Jump to content
Online Baptist

John Young

Independent Fundamental Baptist
  • Content Count

  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won


Everything posted by John Young

  1. Another one of Paul's allegories, uses a variant of this method when contrasting Adam and Christ. The below image also from Bro. Melton illustrates it this way:
  2. An other example of allegory, similar to the allegorical method used with Esther above, is the comparison between The "Cross of Christ" and the "Cross" of Israel's camp in the wilderness. In this, two literal things are compared and contrasted, to draw out the Spiritual principles common to them both. The two literal objects are not the same physical thing but they, both together, can present a better view of the spiritual. Brother James Melton has a Facebook post that illustrates it in the following way: James L. Melton November 30, 2019 · THE
  3. A change of mind (assent) and a change of heart (from pride and rejection to humility and submission).
  4. So from these passages we can see biblical allegory (the spiritual principles under-girding the text) is available and discernible to the average and common believer if they set their mind to know them through the leading of the Holy Ghost.
  5. I welcome your insight and if you feel that it is a subject you want to discuss and improve upon then I have no problem with you continuing but not to contentions or offences. As I said before I like learning about these things not fighting about them. I realize we don't see eye to eye on the subject but I think we can move on in spite of that. My comments on the topic will be general because that is what I'd like to discuss and not necessarily the person who presented them.
  6. Amen. Most sources tend to do well on teaching the psalms separately and individually in their historical context and general applications for that particular psalm but only allude to the possible reasons for them being in one collected work. As I study the psalms collectively, their arrangement makes more sense and less arbitrary. I do have it as one of my projects to develop a "whole psalms view" and use that view for developing a Christian handbook from the psalms. As I am able I'll share any solid development in the project here. If anyone knows of good material dealing with psal
  7. Galatians 4:21-31 21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law? [the literal law was a servant's covenant binding them to God] 22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid [a subservient roll made to Abraham], the other by a freewoman [an equal, freely bound in marriage]. 23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh [subject to bondage with no privileges]; but he of the freewoman was by promise [by faith in the privileges promised before marriage]. 24 Which things are an allegory [represents a spiritual principle that transcend
  8. To say allegory is only privately available to the apostles or select few would imply private interpretation of those passages. Which scripture makes very clear is not how biblical interpretation works. Allegory does not mean random private opinion applied to the text, like many seem to think. A simpler form of allegory would be when scripture uses feeding the ox treading the corn to convey a biblical principle which not only applies to the Ox in the passage but to all living Creature and in particular humans. Paul uses this same basic interpretation principle to show the SPIRITUAL covenants a
  9. STRONGS NT 238: ἀλληγορέω ἀλληγορέω, -ῶ: (present passive participle ἀλληγοροὺμενος); i.e., ἄλλο μὲν ἀγορεύω, ἄλλο δὲ νοέω, "aliud verbis, aliud sensu ostendo" (Quintilian instt. 8, 6, 44), to speak allegorically or in a figure: Galatians 4:24 (Philo, Josephus, Plutarch, and grammatical writers; [cf. Meyer on Galatians, the passage cited].) ~ https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G238&t=KJV AL'LEGORY, noun [Gr. other, to speak, a forum, an oration.] A figurative sentence or discourse, in which the principal subject is described by anoth
  10. In my opening post I presented what I believe they represent and for what reasons. The bible deals with spiritual things and applies them to physical types/figures/pictures so that mankind can understand. Those physical types are never a perfect representation of the spiritual and are not meant to be. However, in your questions you flip the application and you are applying the physical limits onto the spiritual and then disregarding both because the physical does not measure up to your expectations. That is not how allegory works and is an errant application in my opinion. I respect y
  11. I have heard the "Gentile bride" theory before, as referring to the "rebellious church" being taken away in the rapture but I don't think it fits, as the church is not just gentile but both gentile and Jewish and Christ and the church is marked by faith. I think the focus on being a "faithless bride" being Unbelieving Israel who is later replaced by a "faithful bride", the believing Israel of Revelation 12, makes more sense. I agree.
  12. I would have to disagree with this understanding of biblical allegory and Spiritualizing passages, as if they were disconnected from the reality of the text and only discernible by limited divine sanction or special Apostolic authority (such limited revelation of a passage are claimed by false prophets for their own teaching and not of God or the Apostles). The apostles rested on the authority of the Old Testament Scripture as understood to prove their doctrine. If the method used by the Apostles was not true from a "proper method" then it would be a private interpretation with no authority wh
  13. (I was recently asked about what the overall theme of Esther was, beyond the general story and the subject or the historical background. My friend was wanting to know if there was a good commentary that clearly laid out the Allegorical/Types found in Esther. Its clear from reading the story that it holds more than just what is found on the surface but many commentaries do not go beyond a surface reading except to venture the fact that God orchestrated their salvation from behind the scenes. Those that did venture in to the allegorical tended to very odd or speculative ways that were not consis
  14. Not when God causes it by His grace. What do you think is meant by submission to God? Rebellion and pride and self righteousness is work, not submission to God. Submission is the opposite of self work! its letting go and allowing God to have his way. First by submitting to Him in the matter and manor of salvation (by God's grace thru faith in Christ, not of our own way or works of righteousness) and then in the matter of daily cleansing from sin through submitting to the Spirit of His Word. Romans 10:1-4 Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved
  15. Actually the definition you are applying isn't the definition of repentance. The issue is taking the general definition of the Greek word that means "change of mind", equating that definition to simply a turning of the mind, and then applying that definition to the biblical context to claim the English word Repentance as used in the bible just means a mere turning of ones mind. Repentance is not not simply a change of mind about facts and figures or one object to another but also one of changing the heart towards whom one is repenting. I agree with you that repentance in salvation is not
  16. Not really sure this is pertinent to the discussion but I wonder if sound and site work differently in the spirit world (no physical body) than in the Physical world. A few examples would be when on earth, Paul, John, Peter, The 70 elders of Israel on Mount Sinai, etc., were given temporary spiritual sight into heaven.
  17. "Hell" is an English word, "Sheol" is not. It is a Hebrew word transliterated into roman letters from Hebrew letters. If it was translated into English then the correct English word would be "hell".
  18. You are moving the focus of faith off of Christ and onto his acts. This is called "moving the goal post". We are not saved "by our faith in the death, burial, and resurrection" but rather by our faith in Christ. The acts of Christ in HIS Death Burial and Resurrection provided the way of salvation but knowledge of those facts does not save. Rather, our faith is IN CHRIST places is into HIM and only then do we become partakers in His salvation. OT believers IN CHRIST receive the same Blessings without full knowledge of HIS acts to provide that salvation, just as much as do we NT believers who ha
  19. You are not saved by your knowledge and facts of HOW Christ saved us. Rather you are saved by faith in Christ. The OT believer had faith in Christ for their salvation and were saved by that faith alone. John 20:29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
  20. The same can be shown for Moses (Hebrews 11:24-27), and David (Acts 2:30-31, 4:25-28), and many other OT saints, that they trusted in Christ (the coming messiah). Something to note as you read the gospels, the amount of people who were looking for "The Christ" to deliver them BEFORE Jesus died on the cross. They were not looking for the cross or some generic promise that God gave about the nation but rather looking for their savior. The wicked wanted to destroy him, the faithful wanted to submit to him. If you do a word study on "Christ" in the Gospels, before Jesus was sacrificed, you will se
  21. John 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. Hebrews 11:17-20 By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son, 18 of whom it was said, That in Isaac shall thy seed be called: 19 accounting that God was able to raise him up, even from the dead; from whence also he received him in a figure. 20 By faith Isaac blessed Jacob and Esau concerning things to come. Galatians 3:17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was fou
  22. This is generally true but technically it was not the cross. They Looked forward to the Christ who would one day come and save them. However, they did no know that the cross would be the method until after he rose again. John 4:25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.
  23. Understanding The Psalms A handbook for Spiritual Christian Growth Book 1 (Psalms 1-41): How to Be Blessed by God (Downward Blessing) Book 2 (Psalms 42-72): Learning To Trust God (Upward Trust) Book 3 (Psalms 73-89): The Believer's Worldly Struggle (Outward Reality) Book 4 (Psalms 90-106): Going to God for Protection (Inward Faith) Book 5 (Psalms 107-150): Learning to Praise God (Pressing Onward) "The Psalms" is a harmonious collection meant to be meditated upon and mastered in progresive order, to foster spiritual growth and understanding. Learned as a whole, greater truth
  24. What I said is in harmony with scripture, showing that The Father worked through Christ (by Christ's Works) to secure our eternal salvation and that he is now working in us, the believer, to convey that salvation to others (by our works). Christ's Works secured the salvation and our works convey his salvation to others and thu this conveyance the Father delivers faith and draws the person. 2 Corinthians 5:17-19 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. 18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to hims
  • Create New...