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In these last days, we are seeing a lot of new ideas, in the area of ministry: E.G. Video presentations, Power point presentations, You tube videos, sites like this etc.. And although there is nothing wrong with these tools, there is "something wrong". Because during this same period of time, the Church's mission is failing. (i.e. People's lives aren't being changed). Therefore, we must be doing something wrong.

Before I continue, let me explain how we can tell, that people's lives, aren't being changed. It all has to do with, a lack of true repentance. Some Churches may be full, but the people's hearts are empty; And the reason we know this, is because of all the open sin in their lives. When Jesus is changing people, they are going to be dealing with their sin. And when people are dealing with their sins, pornography and alcohol sales, start dropping off. -This isn't happening.-

Now back to my main point; i.e. "The question is, how we can have all the latest technology at our disposal, and yet our message seems to be powerless to really change people's lives?" The source to this problem, has to do with a lack of power. How can we be preaching, "the right message", yet see that same message, powerless to change people's lives?

The answer to this question, boils down to "words". We may have "the right message" but are we using the right words to convey it? There is a doctrine, that all true believers accept, but many misunderstand it. That is, the doctrine of "verbal inspiration". We all agree on what "inspiration" means: (i.e. "God breathed") but what about that word, "verbal"? The word verbal, means "using words". God gave us our Bible, using "words", and not simply ideas. Therefore, the true power of God's message, lies in His Words, and not just in His message.

This is the whole issue with the King James Version, of the Bible. These who translated the King James, believed that the words were important, therefore they translated the original languages into English, word for word(as close as it could be). But the philosophy behind "every other English translation", is that "words aren't important, but the ideas are;" This is why they feel free to change the words, any way they choose. (Like has be said for years, "If you change the words you change the meaning!")

But something else has happened. When the words are changed, the power of the words is taken away.

Today, most ministers, are trying to get God's message out to the world and the Church; But they are overlooking a vital component, to God's message. We must use "God's Words", to get God's message across, with power.

God's powerful message is,
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

and not,

"For God had such love for the world that he gave his only Son, so that whoever has faith in him may not come to destruction but have eternal life."

Note: When you change the words, you rob the message, of God's power!

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All these things you say are true, but your preaching to the choir. Seems that is something many love to do here in modern time, I suppose its safe and it pays very good, and one does not have to pull up their shirt sleeves and enter the trenches. Jesus and His called gave all of us a wonderful demonstrated of how this was done

But the answer to all problems is for each of us to get down on our knees in prayer, them get up and hit the trenches.

As we post here there are very faithful Christians workers doing this very thing, these faithful Christians workers are not preaching to the choir nor reading books written to the choir, they have not the time for that for lost souls are being lost to the depths of hell daily for there be few labors who are in the trenches.

Note. No put down intended, it just seems that so many are going about saying what we ought to do and that is the only thing they do, the pastors in Jesus' Churches, that is their very job, I feel there be many of them who are hard at the task God has given them, and there are probably a few on this message board who can testify to that.


My Work

If I should fail to do the work,
Which God designed for me,
In all the world there's not a soul,
To do my job, you see.

Some may accomplish what I could not,
And gather much fame and wealth,
But no other creature which God has made,
Can do my work but myself.

So, however humble my task may be,
And how much tempter to quit,
I'll remember each day as I press along,
That nobody else can do it.

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In these last days, we are seeing a lot of new ideas, in the area of ministry: E.G. Video presentations, Power point presentations, You tube videos, sites like this etc.. And although there is nothing wrong with these tools, there is "something wrong". Because during this same period of time, the Church's mission is failing. (i.e. People's lives aren't being changed). Therefore, we must be doing something wrong.

Before I continue, let me explain how we can tell, that people's lives, aren't being changed. It all has to do with, a lack of true repentance. Some Churches may be full, but the people's hearts are empty; And the reason we know this, is because of all the open sin in their lives. When Jesus is changing people, they are going to be dealing with their sin. And when people are dealing with their sins, pornography and alcohol sales, start dropping off. -This isn't happening.-

Now back to my main point; i.e. "The question is, how we can have all the latest technology at our disposal, and yet our message seems to be powerless to really change people's lives?" The source to this problem, has to do with a lack of power. How can we be preaching, "the right message", yet see that same message, powerless to change people's lives?

The answer to this question, boils down to "words". We may have "the right message" but are we using the right words to convey it? There is a doctrine, that all true believers accept, but many misunderstand it. That is, the doctrine of "verbal inspiration". We all agree on what "inspiration" means: (i.e. "God breathed") but what about that word, "verbal"? The word verbal, means "using words". God gave us our Bible, using "words", and not simply ideas. Therefore, the true power of God's message, lies in His Words, and not just in His message.

This is the whole issue with the King James Version, of the Bible. These who translated the King James, believed that the words were important, therefore they translated the original languages into English, word for word(as close as it could be). But the philosophy behind "every other English translation", is that "words aren't important, but the ideas are;" This is why they feel free to change the words, any way they choose. (Like has be said for years, "If you change the words you change the meaning!")

But something else has happened. When the words are changed, the power of the words is taken away.

Today, most ministers, are trying to get God's message out to the world and the Church; But they are overlooking a vital component, to God's message. We must use "God's Words", to get God's message across, with power.

God's powerful message is,
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

and not,

"For God had such love for the world that he gave his only Son, so that whoever has faith in him may not come to destruction but have eternal life."

Note: When you change the words, you rob the message, of God's power!

:goodpost:
God's Word is sharper than any two-edged sword and more powerful than anything in the realm of human effort.
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This immediately caught my eye from stillearning's post..."only Son"!
"John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth."

I agree with you and with Jerry. I also agree with my pastor, who said we need to get the Gospel to the lost. It pretty much means taking the Bible with us on soul-winning visitation...and everywhere. It means having some scripture memorized "1 Peter 3:15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:" for those inconvenient times when you don't have a Bible in your pocket.

"Acts 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth."

I have a "Jerusalem" that I'm working on now and "Judaea" every time an opportunity is there. My Pastor said, I already have a mission field to my own family of lost souls. I believe God is using the Scripture I plant and also, the simple story of the Savior's virgin birth, death, burial, and resurrection.

I take your exhortation as a need in me to memorize more Scripture and hasten the witness to my Jerusalem and Judaea. That is a goal I have this year, another reminder will help. I hope you will become a regular here and even more so, that you will be able to say..."Has anyone heard from Dave (1Tim115) recently."

"2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:"
Thanks,
Dave

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I think a bigger problem than the words is the question, "are we conveying it at all and are we conveying it with the right attitude?" Are we obeying Christ's command to love our neighbor as ourself and following His example of meeting their physical needs and their spiritual needs? Do our lives show a love and sincere relationship with our Creator? I can point people to Christ with a handful of different versions but it must be done with the evidence and attitude of God in my own life.

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Hello Jerry

I considered that possibility that this message may be ?preaching to the choir?, and normally I would not have posted it: (Except for one consideration).
--------------------------------------------------
I am new here: and the forum that I came from(the most conservative of the handful that I frequent), is also a ?Baptist? forum.

I have been there for about a year or so, battling for the Bible(and it has been a battle). Over that period of time, the Lord has wonderfully blessed me with several posts, that have hit the nail on the head, on the issue of getting away from God?s Word.

Praise the Lord, I have not gotten nasty or abusive, in the face of the personal attacks that I have repeatedly been subjected to on that forum, therefore they have not had an excuse to kick me off.

I truly believe, that I have been making some headway recently, when I was able to reveal the truth about BB Warfield?s attack upon the word of God.
--------------------------------------------------
Then last night, I discovered a post on that forum, where those who run it, had been considering shutting down, the ?Bible Versions/Translations? section of that forum, and as I read the responses to that post, I found a few that read like this.......

This ?Bible Versions/Translations? forum is one of many tools that the Lord has used to grow me out of the KJVO movement and thought. I for one am grateful for this forum. I hope it remains, despite its upkeep and heartache (or headache, which ever).?

--------------------------------------------------
What this means, is that even though I may be ?preaching to the choir?, the dear souls that at in that choir, may not be as safe as we may think.

I am reminded of........
1 Corinthians 10:12
?Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.?
--------------------------------------------------
If this post, can keep one person, from forsaking God?s Word, than I will be glad.
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Hello Jerry...
I have been there for about a year or so, battling for the Bible(and it has been a battle).


Stilllearning,
I just recently left a board (sports) where I was a member for a couple of years. Regretfully, I was not always posting God's plan of salvation nor was I posting anything God related during the first year.

At the 1 year point, I began posting nothing but KJV Scripture and God honoring comment; so they built me a forum to post in. It was both a blessing and a curse. I was stuck over in a section (out of site out of mind) where I received a lot of looks and several God hating replies. After beating my head against the wall with a year's worth of posting scripture, I left. I took 4 lessons away from that board.
1. "John 4:44 For Jesus himself testified, that a prophet hath no honour in his own country."
I had not posted scripture there for a year previous and it was nearly impossible to get more than a handful to listen.
2. "Matthew 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen."
Those who listened and received the Word gladly told me so but, more times than not by personal message. Not all were against receiving the Word but, those who would agree openly were few.
3. "Matthew 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you."
I was viciously attacked (verbally) by many who wanted to oppose God's Word. There were those who belittled the Savior and scoffed at God entirely. There were avowed atheists, agnostics, scientoligists, even some professing to be wicken but, the latter I believe to be false. For the most part I believe they were all humanists.
4. "Luke 9:5 And whosoever will not receive you, when ye go out of that city, shake off the very dust from your feet for a testimony against them."
I just closed my account one day and the same day found OB. I am recharging my batteries as many before me have said. I intend to use the internet as a means to get the Gospel out throughout the world. The internet will be my "...Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth." It will not be my only way to witness and spread the Gospel of Christ but, it will be another way. I believe nothing beats worn off shoe leather.

I was called something which I will cherish by one of the humanists, he called me a ?fundamentalist!?
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Hello again Jerry

God has called me to minister to his Church(although I share the Gospel as the Lord leads), but praise the Lord for your labor.

I am sure, that a lot of seeds were planted, while you were there.

Most likely, there are a few on this site, that are just religious, and don?t really know the Lord.
They are my target.

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I believe the real problem is lack of holiness. So many christians today are addicted to entertainment even though it's unrighteous entertainment. And I really believe it is an addiction. We need to learn how to get past this addiction.

Psalms 24:3 Who shall ascend into the hill of the LORD? or who shall stand in his holy place?
Psalms 24:4 He that hath clean hands, and a pure heart; who hath not lifted up his soul unto vanity, nor sworn deceitfully.
Psalms 24:5 He shall receive the blessing from the LORD, and righteousness from the God of his salvation.
Psalms 24:6 This is the generation of them that seek him, that seek thy face, O Jacob. Selah.

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Stilllearning,
I just recently left a board (sports) where I was a member for a couple of years. Regretfully, I was not always posting God's plan of salvation nor was I posting anything God related during the first year.

At the 1 year point, I began posting nothing but KJV Scripture and God honoring comment; so they built me a forum to post in. It was both a blessing and a curse. I was stuck over in a section (out of site out of mind) where I received a lot of looks and several God hating replies. After beating my head against the wall with a year's worth of posting scripture, I left. I took 4 lessons away from that board.
1. "John 4:44 For Jesus himself testified, that a prophet hath no honour in his own country."
I had not posted scripture there for a year previous and it was nearly impossible to get more than a handful to listen.
2. "Matthew 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen."
Those who listened and received the Word gladly told me so but, more times than not by personal message. Not all were against receiving the Word but, those who would agree openly were few.
3. "Matthew 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you."
I was viciously attacked (verbally) by many who wanted to oppose God's Word. There were those who belittled the Savior and scoffed at God entirely. There were avowed atheists, agnostics, scientoligists, even some professing to be wicken but, the latter I believe to be false. For the most part I believe they were all humanists.
4. "Luke 9:5 And whosoever will not receive you, when ye go out of that city, shake off the very dust from your feet for a testimony against them."
I just closed my account one day and the same day found OB. I am recharging my batteries as many before me have said. I intend to use the internet as a means to get the Gospel out throughout the world. The internet will be my "...Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth." It will not be my only way to witness and spread the Gospel of Christ but, it will be another way. I believe nothing beats worn off shoe leather.

I was called something which I will cherish by one of the humanists, he called me a ?fundamentalist!?


There is a time to stop, if I may say it this way, brush off your feet and leave.

10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;

11 Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.

Titus 3:10-11 (KJV)

I know that many times its hard to. A long time back I posted on a Baptist board where some Catholics came in, told us how wrong we are, that if we want any home pf heaven we woudl come into their church. Them along came someone teaching oneness doctrine, the 2 or 3 more of them joined in, them along came a church of Christ telling us how wrong we were. I finally realized I was way past the point the verse above points out. I kept searching the net, finally found this board.

I realize to, there are those who think we should accept anything and everything, that we should never offend anyone by taking a stand, when you do take a stand, those type of people will develop hate for you, but that is exactly how they reacted to Jesus. So it should not suprise us that they will do us the same way, once again the verse about should be obyed.
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So much of what everyone said I believe is true yet one thing hasn't been pointed out. I must say this so really, really think this thru---Please! In our fundamental, Independent KJO churches--all know they must have repentance I'm assuming! Are our families different? Are our husband having prayer time daily with their wives and are they in the word with their family and privately? Are the men leading their families? Are you? ---Pixiedust P.s. Are you teaching the men how to do that? praying for one another? :pray

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So much of what everyone said I believe is true yet one thing hasn't been pointed out. I must say this so really' date=' really think this thru---Please! In our fundamental, Independent KJO churches--all know they must have repentance I'm assuming! Are our families different? Are our husband having prayer time daily with their wives and are they in the word with their family and privately? Are the men leading their families? Are you? ---Pixiedust P.s. Are you teaching the men how to do that? praying for one another? :pray[/quote']

This is why my move out into my "Judaea" is slowed. I have to get my house in order first. The story is long and need not be given here but, there is a great need for me to first work with my immediate family.
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