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Old-Pilgrim

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Posts posted by Old-Pilgrim

  1. For what it's worth, although I hate to think about Benny Hinn and Todd Bently and the froth and poison they stir up, I don't see anywhere in scripture or in my experience that "that which is perfect has come", for that is when those spiritual gifts "shall be done away", the phrase in 1Cor 13:10 "that which is perfect has come" is key and is also used in a similar context in Eph 4:13 in the phrase "unto A PERFECT man" so as I see it the gifts will pass away when the WHOLE church is COMPLETELY mature in a way which it never has been, and then I guess we will also see Him face to face. Wretched although you seem to have a well sown up case "Only God chose Prophets and Apostles but according to the NT, men now choose pastors and deacons. If God still called men as He previously did, those passages would not be included in the Epistles ", The electing of deacons and elders and bishops does not exclude God calling men to ministry. I think it is easy to prove a point or a whole theological system and claim it to be 'bible doctrine', but when we know fully we shall be fully known, and it will be all over as it were, and heaven will have begun, I believe we are being led into all truth, we don't have all truth, we have scripture which is all true, but until we can reconcile all scripture honestly without leaving some parts out or twisting some, then we aren't perfect.

  2. If a fellow Christian posted this picture, what would you think?

     

     

     

    Old-Pilgrim, I deleted your photo because I don't think it's appropriate for this board. I guess that tells you what I would think if a fellow Christian posted this picture. :lol:

     

  3. On 6/5/2016 at 8:04 PM, Wmccarthy99 said:

    I hope someone on here can help shed some light on this for me since I have heard so many different answers to this that I'm honestly very confused about this. No one in my family believes in Jesus Christ, does that mean I must cut ties with them? It doesn't really make sense that one of the ten commandments would be "Honour thy father and thy mother" and then God would then tell us to not associate with them anymore because they don't believe. I am 26 and had to move back in with my parents because I don't make enough to move out again yet. I don't engage with their sinful behavior, and talk to them about Christ all the time ( they are not interested  :( ). After I first became a believer I read an article somewhere that references 2 Cor 6:14 that said I should completely cut ties with my family. I believed it and told my parents I was leaving and couldn't talk to them anymore and it had my parents in hysterics. I have since been told that this is not the case but it has always stayed with me and It seems sometimes that I'm to attached to my parents and my dog and that Jesus wants me to leave that all behind to follow him.

    Unsaved family are  'of this world', it's ok to mix with them just not christian fellowship.

    1 Corinthians 5:9-12  I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators: Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? Unsaved Family are with out the body.

    So we can even 'company' with fornicators of this world.

    God Bless

     

     

  4. Hello John, as i see it, the sexually immoral should be put out of fellowship, or to be more precise the openly public and proud should be put out, 1Cor 5. if fornication is kept private then it is most likely because the fornicator knows that it is sin and so in effect is agreeing that it is sin 1Jo 1:9 . As it turns out I have just found out that two of my most sound christian friends have between them three 'gay' sons. this forum seems to be a cyber ghost town. Do you have a face book account?

     

  5. I don't see any scripture about Christians holding 'Easter' or 'Resurrection' or 'Sunrise' or any other symbolic 'holy' days. It's a little like making an image of a man and calling it Christ, and then gazing at it as if it were endowed with some sort of holy power. The shadows have gone, we aren't called to paint them back, I am looking forward to the real sunrise. The Old Testament saints had types to point them forward, we have bread and wine, to remind us and point us forward, be it on a sunday or any other day of the week, as often as we meet together.

    Malachi 4:2  But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.

    2 Peter 1:19  We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:

  6. Not sure what catagory this should be in.

    Do you ever hope that someone doesn’t get saved, so they can go to hell and get punished for what they did?

    I used to take comfort in knowing that justice will be dealt out by God on Judgement day and in hell.

    And child rapists well get a just reward from the hand of the Lord, but then the thought came to me, if that child rapist gets saved, then they won’t get a just reward. I recently met a Christian from one town along, he was telling me all his relatives, and making excuse for the last one he mentioned when he said his name, it was the same name as a bloke who many years ago when drunk took a car that wasn’t his and hit my brother who was out cycling, my brother was in intensive care and suffers some long term trauma, on effect was that he never wanted to learn to drive in case he ever had an accident and killed or injured someone.

    It was a little awkward when he mentioned that, how would it have went if he was the drunk driver who almost killed my brother?

    Thanks for your prayers, always appreciated.

     

  7.  

    There is also the harlot, mystery Babylon, which is explained as being Rome.  The direct opposite to the bride and the new Jerusalem.

    Well It does sound like Rome, and I know it has been taken as Rome by friend and foe in one shape or another, but politics aside, both 'heads' and a 'beast' sound like living things and one would wonder why a hill of soil or rock would be represented as a living creature, and I wonder if there might be a bit more to the beast than simply a literal mass of land, if Rome was the beast, then it was one of its heads which was wounded, but there was only one Pope over Rome, perhaps the heads are seven power structures of which Rome was one. We also have in Revelation the Mystery Babylon, and in History we Have the Mystery Religion, So the seven mountains of Rome might represent seven different occult entities all similar in nature and intent, but each with some degree on self governance. Such as Kabalism, Gnosticism, Illuminate in more modern times, But there might be seven spirits leading seven heads in an effort to supplant the seven spirits of God.Re 3:1

  8.  

    I was born again in 1981 and I came to Christ after seeing the movie "Thief in the Night" at an Assembly of God church my girlfriend at the time talked me into attending. As most know, that film is based upon the pre-trib rapture view. That church held to that view and every Sunday night service was focused upon end-times matters. So most of my early born again learning on the matter was from books and sermons from the 1970s and early 80s. Everything I heard at the time indicated the Anti-Christ would not be known until after the Rapture. Over the past couple of years I'm hearing more and more that Christians will be here when the Anti-Christ takes the world stage and we will know who he is; the Rapture taking place sometime after that.

    Why the shift from the predominate view being Christians wouldn't know who the Anti-Christ was because we would be raptured prior to his revealing, to the current view which says the Anti-Christ will be revealed before the Rapture so Christians will know who he is?

    Hello John, this isn't a direct response to you question, but it is related to the topic, I was listening to a sermon about the mark of the beast by Ralph Yankee Arnold, I like him because of his teachings on the Gospel, but on his eschatology I think he used a bad method of interpreting. He had worked out a scheme based on the numbers found in the book of Daniel and Revelation which are both Apocalyptic in nature, they give a sort of birds eye view and are not what I would call foundational scriptures to build upon, he then went to 2Thesosalonians which is much more straight forward than Revelation and Daniel, and sort of lifted it up and plonked it into his system of things which was based on less clear scripture. I think 2Thesilonians is a better starting point on Eschatology than Revelation and Daniel, because it is straight forward and has a solid anchor in time.

  9. On Wednesday, January 20, 2016 at 9:01 PM, Ronda said:

    Pastor Markle, excellent  study on the word "signify" as well as the Greek "semaino" used in  Rev. 1:1 (as well as in all the other verses you brought forth)! Showing again that scripture compared with other scripture actually interprets itself!  The importance of literal interpretation  is so very important as well!!! If a person is willing to allegorize (symbolize or spiritualize) scripture, I believe it shows a lack of reverence for God's word. I believe He meant what He said and said what He meant.

    There are cases of symbolism in the Bible, however, in most of those cases the interpretation is also given. For instance: I once had an argument with another (supposedly) Christian on the meaning of the "seven heads" given in Rev. 17:3... the actual interpretation is GIVEN to us in verse 9 "..The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth". Yet this other person demanded (to my exasperation) that that is NOT what they seven heads were! I should have ended the discussion then, but instead furthered to discuss it by stating that the meaning for "mountains" were actual, physical mounds of earth, and were certainly not symbolic.... the "heads" were symbolic, the interpretation (mountains) was NOT symbolic. But this person couldn't seem to see the difference at all! Which proved to me (for the hundreth time likely) that in matter of the Bible, those who do not use a literal interpretation cannot grasp even the simplest of differences in interpretation... to them it's ALL symbolic!!! I believe those who allegorize scripture will never be able to comprehend even the most basic parts of eschatology. I've heard some say that allegorizing is a "lazy" approach, I think it's worse than "lazy", I think it show the lack of respect for God's word.

    I recently started a thread here entitled "Jeremiah 49"... the reason being, I have had many discussions elsewhere (not on OB) regarding this section I referenced (Jer. 49:35-39, and even more specifically verse 36).  There are so few (who claim to study eschatology) who use a literal interpretation. I have many fellow friends who I believe DO use literal interpretation, yet they have no interest (or little interest) in eschatology and/or Bible prophecy. And the other (professing) Christian friends who DO claim to have interest in eschatology and/or Bible prophecy, but do not use literal interpretation.  Some admit they allegorize... sadly (and possibly worse) others SAY they interpret literally, but actually DO interpret allegorically, mixing and matching (a horrible mistake) of both literal and allegorical interpretation (likely to "fit" a theory).  So I brought this forth on OB hoping there would be at least one person who uses literal interpretation rather than allegorization.  I wasn't really wanting to argue the verse (other than if I had to, if someone attempted to allegorize the meaning of "wind", etc), I was more interested in what others (if any  have) already studied on this, and the conclusion they arrived at... using literal interpretation. I did get one brief answer, but not enough description to give me a clue about where they were headed with a conclusion.... so anyways... I do hope someone will come forth with some thoughts/conclusions on Jeremiah 49:36 (using literal interpretation).

    Sorry to "derail" your thread... I simply wanted to commend your study on "signify" as well as commend the literal interpretation as well (as usual my brain went off down the trail to the next thought and I didn't stop typing, lol)

    Hi Ronda, this is not my favorite topic, but on the symbolism, I think there is cases of double symbols, or symbols being explained in symbol, I can think of one case off hand from Revelation,

    Revelation 21:2  And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband....Revelation 21:9  And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.

    So we have the City and the Bride, both symbols of the same thing which presumably must be the Church, or am I wrong? I think the gulf between the heavens and earth are so vast that symbols are needed to convey some glimpse of the heavens and the spiritual realm to us.

  10. I agree that the rewards are after this life, but since every christian is an heir of God

    Galatians 4:7  Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.

    and shall be FREELY given all thing

    Romans 8:32  ... shall he not with him also freely give us all things?

    All thing just means all things, we inherit it all, and judge the world and the angels, keep the gold of heaven, so the after the earth reward has got to be between the end of this life and the end of all time for us, because nothing can crown being an heir of God and all things, only one verse you gave might support your idea that the rewards are eternal, and that is the second one about the incorruptible crowns, but don't we cast them back at his feet because we aren't really worthy, at least in our estimations.

    Revelation 4:10-11  The four and twenty elders fall down before him that sat on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying, Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

    so that will make us all equal gifted.

  11. On Tuesday, September 08, 2015 at 8:16 PM, Eric Stahl said:

    Daniel 12:2-3 tells us that our brightness will show our faithfulness forever.

    not all who rise to eternal life will shine like stars but just those who turn many to the faith, I think this might be a reference to people like Paul the apostle and Peter and Andrew &co. who shine for ever as long as the earth remains..

    Da 12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
    Da 12:3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

    I don't think it will be a earthly light. just like,

    2Pe 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:

  12. On Wednesday, September 09, 2015 at 1:31 AM, Ronda said:

    I'm sorry, Old-pilgrim, I don't understand your last entry. What do you mean will you shrug the fire off as if nothing? Do you think you will go through a fire? I just don't understand what you are saying, sorry.  

    I was trying to say although the rewards and losses are temporal, they will still be a big deal.

    1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

    1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

  13. On Tuesday, September 08, 2015 at 7:54 PM, Ukulelemike said:

    I think the loss of rewards may apply primarily to the 1000 years when we reign with Christ-since this is before the time all tears will be wiped away. So our rulership will be greater or lessened according to our rewards, perhaps? But I agree with Mountain, above, that once we enter eternity fully, those things will be gone. I wonder if everything about our human lives may be gone completely, fully realizing being new creatures. I may be wrong, but interesting to think upon.

    I think I'd agree with something like that.The Scripture bellow might be a summary of the reward. Key word being Abundant and entrance, so the reward although in heaven is still a temporal reward.

    2Pe 1:11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

  14. On Tuesday, March 22, 2016 at 6:38 PM, Invicta said:

    I have a friend who lives in Wales.  He is a teacher but couldn't get a job there as to be a teacher in Wales you have to speak Welsh and he didn't, even though it is an English speaking area and few speak Welsh. The last time we went to Wales was for the funeral of his wife who died quite young.  He was hoping to be a pastor but could only get itinerant posts.  

     

    I know teachers here who aren't Welsh speakers, but apparently they are expected to use some Welsh terms, one of them told me also that every time the name of the false prophet Mohamed is spoken they are supposed to parrot some phrase about him. I wouldn't know anything about how one becomes a pastor of an established Church. I know up our way [Scotland] we got together and started a church in a hired hall, they now have a building. I can't actually remember now the exact details, but I remember making inquiry on how to become a Charity, I think in the UK you normally need to become a Business or a Charity if you want an 'official' meeting, although I was told by a JW that the Brethren get round that because their meetings are so small. I think the Gov's leverage is that there is money involved, so they get their nose in the door. I guess there might be other laws. To become a charity you need to send a statement of intent or sort of define your 'charities' purpose, they will either grant you a charity status or tell you why you don't qualify, then you need to amend the offending words and reapply. There doesn't seem to be a definition in statute written down anywhere of what does and doesn't qualify.

    The AOG leadership tried to keep it hidden from us as much as they could, when they were becoming a charity, perhaps they didn't want us to know the Government was bossing them about, or perhaps they didn't want us to know that the Government was granting us more rights concerning the property than were currently afforded us. And the Gov told them that there had to be an annual business meeting and we could have a look at 'the books' etc. I think unofficial house groups would be the way ahead. [It seems to me that as a church becomes 'established' it starts to die.

  15. 3 hours ago, Invicta said:

    I don't think you have to have authority in the UK to conduct marriage services. You have to have an approved person to oversee the service and signing of the register, or to have a registrar from the registry office come and do the legal bit.  When our church secretary got married the church didn't have an approved person so they had to book a visiting registrar.  Unfortunately at the time the registrars had a strike and were refusing to go out, so they had to get married in the registry office then have a service in the church, but they had to give the registrar the exact wording of the service as it couldn't be a marriage service as that would mean they were married twice and that would be illegal.

    I am guessing that the legal bit is not compulsory. So Christians could meet in a non state church and have non state wedding. The marriage might not be recognized by the Government, but it will be by God, and the Church.

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