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It was a joy to have @Jordan Kurecki preach and present his work for us. It was good to to finally meet him after knowing him online for a few years. I want to encourage all you pastors out there to give him a call and have him present his work in your church, you will be blessed. Thank you Brother for coming to our small church and being a help to our people.

SAB76, I've answered you biblically. I've answered the questions that you proposed in your last post. In fact, my answer(s) are in the post that immediately precede your latest post. I no longer see the purpose in continuing this "back and forth" conversation on my part. I don't mean to sound harsh, but it's going nowhere except in a circle. Take care.

Houghton Lake is very scenic and is surrounded by forests in north central Michigan. Houghton Lake & Beach Houghton, Michigan

OK, no mincing words. This reply is aimed at SAB76. The moderators have been fielding complaints from other members about your offensive manner in this thread. Divorce or some other doctrine is not the subject of this particular reply. Offensive language is the subject. Calling other Christians "Pharisaical" is offensive and not Christ like. I gave a warning back a few replies about this sort of thing. Once again you have chosen to ignore a moderator's warning in your reply that was worded in the following manner: "And I will keep stating what I have since the start. This is Pharisaical." If you had read the board rules posted by the owner of this board you would have seen the following: 8. We will not allow the following a) Bashing of other message boards. b) Bashing of your pastor or church. ** Online Baptist is a place for fellowship, disagreements you may have with others should not be handled here. c) Members that come just to argue doctrine instead of fellowship. This is your last warning; if you can participate in discussions civilly and fellowship in a Christian manner, you are welcome here. If you choose to continue as you have, your time here will have come to an end.

Nuff said..... I am out. No accusation - your starting position is the same as Thomas - I WILL NOT BELIEVE...…. This attitude displayed in your responses to anyone who has tried to help, and displayed further in the quotes above tells me that you are not actually after answers You are convinced that the Bible is not true, and until you move from that premise you cannot make any forward progress. You need to worry less about what men like CS Lewis or Peterson say and try studying the Bible in order to answer your own questions. You are obviously not interested in what other people have to say (because you reject it without consideration), so the ONLY course of action for you to take is to diligently study the Word of God and find the answers for yourself. If you are indeed in any way interested in getting the answers...…. Have fun, but I will take no further part.

Your beginning premise is wrong. Your beginning is that the Bible is NOT TRUE, and you are asking people to prove to you that it is true. This is you (and I suspect why you have chosen that name....): Joh 20:24-25 (24) But Thomas, one of the twelve, called Didymus, was not with them when Jesus came. (25) The other disciples therefore said unto him, We have seen the Lord. But he said unto them, Except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe. This is the clear attitude that you have displayed in your answers. In contrast to your dismissing of Wretched's comments, I point you to what Jesus said to Thomas: Joh 20:29 (29) Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed. Thomas said he would not believe unless he had 100%solid proof, but the Lord said it is more blessed to believe WITHOUT THAT 100% solid proof. I can show you verse after verse after verse after verse that are absolutely 100% true and accurate, and you are sweeping aside any explanation that you do not like for three passages that YOU find doubtful. You are beginning from the premise that the Bible is in error, and asking people to prove to you that what you have already decided is false, is true. From that starting point, you cannot come to real faith in either the Lord or in His Word. I am not asking you to believe in "blind faith", but to start from a position of faith, not a position of opposition.

Brethren, Our next lesson on the local church will be in 2 Thessalonians 1:1-4 God bless you all. Alan

I'm on my phone and can't answer in-depth...sorry. The qualifications apply to a MAN...not a child, adolescent, or teenager (in my opinion). That does away with "at any time". The qualifications also are the traits that he is publicly known by...this goes beyond what the man is now...it covers years. Why? Because of how he is known by those not only in the church...but how he is known by those who are "without". It takes a long time for a man to establish his reputation...especially by those who are "without". I know pastors who are popular in my community, but they don't meet the qualifications that God has ordained. Numerous church splits have resulted from these men...hard feelings and bitterness are the results. Many have adopted false doctrine...but they chalk it up to being persecuted...when neither they (nor the churches that elected them) held them to biblical qualifications.

1 Thessalonians 2:14, "Followers of Other Good Churches" "For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in Judaea are in Christ Jesus: for ye also have suffered like things of your own countrymen, even as they have of the Jews." 1 Thessalonians 2:14 The apostle Paul had previously shown how the churches, which were regional, or local, in Judaea, a region of Israel, had suffered intense persecution by their own countrymen. The Thessalonian saints willingly followed the examples of the churches, or assemblies, of the saints in Judaea in following Christ. And, because of their faith in following Christ, and His doctrines, the Thessalonian church was persecuted by their own countrymen. The apostle Paul is very clear in his meaning. The churches in Judaea were separate congregations of believers from the churches in Thessalonica. The two regions, or local areas, were not connected, or governed, in any manner, with any ecclesiastical hierarchy, bishop, Pope, Priest, denomination, or other governmental body. The church, as a body of believers, in Thessalonica willingly made the decision to follow the example of the good churches in Judaea. A true New Testament church does not have any ecclesiastical body over them. All New Testament churches, or assemblies, are independent and make their own decisions in church matters.

Woah there big boy......The only place I remember John saying anything to do with "low calibre" is: And yet you accuse him of saying: You need to be careful with your accusations, for that is not what John said, nor even what he implied. In fact, almost exactly the opposite. He didn't say they were defiling the church, and he didn't restrict the reason to only divorce - in fact he didn't even designate divorce specifically. And yet you go on a rant about all the other problems with churches today saying that John was ignoring those and suggesting it was ALL ABOUT DIVORCE. In fact, John's statement includes, not excludes all of these things, because it is a general statement. This is very close to a false accusation.

I have to say, I appreciate the honesty of those who admit they are too weak to fast. Honesty is a good thing, but it also implies you know you ought to do it, and you know it will bring your walk with Christ somewhere it has never been before. So I ask: Is it worth it to you? Do you want a better relationship? But I also warn you: like anything we do when we seek to grow in Christ, it has its inherent dangers. The last time I fasted, I fasted for a week, because I wanted to gain some wisdom and seek god's will, as well as begin to improve my work as a pastor. Shortly after starting, my wife got sick. They said it was nothing, but a few days later, she went into the emergency room and didn't leave the hospital for 5 months, severely ill, almost dying. Listening to some preaching sermons to try to gains some balance as I reeled over what was happening, a sermon by my old pastor, who himself has done serious fasting, warned that when we fast, we need to keep in mind that things may occur that seem devastating at the moment, but are happening as a response to the fasting done to grow, and that helped immensely, as I fully realized this was god's will for some reason, and that through it all, there would be some spiritual gain. So when you fast, if you're truly looking for spiritual results, things can happen that may seem hard, but remember, a tree only bears more and better fruit when it is properly pruned from time to time. But is it worth it? Absolutely!

Friend, it is your only hope. What do you have to lose? Besides everything that is. You claim to be truly seeking Him and all who truly seek Him will find Him but only through His Word. Your choice but choose wisely.

Well no surprises here my friend. You seem to display tremendous faith in your "doubts". Your fatal error is how you view God's Word. As with most of the religious you regulate it as merely a reference for yours or others theology and not the Bread of Life. Until you decide that true life can come only from it, you will remain in doubt. MATTHEW 4

Longer answer than I intended, so sorry about that, but if you are really interested you will read it all. As Wretched said, if you are looking for a 100% kind of thing, then you are looking to do without faith. Heb 11:6 (6) But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. However, to address the three examples you cite: First of all, we must confirm that you are talking about the KJV. Most of the other versions have some pretty gross errors in them, and the rest are less obvious but still notable. Secondly, I am taking this as a genuine question, although these are the three most common “issues” that people bring up……. Thirdly, if you take single verses in isolation, then it is very easy to become “disoriented” from the account. As a result, I will quote passages in most cases rather than single verses. “Matthew 27:5 (Judas hanged himself) and Acts 1:18 (Judas died by falling down in a field)” Mat 27:4-8 (4) Saying, I have sinned in that I have betrayed the innocent blood. And they said, What is that to us? see thou to that. (5) And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself. (6) And the chief priests took the silver pieces, and said, It is not lawful for to put them into the treasury, because it is the price of blood. (7) And they took counsel, and bought with them the potter's field, to bury strangers in. (8) Wherefore that field was called, The field of blood, unto this day. Act 1:18-19 (18) Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out. (19) And it was known unto all the dwellers at Jerusalem; insomuch as that field is called in their proper tongue, Aceldama, that is to say, The field of blood. There are actually 2 issues with this passage: the one you mentioned (the manner of his death), and the purchase of the field. Judas didn’t purchase the field, as Acts 1 18 says, but Matthew 27:7-8 tells us that the chief priests purchased the field – but they did so with the money they paid to Judas, so in effect they purchased it for him. Neither is in error. It was the money of Judas, and therefore he paid for it, although the transaction was not done by Judas himself, but on his behalf. I point this out, because it shows that things stated in different ways can correctly refer to the same event. Now in regard to your actual issue with this passage, Matthew 27 tells us that Judas hanged himself. This would be the manner of his death. Acts 1:18 doesn’t actually mention his death at all – you are assuming it is how he died, but the verses do not say that. If you look at the verse it says that he purchased the land, then fell over and his bowels gushed out. But if you look in Matthew 27 you see that he hanged himself, THEN the land was purchased in his name. Paupers who died in those days were thrown into a rubbish pile outside the city walls, and if he was dropped over the wall into that rubbish pile I would think that he would likely burst asunder and his bowels would gush out…… Of course, the money was used to buy “the Potter’s Field” so that practice (Bodies on the rubbish pile) should have ceased after Judas, for then there was a place to bury strangers in. But only after this event, for even in those days it would take time to find, purchase, and organise the land for this purpose. The order of events, and an understanding of history is enough for us to address this "problem". “1 Chron 21:5 vs. 2 Sam. 24:9 (number of fighting me in Isreal)” 1Ch 21:1-7 (1) And Satan stood up against Israel, and provoked David to number Israel. (2) And David said to Joab and to the rulers of the people, Go, number Israel from Beersheba even to Dan; and bring the number of them to me, that I may know it. (3) And Joab answered, The LORD make his people an hundred times so many more as they be: but, my lord the king, are they not all my lord's servants? why then doth my lord require this thing? why will he be a cause of trespass to Israel? (4) Nevertheless the king's word prevailed against Joab. Wherefore Joab departed, and went throughout all Israel, and came to Jerusalem. (5) And Joab gave the sum of the number of the people unto David. And all they of Israel were a thousand thousand and an hundred thousand men that drew sword: and Judah was four hundred threescore and ten thousand men that drew sword. (6) But Levi and Benjamin counted he not among them: for the king's word was abominable to Joab. (7) And God was displeased with this thing; therefore he smote Israel. One million one hundred thousand men in Israel (Northern Kingdom), and four hundred and seventy thousand men in Judah (Southern Kingdom). 2Sa 24:1-10 (1) And again the anger of the LORD was kindled against Israel, and he moved David against them to say, Go, number Israel and Judah. (2) For the king said to Joab the captain of the host, which was with him, Go now through all the tribes of Israel, from Dan even to Beersheba, and number ye the people, that I may know the number of the people. (3) And Joab said unto the king, Now the LORD thy God add unto the people, how many soever they be, an hundredfold, and that the eyes of my lord the king may see it: but why doth my lord the king delight in this thing? (4) Notwithstanding the king's word prevailed against Joab, and against the captains of the host. And Joab and the captains of the host went out from the presence of the king, to number the people of Israel. (5) And they passed over Jordan, and pitched in Aroer, on the right side of the city that lieth in the midst of the river of Gad, and toward Jazer: (6) Then they came to Gilead, and to the land of Tahtimhodshi; and they came to Danjaan, and about to Zidon, (7) And came to the strong hold of Tyre, and to all the cities of the Hivites, and of the Canaanites: and they went out to the south of Judah, even to Beersheba. (8) So when they had gone through all the land, they came to Jerusalem at the end of nine months and twenty days. (9) And Joab gave up the sum of the number of the people unto the king: and there were in Israel eight hundred thousand valiant men that drew the sword; and the men of Judah were five hundred thousand men. (10) And David's heart smote him after that he had numbered the people. And David said unto the LORD, I have sinned greatly in that I have done: and now, I beseech thee, O LORD, take away the iniquity of thy servant; for I have done very foolishly. Eight hundred thousand in Israel, and five hundred thousand in Judah. A seeming difference of three hundred thousand in Israel and thirty thousand in Judah. My first thought is that in 1 Chron 21:6 it says that Joab didn’t count the Levites nor the Benjamites, so we would expect a difference in the numbers, with the 1 Chron 21 being the lower number, because it specifically says that some were not counted. That might explain the difference from Judah, but the difference in Israel is the wrong way for that simple explanation. We must therefore cast our net a little wider. And we come to this passage: 1Ch 27:1 (1) Now the children of Israel after their number, to wit, the chief fathers and captains of thousands and hundreds, and their officers that served the king in any matter of the courses, which came in and went out month by month throughout all the months of the year, of every course were twenty and four thousand. It seems that there was a system of “reserves” called up each month 24000 from each tribe, which equals a total over the year of 288000. For me, that is close enough to 300000 to make up the difference. So Joab refused to count the Levites and the Benjamites – I assume they were associated with the Temple and with Jerusalem – I can happily assume that takes care of the 30000 of Judah missing from 1 Chron 21, and if the count from 2 Sam 24 didn’t include all those who were “already on the books” as it were as soldiers of the regular rotation, then we have a close enough number on the second figure to explain it as a “rounding to the nearest….” “2 Chron 36:9 and 2 Kings 24:8 (was King Jehoiachin 8 years old or 18 when he was crowned).” This is one of the most common issues we hear – I think that there is a thread from some time ago about this on this site….. 2Ch 36:8-10 (8) Now the rest of the acts of Jehoiakim, and his abominations which he did, and that which was found in him, behold, they are written in the book of the kings of Israel and Judah: and Jehoiachin his son reigned in his stead. (9) Jehoiachin was eight years old when he began to reign, and he reigned three months and ten days in Jerusalem: and he did that which was evil in the sight of the LORD. (10) And when the year was expired, king Nebuchadnezzar sent, and brought him to Babylon, with the goodly vessels of the house of the LORD, and made Zedekiah his brother king over Judah and Jerusalem. 2Ki 24:6-9 (6) So Jehoiakim slept with his fathers: and Jehoiachin his son reigned in his stead. (7) And the king of Egypt came not again any more out of his land: for the king of Babylon had taken from the river of Egypt unto the river Euphrates all that pertained to the king of Egypt. (8) Jehoiachin was eighteen years old when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem three months. And his mother's name was Nehushta, the daughter of Elnathan of Jerusalem. (9) And he did that which was evil in the sight of the LORD, according to all that his father had done. This at first seems like a problem, but in this case we need to look at the situation and see if we can find a solution. In cases like this it would be easier for us if God made it super clear, but He does tell us to 2Ti 2:15 (15) Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. ….so we really can’t complain if we have to put some effort in…… What was the situation in which he became “king”. In the first place it is interesting that in 2 Chron 36 it says he was 8 when he began to reign in Jerusalem. But in 2 Kings 24 it says he was 18 when he began to reign in Jerusalem. Both accounts mention the same length of reign – I don’t see the 10 days being an issue. In fact aside from the 8 vs 18 the only other difference is the mention of the mother in 2 Kings 24. The point about that is that in the passage which says he began to reign when he was 8 it doesn’t mention his father’s death, and in the passage where it mentions 18 and his mother, it specifically mentions his father’s death. If you look at the situation of his father’s reign, you see Babylon was all around the place causing trouble and laying on pressure. And in fact the last few verses 2 Kings 24 tells us that when Jehoiachin was taken to Babylon the Babylonian king put someone else as King over Jerusalem. This is why he reigned only three months. So is this an indication that Jehoiachin was appointed by his father as co-regent or heir in waiting? With the unsettled nature of the rule under Babylon (see the early part of that chapter), and the resultant replacement soon after Jehoiakim’s death, it is entirely reasonable to think that he may have appointed his son as co-regent in the hope that his claim to the throne would be established. Therefore, he began to reign with his father at the age of 8, but began to reign in his own right 10 years later. In any case, he reigned only 3 months before he was taken by the Babylonians and put into a prison in Babylon, and another man put into the place of king instead of him, thereby proving his father’s wisdom in making him co-regent, but that not succeeding in its plan. Now, none of these is a watertight answer, but each of them gives a satisfactory answer to the problems presented.

I have gone through plenty of topics that seemed to contradict to me. But I inevitably found a way to reconcile Apparent discrepancies. I learned from those not to worry too much about things and accept that sometimes I wont always understand things.

2 Timothy 3:16 (KJV) All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 2 Peter 1:21 (KJV) For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. These two scriptures speak to the issue of God being the author of scripture. Men penned the words, but God gave the information He wanted to impart. He cannot contradict himself because to do so He would have to deny himself. You post causes me to wonder what bible you read and what church affiliations you have been exposed to. I think in your post I am seeing different denominational teaching and leaning. You indicate you are Baptist, but seem very unfamiliar with Baptist teaching and doctrine. You speak of saints as Roman Catholics do when they indicate that only people like the men who wrote the gospels were saints because the church said so. The reality is that all who are believers are saints. Lastly you talk about losing your faith, but there is no indication in what you wrote to indicate that you are indeed saved. It may help us some if you went over to the introduction forum and told us a bit about yourself and your religious background. So please help us to help you.

Thank you brother. It was our privilege to be with you folks.

Faith comes by hearing His Word friend, never by intellectual exercise or argument. If you are truly serious and truly searching for Him, then do this. BREAD OF LIFE There is no other way nor intellectual reasoning that will prove Him to you beyond all shadow of doubt.

Have some version of the Romans Road as a guideline, especially at first, but know and understand what you are there to say. Realize that it will take time to be fluent in presenting the gospel, and in being able to be interrupted, yet keep your message fluid amidst interruptions. Try to bring them back to what you have predetermined to be a good order of information when they get you off track with side issues, and do all things as gently as possible. It is ok to be direct when necessary. If a mormon tells you that they are good to go, let them know that they are not, and that hell is hot. "Some save with fear". Purposely develop an understanding of what to say to different people. Give some thought, study, and prayer to what you are doing. Most importantly of all points is to make sure that you are not delivering a false gospel of repentance from sin for salvation. God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way, and God repented of the evil that he said that he would do unto them, and he did it not. Don't make them think that they have to feel bad about their sin to be saved, because the heart is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked. Give the gospel of being saved by grace through faith, and without works. There is no Billy Baalam Graham changed life gospel that gets anyone saved. Make sure that they understand "everlasting", "eternal", "shall not come into condemnation", and "shall never die". That is the gift of God that they must receive, not a temporary salvation based on your changed life or repentance of sins. Faith is the evidence of things unseen. You can't see their salvation, nor should their salvation produce evidence to you, for them to be saved. Inviting Jesus into their heart is not biblical, so don't use it. Use "believe in thy heart", and "call on the name of the Lord". Make sure that they understand and believe that once they become a child of God, there is nothing that can separate them from the love of God, and although they may be a son or daughter that gets chastened, God will never leave them nor forsake them. Finally, and very importantly, show them the bible verses from the KJV for what you are telling them, because faith commeth by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

John, Your meaning was clear the first time your made it. SAB76 miss-used your clear meaning. Your second meaning is also very clear and worth repeating. Alan

Sentences within a paragraph carry on the same thought. New Paragraphs carry on a related but new thought. 1st paragraph is about Bishops being a reflection of Christ and that their infidelity or loyalty towards Christ and how that carries over to their own wives. Second is about the "Abandonment" argument being a sign of a hard heart and a reason many lack power. The third is my general opinion that GENERAL disregard for the qualification (not just divorce) is the reason our churches lack the power of God. The qualifications for the OFFICE are there for a reason and all I am saying is that churches should strive to get and hold men to the Highest standard of those qualifications that they can for the sanctity of the OFFICE and not make excuses for getting minimally and questionably qualified men for the OFFICE. To make this about us "not forgiving men" or about "how well" God used men in other capacities who were not qualified for this office, is wrong, and are false arguments.

Understood brother! I am not dogmatic trust me, just sounding an alarm to get folks to see through the rhetoric. This new, reprobate "morality" of the left with the fabricated "panic" of climate change are the main candidates I am warning of. Just praying we all keep oil in our lamps and keep this in mind during these perilous days: I Thessalonians 5

Quite frankly, the title of this thread is misleading and somewhat deceitful. The title implies that Baptists do not fast and therefore Baptists are not spiritual and do not obey the admonition to fast. This is one of the reasons why I have never commented on this thread the years that I have been on Online Baptist. In other words, the title of this thread already insinuates that "Baptists" do not fast which is an error. Quite a few "Baptists" do fast; they just don't tell everyone about it. Why? The Lord Jesus said, "Moreover when ye fast, be not, as the hypocrites, of a sad countenance: for they disfigure their faces, that they may appear unto men to fast. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. But thou, when thou fastest, anoint thine head, and wash thy face; That thou appear not unto men to fast, but unto thy Father, which seest in secret, shall reward thee openly." Matthew 6:16-18 Normally, when I fast, and I am a Baptist, only my wife knows as she cooks the food I would normally eat and maybe the children. 'nuff said.

Our church has a WhatsApp group which is mainly for prayer requests.

My wife and I went for a drive in the country the other day to a place called Dwellingup, stopped and had lunch near the river, and saw these couple of guys. No Idea what the first guy is as I am not a birdwatcher (after some searching it is a Scarlet Robin), but everyone here knows what the other one is: a Kookaburra. They are a kind of kingfisher, but have a distinctive call, which sounds a little bit like maniacal laughter when they get really into it. They are not a cautious bird at all, well known for stealing food from the tables while people are eating there. In fact, one of them flew right in between my wife and I facing each other at the table. He didn't get our food though, because we were quick enough.....

My phone camera didn't do justice to the beautiful sunset last night! I turned to the left to get a view of the fading light in the clouds, and now you can see the pineapple field. There are pineapples in the top photo as well, but the lighting is too dark over the fields.

Having a short break away for the week, in a house in the South West of Western Australia - mid winter here, so a light rain, around 18° C, so cool but perfect for sitting on the verandah, and retreating to the wood fire when it cools more. (I hope the short video works) 20190724_090703.mp4

During a trip to the Taipei Zoo, (in Taipei, Taiwan, the Republic of China), we had the opportunity to see a Panda Bear. As my wife said, "My aren't they adorable!"