin again, but
he nevertheless does not succumb because he wishes to repent, and not because he is too
fearful or weak [to repeat the sin]. How so? If he had relations with a woman forbidden
to him and he is subsequently alone with her, still in the throes of his passion for
her, and his virility is unabated, and [they are] in the same place where they
previously sinned; if he abstains and does not sin, this is a true penitent"
(Mishneh Torah, "Laws of Teshuva," 2:1).

Mormons
http://www.whatmormonsbelieve.org/mormon_repentance.html
Repentance in Mormonism
Repentance is one of the first principles believed by the Mormon Church. Article of Faith 1:4 reads: ""We believe that the first principles and ordinances of
the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance…"1 Mormons do believe that faith leads to repentance and the need for repentance
has always been necessary. In Ecclesiastes we are told that 'no one is without sin and that if we think we are, we are deceiving ourselves.
'2 We each sin whether that be through ignorance, our weaknesses or willful disOBedience.

It is believed that we each come to this earth to grow and progress and work towards returning to our Father in Heaven; it is a lifelong process for each of us. Because each of us sin, it makes us unworthy to dwell in the presence of God.

Mormons believe that Jesus Christ suffered the penalty for each of our sins so that we can each be forgiven if we truly repent. Since we are not perfect as
the Savior was, we need help in returning to live with our Father in Heaven. Through the Atonement of Jesus Christ (atone = reconcile or to restore to harmony), we can be prepared or reconciled to return to our Heavenly Father and able to dwell in His presence forever because we have been made perfect through the Atonement of Jesus Christ.

Repentance is a vital part in our returning to live with God. This life, as short as it may be, is believed by the Mormons, to be the time to prepare to meet God. Repentance is a daily process – we sin daily, thus we need to repent daily.

Muslims
http://www.themodernreligion.com/basic/repent3.htm

Question 1: I fall into a sin and then repent, but my base self overcomes me and I fall into it again. Does this nullify my earlier repentance leaving the previous sins intact, unforgiven?

Answer: In the opinion of the majority of scholars it is not conditional for a repentance to be accepted that the penitent does not fall into the same sin again. It is conditional that the sin be given up immediately and that there should be true feelings of regret in the heart. This should be accompanied by the firm intention not to fall into it again. Now, with these conditions met, if he falls into it again, then this will be considered a new sin altogether requiring a new repentance and with no connection with those of the past.

Question 2: Is repentance over a particular sin acceptable while I am a victim of another?

Answer: Yes, repentance over a particular sin is acceptable even if the repentant insists on another sin which is of a different nature and not the same as the one he has repented. To take an example, if a man repents having accepted "interest money", but not drinking wine, his repentance over the interest money is acceptable, and vice versa, but if he repents simple interest but not compound interest then his repentance is invalid. So also if he repents drugs but insists on drinking wine, or vice versa, then that repentance is invalid too. It will also be incorrect and unacceptable if a man repents adultery with a woman but commits it with another. In all these cases they have only shifted from one variety of sin to another within the same kind.


Hindus -
http://www.hinduwebsite.com/hinduism/h_karma.asp

Edited October 13, 2010 by MaxKennedy

[heartstrings]

Repentence takes no effort. It is not something that you do, or strive to do.
It is something you believe in your heart. Anything you DO, is a result of repentance which has already taken place. You admit you are wrong, in your heart, and turn to Jesus, in your heart.

Salvation is not a work.

[John81]

Repentence takes no effort. It is not something that you do, or strive to do.
It is something you believe in your heart. Anything you DO, is a result of repentance which has already taken place. You admit you are wrong, in your heart, and turn to Jesus, in your heart.

Salvation is not a work.

[JerryNumbers]

If, that is if it was a work, them salvation would not be a gift, and the Bible is clear, its a gift.

[MaxKennedy]

Repentence takes no effort. It is not something that you do, or strive to do.
It is something you believe in your heart. Anything you DO, is a result of repentance which has already taken place. You admit you are wrong, in your heart, and turn to Jesus, in your heart.

Salvation is not a work.

The sorrow of the world produces death. And its all repentance too, but not the one thing you need to do.

[MaxKennedy]

If, that is if it was a work, them salvation would not be a gift, and the Bible is clear, its a gift.

The logic follows the other way as well. If repent means to believe the gospel, then you added a work, so if it is a gift, then adding the other must not be the true gospel.

All these religions believe in repentance. You must differentiate yourself. You have all failed to do so. It is not my jOB to understand for you. Explain the difference, or appear as you do - people who do not know the difference.

You teach as the world teaches. Repentance (of sins) is common in the world - but Jesus Christ has already paid the price.
Water can't wash away sin. Only the blood of Jesus. Edited October 16, 2010 by MaxKennedy

[John81]

All these religions believe in repentance. You must differentiate yourself. You have all failed to do so.

It is not my jOB to understand for you. Explain the difference, or appear as you do - people who do not know the
difference.

You teach as the world teaches. Repentance is common in the world - but Jesus Christ has already paid the price.

Other religions also baptize, assemble together, worship, read their "holy" books, pray and other things that Christians are also commanded to do in the Word of God. That doesn't mean Christians shouldn't practice any of these.

The differentiaiton comes in Christians doing these things, including repentance, in accord with the Word of God and for His glory; not in some fale religionist manner or for any unbiblical reason.

You seem to have an unbiblical definition of repentance. Biblical repentance means one realizes they are a lost sinner headed for hell, they realize Jesus is the Son of God who has paid the price for their sins and is the only way of salvation, and they determine in their heart to accept this and follow Christ. They have repented, agreed with God, turning their backs upon their old selves as they accept Christ as Saviour and Lord, putting on the new man in Christ.

[MaxKennedy]

Bible verses?

Having an unbiblical definition of repentance is as much heresy and changing the bible as anything. I've posted a whole thread on repentance, as well as the actual greek word.

God repents maybe 60 times in the bible without counting. I'm using the word repent as it is actually used in the bible. Also, the appeal to emotion and accusation instead of the bible is not a Christian discussion.

Many Christians have said the same thing. The heresy you are being mislead to believe in is called Lordship salvation. Meaning, if you don't work enough at being a servant, Jesus isn't your Lord. This is unbiblical.

Believing that you are justly headed to hell, and God has judged fairly in this matter, is Christian doctrine.

But only believing that Jesus Christ paid the price for your sins already is the actual gospel. You can't repent of your sins, you can only be aware that you are going to hell, and even repenting of them doesn't change the fact that God is just, that He created hell, and you are going there. Jesus came to save you from that. And your sins are already paid for on calvary. You are a sinner saved by God's grace.

There is only *one* thing that the sinner needs to be saved. Not two. You are not making an agreement with God. God has already promised. You are not adding to God's work. It is God's work. You have not determined in your heart to follow God - because only God's will saves, not yours. You are not repenting of sins when the price has already been paid, which is a denial that it has already been paid. You are going to hell. You know you can not repent of all your sins, and you don't even know them all.

If you are not adding to the gospel - name the *one* thing you need, which God gives you.

I see a bunch of things you need to do to be saved (paragraph long statements), and it indicates to me lack of faith in God when He says there is only thing that is the work of God. Lets not argue, lets strengthen each other. The lack of faith is caused by the devil when he sows seeds of doubt in your mind, and we all feel it at times. There is no doubt in mind that there is only one thing that is the work of God.

Edited October 16, 2010 by MaxKennedy

[heartstrings]

Matthew 7:15
Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? 17Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. 18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. 19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. 20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Sir, the devils believe in the deity of Christ, the virgin birth, the second coming, they really beleive. They know their fate in Hell. But there is one difference; They will never trust Jesus as their only hope. Benny Hinn has the plan of salvation given on his website, sir, complete with King James Bible references. Do you think Benny is saved? We You see...you can believe there IS a Jesus all you want to, but until you are willing to admit you are wrong, God is right, and give your heart to Him, you will die and bust Hell wide open. In order to be saved, there must be something to be saved FROM. And that something is your dirty rotten sin nature. If you simply beleive Jesus exists but think that you are reallya good person, and that your good works are sufficient, you haven't really beleived on Jesus. You are not born again. You are like the ones in verses 22 and 23. Like I said, rpentence is BELIEVENG, you are a sinner, deserving punishment,and simply turning to Jesus, putting your trust in Him. It is not a "work" it is a beleif in the heart. It's not "confessing" all your sins, although some may do that. If I had to confess all mys sins to get saved, I would be old and grey before I finished. Repentence is also an on going process in the life of a beleiver.

[John81]

Matthew 7:15
Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? 17Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. 18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. 19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. 20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Sir, the devils believe in the deity of Christ, the virgin birth, the second coming, they really beleive. They know their fate in Hell. But there is one difference; They will never trust Jesus as their only hope. Benny Hinn has the plan of salvation given on his website, sir, complete with King James Bible references. Do you think Benny is saved? We You see...you can believe there IS a Jesus all you want to, but until you are willing to admit you are wrong, God is right, and give your heart to Him, you will die and bust Hell wide open. In order to be saved, there must be something to be saved FROM. And that something is your dirty rotten sin nature. If you simply beleive Jesus exists but think that you are reallya good person, and that your good works are sufficient, you haven't really beleived on Jesus. You are not born again. You are like the ones in verses 22 and 23. Like I said, rpentence is BELIEVENG, you are a sinner, deserving punishment,and simply turning to Jesus, putting your trust in Him. It is not a "work" it is a beleif in the heart. It's not "confessing" all your sins, although some may do that. If I had to confess all mys sins to get saved, I would be old and grey before I finished. Repentence is also an on going process in the life of a beleiver.

[MaxKennedy]

Sir, the devils believe in the deity of Christ, the virgin birth, the second coming, they really beleive. They know their fate in Hell. But there is one difference; They will never trust Jesus as their only hope. Benny Hinn has the plan of salvation given on his website, sir, complete with King James Bible references. Do you think Benny is saved? We You see...you can believe there IS a Jesus all you want to, but until you are willing to admit you are wrong, God is right, and give your heart to Him, you will die and bust Hell wide open.

In order to be saved, there must be something to be saved FROM. And that something is your dirty rotten sin nature. If you simply beleive Jesus exists but think that you are reallya good person, and that your good works are sufficient, you haven't really beleived on Jesus. You are not born again. You are like the ones in verses 22 and 23. Like I said, rpentence is BELIEVENG, you are a sinner, deserving punishment,and simply turning to Jesus, putting your trust in Him. It is not a "work" it is a beleif in the heart. It's not "confessing" all your sins, although some may do that. If I had to confess all mys sins to get saved, I would be old and grey before I finished. Repentence is also an on going process in the life of a beleiver.

Although you are beginning to sound more like what I have been saying the whole time, you are still not right. First, you quote what devils believe so much, but the prOBlem is, this isn't a good witness for others. People aren't devils, and while fallen angels in this world may know all these things, many people do not. Futhermore, devils can't be saved. Lastly, devils also know they are sinners. And most sinners actually know they are sinners too. They may be ignorant of how much but that is because they haven't known the love of God. Also, you may have many beliefs in your heart - but God needs to have put it there. A belief may be wrong, although it is in the heart.

That repentance is according to you now an ongoing process means that repenting of sins by the believer is therefore not part of the one time thing done when a believer is born again. Repenting of sins is an ongoing work of the Holy Spirit. We come to know God's love, and we become aware of our sins. Knowing God's love also is not our work either. We loved him because he first loved us.

A lot of people have been arguing about belief and if it is enough, but the bible says that the faith isn't ours that no one should boast.
IT IS THAT BOASTING I suggest that is the cause of all arguments like this that you see online. The boasting and argumentation is an indication that people don't agree that the faith wasn't from themselves. The boasting over salvation is an indication that you may not be saved, and I don't mean that personally.

I have noted maybe dozens of arguments like this over various aspects of the salvation process, but isn't it all boasting of sorts? If it is God that gives you the faith, it also isn't your belief in the heart but HIS. Where is the argument and boasting? We love him because He first loved us. Edited October 18, 2010 by MaxKennedy

[MaxKennedy]

We love God, because He first loved us. Jesus Christ already paid the price for your sins on the cross, before you even knew him.

Edited October 18, 2010 by MaxKennedy

[heartstrings]

Sir, Jesus is the one who gave the illustration "the devils believe".


To "believe on Christ" is MORE than just to believe that Jesus Christ paid the price for your sins on the Cross. Everyone has faith because everyone believes in something, even athiests. Until you come to the place that you admit that YOU are wicked and unrighteous, God is righteous, and you put your trust in Jesus as your only hope, you won't get saved. But when you do, at that moment in time, you have, in effect said in your heart "I no longer trust my SELF, I'm giving my heart to Jesus." Then and ONLY then can you truly say "I love Him, because He first loved me". But until you come to the end of your SELF and realize what a dirty rotten scoundrel you really are, there will be no Godly sorrow. You see, that "godly sorrow worketh repentence" the Bible says. I don't know about others, but when I got saved there was Godly sorrow, and fear of God. Too many people have no fear of God. The theif on the cross had that fear. And he realized what a rotten, no account loser he was. He turned to Jesus, realizing Jesus was righteous, he himself was unrighteous, and he asked Jesus for mercy. That's it....he turned to God from sin and self. That's all repentence is. But if you don't do it. You will remain lost.

[MaxKennedy]

Sir, Jesus is the one who gave the illustration "the devils believe".


To "believe on Christ" is MORE than just to believe that Jesus Christ paid the price for your sins on the Cross.

You can stop using Sir as a means of insult, it is hypocritical. I didn't need to use sir to point out that you are wrong to do that.

I stopped reading your messages closely when its apparent you weren't reading mine closely. If you weren't quoting Paul's similar admonishment, then I am sorry I misread it.

You misquoted my message however, and therefore have misread it.

I said Jesus *already* paid the price for your sins, before you even knew him. And that we love God because he first loved us.

You seem not to understand that. That you think you have to repent of your sins first before you know it, that it is something you do, and repenting of something you have already been forgiven for is not understanding you already have been forgiven of it.

It is not of ourselves, but God, so that no one can boast. You didn't save yourself if you are saved, and God loved you first. You didn't have to do anything, its a free gift. Edited October 18, 2010 by MaxKennedy

[MaxKennedy]

Sir, Jesus is the one who gave the illustration "the devils believe".

The boasting and argument is because you've made your salvation dependent on your belief works I think, and not the Rock. Satan sometimes does that to believers too, but they can't lose their salvation, just be really confused for a time.

Until
you come to the place that
you admit that
YOU are wicked and unrighteous, God is righteous, and
you put your trust in Jesus as
your only hope,
you won't get saved. But when

you do, at that moment in time, you have, in effect said in your heart

At the moment you do all that, you've created an idol in your heart.

You don't do anything. God saves us Himself, and he gives us the faith, not ourselves. You can't come to that place. You can't admit. You can't see that. You can't put trust in Jesus, and God will save who He wants no matter how many witchcraft forumulas you give, because faith is only from Him. Because thats all it is, a way to require God to save you, instead of knowing that God has saved you because God loves you. You can't take love.

I've been saved a long time, but you've been increasingly boasting against me. The bible says:

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

This boasting comes in when its not believed its just a gift of God, and you have to do something yourself.

But God did it all himself, its a free gift. We love him because He first loved us.

"Godly sorrow works revenge" Edited October 18, 2010 by MaxKennedy