2Tim215

1 - Devils / Fallen Angels cannot be saved. Read the Bible.
2 - Christ did not die for the angels, he died for man. Read the Bible.
3 - Angels do not have souls. Read the Bible.
4 - Salvation / Redemption is a mystery to the angels. They Don't understand it, but desire to. Read the Bible
5 - Believing on Jesus Christ is trusting him as Saviour. Jesus means Jehovah, the one who saves. The devils do not trust him as Saviour, and cannot believe on him as Saviour. Read your Bible.

You guys have it all wrong. It's NOT the believing in Jesus that saves - It's the believing that Jesus died for you, that He took your sins upon Himself and that with Him nothing you can do can reunite you with God. The devils believing Jesus is that they believe Him to be the Son of God - we on the other hand believe Him to be THE SAVIOR!!

KJV1611 is right. By your definition anyone who falls back into sin at any time in their life was never saved. When I state the "I live like the devil" - you will note that it is in inverted commas. This is because some of you have already decided to label me in this manner. Like you, I am of the flesh and as such live in sin ALWAYS. I fall, I get angry, I sin daily, I often do what I want and not what I should and often I wish I had never heard of the gospel or Jesus Christ. BUT I know that He is real, I know He died for me, I know WHY he died for me and I know without a doubt that I am saved!!!

This whole true salvation and false salvation thing that a lot of you IFB's use to justify your lack of understanding of why people live unchanged lives smacks of Calvinism. I chose to believe and I choose to continue to live in sin or not, and this is never permanent. It changes every second of every day. Life happens and some of you are blessed to have a loving community of believers surrounding you where you are held accountable, chastised, loved and motivated and finally, have reason to believe in God's goodness rather than His indifference.

For many that is not the case and if you believe in eternal security you will hopefully understand the absolute simple beauty of God's saving Grace. He made it simple for a reason, the entire bible testifies that man can not get saved by works, that nothing he does will ever satisfy God's righteousness and that only through Jesus are we made acceptable unto Him. That if we believe once off at any one time in our lives we are promised eternal salvation. And the reason this is of God alone is because NOTHING we can EVER do can take that promise away, that our works can not bank it and our sin can not withdraw it. It is done and will for ever stay done. IFB's slam all others who don't believe in eternal security yet turn around and say that if they don't live holy lives they were never saved. Many believe they can lose their salvation and "repent" daily - You believe they were never saved in the first place if no change occurs. This whole thing that you need to repent and change in order to be saved stinks of works based salvation - so I have to throw the question back at you - are you truly saved if you think that you can convince God that you are worthy to be saved because you "repented"?

Me, I think I will stay with the fact that I am unworthy, was unworthy and remain unworthy and it is only His grace that saved me. Remember, it is not how many times they fall, it's how many times they get up - even if it's only in the heart where the judgmental pharisees can not see, GOD SEES IT!!!

My response to your comments is in RED above.

Jesus dying on the cross was to pay for your sin and my sin. Those "sins" you are saying you are required to "turn from"...they are already paid for by the blood of Christ. He doesnt need the lost sinner to "turn from sin" "give up sin" surrender" "etc". He wants the lost sinner to BELIEVE. Trust CHRIST to pay for those sins. He'll clean the sinner up, and doesnt need our help. The sinner simply believes, God saves, and God will make the change in the person.

Where to begin...

First, you are defining "repentance" in reference to salvation as "turning from sin" and "being sorrowful for sin" and "surrendering to God". Show me SCRIPTURE that teaches ANY of these definitions. The "Way of the master" website might teach this, but God's word does NOT. Repent always means a 180 degree turn from one thing to the opposite. It would NOT be turning from sins to God. It would be turning from sins to NOT sinning. The Bible does not teach this for salvation. It does teach that it is turning from unbelief to belief.

Second, you mentioned even the devil believes but hasnt repented. The angels cannot be saved. One reason is because they do not have souls. Another is that Christ did not die for them. To angels, salvation is a mystery.
1 Pet 1:12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.
Next, Acts 20:21 and Acts 26:20

"Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ."
"...that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance."
In the first one, they are turning from unbelief in God and unbelief in the Lord Jesus Christ TO belief in God and Jesus Christ.
In the second one, they are to repent (from unbelief) and turn to God (in belief) and do works meet (worthy of) repentance. So when a person gets saved they are commanded to do good works because it is their duty, and it is the least they can do for the great salvation God has given them. Ephesians 2:8-10 also say something very similar. Why complicate something that is so simple to see in scripture. Repentance is obviously a necessary part of salvation. SO...knowing this, lets look at just one example, although there are many, many, many more. Acts 16:30-31 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. Now, why didnt they tell him to "repent"? Isn't it NECESSARY for salvation? Jesus said it was. John the Baptist preached it. The Bible clearly teaches it. So, I ask again, why didnt they tell him to repent? The answer is simple. In order to "believe on the Lord Jesus Christ" you have to turn from your unbelief to believing. So by saying to BELIEVE, they are in essense saying to REPENT.

Forget what "way of the master" says and believe what the Bible teaches about itself. You cant define terms based on what others say they mean. Interpret their definitions from the way the Bible gives them. The Bible clearly teaches that biblical repentance when in reference to salvation is turning from unbelief to belief. It is NOT turning from sins.

Here's my two cents:
Personally, I am a KJO kinda guy, but I do not believe that one can not learn something nor get saved by many of the newer versions of God's Word. God will use a brick to get someones attention if He has to, He used a rock to give water in the desert to prove a point. I know that the KJO argument has many dark faces and many darker advocates. I am not saying that all are that way inclined, but you get the few IFB's that can get down right nasty on this issue and then there are those that allow God to enlighten in His own time - I am one of the latter. There is nothing more forbidding than telling a saved believer that his doctrine and bible are "wrong" just because one believes it to be so and in the end, regardless of what anyone says this KJO thing is based only on what one believes to be true to themselves.
I have yet to come across a verse that states "Thy shall read the 1611AV King James Bible only and thou shalt condemn all other versions of the devil". Think about it. How do you convince a person that the foundation they have based there entire life's doctrine and understanding of God, Jesus, salvation and the church is now wrong or skewed? Definitely not by forcing KJO doctrine down there throats. You do it subtly with much prayer, understanding, patience and love. Not by telling they are stupid as some KJO liests do.

Now to my point - I am a newbie here so stand corrected if my assumption is incorrect here. Do we as KJO IFB's help those who do not adhere to our beliefs by closing them out of areas of our "life" (forum) for the sake of not having to deal with the nutty side of both factions (I have seen this on the 1611 site - can get a little crazy) or do we allow them to decide for themselves and just ban them when they get crazy and malicious? There are many out there tired of the wishy washy doctrine being preached in the world today and are seeking the truth - do we close the doors of the church just because someone doesn't agree with the preacher. I say let them in and let God and the power of the Word deal with them. They will soon leave when there fire doesn't cause the reaction they are looking for.

Now can someone pls direct to this doctrinal statement so I can become "unprotected"

Here's my two cents:
Personally, I am a KJO kinda guy, but I do not believe that one can not learn something nor get saved by many of the newer versions of God's Word. God will use a brick to get someones attention if He has to, He used a rock to give water in the desert to prove a point. I know that the KJO argument has many dark faces and many darker advocates. I am not saying that all are that way inclined, but you get the few IFB's that can get down right nasty on this issue and then there are those that allow God to enlighten in His own time - I am one of the latter. There is nothing more forbidding than telling a saved believer that his doctrine and bible are "wrong" just because one believes it to be so and in the end, regardless of what anyone says this KJO thing is based only on what one believes to be true to themselves.
I have yet to come across a verse that states "Thy shall read the 1611AV King James Bible only and thou shalt condemn all other versions of the devil". Think about it. How do you convince a person that the foundation they have based there entire life's doctrine and understanding of God, Jesus, salvation and the church is now wrong or skewed? Definitely not by forcing KJO doctrine down there throats. You do it subtly with much prayer, understanding, patience and love. Not by telling they are stupid as some KJO liests do.

Now to my point - I am a newbie here so stand corrected if my assumption is incorrect here. Do we as KJO IFB's help those who do not adhere to our beliefs by closing them out of areas of our "life" (forum) for the sake of not having to deal with the nutty side of both factions (I have seen this on the 1611 site - can get a little crazy) or do we allow them to decide for themselves and just ban them when they get crazy and malicious? There are many out there tired of the wishy washy doctrine being preached in the world today and are seeking the truth - do we close the doors of the church just because someone doesn't agree with the preacher. I say let them in and let God and the power of the Word deal with them. They will soon leave when there fire doesn't cause the reaction they are looking for.

Now can someone pls direct to this doctrinal statement so I can become "unprotected"