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Ukulelemike

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    Ukulelemike got a reaction from E Morales in Should Christians tithe during the corona virus?    
    While we are not a church plant, we are in an area of very limited numbers. When I began the finances were taken care of by a lady who was very good with it. However they left, due to age, wanting to live near family, so the money was taken over by my wife and I, as we are quite small, and most of the people we deal with in our church have no ability to see to their own finances, much less the church's. As you probably agree, it is not a position I prefer to be in, BUT, since my wife and I, along with three people who aren't even part of our church anymore, are really the only ones who ever give, well, there's not much to work with anyways.
    We once had a man who wanted a full accounting of the money coming in. He gave a couple times while there, but, again, while no one else was giving, and at this point, he had not for quite some time, I told him I would get him a list of bills and what came in, but he wanted a big accounting, and I told him, not giving himself, that he wasn't entitled to it. This was very shortly before we lost our building due to lack of giving, and I think he figured we were misusing the vast stores of riches that were coming in. 
    Later, he left the church, but some of the younger members were still in contact with him, and he got them all fired up for an accounting of the money. Mind you, not ONE of these people ever gave a dime, even though some worked full time jobs. They said, What do you do with the offerings? I said, What offerings? I asked them, what offerings have you given that I need to account for, and of course, none could answer at all. However, my wife went over the entire last, like, five years of giving, (except what we gave, as it wasn't their business), to show that really, nothing was coming in. The bills were being paid primarily by us, only. They were pretty embarrassed and never asked again. Of course, not embarrassed enough to start giving. 
  4. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from PastorMatt in Should Christians tithe during the corona virus?    
    While we are not a church plant, we are in an area of very limited numbers. When I began the finances were taken care of by a lady who was very good with it. However they left, due to age, wanting to live near family, so the money was taken over by my wife and I, as we are quite small, and most of the people we deal with in our church have no ability to see to their own finances, much less the church's. As you probably agree, it is not a position I prefer to be in, BUT, since my wife and I, along with three people who aren't even part of our church anymore, are really the only ones who ever give, well, there's not much to work with anyways.
    We once had a man who wanted a full accounting of the money coming in. He gave a couple times while there, but, again, while no one else was giving, and at this point, he had not for quite some time, I told him I would get him a list of bills and what came in, but he wanted a big accounting, and I told him, not giving himself, that he wasn't entitled to it. This was very shortly before we lost our building due to lack of giving, and I think he figured we were misusing the vast stores of riches that were coming in. 
    Later, he left the church, but some of the younger members were still in contact with him, and he got them all fired up for an accounting of the money. Mind you, not ONE of these people ever gave a dime, even though some worked full time jobs. They said, What do you do with the offerings? I said, What offerings? I asked them, what offerings have you given that I need to account for, and of course, none could answer at all. However, my wife went over the entire last, like, five years of giving, (except what we gave, as it wasn't their business), to show that really, nothing was coming in. The bills were being paid primarily by us, only. They were pretty embarrassed and never asked again. Of course, not embarrassed enough to start giving. 
  5. Thanks
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from Jim_Alaska in Should Christians tithe during the corona virus?    
    While we are not a church plant, we are in an area of very limited numbers. When I began the finances were taken care of by a lady who was very good with it. However they left, due to age, wanting to live near family, so the money was taken over by my wife and I, as we are quite small, and most of the people we deal with in our church have no ability to see to their own finances, much less the church's. As you probably agree, it is not a position I prefer to be in, BUT, since my wife and I, along with three people who aren't even part of our church anymore, are really the only ones who ever give, well, there's not much to work with anyways.
    We once had a man who wanted a full accounting of the money coming in. He gave a couple times while there, but, again, while no one else was giving, and at this point, he had not for quite some time, I told him I would get him a list of bills and what came in, but he wanted a big accounting, and I told him, not giving himself, that he wasn't entitled to it. This was very shortly before we lost our building due to lack of giving, and I think he figured we were misusing the vast stores of riches that were coming in. 
    Later, he left the church, but some of the younger members were still in contact with him, and he got them all fired up for an accounting of the money. Mind you, not ONE of these people ever gave a dime, even though some worked full time jobs. They said, What do you do with the offerings? I said, What offerings? I asked them, what offerings have you given that I need to account for, and of course, none could answer at all. However, my wife went over the entire last, like, five years of giving, (except what we gave, as it wasn't their business), to show that really, nothing was coming in. The bills were being paid primarily by us, only. They were pretty embarrassed and never asked again. Of course, not embarrassed enough to start giving. 
  6. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from E Morales in Should Christians tithe during the corona virus?    
    When a younger IFB, (I became one in my 20's while in the Navy), I was, of course, brought up in the idea that the tithe was unquestionable, and absolute. I never bothered to question it-of course, I was learning so much new, but didn't do a lot of searching at the time. 
    It wasn't until much later that my father gave me some of his old Bible college papers he had written, since I was preparing to become a pastor, and one the things he wrote was why He believed the tithe was not for today. I read it once and kind of poo-pooed it, but it stuck in my mind and I began to study it out and came to find that he had, indeed, done his homework, and was correct, that the only reason churches teach a tithe today is because they just seem to want that money and it is often easier to obtain by making it basically a matter of "you're stealing from God!', if you don't.
    The Bible is really quite plain: the tithe was OT, it was, by the law, generally made up of foodstuffs, not money. Before the law there are only two instances of a tithe, or a tenth, and both were by choice: Abraham giving a tithe to Melchezidek,  which was only a one time deal, and it came from the things taken in the battle, not his own property. The other was Jacob, and his tenth had a condition attached to it, being that God returned him back to his father and homeland in peace, THEN he would give God "the tenth part', so it wasn't even so much the first tenth, but the tenth part; and we actually never see the fulfillment of this promise and how he did it. 
    so pre-law tithing is very limited, purely voluntary, and each apparently single incidents. After the law we never see one place where it was given in money, gold, silver or any such thing, always food. And it WAS an aspect of the law.
    The NT clearly teaches freewill giving, as we have been prospered by God.
  7. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from wretched in Should Christians tithe during the corona virus?    
    When a younger IFB, (I became one in my 20's while in the Navy), I was, of course, brought up in the idea that the tithe was unquestionable, and absolute. I never bothered to question it-of course, I was learning so much new, but didn't do a lot of searching at the time. 
    It wasn't until much later that my father gave me some of his old Bible college papers he had written, since I was preparing to become a pastor, and one the things he wrote was why He believed the tithe was not for today. I read it once and kind of poo-pooed it, but it stuck in my mind and I began to study it out and came to find that he had, indeed, done his homework, and was correct, that the only reason churches teach a tithe today is because they just seem to want that money and it is often easier to obtain by making it basically a matter of "you're stealing from God!', if you don't.
    The Bible is really quite plain: the tithe was OT, it was, by the law, generally made up of foodstuffs, not money. Before the law there are only two instances of a tithe, or a tenth, and both were by choice: Abraham giving a tithe to Melchezidek,  which was only a one time deal, and it came from the things taken in the battle, not his own property. The other was Jacob, and his tenth had a condition attached to it, being that God returned him back to his father and homeland in peace, THEN he would give God "the tenth part', so it wasn't even so much the first tenth, but the tenth part; and we actually never see the fulfillment of this promise and how he did it. 
    so pre-law tithing is very limited, purely voluntary, and each apparently single incidents. After the law we never see one place where it was given in money, gold, silver or any such thing, always food. And it WAS an aspect of the law.
    The NT clearly teaches freewill giving, as we have been prospered by God.
  8. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from Jim_Alaska in Should Christians tithe during the corona virus?    
    When a younger IFB, (I became one in my 20's while in the Navy), I was, of course, brought up in the idea that the tithe was unquestionable, and absolute. I never bothered to question it-of course, I was learning so much new, but didn't do a lot of searching at the time. 
    It wasn't until much later that my father gave me some of his old Bible college papers he had written, since I was preparing to become a pastor, and one the things he wrote was why He believed the tithe was not for today. I read it once and kind of poo-pooed it, but it stuck in my mind and I began to study it out and came to find that he had, indeed, done his homework, and was correct, that the only reason churches teach a tithe today is because they just seem to want that money and it is often easier to obtain by making it basically a matter of "you're stealing from God!', if you don't.
    The Bible is really quite plain: the tithe was OT, it was, by the law, generally made up of foodstuffs, not money. Before the law there are only two instances of a tithe, or a tenth, and both were by choice: Abraham giving a tithe to Melchezidek,  which was only a one time deal, and it came from the things taken in the battle, not his own property. The other was Jacob, and his tenth had a condition attached to it, being that God returned him back to his father and homeland in peace, THEN he would give God "the tenth part', so it wasn't even so much the first tenth, but the tenth part; and we actually never see the fulfillment of this promise and how he did it. 
    so pre-law tithing is very limited, purely voluntary, and each apparently single incidents. After the law we never see one place where it was given in money, gold, silver or any such thing, always food. And it WAS an aspect of the law.
    The NT clearly teaches freewill giving, as we have been prospered by God.
  9. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from E Morales in Baptist Don't Fast?   
    I JUST taught on fasting last Sunday night!  It isn't a terribly popular subject, but it is such an important thing. It has many benefits to it, and God promises that those who fast in secret, God will reward openly! 
  10. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from Jim_Alaska in Baptist Don't Fast?   
    I JUST taught on fasting last Sunday night!  It isn't a terribly popular subject, but it is such an important thing. It has many benefits to it, and God promises that those who fast in secret, God will reward openly! 
  11. Thanks
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from Jim_Alaska in What Happened to my Church?   
    The clear initial problem here is that deacons ran the church. Deacons are there to assist the pastor, to take certain responsibilities off his hands so he can minister in prayer and the word-when deacons boards began to run things, that's when church leadership went awry.
  12. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from wretched in Should Christians tithe during the corona virus?    
    Well, I do not believe tithing is a NT principle in the first place, but giving definitely is, so I will approach from that perspective:
    As far as, should Christians keep giving? Absolutely! As we are prospered, so we ought to give to God's work. Of course, those out of work, on furloughs, laid-off, etc, well, see to your family first; many are out of work so they cannot be expected to continue. Church expenses should be a bit down for buildings, in power usage and without normal activities, but I also know utility companies and mortgage companies are being told to give breaks during this time, as well. 
    This is also a good time for believers to practice helping one another, as those who are still working should help see to the needs of those members who cannot right now. This is also a basic Bible principle. Brethren in need, don't hide your needs from those who are still doing alright-we need to know your plight if we are to help. Brethren who are still working, time to put basic NT tenets to work! Don't be stingy with what God prospers you with.
  13. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from Jim_Alaska in Should Christians tithe during the corona virus?    
    Well, I do not believe tithing is a NT principle in the first place, but giving definitely is, so I will approach from that perspective:
    As far as, should Christians keep giving? Absolutely! As we are prospered, so we ought to give to God's work. Of course, those out of work, on furloughs, laid-off, etc, well, see to your family first; many are out of work so they cannot be expected to continue. Church expenses should be a bit down for buildings, in power usage and without normal activities, but I also know utility companies and mortgage companies are being told to give breaks during this time, as well. 
    This is also a good time for believers to practice helping one another, as those who are still working should help see to the needs of those members who cannot right now. This is also a basic Bible principle. Brethren in need, don't hide your needs from those who are still doing alright-we need to know your plight if we are to help. Brethren who are still working, time to put basic NT tenets to work! Don't be stingy with what God prospers you with.
  14. Thanks
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from Jim_Alaska in Baptism of John the baptist?   
    I think maybe just the term "Baptist" was coined as a denomination, so to speak. 
     
  15. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from swathdiver in Why are Millennials Leaving the Church?   
    Pretty much all (of the few) in our church are of the millennial persuasion, so I can speak a bit on this.
    I have, for instance, twin brothers, 28, who seem to love the church and the Lord, but tend to be in and out, for family events, occasionally getting caught up in a video game, working so any hours of overtime they sleep most of Sunday, spending the day working on their yard or truck. So there seems to be a certain ADHD, of sorts, that they are going so many directions they tend to just...forget. We find that often if we text and remind them of upcoming service, probably 90% of the time they make it. But they are too mindful of other things. They haven't learned to fully put God first. I am patient with them, because I see myself there, too, when I was their age. 
    It is nothing new really-we must remember the Bible says that few will find the narrow path.
  16. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from Jim_Alaska in Protecting Our Congregation - Church Security   
    In our little country church, maybe we will just bring in our guard dogs. 
     
  17. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from John Young in What Happened to my Church?   
    When I first became a pastor, there were no deacons, just 'trustees', because we were small, and they were there for business purposes. I have since done away with the official state business aspect, got rid of the 501C3 aspect of the church, and so no trustees. While still too small to worry about deacons, once I had considered it, and they balked at the idea that, A, they weren't going to be a board who decided what did and didn't go on at the church and run the pastor's ministry, and, B, that their primary job was to take things OFF my shoulders and take over in various duties like visitation and the like, so I could put my focus on the word and prayer for the sake of the church. Even when I showed them in scripture what the deacons were hired for, basically waiting tables, they didn't like it, and so no deacons.
  18. Like
    Ukulelemike got a reaction from Jim_Alaska in What Happened to my Church?   
    My old church in San Diego, fortunately, hasn't gone through this, though I've seen they are starting to use some contemporary music, carefully recrafted to a more conservative sound. Unfortunately, this is often the first step down. Once the current pastor, who is holding things together, passes, the trip down will be much quicker.
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