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Pastor Scott Markle

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Everything posted by Pastor Scott Markle

  1. And I was waiting for that interaction, to see in what direction it might go.
  2. Brother MBKJPreacher, If I may, I wish to respond toward your above posting with small comments or changes here and there. Some may view this as being overly "picky," but it is actually my desire to provide precision (from my perspective at least). I would say that it is through "the knowledge of the gospel message" AND the convicting work of the Holy Spirit that a lost sinner's heart CAN be moved and will CAN be influenced to decide willingly to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ as Savior. (I would employ the verb "can" instead of the verb "is," because the verb "is" almost makes it sound as if it is a certainty that a lost sinner will respond in faith to the knowledge of the gospel and the conviction of the Holy Spirit. This is not certain because lost sinners can resist, refuse, and reject.) I would say that the first time a lost sinner would respond in love for God is when the lost sinner understands God's love for him (through the gospel message) AND actually engages in heart repentance of his or her love for the darkness. I would contend that understanding the message of God's love is not enough, but that actual heart repentance must occur before a lost sinner has changed from love of the darkness to love of the light. Indeed, I would agree that this idea is Biblically false. Romans 3:11 - "There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God." Romans 3:18 - "There is no fear of God before their eyes." (And I could add more passages to this list.) I would utterly reject the Calvinistic belief of "regeneration before faith" as a Biblical falsehood and false gospel. I would have to disagree with such a position. Biblical repentance involves the emotion, and according to God's Word the "heart" is clearly involved in the matter of Biblical faith. (Note: I do NOT believe that the "heart" is Biblically to be viewed as the seat of emotion, but as the seat of motivation.) I strongly oppose this viewpoint. _________________________________ Well, I have a scheduled obligation; so more to follow later.
  3. Brother Mike, In your posting above, you asked a question concerning Revelation 14:14-16. In addition, you implied a second question concerning "the Day of Christ" in 2 Thessalonians 2:2 and its relationship to the context of 2 Thessalonians 1 - 2. As I answer those questions, I wish to begin with the context of 2 Thessalonians 1 - 2, since that context is foundational to my position on a pre-tribulational rapture. And in this posting I wish to begin with the flow of thought in 2 Thessalonians 1 -- 1. In 2 Thessalonians 1:3-4 the apostle Paul expresses his thanks unto God for the faith, charity, and patience of the believers at Thessalonica, especially in the face of the persecutions and tribulations that they were experiencing. 2. In 2 Thessalonians 1:5-7 the apostle Paul seeks to encourage the believers at Thessalonica is relation to the persecutions and tribulations that they were experiencing by focusing their attention upon "the righteous judgment of God." 2.a First, the encouragement of God's righteous judgment is that these believers "may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God," for which they were suffering. 2.b Second, the encouragement of God's righteous judgment is that God would (in due time) "recompense tribulation" to those who were persecuting them. 2.c Third, the encouragement of God's righteous judgment is that God would (in due time) recompense rest to those who are being persecuted for His name's sake. 3. In 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10 the apostle Paul reveals the time wherein God's will bring about this righteous judgment and recompense - at our Lord Jesus Christ's "Second Coming." 3.a This is the time of Christ's REVELATION in power and glory - "When the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels." (This would seem to correspond with Revelation 1:7 & Revelation 19:11-16) 3.b This is a time of Christ's VENGEANCE upon unbelievers - "In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not god, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power." (This would seem to correspond with Revelation 14:9-11 & Revelation 19:17-21.) 3.c This is a time of Christ's GLORIFICATION among believers - "When he shall come to be glorified in his saints,a nd to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day." (This would seem to correspond with Revelation 14:12-13 & Revelation 20:4-6) 4. In 2 Thessalonians 1:11-12 the apostle Paul prays for the believes at Thessalonica concerning their faithfulness and spiritual growth, all that the name of Christ might be glorified in them. _________________________________________ It does indeed seem clear that 2 Thessalonians 1 is talking about the "Second Coming" of Christ.
  4. Brother MBKJPreacher, In the questions above, you present two passages for consideration: 1 John 4:19 & James 1:18. You presented 1 John 4:19 as the primary passage under question and presented James 1:18 as an illustration of your point (as per question #2). Allow me to begin with questions #3-4 concerning James 1:18. 3. Yes, there are such times; and yes, James 1:18 is an example thereof. 4. Yes, in James 1:18 God's Word is speaking to believers about the principle and event of their regeneration by God's gracious will through the power of God's Word (the gospel of faith in Christ). In fact, in James 1:18 the principle and event of our regeneration is employed as a motivator for us believers to grow further in spiritual maturity through the truth and wisdom of God's Word (as per James 1:19-ff). (Note: Referencing elements from the event of our salvation as a motivator for further growth is a common practice in the New Testament Scriptures.) So then, what about 1 John 4:19? 2. 1 John 4:19 presents a general spiritual principle - We sinful humans have not initiated the relationship of love with God. The Lord our God is the one who has initiated that relationship of love. Sinful humans only ever engage in a love relationship toward God because He Himself first chose to demonstrate love toward us. Indeed, according to the teaching of the New Testament, God's demonstration of "First Love" is the giving of His Son as a sacrifice for the salvation of us sinners. Even so, the PRINCIPLE of 1 John 4:19 can be applied to any aspect of our relationship of love toward and with God. 1. No, I am NOT proposing that the general principle of 1 John 4:19 has no application to the first time that an individual recognizes God's "First Love" and responds in love. In fact, as I have presented in the paragraph above, the principle of 1 John 4:19 can be applied to ANY aspect of our relationship of love toward and with God. However, I AM proposing that the general principle of 1 John 4:19 is not included in its immediate context primarily to teach the doctrine of the lost sinner's change from love of sin to love of God. Rather, the primary doctrine of the immediate context (encompassing 1 John 4:7-21) is that we believers should love one another. Within this immediate context, the principle of 1 John 4:19 is intended as a motivator for this doctrinal responsibility (and is somewhat of a rewording and expansion of the same principle as given in 1 John 4:10). Thus I would contend that 1 John 4:19 should not be presented as a primary and foundational source for the doctrine that you are seeking to build upon it, that is - the doctrine concerning a lost sinner's change from love of the darkness to love of the light, from love of sinful evil to love of God and His Savior. I could accept if it is employed simply as a supporting principle, but I would contend that the substance of the doctrine needs to be significantly communicated from some other foundational passage first (such as I have done above with John 3:19-21). Furthermore, I would contend that the principle of 1 John 4:19, when applied to this doctrine, really only teaches that God's "First Love" is a motivator for the lost sinner's love toward God. It does NOT teach that a lost sinner's encounter with God's "First Love" will necessarily bring about the lost sinner's response of love back to God. It does not teach whether a lost sinner can resist the motivation of God's "First Love" and thereby reject it. It only teaches that whenever any given lost sinner engages in love toward God, it is only because God demonstrated love first. (In fact, the reason that this passage does not teach these certain things is because it is written to those who are already believers, and who thus have already entered into the relationship of God's love. Furthermore, it is written to those believers in order to motivate love toward fellow believers. The process by which a lost sinner first engages in love toward God is NOT the issue of the context.)
  5. Literal. Agreed. At this point, I disagree. Rather, I would hold that all of the 144,000 experience martyrdom during the second half of the seven year Tribulation Period, since it appears to me that they all are standing in heaven with the Lamb before the throne of God in Revelation 14:1-5.
  6. Brother MBKJPreacher, I do not believe that either 1 John 4:19 or Galatians 5:5-6 within their immediate context are intended to teach the truth that you trying to build upon them. Rather, I believe that contextually both 1 John 4:19 and Galatians 5:5-6 are intended to teach to those who are already believers concerning our ongoing life of faith and love. On the other hand, I believe that John 3:19-21 and 2 Thessalonians 2:10b are more contextually appropriate to teach the truth that you are seeking to promote - John 3:13-21 is clearly a gospel context. Involved in that gospel context - 1. John 3:13 teaches the deity of God the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ. 2. John 3:14 & 16 teach the sacrificial death of God the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ. 3. John 3:15-16 & 18 teach the need for faith on God the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ. 4. John 3:15-18 teaches the gift of salvation, eternal life, and justification for believers. 5. John 3:18 presents a warning and judgment unto those who refuse faith in God the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ. Then John 3:19-20 provides the reason why some refuse faith in God the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ; while John 3:21 provides the reason why others come in faith unto God the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, as personal Savior. According to John 3:19-20 the reason why some refuse faith in God the Son is because "men loved darkness rather than light." Furthermore, we learn the reason that "men loved darkness rather than light" is "because their deeds were evil." Finally, we learn the reason that men hate and reject the light is lest their "deeds should be reproved." On the other hand, according to John 3:21 the reason why others come in faith unto God the Son as personal Savior is because they "do truth," such that their "deeds might be made manifest" in order to reveal that God Himself is doing His saving work in their lives. Even so, this passage clearly speaks about the matters of love and hate in relation to the gospel of faith in God the Son as Savior. The second line of John 3:19 states the fact that "light is come into the world." Based upon the teaching of John 1:4-5 (as well as other passages in the Gospel of John), this seems to be a reference unto God the Son Himself as Savior. Thus when John 3:19-20 states that "men loved darkness rather than light" and that they hate the light, and will not come to the light, this appears to reveal a hatred and rejection by lost individuals against God the Son as Savior. From this would be implied the truth that those who do come in faith unto God the Son as personal Savior are those who no longer love darkness rather than light, but who now love light and truth rather than darkness (which from my perspective appears to be the moment of Biblical repentance). I would further contend that the second half of 2 Thessalonians 2:10 corresponds to this understanding -- "Because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved." Herein we learn that those who receive "not the love of the truth" are those who will not be saved. From this is implied that in order to be saved an individual must receive "the love of the truth." I believe that this corresponds with the teaching of John 3:21 that those who are saved are those who "do truth" and thus come "to the light." So then, I would contend that there IS an aspect of love which is necessary in coming through faith unto God the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, as personal Savior from the darkness of our sinfulness. Scripture appears to teach that those who actually come in faith unto God the Son as Savior are those who: 1. Cease to love the darkness of evil more than the light. 2. Turn from hating the light unto some manner of love for the light. 3. Receive the love of the truth and thus "do truth" such that they come to the light. So then also, I would contend that this describes the Biblical repentance that leads unto faith for salvation. ________________________________________ Yet the title question of this thread discussion is as follows: To the question as given, I would answer - Yes. I would contend that an unbeliever cannot receive "the love of the truth" until they have encountered the truth. However, if the question is intended to imply that simply "hearing the gospel" is that which immediately moves an unbeliever from love for darkness to love for the light, I would say - I cannot agree. Many hear the gospel and yet continue to love "the darkness rather than the light." Rather, I would contend that the moment of change from hate of the light to love for the light is the moment of Biblical repentance in the heart. Indeed, I would contend that even Holy Spirit conviction itself is NOT the moment of this change. Certainly the Holy Spirit's work of conviction is intended to convince a lost sinner unto Biblical repentance; however, lost sinners can and do resist the convicting work of the Holy Spirit. It is only when a lost sinner yields to the convicting work of the Holy Spirit, that he or she comes to Biblical repentance, receives the love of the truth, and places faith in God the Son as Savior.
  7. Thank you for clarifying. It just appeared to me that your opening post did not necessarily acknowledge that some dispensationalists do not hold to a "different gospel for different dispensations" position. Thus I expressed my contention. As I stated in my earlier posting, I myself do firmly stand against and have firmly (fiercely) contended against any such idea concerning "different kinds of gospel." There is ONLY one gospel unto eternal salvation from sin, from the beginning of human sin unto the end of time - It is the gospel of repentant faith in the grace of God through the saving work of His Messiah/Christ. (Not every dispensation has had all of the revealed details of historical event or soteriological doctrine, but every dispensation has possessed this foundational gospel.)
  8. I say ANY view of different gospels is FALSEHOOD. In fact, I myself have fought firmly (some might even say, fiercely) right here on Online Baptist against the viewpoint of "different gospels for different dispensations." However, I must also contend against your posting above. You open with the statement, "The Dispensationalists believe," as if ALL Dispensationalists hold the viewpoint of "many kinds of gospel and different plans of salvation." Such is simply an inaccurate idea. Some Dispensationalist may hold to that viewpoint (even as you provided the example of "Steven Andersonites"), but ALL Dispensationalist do NOT hold to that viewpoint. In fact, I myself am a Dispensationalist (to some extent), but I strongly oppose that viewpoint.
  9. In this posting I wish to consider just Romans 1:28-30 - Herein we do indeed have a passage of Scripture which directly states that unbelievers are "haters of God." However, the opening question for this thread discussion was whether or not ALL unbelievers hate God, as follows - So then, does Romans 1:28-30 precisely teach that ALL unbelievers are "haters of God." I am compelled to contend that Romans 1:28-30 does NOT precisely teach that ALL unbelievers are "haters of God." In Romans 1:18-32 we encounter a five step progression of ungodliness and unrighteousness within an unbelieving society: Step 1 - They know of God's existence, but do not glorify Him as God. (vs. 18-21) Step 2 - They change the glory of uncorruptible God into an image of corruptible creation. (vs. 22-23) Step 3 - God Himself gives them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts. (vs. 24-25) Step 4 - God Himself gives them up unto vile affections. (vs. 26-27) Step 5 - God Himself gives them over to a reprobate mind. (vs. 28-32) If we view Romans 1:18-32 according to this progression, then we would be compelled to acknowledge that the descriptive concerning unbelievers as "haters of God" does not precisely occur unto the fifth and final step of the progression, wherein God has given unbelieving society "over to a reprobate mind." Now, this does NOT necessarily indicate that unbelievers are not "haters of God" prior to this stage of the progression. Rather, this is to indicate that the passage itself does not precisely teach that ALL unbelievers are "haters of God," but only those unbelievers who are in the "reprobate mind" stage. (Now, if Romans 1:18-32 is not viewed as a progression, then this "argument" might not be viewed as valid.) (Note: This "argument" concerning Romans 1:18-32 does not cancel my earlier posting concerning the definition of "hate" and "love" in relation to unbelievers and the matter of disobedience and obedience.)
  10. Here is a very serious set of questions on the matter of standards in general (and thus also on the matter of standards in the realm of clothing) -- Is it possible for us to mandate a "standard" in a given area (not simply for our own behavior, but over the behavior of others) that is more strict than the Lord our God Himself would mandate? Is it possible for us to mandate such a "stricter standard" than the Lord our God, and even base that standard on principles from God's own Word? If it is possible for us to so mandate such a "stricter standard" than the Lord our God, how bad of a thing is it for us to do? (Note: Consider 1 Timothy 4:1-3 -- "Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; fobidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth."
  11. So, let us consider a corresponding question -- Deuteronomy 22:5 teaches that a man should not "put on a woman's garment." Here then is the question -- Is skirt-wear "a woman's garment?" If you say "yes" to the above question, did you come to that conclusion through the actual declarations of God's own Word, or through some other "authority"?
  12. And such is a spiritually grievous problem, for those who profess godliness should certainly maintain a higher standard of modesty than the lost world does. "Picking a fight" - Not at all my intention. Pushing to Biblical precision - Definitely my intention.
  13. Indeed, the "dress code" as presented by our Lord Jesus Christ is to wear "modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety," . . . "which becometh women professing godliness." The issue of MORE "dress codes" than your public school is not actually relevant. Rather, the relevant issue is whether the women of God are following the ACTUAL "dress code" that our Lord Jesus Christ provided.
  14. When talking about the New Testament church, who should be the authority to tell us how we ought to behave ourselves "in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth"? I would think the answer should be -- Our Lord Jesus Christ, the Head of the church, concerning whom God the Father desires that in all things He should have the preeminence. So then, in the New Testament Scriptures has our Lord Jesus Christ, the Head of the church, given us by Holy Spirit inspiration more or less "dress codes" than the public school for whom your drive bus? Your comment above seems to carry a negative view of many churches in America because they have less "dress codes." It would seem that if our Lord Jesus Christ, the Head of the church, has given less "dress codes" in the New Testament Scriptures for the New Testament church, then the same negative view would carry against Him as well.
  15. Brother Mike, As I assume you are aware, I would disagree with your position on this matter. Indeed, as I presented earlier in this very thread discussion, I hold my position based primarily on my understanding of the grammatical and contextual flow of thought in 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12. On the other hand, I would view the reasons that you have presented above, by which it seems others have argued for the pre-tribulational rapture, as nothing but human rhetoric. You are correct - 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 does not state anything about the timing of the rapture, but only about the reality thereof. In fact, although I would not agree with the position of your posting above, I would indeed agree with sentiment of your posting - human logic is a poor foundation for doctrine. Only precise Biblical truth and teaching is a solid foundation for doctrine.
  16. I hold to a pre-tribulational rapture position, primarily due to my understanding of the grammatical and contextual flow of thought in 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12.
  17. Brother Matt, Our primary way of usage is through door hanger bags. We pack a door hanger bag with a booklet, a tract (usually God's Simple Plan), and a church business card. Then we distribute door to door in our local towns and mailbox post to mailbox post (not in or on the mailbox, since that is illegal) throughout our rural areas. Since we live in a primarily rural area, we have found this to be a most profitable way of distribution. Also, some do hand out these booklets to those with whom they have a little more contact/relationship than simply a "cold contact." They would not likely be used at the check-out counter, but more likely with neighbors, friends, co-workers, family, acquaintances, etc.
  18. Brother Matt & Brother Tony, are you interested in receiving a sample copy of the booklet? If so, let me know your mailing address through private message. Sample copy would be sent with no cost to you.
  19. Interesting complaint. Bouncing Bill in one of your previous postings above, approximately an hour ago, you stated the following: As an outside reader, it appears to me that Brother Matt has been attempting to "enlighten you" ever since, just as you yourself requested. Yet now you complain that his very attempt to "enlighten you" (as per your own request) is somehow not answering your questions, but pursuing misdirecting "rabbit tracks." Here then is the primary flow of thought in the most immediate discussion above: Your statement - Brother Matt's request (which actually means that this most immediate discussion is supposed to be about you, Bouncing Bill, answering HIS request) - The opening Biblical quotation in your response to Brother Matt, which is a quotation from Matthew 25:35-36 (although NOT from the King James translation), and which does indeed reference the "Final Judgment" as per your reference above (although it is NOT actually the FINAL judgment) - To which quotation Brother Matt asked another question (which means that once again you, Bouncing Bill, are supposed to be answering HIS question) - Yet you then responded with the following - Thus Brother Matt has been expressing his confusion. You, Bouncing Bill, presented Matthew 25:35-36 as Biblical evidence for your position, but then state that you do not see how Matthew 25 has any bearing on the topic. Then why did you quote Matthew 25:35-36 as evidence for your position? That is now Brother Matt's confusion and request. -
  20. Brother Bruce, I also attempted to transfer your tract into a pdf format. It turned out as follows: Brother Bruce's Gospel Tract.pdf See if that will work for you.
  21. Hmmmm. To this point in time, I have not done so, but have only used them in and for our church ministry. I suppose that I am open to doing so, but would have to consider exactly how to go about it (calculating printing cost, shipping, etc.). At first I would think it best to send a sample to those who might be interested, in order that they might check over the booklet as a whole and be sure of their interest. If that sounds acceptable, we can proceed from there. (Note: We would also need to figure out how to place a different church imprint, than that of Melvin Baptist Church, on the last/invitation page. For that I may need to discuss with the printing ministry concerning how to make such changes.)
  22. Also a 12 page booklet entitled "God's Way of Forgiveness for Your Sins" that I have compiled myself and that our church has printed by Bethel Baptist Print Ministry in London, Ontario. This booklet contains two primary sections: I. The first five pages - God's Way of Forgiveness for Your Sins (with the following subpoints, and corresponding passages typed out) 1. You must believe the truth of God's Word that you need God's forgiveness for your sins. You must acknowledge that you have sinned against God. You must acknowledge that you deserve God's judgment. You must acknowledge that you cannot save yourself. 2. You must believe the truth of God's Word that God the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, is the only way of forgiveness and salvation -- through His shed blood, sacrificial death, and glorious resurrection. You must believe that the Lord Jesus Christ died for you and for your sins and sinfulness. You must believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is God the Son, and that He rose again from the dead. You must believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is the one and only way of forgiveness and salvation from your sins. You must believe that the Lord Jesus Christ can and will save you from your sins. 3. You must obey the commandment of God's Word to believe and call upon God the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, as your personal Savior from sin. You must personally choose from you heart to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ as your personal Savior. You must personally and purposefully call in faith from your heart unto the Lord Jesus Christ, asking Him to save you from your sins. You should call upon the Lord Jesus Christ in faith and receive Him as your personal Savior right now. (After a few corresponding passages to the last truth, a "Sample Prayer" is included along with the following note: "This prayer is not magical. If you do not mean this prayer from your heart, it will do you no good.") II. The sixth page - My Decision for Christ (An explanation that the decision to receive the Lord Jesus Christ as personal Savior makes one a child of God. A place to record their spiritual birth date. And some corresponding passages to the above truth.) III. The seventh through tenth page - Counsels to The New Born Child of God (with the following subpoints, and corresponding passages typed out) 1. Know that you have eternal life and that you are secure forever in the Lord's hand. 2. Joyfully obey your Lord and Savior Jesus Christ in being baptized Biblically as a believer. 3. Give yourself as a living sacrifice to your Lord and Savior Jesus Christ to live your life wholly for Him. 4. Speak to your Lord and Savior Jesus Christ every day in prayer. 5. Read from and meditate on the Word of God every day. 6. Faithfully obey the counsels and commands that your Lord and Savior Jesus Christ gives to you from His Word (the Bible). 7. Attend a Biblically faithful church (a church that preaches, teaches, and stand for the truth of God's Word) whenever it has services. 8. Confess your sins in prayer to the Lord and ask His forgiveness, whenever you disobey the counsels and commands of His Word. 9. Tell others how the Lord Jesus Christ saved you from your sins, and seek to lead them to receive Him as their personal Savior also. IV. The eleventh page - An invitation to Melvin Baptist Church. V. The twelfth page - a blank page. _____________________________ Front Cover
  23. God's Simply Plan of Salvation by LifeGate (with its various cover designs) Peace by LifeGate Are You 100% Sure by Partner's in Ministry Amazing Love by Partner's in Ministry (Note: Not in favor of all that Partner's in Ministry produces)
  24. Brother Bruce, I thank you for this message, since I have been pondering on this (how to proceed) for the past few days. In a broad sense, I suggest that we proceed in the following order of discussion: 1. The Permanency of Marriage (God's primary intention) 2. The Permission for Divorce (If God has granted any) 3. The Perspective on Remarriage (From God's viewpoint) Even if someone comes to the conclusion the the Lord our God through His Holy Word has granted some provision for divorce (which I presently hold), and even maybe for remarriage after divorce (which I presently do not hold), I still believe that the discussion should always begin with our Lord God's original and primary intention for the PERMANENCY of marriage. What do you think about the order above?
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