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Ignorance or what?


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"But I am very disappointed with those that strongly oppose this system"

I strongly oppose it and:

Here's why PtWild...........It's kinda like "sin", it starts with little things, then the little things get bigger, and it grows, and before you know it, it's out of control. All the government is wanting to do, is just start the medical reform and then it has it's foot in the door and before you know it........COMMUNISM (well we're already there, looks like it) !!!!!! yep........keep thinking we need reform........EVEN SO COME QUICKLY LORD JESUS,,,,,I don't want my grand daughter or my family to go through what's about to come down on us. My wife is a Canadian citizen and she told me it takes over a year for a woman to get a mammogram (even if they feel like they have cancer). She was in a 40 car collision in Halifax, Nova Scotia and all her treatments were at home. While awaiting medical care, transported to medical facility, no medication was offered to relieve her pain. Read about the medical care in Canada and The United Kingdom.....that's where we're headed......WAKE UP MAN !!!!! As long as God provides income to pay my insurance company, I think we have the right to choose our doctors, I don't need a government telling me when I can and can't get treatment. Truth is, the government wants control of the insurance companies, just like GM and Chrysler.......Look at the largest building in most cities, most cases, it's an insurance company. It's no secret that they make money and lots of it !!!!! THE GOVERNMENT WANTS IT !!!!!!


This is exactly the kind of fear mongering propaganda I am talking about. People use words like "socialism" and "communism" because their generation sees views these words as scary (mainly the product of being the children of WWII vets and living during the Vietnam episode). Most of the time, the people using these words don't even know what they mean. Or, they use some blanket noncontextual definition from a standard dictionary. It's like the guy at Sen. Specter's town hall meeting yesterday that said he wanted the legislation written on a junior high level so he could understand it. Please. If he can't understand it, then we'll tell him what it means.

The House bill currently on the table in no way prohibits a person from continuing their existing private insurance just as it exists today. It does provide government insurance for those that cannot afford private health care and those who can afford it but are being turned away by the private sector due to preexisting conditions. It in no way limits your choice of doctor any more than the private sector does (it is of course limited in that if the doctor will not accept the insurance, you can't go there, but that is the way it is now). Although I have not read Canada or the U.K.'s legislation regarding national health care, I do not believe that the bill being currently proposed is an exact copy or even similar in all respects. In any event, we need some kind of reform. Children in the country DIE everyday because they can't afford adequate health care. People involved in car accidents, who could fully recover and begin contributing to society again with adequate health care, are now classified as "disabled" for life.
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Please. If he can't understand it, then we'll tell him what it means.


Now that is too funny!

Here little citizen, if you can't understand our legal double speak that took 100 Harvard educated medical lawyers 3 months to write we'll explain it to you, just TRUST us. No need to write it so that the masses can understand it!

Reminds me of that cartoon with the little girl who is chasing the cat saying, "Come here little kitty, I won't hurt you, I just want to pet you!"

Yeah, RIGHT!
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Now that is too funny!

Here little citizen, if you can't understand our legal double speak that took 100 Harvard educated medical lawyers 3 months to write we'll explain it to you, just TRUST us. No need to write it so that the masses can understand it!

Reminds me of that cartoon with the little girl who is chasing the cat saying, "Come here little kitty, I won't hurt you, I just want to pet you!"

Yeah, RIGHT!


By "us" I meant attorneys, or those who are trained in drafting legislation. The reason the legislation is hard to understand is because it is a very comlicated issue that touches on serious matters. It must be written so as to address several situations, all the while addressing economics as well as social issues. There is no "easy" or "elementaray" way to do it.
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For the legal record, I believe "elementaray" should be spelled "elementary." But I could be wrong.

I have a very revolutionary idea. Instead of reforming health care first, why don't we reform the legal system and provide tort reform first? That would provide a cost savings to the health care system of 20% (I'm guessing, but wouldn't be surprised if I was close).

Did you know there are more lawyers than doctors in the USA? {P.S. Probably not, but I thought it was funny}

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pt, my friend, for you to claim that people who are leery of socialism is only because their generation views the words as "scary" shows that you really don't understand what it is nor how close we are to a socialist state.

As for the fear mongering an propoganda: you weren't around when the "Great Society" was proposed and instituted. And you most likely don't visit the Appalachian areas of this utopia. Sad, sad situations. Why? Because the government program that was supposed to "help" these people out of poverty simply enslaved them: each generation gets more dependent on the welfare that is handed to them. Goodness, when I was a teenager in WV, there was so much unwed teen pregnancy...and nobody worried about it 'cause they could get welfare. I lived there and saw the result, pt, not only in my neighbors and friends, but amongst my own family. And it's only gotten worse, not better.

What does that have to do with health care? Simple: it's a government handout program. IT IS UNCONSTITUTIONAL for the federal government to stick it's nose into this kind of thing. And said federal government knows it and doesn't care. What the government wants is control. Whether you like that or not, that is what this government is aiming for. And, my friend, fearmongering propoganda in your mind or not; simply being scared of "words" that are generational or not - that is socialism. And, if the Lord tarries, one of these days you will see that.

Funny. My grandpa warned people about FDR and the damage he would do to this country. But he got elected. And he began some horrible social programs (social insecurity). Now, all these years later, young people say it's a good thing...but a good number of older people realize that it has stolen the initiative that Americans used to have. Save money for retirement? No need, the gubmint takes it from my check and I'll get a check back...if there's any money left when I get that old...(BTW - isn't it interesting: it's wrong to double tax...but people get taxed on their entire income before social security is taken out - and then, when people get their social security checks, they are taxed again...)

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For the legal record, I believe "elementaray" should be spelled "elementary." But I could be wrong.

I have a very revolutionary idea. Instead of reforming health care first, why don't we reform the legal system and provide tort reform first? That would provide a cost savings to the health care system of 20% (I'm guessing, but wouldn't be surprised if I was close).

Did you know there are more lawyers than doctors in the USA? {P.S. Probably not, but I thought it was funny}


Is this supposed to be one of those "gotcha" moments that proves something substantively?

Anyway. Most states already have tort reform, which in my opinion is a poor choice of reform. In the state I live in, a doctor can come to work drunk, chop off your right leg when it is the left that has to be removed, and the most you can get out of him is $1 million. Imagine yourself with no legs, or arms, or even dead. Imagine the affect it has on your family. And $1 million is supposed to replace all that.

And there should be more lawyers than doctors. Only sick people need doctors. Everything on the planet needs a lawyer.
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Are you sure they die because of lack of insurance? I can't imagine anyone saying "oh he is dying, but I can't afford take him to the doctor, so I'll just let him die" People do that with dogs and cats (remembering when one of our cat got hit by a car and everyone stood around and let him die because taking him to the vet was too expensive). The only thing I would believe that people are in debt because of lack of insurance and cut back treatment where they feel their child can survive without it (my son has a hernia, but it doesn't hurt him so I am delaying it because he will be alright without the surgery. Even his doctor check it out, and knows he is ok without the surgery) .

I do know that premature babies die all the time but it never because of no insurance. It's because the situation is out of our hand. That goes with most children who died. Such as SID and such. Or parents are just plain neglectful.

My aunt was in an car accident, and yes, it can disabled you for life even if you could contribute to society again. She had a lot of therapy, but she will never be like she used to be. She is working now, but she can easily lose her job too because of the brain damage she had because of her accident.(her accident cause her to struggle with communication)

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We are the "ruling class." :icon_smile:


Here's what Jesus himself said about lawyers. "Ruling class"........Jesus didn't think so. In turn, I know this age we're living in, we need good Christian lawyers and I appreciate men that will help those in times of need.........Jesus said that Christians should be able to settle disputes between themselves. I'd like to think we could do that. What's a lawyer here for?.......to settle disputes between the government the people? Could you enlighten me, your duties as a Christian attorney?

"And he said, Woe unto you also, ye lawyers! for ye lade men with burdens grievous to be borne, and ye yourselves touch not the burdens with one of your fingers"

Luke 11:46 KJB AV
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Here's what Jesus himself said about lawyers. "Ruling class"........Jesus didn't think so. In turn, I know this age we're living in, we need good Christian lawyers and I appreciate men that will help those in times of need.........Jesus said that Christians should be able to settle disputes between themselves. I'd like to think we could do that. What's a lawyer here for?.......to settle disputes between the government the people? Could you enlighten me, your duties as a Christian attorney?

"And he said, Woe unto you also, ye lawyers! for ye lade men with burdens grievous to be borne, and ye yourselves touch not the burdens with one of your fingers"

Luke 11:46 KJB AV


My duties are codified in a code of professional conduct. Said code requires that I zealously represent the best interest of my client. So I guess that would be my main duty as a lawyer. And lawyers do settle disputes. Sometimes it just takes a lawsuit to do so.

bzmom: Tell your husband that in this country, where we are ruled by the common law, hardly does any lawyer ever deal with any issue that is governed by a legislated law. You need lawyers, whether you like it or not, just like you need air.
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