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         33
      Closed Communion
      James Foley
       
      I Corinthians 11:17-34: "Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse. For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it. For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you. When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's Supper. For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken. What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not. For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread: And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me. After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me. For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do show the Lord's death till he come. Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep. For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged. But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world. Wherefore, my brethren, when ye come together to eat, tarry one for another. And if any man hunger, let him eat at home; that ye come not together unto condemnation. And the rest will I set in order when I come."

      INTRODUCTION

      Historic Baptists, true Baptists, have believed in and still believe in closed communion. Baptists impose upon themselves the same restrictions that they impose on others concerning the Lord’s Supper. Baptists have always insisted that it is the Lord’s Table, not theirs; and He alone has the right to say who shall sit at His table. No amount of so called brotherly love, or ecumenical spirit, should cause us to invite to His table those who have not complied with the requirements laid down plainly in His inspired Word. With respect to Bible doctrines we must always use the scripture as our guide and practice. For Baptists, two of the most important doctrines are Baptism and The Lord’s Supper. These are the only two doctrines we recognize as Church Ordinances. The Bible is very clear in teaching how these doctrines are to be practiced and by whom.

      We only have two ordinances that we must never compromise or we risk our very existence, they are Baptism and The Lord’s Supper.

      The moment we deviate from the precise method God has prescribed we have started down the slippery slope of error. True Baptists have held fast to the original doctrine of The Lord’s Supper from the time of Christ and the Apostles.

      Unfortunately, in this day of what the Bible describes as the age of luke warmness, Baptists are becoming careless in regard to strictly following the pattern laid out for us in Scripture. Many of our Bible colleges are graduating otherwise sincere, Godly and dedicated pastors and teachers who have not been taught the very strict, biblical requirements that surround the Lord’s Supper. Any Bible college that neglects to teach its students the differences surrounding Closed Communion, Close Communion and Open Communion is not simply short changing its students; it is also not equipping their students to carry on sound Bible traditions. The result is men of God and churches that fall into error. And as we will see, this is serious error.

      Should we as Baptists ignore the restrictions made by our Lord and Master? NO! When we hold to the restrictions placed upon the Lord’s Supper by our Master, we are defending the "faith which was once delivered to the saints" Jude 3.

      The Lord’s Supper is rigidly restricted and I will show this in the following facts:

      IT IS RESTRICTED AS TO PLACE

      A. I Corinthians 11:18 says, "When ye come together in the church." This does not mean the church building; they had none. In other words, when the church assembles. The supper is to be observed by the church, in church capacity. Again this does not mean the church house. Ekklesia, the Greek word for church, means assembly. "When ye come together in the church," is when the church assembles.

      B. When we say church we mean an assembly of properly baptized believers. Acts 2:41-42: "Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers."

      The church is made up of saved people who are baptized by immersion. In the Bible, belief precedes baptism. That’s the Bible way.

      Acts 8:12-13, "But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women. Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done."

      When we say properly baptized, we mean immersed. No unbeliever should take the Lord’s supper, and no non-immersed believer should take the supper. Those who are sprinkled are not baptized and cannot receive the supper. The Greek word for baptize is baptizo, and it always means to immerse.

      "In every case where communion is referred to, or where it may possibly have been administered, the believers had been baptized Acts 2:42; 8:12; 8:38; 10:47; 6:14-15; 18:8; 20:7. Baptism comes before communion, just as repentance and faith precede baptism".

      C. The Lord’s Supper is for baptized believers in church capacity: "When ye come together in the church," again not a building, but the assembly of the properly baptized believers.

      D. The fact that the Lord’s Supper is a church ordinance, to be observed in church capacity, is pointed out by the fact that it is for those who have been immersed and added to the fellowship of the church.

      E. The Lord’s Supper is never spoken of in connection with individuals. When it is referred to, it is only referred to in reference to baptized believers in local church capacity I Cor. 11:20-26).

      I want to quote Dr. W.W. Hamilton,

      "The individual administration of the ordinance has no Bible warrant and is a relic of Romanism. The Lord’s Supper is a church ordinance, and anything which goes beyond or comes short of this fails for want of scriptural example or command".

      “The practice of taking a little communion kit to hospitals, nursing homes, etc. is unscriptural and does not follow the scriptural example.”

      IT IS RESTRICTED TO A UNITED CHURCH

      A. The Bible in I Cor. 11:18 is very strong in condemning divisions around the Lord’s table. For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
      19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
      20 When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's supper.

      There were no less than four divisions in the Corinthian church.
      I Cor. 1:12: "Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ."

      Because of these divisions, it was impossible for them to scripturally eat the Lord’s Supper. Division in the local church is reason to hold off observing the Lord’s Supper. But there are also other reasons to forego taking the Lord’s Supper. If there is gross sin in the membership we do not take it. Here is scriptural evidence for this: 1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our Passover is sacrificed for us:
      8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. 9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
      10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. 11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

      B. At this point, I want to ask these questions: Are there not doctrinal divisions among the many denominations? Is it not our doctrinal differences that cause us to be separate religious bodies?

      IT IS RESTRICTED BY DOCTRINE

      A. Those in the early church at Jerusalem who partook "continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine" Acts 2:42. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

      B. Those that do not hold to apostolic truth are not to partake. This means there is to be discipline in the local body. How can you discipline those who do not belong to the local body? You can’t. The clear command of scripture is to withdraw fellowship from those who are not doctrinally sound.

      II Thes 3:6: "Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us."
      Rom. 16:17: "Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them."
      To commune together means to have the same doctrine.
      II Thes. 2:15: "Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle."
      II John 10-11: "If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."

      C. Some Baptists in our day have watered down this doctrine by practicing what they call “Close Communion.” By this they mean that they believe that members of another Baptist church may take communion with us because they are of the same beliefs. Once again, this is unscriptural.

      The welcome to the Lord's Table should not be extended beyond the discipline of the local church. When we take the Lord’s Supper there is supposed to be no gross sin among us and no divisions among us. We have no idea of the spiritual condition of another church’s members. If there is sin or division in the case of this other church’s members, we have no way of knowing it. We cannot discipline them because they are not members of our church. This is why we practice “Closed” communion, meaning it is restricted solely to our church membership. 
      So then, in closing I would like to reiterate the three different ideas concerning the Lord’s Supper and who is to take it. 
      Closed Communion = Only members of a single local church. 
      Close Communion = Members of like faith and order may partake. 
      Open Communion = If you claim to be a Christian, or simply attending the service, you may partake. 
      It is no small thing to attempt to change that which was implemented by our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. 
      Mt. 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. 
      Many of our Baptist churches have a real need to consider the gravity of the act of observing The Lord’s Supper. It is not a light thing that is to be taken casually or without regard to the spiritual condition of ourselves or our church.
      1Co. 11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.

       28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.

       29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

       30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

Billy Graham's Sad Disobedience to the Word of God


PastorMatt
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Republished December 16, 2009 (first published in February 1997) (David Cloud, Fundamental Baptist Information Service, P.O. Box 610368, Port Huron, MI 48061, 866-295-4143, fbns@wayoflife.org; for instructions about subscribing and unsubscribing or changing addresses, see the information paragraph at the end of the article) –

“And Jehu the son of Hanani the seer went out to meet him, and said to king Jehoshaphat, Shouldest thou help the ungodly, and love them that hate the Lord? therefore is wrath upon thee from before the Lord” (2 Chronicles 19:2).

Screen shot 2009-12-16 at 6.47.26 AM
I have been warning about Billy Graham’s compromise for decades, and it is a very difficult thing to do. He is one of the most popular men in the world. He is universally acclaimed as a wonderful Christian and a great evangelist. When you say something critical of Billy Graham, many people consider it equal to blasphemy against Almighty God!

The Lord knows, if I thought I could fulfill my OBligations before God as a preacher of His Word and still keep my mouth shut about the Billy Grahams of our day, I would do it in a heartbeat! I am convinced that this is not possible, though, and by God’s grace I would rather please Him than man.

In February 1997, I published an article in
O Timothy magazine about Jerry Falwell’s support of Billy Graham. We noted that a watershed of sorts had occurred at Falwell’s Liberty University, in that the 1997 commencement speaker was Dr. Billy Graham, the foremost spokesman for the New Evangelical movement. The announcement in the National Liberty Journal stated:

“It is befitting that Dr. Graham will speak at Liberty’s 1997 Commencement, since his grandson, William Franklin (Will) Graham IV, will be among the graduating seniors. (Another grandson, Roy Graham, is a freshman at Liberty.) ... Dr. Falwell said, ‘This will be Dr. Graham’s first visit to Liberty. THIS COMMENCEMENT ADDRESS WILL NO DOUBT BE REMEMBERED HISTORICALLY IN THE NEXT CENTURY AS ONE OF LIBERTY’S HIGH DAYS. I am grateful that Dr. Graham is taking time from his busy schedule to grace us with his presence” (emphasis added) (National Liberty Journal, December 1996, pp. 1, 17).

Posted at http://www.wayoflife.org/files/00514b9bbda86fff9ce307d20824cee4-478.html#unique-entry-id-478
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You know, when I go to the auto dealer and the sales man comes out to talk with me about buying his particular brand of vehicle; I despise it when they try to get me to buy their brand by putting down some other person's brand. If they can't sell me their vehicle by extolling its own virtues then I won't deal with them nor will I buy their vehicle.

I'm inclined to look at this type of constant bombardment by certain "preachers." I'd much rather they extol the virtues of the Lord Jesus Christ and how one needs salvation from their sins than them constantly putting out literature on how some fallible human being isn't right with the Lord.

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You know, when I go to the auto dealer and the sales man comes out to talk with me about buying his particular brand of vehicle; I despise it when they try to get me to buy their brand by putting down some other person's brand. If they can't sell me their vehicle by extolling its own virtues then I won't deal with them nor will I buy their vehicle.

I'm inclined to look at this type of constant bombardment by certain "preachers." I'd much rather they extol the virtues of the Lord Jesus Christ and how one needs salvation from their sins than them constantly putting out literature on how some fallible human being isn't right with the Lord.

:amen::goodpost::goodpost:
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Republished December 16, 2009 (first published in February 1997) (David Cloud, Fundamental Baptist Information Service, P.O. Box 610368, Port Huron, MI 48061, 866-295-4143, fbns@wayoflife.org; for instructions about subscribing and unsubscribing or changing addresses, see the information paragraph at the end of the article) –

“And Jehu the son of Hanani the seer went out to meet him, and said to king Jehoshaphat, Shouldest thou help the ungodly, and love them that hate the Lord? therefore is wrath upon thee from before the Lord” (2 Chronicles 19:2).

Screen shot 2009-12-16 at 6.47.26 AM
I have been warning about Billy Graham’s compromise for decades, and it is a very difficult thing to do. He is one of the most popular men in the world. He is universally acclaimed as a wonderful Christian and a great evangelist. When you say something critical of Billy Graham, many people consider it equal to blasphemy against Almighty God!

The Lord knows, if I thought I could fulfill my OBligations before God as a preacher of His Word and still keep my mouth shut about the Billy Grahams of our day, I would do it in a heartbeat! I am convinced that this is not possible, though, and by God’s grace I would rather please Him than man.

In February 1997, I published an article in
O Timothy magazine about Jerry Falwell’s support of Billy Graham. We noted that a watershed of sorts had occurred at Falwell’s Liberty University, in that the 1997 commencement speaker was Dr. Billy Graham, the foremost spokesman for the New Evangelical movement. The announcement in the National Liberty Journal stated:

“It is befitting that Dr. Graham will speak at Liberty’s 1997 Commencement, since his grandson, William Franklin (Will) Graham IV, will be among the graduating seniors. (Another grandson, Roy Graham, is a freshman at Liberty.) ... Dr. Falwell said, ‘This will be Dr. Graham’s first visit to Liberty. THIS COMMENCEMENT ADDRESS WILL NO DOUBT BE REMEMBERED HISTORICALLY IN THE NEXT CENTURY AS ONE OF LIBERTY’S HIGH DAYS. I am grateful that Dr. Graham is taking time from his busy schedule to grace us with his presence” (emphasis added) (National Liberty Journal, December 1996, pp. 1, 17).

Posted at http://www.wayoflife.org/files/00514b9bbda86fff9ce307d20824cee4-478.html#unique-entry-id-478


I wish this issue would get more circulation among IFB churches. There are too many people out there thinking that since it is Billy Graham it must be ok. I have had a hard time with him since I learned of all this especially since the first thing I learned (a few years back) was that he supports the gap theory. http://www.beaconmbc.com/articles/thegaptheory.htm
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I wish this issue would get more circulation among IFB churches. There are too many people out there thinking that since it is Billy Graham it must be ok. I have had a hard time with him since I learned of all this especially since the first thing I learned (a few years back) was that he supports the gap theory. http://www.beaconmbc.com/articles/thegaptheory.htm


Precisely how does a believer's sincere interpretation of creation that may differ from yours have to do with whether or not a person is walking upright before the Lord? I mean if they believe the Bible is God's word and inerrant and perfect and yet one looks at days with the Lord as possibly years, etc......

Just curious.......
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You know, when I go to the auto dealer and the sales man comes out to talk with me about buying his particular brand of vehicle; I despise it when they try to get me to buy their brand by putting down some other person's brand. If they can't sell me their vehicle by extolling its own virtues then I won't deal with them nor will I buy their vehicle.

I'm inclined to look at this type of constant bombardment by certain "preachers." I'd much rather they extol the virtues of the Lord Jesus Christ and how one needs salvation from their sins than them constantly putting out literature on how some fallible human being isn't right with the Lord.



We aren't buying cars though. This is a totally different level of seriousness. We are dealing with peoples souls here. Graham has a well know pattern of false teaching and it is well that some are warning against it.
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We aren't buying cars though. This is a totally different level of seriousness. We are dealing with peoples souls here. Graham has a well know pattern of false teaching and it is well that some are warning against it.


True enough, which is why Christians should have more class and grace in reaching the lost world.

I've never personally met an individual who got saved by hearing slander against Billy Graham (or anyone else I can think of); but I've known many who were saved when hearing the Gospel preached and to turn from their sins and to the Lord Jesus Christ.
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And there be many who are led to hell by such people as Billy Graham who at times teaches a false path to hell.

But I well understand, out there in the world there be many who for what ever reason hates for false teachers to be pointed out. I might add, its been that way forever, it will wax worse.

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Hey Jerry, straight up....you can drop the "But I well understand, out there in the world there be many who for what ever reason hates for false teachers to be pointed out" if you are trying to refer to what I said. I never indicated such a thing. My point is that people should try using some class, tact and preaching the Gospel (even preach it hard) rather than constantly trashing other people. Pretty simple. Trashing other people just doesn't get it done for getting out the Gospel. I recall being taught in Bible College that people of mediocre character talk about things, people of inferior character talk about other people and people of superior character talk about the Lord Jesus Christ.

If by some chance you didn't have my posts in mind when you posted that sentence, I apologize; but the proximity to my post and the way it was written certainly does make it look that way to me.

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've never personally met an individual who got saved by hearing slander against Billy Graham (or anyone else I can think of); but I've known many who were saved when hearing the Gospel preached and to turn from their sins and to the Lord Jesus Christ.


Are you saying that article is slander(or libel more accurately)? Slander is not simply expressing a negative opinion slander is stating something that is untrue with the intent to harm someone else. I did not see anything in that article that was untrue. It contains Grahams stated views that are a matter of public record. Certainly preaching the gospel is of great importance, that does not mean however that it is not important to warn against false teachers. Jesus, Paul, and various prophets warned against false teachers, sometimes by name. I don't think it is wise to marginalize the importance of such warnings when the fellow being warned against has a significant record of teaching things contrary to the bible and things that would prevent a lost person from getting saved if he shared the same views.
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Are you saying that article is slander(or libel more accurately)? Slander is not simply expressing a negative opinion slander is stating something that is untrue with the intent to harm someone else. I did not see anything in that article that was untrue. It contains Grahams stated views that are a matter of public record. Certainly preaching the gospel is of great importance, that does not mean however that it is not important to warn against false teachers. Jesus, Paul, and various prophets warned against false teachers, sometimes by name. I don't think it is wise to marginalize the importance of such warnings when the fellow being warned against has a significant record of teaching things contrary to the bible and things that would prevent a lost person from getting saved if he shared the same views.

:goodpost:
Wouldn't you say that preaching an incorrect view on Creation would diminish the deity of God in people's minds?? When you don't preach what is in the Bible, then your message loses power because the Bible is a powerful book. The Bible is what God has to say to man. They are his words!! I don't think we should be lifting up people on a pedestal who aren't preaching the Word of God. We should be warning others against them.
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:goodpost:
Wouldn't you say that preaching an incorrect view on Creation would diminish the deity of God in people's minds?? When you don't preach what is in the Bible, then your message loses power because the Bible is a powerful book. The Bible is what God has to say to man. They are his words!! I don't think we should be lifting up people on a pedestal who aren't preaching the Word of God. We should be warning others against them.


No, I would not say that preaching (in the context of creation) concerning whether a day was a literal day or a thousand years or whether there was a "gap" in time between two verses diminishes the deity of God.

(Ps 90:4 For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.; 2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.)

I know there are principles of interpretation that are to be followed when rightly dividing the Word of God. And while I believe in the literal one day equals a 24 hour period in the Genesis account of creation, I also know there are very godly true believers that would disagree. Do I disagree with them, yes. Do I put them down, no. Do I think their walk with the Lord is less than what it should be solely based upon their interpretation of creation, no.

There are plenty of people who believe God's Word to be inerrant and every word true and that disagree on whether there was a gap or not and whether the days are literal or not. I don't see God as being "diminished" in any way by either belief.

Please allow me to clarify something as well; I am not defending Billy Graham for any areas he has wrong beliefs, taught wrong teaching or did wrong things. I am saying however that it is totally counterproductive, unnecessary and poor form to continue to beat him up publicly.....if anything this diminishes getting the Gospel out and diminishes the testimony of Christians as they seek to show the world the truth of the Lord Jesus Christ.

One does not need to continually teach on or warn about counterfeits to lead people to faith in Christ; one should be continually teaching about Christ and warning them of the consequences of their sins to bring them to salvation. That is all I'm trying to convey in what I have written concerning this matter.
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No, I would not say that preaching (in the context of creation) concerning whether a day was a literal day or a thousand years or whether there was a "gap" in time between two verses diminishes the deity of God.

(Ps 90:4 For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.; 2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.)

I know there are principles of interpretation that are to be followed when rightly dividing the Word of God. And while I believe in the literal one day equals a 24 hour period in the Genesis account of creation, I also know there are very godly true believers that would disagree. Do I disagree with them, yes. Do I put them down, no. Do I think their walk with the Lord is less than what it should be solely based upon their interpretation of creation, no.

There are plenty of people who believe God's Word to be inerrant and every word true and that disagree on whether there was a gap or not and whether the days are literal or not. I don't see God as being "diminished" in any way by either belief.

Please allow me to clarify something as well; I am not defending Billy Graham for any areas he has wrong beliefs, taught wrong teaching or did wrong things. I am saying however that it is totally counterproductive, unnecessary and poor form to continue to beat him up publicly.....if anything this diminishes getting the Gospel out and diminishes the testimony of Christians as they seek to show the world the truth of the Lord Jesus Christ.

One does not need to continually teach on or warn about counterfeits to lead people to faith in Christ; one should be continually teaching about Christ and warning them of the consequences of their sins to bring them to salvation. That is all I'm trying to convey in what I have written concerning this matter.

:goodpost:

Spend more time telling people the truth and they'll be better able to recognize a lie on their own and in far less time than it takes to write an article.
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:goodpost:

Spend more time telling people the truth and they'll be better able to recognize a lie on their own and in far less time than it takes to write an article.


Agreed. And to a lot of people, articles like this only serve to discredit the author. I know that anytime I read stuff such as this, I always question the author's motive. What is he getting out of this?
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Please allow me to clarify something as well; I am not defending Billy Graham for any areas he has wrong beliefs, taught wrong teaching or did wrong things. I am saying however that it is totally counterproductive, unnecessary and poor form to continue to beat him up publicly.....if anything this diminishes getting the Gospel out and diminishes the testimony of Christians as they seek to show the world the truth of the Lord Jesus Christ.

One does not need to continually teach on or warn about counterfeits to lead people to faith in Christ; one should be continually teaching about Christ and warning them of the consequences of their sins to bring them to salvation. That is all I'm trying to convey in what I have written concerning this matter.



His views on creation are among the least(still a serious issue though) of the concerns raised. Things like this quote are far more serious.

"Well, Christianity and being a true believer--you know, I think there's the Body of Christ. This comes from all the Christian groups around the world, outside the Christian groups. I think everybody that loves Christ, or knows Christ, whether they're conscious of it or not, they're members of the Body of Christ. And I don't think that we're going to see a great sweeping revival, that will turn the whole world to Christ at any time. I think James answered that, the Apostle James in the first council in Jerusalem, when he said that God's purpose for this age is to call out a people for His name. And that's what God is doing today, He's calling people out of the world for His name, WHETHER THEY COME FROM THE MUSLIM WORLD, OR THE BUDDHIST WORLD, OR THE CHRISTIAN WORLD OR THE NON-BELIEVING WORLD, THEY ARE MEMBERS OF THE BODY OF CHRIST BECAUSE THEY'VE BEEN CALLED BY GOD. THEY MAY NOT EVEN KNOW THE NAME OF JESUS but they know in their hearts that they need something that they don't have, and they turn to the only light that they have, and I think that they are saved, and that they're going to be with us in heaven."

Here Graham marginalizes the Gospel, claims that it is possible to love and know Christ without being conscious of it(:smilie_loco:4) and then claims that lost people can be part of "the body of Christ" without even knowing the name of Jesus because God is calling out a people for his name. Beside the OBvious biblical errors it raises the logical question of how can God call out a people "for his name" if those people don't even know his name? This is hardly the only serious error he makes even though alone it would be enough. Just a few other issues mentioned in that article are denying a literal hell and refusing to call the bible
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His views on creation are among the least(still a serious issue though) of the concerns raised. Things like this quote are far more serious.

"Well, Christianity and being a true believer--you know, I think there's the Body of Christ. This comes from all the Christian groups around the world, outside the Christian groups. I think everybody that loves Christ, or knows Christ, whether they're conscious of it or not, they're members of the Body of Christ. And I don't think that we're going to see a great sweeping revival, that will turn the whole world to Christ at any time. I think James answered that, the Apostle James in the first council in Jerusalem, when he said that God's purpose for this age is to call out a people for His name. And that's what God is doing today, He's calling people out of the world for His name, WHETHER THEY COME FROM THE MUSLIM WORLD, OR THE BUDDHIST WORLD, OR THE CHRISTIAN WORLD OR THE NON-BELIEVING WORLD, THEY ARE MEMBERS OF THE BODY OF CHRIST BECAUSE THEY'VE BEEN CALLED BY GOD. THEY MAY NOT EVEN KNOW THE NAME OF JESUS but they know in their hearts that they need something that they don't have, and they turn to the only light that they have, and I think that they are saved, and that they're going to be with us in heaven."

Here Graham marginalizes the Gospel, claims that it is possible to love and know Christ without being conscious of it(:smilie_loco:4) and then claims that lost people can be part of "the body of Christ" without even knowing the name of Jesus because God is calling out a people for his name. Beside the OBvious biblical errors it raises the logical question of how can God call out a people "for his name" if those people don't even know his name? This is hardly the only serious error he makes even though alone it would be enough. Just a few other issues mentioned in that article are denying a literal hell and refusing to call the bible
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As I remember Mr. Graham statement, "There will be people in heaven who will not even know who Jesus is."

Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Which completely contradicts the above Scripture.

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As I remember Mr. Graham statement, "There will be people in heaven who will not even know who Jesus is."

Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Which completely contradicts the above Scripture.


But is compatible with the scriptures quoted by trc. Also, the phrase "but by me" does not neccesrily mean "but by knowing my name personally." It could just as easliy be interpreted as "but by having faith in my way." Wouldn't you agree?
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    • Razor

      “Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to reform (or pause and reflect).”
      ― Mark Twain
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    • Razor

      “Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to reform (or pause and reflect).”
      ― Mark Twain
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      Psalms 139 Psalm 139:9-10
      9. If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; 10. even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy righthand shall hold me. 
       
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    • Bro. West  »  Pastor Scott Markle

      Advanced revelation, then...prophecy IS advanced revelation in the context of the apostles.
      I really do not know where you are going with this. The Bible itself has revelations and prophecies and not all revelations are prophecies.
      Paul had things revealed to him that were hid and unknown that the Gentiles would be fellow heirs.
      How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words, Eph 3:3-9
      And I do not mean this as a Hyper-dispensationalist would, for there were people in Christ before Paul (Rom. 16:7). This is not prophecy for there are none concerning the Church age in the O.T..
      Israel rejected the New Wine (Jesus Christ) and said the Old Wine (law) was better, had they tasted the New Wine there would be no church age or mystery as spoken above. to be revealed.
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        I just read your comment and you bypassed what I wrote concerning book arrangement, chapters being added and verse numberings and such. There is no scripture support for these either, should we reject these?
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    • Bro. West

      Seeing it is Christ----mas time and I was answering question on Luke 2:33 concerning Jesus, Mary and Joseph . I thought it would be fitting to display a poem i wrote concerning the matter.
      SCRIPTURAL MARY

      I WALK NOT ON WATER NOR CHANGE IT TO WINE
      SO HEARKEN O’ SINNER TO THIS STORY OF MINE
      I, AM A DAUGHTER OF ABRAHAM SINNER BY BIRTH
      A HAND MAID OF LOW ESTATE USED HERE ON EARTH
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      TO FATHER OUR CHILDREN WHO NOW ARE ALL DEAD
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      BUT OF THE FIRST BORN WHICH SAVED ME FROM HELL
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      MY PAPS ARE NOT HOLY SO TRUST ME NOT
                                               2
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      MY FLESH SAW CORRUPTION MY BONES THEY DID ROT
      MY PAPS ARE NOT HOLY SO TRUST ME NOT
                                              3
      THEN MY SOUL DID REJOICE IN GOD MY SAVIOR
      HE SCATTERED THE PROUD AND BLESS ME WITH FAVOR
      O’ THE RICH ARE EMPTY, THE HUNGRY HAVE GOOD THINGS
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      WITH STRAW AND DUNG LAID ON THE GROUND
      MY FLESH SAW CORRUPTION MY BONES THEY DID ROT
      MY PAPS ARE NOT HOLY, SO TRUST ME NOT
                                                  4
      MY MATRIX WAS OPEN IN A PLACE SO PROFANE
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      MY PAPS ARE NOT HOLY SO TRUST ME NOT
                                               5
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      GREW UP TO FULFILL THE HOLY PAGES
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      PLEASE TRUST HIS WORDS AND NOT THE GREAT WHORE
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      WITH BLASPHEMOUS PRAISE, DAMMATION AND SHAME
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      NOR, AM A DEMON OF FATIMA FLOATING IN THE SKY
      THERE IS NO DEITY IN MY VEINS FOR ADAM CAME FROM SOD
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      6
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      ENDURING SPIT AND THORNS PLACED ON HIS HEAD
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      I AMEN YOUR DAMNATION THAT TRUST NOT HIM ALONE
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      MY PAPS ARE NOT HOLY, O’ SINNER TRUST ME NOT

                       WRITTEN BY BRO. WEST
       
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