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AmazingGrace

Whats up with the Gaithers??

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Would you say that a guy who charges tons of money for concerts and wears big flashy diamond rings would be "covetous"???? :D (Refer to list a few posts up)


I would, and add a few choice things to it too. :roll:

We had three of their songs in our Living Hymns but are removing them and replacing those songs with others. We use a process called "tipping in".

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Yes it is wrong for Guy Penrod to have long hair. But do you have as much scorn for all the IFB women that have short hair? Be careful and make sure you are fair when you judge. The other thing I find interesing is that Victorious Valley Homes use the song "For Those Tears I Died" written by Marsha Stevens, on one of their new albums, and I haven't seen any IFB people kick up a fuss about that one. Let's be consistent and use the same measuring stick for everyone, peoples.

Katy-Anne

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:) i think we are...i had no idea that vvh uses that song on their cd. i will say that if it was on a cd i made, i would pull it and edit it. and yes i don't think it is right for a woman to have her hair cut like a man's. there is a difference in having short hair (as long as it is femininly cut and styled) and having a man's hair cut if you're a woman... well anyway, needless to say people (even IFBs) have different views, but you're right we should all be using the same measuring stick...the Word of God! Amen. :)

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According to the Bible it is just as wrong for a woman to have short hair as it is for a man to have long hair so why is it "different" if it is apparently "femininely cut and styled"? If it's short it certainly isn't femininly cut or styled.

About VVH, yes people are quick to say they'd edit it out or something, but yet they refuse to listen to Gaither and say he's a bad person but they don't condemn VVH the same. You don't have to listen to Gaither and you're allowed to listen to VVH but measure them with the same thing. If it is wrong for Gaither to sing it and you are disgusted and horrified, you should also be disgusted and horrified that VVH is doing it.

Katy-Anne

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I'm not "debating" you Rachel, I'm just trying to make a point to everyone.

By the way, I have brought up the issue about VVH having it on their new CD to a few fundamentalists and it just gets ignored or explained away but mention Gaither and they condemn him for it. Just sayin there is a double standard.

Katy-Anne

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Actually, not their new CD, but rather, Susan McGill's CD, "Things that never die."
I haven't heard McGill's opinion on this, as to whether she knows it was written by a lesbian, and has unbiblical lyrics. That would be an interesting thing to ask.
If she did it knowingly and doesn't care, I'd probably have to throw out all their CD's to be consistent. :frog
But I should point out, let's not forget the Gaithers' problems either, which are quite clear. I don't think it's a sufficient response to "the Gaithers are unbiblical and ecumencal" to say "well...so are the VV girls!" because that's getting around the issue, like if a smoker were to say "Spurgeon smoked, and everyone likes him." Kind of a "two wrongs don't make a right" issue. I'll definitely have to put some thought about the VV issue, though, because it makes me uncomfortable.
At the same time, I could wonder why my church sings Gaither songs. or "Battle hymn of the republic," and so on. I suspect it's in ignorance, but I don't know.

And girls + short hair = ugly.

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ya know what samer...you always seem to be able to "hit the nail on the head" so to speak. why is it that i can never quite say exactly what i think, it always comes out sounding mixed up! :roll: grrr

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If it helps, I can't sing to save my life (not that it stops me from trying)? :mrgreen: Maybe you could just write your response as a song.

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So what makes you think that Susan McGill could have been unaware of the lady that writes that song and her history after the Gaither affair? I would like to give her the benefit of the doubt, too, but you didn't give Bill Gaither the benefit of the doubt. He even said in his press release that he didn't know she professed to be a lesbian until after he'd already been singing that song in concerts. If the lyrics are unbiblical, then Susan McGill ought to be able to pick that up just as much as Bill Gaither ought to be able to, probably even more so since she is in a good church.

Katy-Anne

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I believe Susan McGill's CD came out before the Gaither/Stevens thing.
You don't think Gaither knew she was a lesbian the day he sang her song and posed with her and her lesbian "partner"?
The reason I am tempted to give McGill more benefit of the doubt than Gaither is because she seems sincerely godly, and Gaither has already yoked up with all sorts of people (denominations, long hair, etc.)...
I don't think I'd separate against the VV music for a slip of discernment, but I would for open disobedience to the Word of God.
At what point should one separate from Gaither and his music?

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i've never listened to him much (gaither that is) because when i was younger i saw a video of one of his homecomings where he had a long-haired hippie guy singing a parody song that was kind of making fun of God and His omniscience. Even from an early age I knew that it wasn't right, so i've never been a big gaither supporter. i've always been taught, and to this day believe, that if someone can joke around about God or His Word or support someone that does, then there is something wrong. this goes for ANYONE, not just gaither and CCM artists...etc. i have actually had to separate from my best friend of 8 years because she was dating a guy like that. it was painful to do, but it was right. guess what...a few months after he was exposed as a liar and a fornicator, and my friend was so thankful for my strong stand. so its always right to stand with the Lord, no matter who you have to stand against!

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[quote]
its always right to stand with the Lord, no matter who you have to stand against!
[/quote] :goodpost: Amen! thanks for all the posts, I kinda missed like everything, I got on the site today and I was like. Ohh, Guess i kinda missed all that (there was 38 posts) Sorry I kinda backed out! Again thanks for all the posts, I found out a lot I didn't know about.

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[quote]
I believe Susan McGill's CD came out before the Gaither/Stevens thing.
You don't think Gaither knew she was a lesbian the day he sang her song and posed with her and her lesbian "partner"?
The reason I am tempted to give McGill more benefit of the doubt than Gaither is because she seems sincerely godly, and Gaither has already yoked up with all sorts of people (denominations, long hair, etc.)...
I don't think I'd separate against the VV music for a slip of discernment, but I would for open disobedience to the Word of God.
At what point should one separate from Gaither and his music?
[/quote]

I am with Katy-Anne it seems many have a huge double standard when it comes to issues like this.

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No need to get defensive over a neo guy who sings, folks...

If you like him you like him but stop trying to convince others with higher standards that they have to burn all their cd's if they wanna say they don't like Gaither. :roll:

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[quote]
higher standards
[/quote]

Really ? Maybe different standards, maybe randomly applied standards, but Higher Standards ? Sounds a little puffed up to me.

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[quote="Tim"]
[quote] higher standards
[/quote]

Really ? Maybe different standards, maybe randomly applied standards, but Higher Standards ? Sounds a little puffed up to me.[/quote]

Give me a break, I've been gone for 12 hours today and on my feet for a good portion of it, so if I say "higher" its probably the first thing my half asleep brain made my hands type. :roll: :D

And yes, the Amish have "higher" dress standards than me. If you want to change my semantics, that's fine, if it makes you feel better. :D

(Woo Hoo and I'm cranky too! haha...)

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What is even funnier is I am not a real fan of the Gathier's. I have many SG CDs and not a Gathier CD in the lot :lol: What is more ironic is the people I know who go to Gathier concerts and really like them are also are members of the most conserative IFB Church in this area :?

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[quote="Tim"]
I am with Katy-Anne it seems many have a huge double standard when it comes to issues like this.
[/quote]

Maybe some have consistent standards and apply them to all areas of their lives. I guage all my music by the same standards, I don't pick and choose. I can't speak for hypocrites that only apply certain standards to certain people - however, if something is wrong, it is STILL wrong, regardless of whether a hypocrite is inconsistent or not.

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That's very true. We need consistent music standards. I've found that if the music itself is in a style that glorifies God, chances are that later you won't find out the artist was involved in some gross sin. It's no guarantee, of course, but I don't think it's a coincidence! There are a lot of CCM artists I've refused to listen to (read: I refuse to listen to ALL CCM artists... lol) and Christian friends thought I was being way too strict. Later on those friends found out things about the artists' lives that convinced them not to listen to them anymore. I thought to myself: why are they surprised? Couldn't you tell the direction they were going by the type of music they played? If the music is worldly it's because it's coming from the heart of a worldly person, and it will come out in that person's life sooner or later.

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[quote="termite"]
That's very true. We need consistent music standards. I've found that if the music itself is in a style that glorifies God, chances are that later you won't find out the artist was involved in some gross sin. It's no guarantee, of course, but I don't think it's a coincidence! There are a lot of CCM artists I've refused to listen to (read: I refuse to listen to ALL CCM artists... lol) and Christian friends thought I was being way too strict. Later on those friends found out things about the artists' lives that convinced them not to listen to them anymore. I thought to myself: [b]why are they surprised? Couldn't you tell the direction they were going by the type of music they played?[/b] [color=darkred][i][b]If the music is worldly it's because it's coming from the heart of a worldly person, and it will come out in that person's life sooner or later[/b][/i][/color].
[/quote]

Absolutely right, termite!!! :clap: :goodpost: :clap: :goodpost: :clap:

[i][b]Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh.[/b][/i]

This is why we say that music is the universal language of the soul. We can go anywhere in the world from the rock concerts of the USA to the jungles of Africa, South America and the Bush of Australia. The demonic rock beat is all very similar, and is coming from the devil himself. :( :roll: :(

Equally universal is the music in the heart of a Holy Spirit filled believer. No matter where in the world we find it, this music will always glorify God. :sing: :sing: :sing: :sing:

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