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  1. Through God's creation of everything, from the quantum to the macro sized universe, he allowed for this universe to have life. It started with a complex set of chemicals and a process called Abiogenesis which is the creation of inanimate matter into life. Later, these single cell life that slowly developed over time developed the ability for biogenesis which is when life creates itself. That single cell organism had a very specific environment that it lived in. It's basic needs were to feed and multiply. To survive, life sometimes takes genetic mutations to allow greater probability of survival in the cells/ simple life forms environment. So, by this long term process of evolution, the gift of sight was added, and many thousands of years these creatures were many thousand celled complex creatures that many other abilities that would allow it to eat/ procreate more efficiently. Then the life in the oceans took another literal step to the land and over millions of years of change, became all the animals that Noah collected on his Ark, including a very special animal called human. This is the most important part! Our history of our origin does not lessen our significance or our belief in our God. It makes it more Devine. It provides truth. It allows us to see our humble beginnings as equals to all creatures of our God. You may scoff at this. You will most certainly come back with harsh thoughts and words. But deep down, you know this to be true. God Bless!
  2. Sharing our salvation testimony will not help us gain true understanding of our Lord. The only purpose it would serve is to aid in the defilement and descrimination. In other words, our spiritual journeys are our own and between ourselves and God. We should keep our pride in check and never put ourselves over another person. God Bless! Ephesians 4:13 'until we all attain to the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature man, to the measure of the stature which belongs to the fullness of Christ.'
  3. Pastorj, absolutely not my intent to offend your group, but rather to understand your thoughts on these topics. We are all brothers in the belief in Christ. I do wish you all the blessings to you and your family in this holy season. In the end of all this discussion, it will most certainly all be sorted out when we are in the presence of our Lord. Take care, my brothers!
  4. First of all, most people would consider such fundamental theories of Evolution to be sufficiently tested by empirical evidence to conclude that they are indeed facts. The IFB doctrine of belief in the Bible as the ultimate source of all information is flawed. The Bible does serve as a humanistic, moral guide, not a scientific guide. As a result of the massive amount of evidence for biological evolution accumulated over the last two centuries, we can definitely conclude that evolution has occurred and continues to occur. All life forms, including humans, evolved from earlier species, and all still living species of organisms continue to evolve today. They are not unchanging end-products. This is a tough pill to swallow for IFB folks, such as yourselves. For those who have difficulty in accepting evolution because of what they perceive as contradictions with their fundamental religious beliefs, it may be useful to distinguish the ultimate origin of life from its later evolution. Many, if not most, biological scientists accept that primordial life on earth began as a result of chance natural occurrences 3.5-4 billion years ago. However, it is not necessary to believe in that view in order to accept that living creatures evolved by natural means after the origin of the first life. Charles Darwin modified his religious beliefs, as did many others, as a result of the discovery of convincing proof of evolution. Darwin's religious faith was also severely challenged by the death of his 10 year old daughter Annie in 1851. Apparently, he came to believe that his God created the order of the universe including the rules of nature that result in biological evolution. His famous book, On the Origin of Species, was not a denial of his God's existence. However, he did reject a literal interpretation of the Judeo-Christian Bible. His religious beliefs were probably very similar to those who advocate "theistic evolution" today. Now as far as evidence, we do have discovery of Lucy by Paleoobtologist Don Johansson. We also have Berkeley biochemists Allen Wilson and Marie King successfully show that humans share 99% of their DNA with Chimpanzees. And most recently the Human Genome Project mapped and sequenced. So, I cited my sources and there are many more to back that up. Where is your evidence? It's easy to say 'No evidence' or 'theory does not work'. Let's hear your evidence of proof that evolution is not real. My mind is wide open to you. God Bless 1974 Discovery of ‘Lucy’ Paleontologists Don Johanson (1943-) and colleagues find ‘Lucy’, an almost complete Australopithecine female at Hadar, Ethiopia.
  5. Thank you for the explanation of IFB. Never heard of your organization until today. I have looked online and apparently it's hardcore KJV only. Do you really believe all black people bear the mark of Cain and are cursed? Do you think our Lord Jesus would say this is how we treat one another? The answer is NO! His message is love not hate. Oh and to give up Movies, Dancing or music with "addictive" rock beat must be a crowd pleaser. Well, God bless you my friend. To each, there own!
  6. Also, what is an Independant Fundamental Baptist? Are you a church of 1? I never heard of that.
  7. Not sure what question you are asking. You mention 'Chain of Custody' which is if I am not incorrect about the handling of evidence. I believe I did provide a great link to the Smithsonian where they show you the skeletal remains of our ancestors. It's quite fascinating in the fact that there were so many subspecies of early humans. We of course are the one surviving line which brought us to what we are today, allowing us to have this conversation. Interesting also in how the skull brain cavity increased in size from subspecies to where we could manipulate objects, rationalize and so forth with increased complexity. Be thankful to God that we were allowed to evolve against so many odds. Of course this was not by chance.
  8. Let's try a different approach here. Where is the proof that we did not evolve from apes and before that from simpler creatures? Don't cite a passage or parable. What is your evidence in your counter argument. We already have the archeological and genetic evidence out there for public consumption. What is the basis for your anger/ dispute against Evolution. How is this threatening to your belief structure?
  9. DaveW, it would at some point be nice to share that.
  10. Thank you for your response. If I may ask a serious question with the utmost respect to those reading...how do we know...really know that all books/ writers of what makes up the Bible are educated, men of God? How do we know that each writer represents God? Is this a matter of faith on your part? Book of Genesis really from an allegorical sense is beautiful, however from a practical view, not so much.
  11. DaveW, There are actually special preparations that would ensure accuracy of Carbon Dating of objects greater than 50,000 years. My 67% confidence level is from memory. So as to the Zero level of confidence you quoted, you are incorrect. I would suggest you do as you had suggested and read one of the various publications on the subject. The reliability of the results can be improved by lengthening the testing time. For example, if counting beta decays for 250 minutes is enough to give an error of 80 years or more with 68% confidence. As far as the reference to Mount St Helens/ Grand Canyon events, you have to understand the science of Geology. The Hawaiian versus events you stated are completely different types of geologic processes. There are several volcano types. My St Helens was a Composite type, which is typically steep-sided, symmetrical cones of large dimensions, oftentimes very explosive. Hawaiian islands were formed by what is called a Shield Volcano which is composed more of fluid rather than explosive lava flows, forming the islands over the hotspot I have previously mentioned. This is a process that formed these island over millions of years. This is all scientific fact that is verifiable. The sudden changes you mention from the Mt St Helens events has happened many times over the course of history all over the world. God's creation is wonderful. Next you will be telling me Earth is the center of the universe or some nonsense about us not animals. Just because we believe in Jesus does not mean we have to be blind to scientific facts, which is also God's creation.
  12. Isn't it interesting how ppl are so averse to discussing certain topics such as Evolution without being rude and dismissive of the plain facts. It's the same ignorance that Nazi sympathizers held on to, stating the Holocaust never occurred or the same prejudice of those in Salem in the 1600's who thought the lady who acted just a bit peculiar, needed to be burned. God gave us the ability through millions of years of existence, to rationalize and understand God's creation. Does the notion of evolution understate the beauty of God's creation? Anyway, I think Bill Nye destroyed Hamm's argument. He has yet to make a valid argument against the facts.
  13. Omega, good points on your post with possibilty of biblical time being measured differently. As far as Transitional fossils, visit the Smithsonian Human Fossil collection. This is the best place to understand that to be evolved from animals is not unGodly, but beautiful. We as Humans have so much history. http://humanorigins.si.edu/evidence/human-fossils/ Here is an interesting evolutionary fact on why we get Goosebumps....The body hair of all mammals automatically stands up when cold, creating a fluffy layer of warmth. When we’re cold, the muscles around the hair follicles contract – a reflex left over from when our ancestors had long body hair. But since we don’t have much body hair, all we see are the goose bumps on our skin. Have a blessed day!
  14. Dear friends in Christ I think science and religion do not have to oppose each other here. Clearly we cannot have 100% reliability in the science of Carbon Dating(67% confidence level) in anything less than 50,000 years, however we can be of reasonable, educated minds to understand how God in his infinite ability can create such a beautiful universe, more specifically our planet in the normal process of plate tectonics through subduction zones, natural sedimentation and other processes. For our planet to evolve to its current state, it takes millions, not 6 thousand years to develop. Take the Hawaiian Islands for an example of this process. These islands were created by a hotspot under the earth's crust and as plate moves inches, maybe feet westward each year, so does the volcanic activity, thus creating each of its islands. I know we want the interpretation of the Bible to be a literal interpretation of God's word, but understand that the men who wrote the books of the Bible were from the mindset of that time, which did not have the science to illuminate God's creation, so we can better understand the beauty of its origin. Let's try to keep our minds open to possibilities.

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