trapperhoney

Brother, I understand your concerns. Several years ago my husband and I were led to a little church who had an interim pastor. We immediately took a liking to this man. He was an excellent Bible teacher. We knew that God wanted us to be there. We were there for about a year and a half and the interim pastor left the church. They assembled a pulpit committee and began looking for a pastor. They were desperate so took the first thing that came along. This man was reformed in theology. Hubby was on the pulpit committee and he tried to warn the people, but it was more important that they have a pastor. They brought him in with an almost unanimous vote (dare I say there were only two who voted nay?) and within six months several people had left because they did not agree with his teaching of reformed theology. We stayed because we didn't want to be a man-follower (it was very tempting to follow the interim pastor to his new church) and because God had not directed us to leave. He brought us there for a purpose, and we had to trust in him. We stayed for probably three more years. My husband had many conversations with him about reformed ideals. Several times hubby stumped him with his comments and he would say, "I will have to look into that and get back to you" -- and never once did he come back with a rebuttal for what hubby had pointed out to him. Eventually God clearly led us away from the church and we are now in a solid, loving IFB church. I am still not 100% sure why we were at that church for that length of time, but it's not for us to know. My advice for you is that as long as God directs you to be at this church, that is where you are to be. The pastor is the head of the church and answerable to God. Show him respect. Many times my husband questioned our pastor, but always with respect and in a non-confrontational way. Most times they ended the conversation agreeing to disagree. Whether you agree with him or not, he should have the respect due his office. I am reminded of David and King Saul. David had opportunities to kill Saul, but he knew it was up to God to deal with Saul. I know many people would have said it was wrong to go to a church that taught reformed theology, but hubby and I both felt it was more wrong to walk away from a situation before having clearly been led of the Lord to do so. I am sorry to say that if this church is heading down the path you suspect, there is little hope for it. From what you have said it sounds like the key leaders in the church want to go in this direction, and unless God changes their hearts or removes them, then that is the direction it will go. Rarely do churches or people turn around once that happens. Frequently the solid people have to walk away. But it is important to do it in God's timing and in the right way. So, pray about it, and my husband and I will be praying with you. It is not an easy position to be in.

I agree. As I read I felt this was a personal letter, not one addressed to a church. You bring out very good points!

I don't know how it is in other areas, but churches around here seem to become desperate when looking for a pastor and often end up settling on the first man who will come to them whether he is the right man or not. I saw a church so desperate that when a man applied he refused to give a statement of faith but they interviewed and hired him anyway. He then proceeded to put his father on the deacon board and change all the bylaws so that he is now "supreme ruler." There should be no reason for a church to become desperate when they are without a pastor. The men should be trained in the leadership of the church and take turns preaching, etc. while waiting for God's man to come to them. Unfortunately it seems most pastors are concerned about "job security" and do not train the men. The flip side is that there are few men who are interested or would be willing to step up for this role. A floundering church is the devil's delight.

I have never heard of them so wondered if they were a good guitar or an off-brand.

so sorry to hear that, Rosie!

just an update, they finally got those new strings put on the guitar and now both hubby and son are in love with it and fighting over who will play it, LOL. also, was wondering if anyone knows anything about this guitar manufacturer, I'm considering this classical guitar for my son.... http://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B005M365ZO?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=ox_sc_sfl_title_87&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

sounds fun! now hubby wants me to look for abandoned places in WV we can go check out

thank you all for your prayers. the emotional strain doesn't come from the uncertainty of what might happen, but that someone who was a "friend" and claimed to be a "Christian brother" could be so ugly and hateful. fortunately hubby and I had a quiet evening last night and we found youtube videos of people exploring old abandoned structures. hubby, as a carpenter, loves old buildings, especially those with woodwork. of course I wanted to smack some of the people because they know nothing about buildings or the eras some of those houses were from. one guy toured a Victorian house and he was going through pointing out there was a fireplace in every room, like he couldn't imagine why they had all those fireplaces. then, there was one or two boards on the edge of the porch that was rotting and the guy says that the place has one foot in the grave and will have to be torn down soon and we're like, What??? that house was in very good shape. *smh* Anyway, feeling much better today. bless you all!

Dear Brothers and Sisters, my heart has not been so heavy since we had to walk away from my home church. I won't go into all the nasty details, but a little background is that we got our son started in karate a little over four years ago to help him break out of his shell. We didn't know anything about karate, differences in style, etc., a place that was reasonably priced opened up near us. Well, in six months it closed, our son was enjoying it so we started going to the main dojo almost 30 miles away. We went there faithfully. I would say that in the three and a half years we only missed two classes. My husband even went out and helped with various repairs to the building when they were needed. Last May we opened a dojo closer to our home with the sensei who had been teaching at the main dojo. That sensei and the grandmaster recently had a falling out. In all reality, the grandmaster was out of line. Recently we had been seeing a change in behavior and personality in the grandmaster. Lately if you disagree with him over the slightest thing you are now "the enemy." Anyway, he kicked our sensei out of the organization and then contacted my hubby. We prayed about it, and with the unstable atmosphere now in the organization we felt it was best to walk away. In the last year there has been a continual string of drama. Hubby wanted to try to leave amicably, but that was not to be. He met with the grandmaster last Tuesday evening and he was trying his best to be intimidating, threatening to sue, etc. if we continued to operate our dojo, threatening to include our son in the lawsuit, etc. Hubby and I both feel they were empty threats, he has no grounds because he had no money into our dojo, but it was all very upsetting. I've been an emotional mess since then. I know we did the right thing. It just hurts that someone who you considered a friend and who claims to be a Christian, would behave in such a way. I am praying that I can get into my studies today and hopefully get myself back to an even keel.

my past week has been quite a roller coaster. I'm trying to catch up today, lol.

They certainly have a handicap by not being grounded biblically or attending a solid church. Sadly I have heard of pastors fostering this kind of behavior. Will certainly pray that they will both get in a good church and their heart will be tender to the leading of the Spirit.

praying, Rosie! *hugs*

I know personally that a man who might seem quiet, easy going and goofy in public can be very different in the 'safety' of his own home where no one else can see him. Anyone can be very longsuffering with people outside their families, but spouses, siblings, etc. will set them off in a heartbeat. It wasn't said if either of these two women he was married to had been married before. Since he has had two women leave him it could be that he in some way mistreats them (emotional abuse is still abuse though harder to see), isn't the godly man he should be, or that he just has very bad judgment in the women he picks. However, the important thing to keep in mind is that right now they are married and everything should be done to try to save the marriage, so I will certainly pray that the Lord will work in both their lives and that they would both be obedient to God in this situation.

Wow, didn't know that about Revenant. Hubby will be disappointed Isn't Edward Panosian in The Printing? I got to meet him, really nice guy, very knowledgeable about the Bible, it was awesome hearing him speak. Hubby and I love the movie Sheffey.