Jump to content
  • Welcome to Online Baptist

    Free to join.

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

PastorMatt

Bring your guns to church

Recommended Posts

Amazing, I had read that article, I'm not as surprised at what many churches will do today.

Many Christians do not appear to be peaceable today.

17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
18 And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.
James 3:17-18 (KJV)

9 Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.
Matt 5:9 (KJV)

I recall seeing show on TV years ago where there was a clash between the Army and the Indians. When the soldiers would ride out to talk about peach with the Indians they would nearly always go unarmed.

People who are armed just do not favor peacemakers.

15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among
Phil 2:15 (KJV)

Neither do they appear harmless.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People who are armed do not favor peacemakers? That's rich!!! Check out the stats, Jerry. Towns and cities who "allow" armed citizens have LESS crimes. And Christians are citizens here, regardless of what you or anyone else wants to say. Christians have a right to carry guns. I think this church is silly with what its doing, but Christians can carry guns.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I see no problem with Christians carrying guns to church. Saying it is wrong is following right into Obama's plan for us Americans.

Yep!! (BTW - when I said it was silly, I meant because it's being used as a promotion. During the founding years of our country, loooong guns were carried to church!)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yep!! (BTW - when I said it was silly, I meant because it's being used as a promotion. During the founding years of our country, loooong guns were carried to church!)


Precisely.............

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm sorry but I see no need to carry a gun at all. I do live in a fairly safe place, a gun in the Lord's house doesn't sit right with me.


Blossom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LOUISVILLE, Ky. ? A Kentucky pastor is inviting people to bring their guns to church to celebrate the Fourth of July and the Second Amendment.

New Bethel Church is welcoming "responsible handgun owners" to wear their firearms inside the church on June 27, a Saturday.

An ad says there will be a handgun raffle, patriotic music and information on gun safety.

Church pastor Ken Pagano says guns must be unloaded and private security will check visitors. He says recent church shootings make it necessary to promote safe gun ownership.

Marian McClure Taylor is executive director of the Kentucky Council of Churches.

She says churches work to prevent violent harm and promote peace, but most "allow for arms to be taken up under certain conditions."

I think this is sad, quite honestly...a three-ring circus in the place set aside for worship of God--not political demonstrations, raffles, patriotic music, and lessons on gun safety. The job of the church is not to make political statements, but to bring people to Christ and edify the saints. I would have no problem with the above event if it were not church-sponsored or held on church grounds. I see nothing wrong with Christians as individuals participating in such an event; it sounds like fun, and it does emphasize an important truth. It just sends the wrong message to a world who is already confused about what churches are supposed to be doing. It is confusing at best, and inappropriate at worst.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think this is sad, quite honestly...a three-ring circus in the place set aside for worship of God--not political demonstrations, raffles, patriotic music, and lessons on gun safety. The job of the church is not to make political statements, but to bring people to Christ and edify the saints. I would have no problem with the above event if it were not church-sponsored or held on church grounds. I see nothing wrong with Christians as individuals participating in such an event; it sounds like fun, and it does emphasize an important truth. It just sends the wrong message to a world who is already confused about what churches are supposed to be doing. It is confusing at best, and inappropriate at worst.


So true and well said Annie, its very inappropriate, but I don't believe many Conservative Christians will actually agree with us on that.

Way to many Christians lets the world influence them much more than God's Word, maybe, I'm just speculating, its a lack of faith.

One of Jesus' Churches is a very scared place for worshiping the Lord thy God and building up the saints. What it will do is further alienate unbelievers, homosexuals towards Christians, especially after the murder of that doctor.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think this is sad, quite honestly...a three-ring circus in the place set aside for worship of God--not political demonstrations, raffles, patriotic music, and lessons on gun safety. The job of the church is not to make political statements, but to bring people to Christ and edify the saints. I would have no problem with the above event if it were not church-sponsored or held on church grounds. I see nothing wrong with Christians as individuals participating in such an event; it sounds like fun, and it does emphasize an important truth. It just sends the wrong message to a world who is already confused about what churches are supposed to be doing. It is confusing at best, and inappropriate at worst.


Agreed, I carry at church every sunday, but that isn't why I am at church.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think a security team of volunteers outside the building or at least outside the sanctuary would be OK. They would need to be properly trained to recognize potential problems and have some knowledge of greeting people who might pose a threat to the church. After the pastor's murder in Illinois I'm not adverse to a security team composed of the parking lot team or others if that was proposed at my church.

I would have to contrast Nehemiah with current events. We have received a warning that the enemy is bold and is predisposed to enter the gate. If he enters the gate I would prefer he has been relieved of any weapons to harm pastors or the church as they worship. Any are welcome to the service but, after profiling (wouldn't worry about political correctness) and determining there is some other pretense for coming to services someone is relieved of their weapon; I see no problem with them hearing the Gospel preached.

Nehemiah 4:7-18
7 But it came to pass, that when Sanballat, and Tobiah, and the Arabians, and the Ammonites, and the Ashdodites, heard that the walls of Jerusalem were made up, and that the breaches began to be stopped, then they were very wroth,
8 And conspired all of them together to come and to fight against Jerusalem, and to hinder it.
9 Nevertheless we made our prayer unto our God, and set a watch against them day and night, because of them.
10 And Judah said, The strength of the bearers of burdens is decayed, and there is much rubbish; so that we are not able to build the wall.
11 And our adversaries said, They shall not know, neither see, till we come in the midst among them, and slay them, and cause the work to cease.
12 And it came to pass, that when the Jews which dwelt by them came, they said unto us ten times, From all places whence ye shall return unto us they will be upon you.
13 Therefore set I in the lower places behind the wall, and on the higher places, I even set the people after their families with their swords, their spears, and their bows.
14 And I looked, and rose up, and said unto the nobles, and to the rulers, and to the rest of the people, Be not ye afraid of them: remember the Lord, which is great and terrible, and fight for your brethren, your sons, and your daughters, your wives, and your houses.
15 And it came to pass, when our enemies heard that it was known unto us, and God had brought their counsel to nought, that we returned all of us to the wall, every one unto his work.
16 And it came to pass from that time forth, that the half of my servants wrought in the work, and the other half of them held both the spears, the shields, and the bows, and the habergeons; and the rulers were behind all the house of Judah.
17 They which builded on the wall, and they that bare burdens, with those that laded, every one with one of his hands wrought in the work, and with the other hand held a weapon.
18 For the builders, every one had his sword girded by his side, and so builded. And he that sounded the trumpet was by me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
For those of you who said you take a gun with you to church, would you mind stating why?????

Blossom


Many church shootings have happened in America, If some crazy person decides to start shooting up the pastor or the congregation then I will be a little better prepared than if I had nothing but my bare hands. There were weapons in the temple in the OT, and in times of need they were used as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think this is sad, quite honestly...a three-ring circus in the place set aside for worship of God--not political demonstrations, raffles, patriotic music, and lessons on gun safety. The job of the church is not to make political statements, but to bring people to Christ and edify the saints. I would have no problem with the above event if it were not church-sponsored or held on church grounds. I see nothing wrong with Christians as individuals participating in such an event; it sounds like fun, and it does emphasize an important truth. It just sends the wrong message to a world who is already confused about what churches are supposed to be doing. It is confusing at best, and inappropriate at worst.


So true. :goodpost:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I think a security team of volunteers outside the building or at least outside the sanctuary would be OK. They would need to be properly trained to recognize potential problems and have some knowledge of greeting people who might pose a threat to the church. After the pastor's murder in Illinois I'm not adverse to a security team composed of the parking lot team or others if that was proposed at my church.

I would have to contrast Nehemiah with current events. We have received a warning that the enemy is bold and is predisposed to enter the gate. If he enters the gate I would prefer he has been relieved of any weapons to harm pastors or the church as they worship. Any are welcome to the service but, after profiling (wouldn't worry about political correctness) and determining there is some other pretense for coming to services someone is relieved of their weapon; I see no problem with them hearing the Gospel preached.

Nehemiah 4:7-18
7 But it came to pass, that when Sanballat, and Tobiah, and the Arabians, and the Ammonites, and the Ashdodites, heard that the walls of Jerusalem were made up, and that the breaches began to be stopped, then they were very wroth,
8 And conspired all of them together to come and to fight against Jerusalem, and to hinder it.
9 Nevertheless we made our prayer unto our God, and set a watch against them day and night, because of them.
10 And Judah said, The strength of the bearers of burdens is decayed, and there is much rubbish; so that we are not able to build the wall.
11 And our adversaries said, They shall not know, neither see, till we come in the midst among them, and slay them, and cause the work to cease.
12 And it came to pass, that when the Jews which dwelt by them came, they said unto us ten times, From all places whence ye shall return unto us they will be upon you.
13 Therefore set I in the lower places behind the wall, and on the higher places, I even set the people after their families with their swords, their spears, and their bows.
14 And I looked, and rose up, and said unto the nobles, and to the rulers, and to the rest of the people, Be not ye afraid of them: remember the Lord, which is great and terrible, and fight for your brethren, your sons, and your daughters, your wives, and your houses.
15 And it came to pass, when our enemies heard that it was known unto us, and God had brought their counsel to nought, that we returned all of us to the wall, every one unto his work.
16 And it came to pass from that time forth, that the half of my servants wrought in the work, and the other half of them held both the spears, the shields, and the bows, and the habergeons; and the rulers were behind all the house of Judah.
17 They which builded on the wall, and they that bare burdens, with those that laded, every one with one of his hands wrought in the work, and with the other hand held a weapon.
18 For the builders, every one had his sword girded by his side, and so builded. And he that sounded the trumpet was by me.


While I understand what you are trying to say, this example doesn't equate. In the case of Nehemiah this was a nation coming back to rebuild their capital and they were threatened by other nations.

Better to look at how the NT Christians dealt with such things. How did Christians in the New Testament deal with such matters? What did 1st century Christians do? What is the Bible example given to NT Christians?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A person toting shooting irons going to church doesn't favor a meek, peaceful, harmless, godly person. Another example of Christians influence by this world and its perverse ways.

Back in my truck driving days I knew a few truck drivers who never left home without their shooting iron, but all of them were lost souls & very worldly, plus with their behavior and the places they would go, I'm speaking of drinking joints & such, I suppose they needed them. Me, never carried one, never needed one but of course I did not go to their hangouts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
A person toting shooting irons going to church doesn't favor a meek, peaceful, harmless, godly person. Another example of Christians influence by this world and its perverse ways.

Back in my truck driving days I knew a few truck drivers who never left home without their shooting iron, but all of them were lost souls & very worldly, plus with their behavior and the places they would go, I'm speaking of drinking joints & such, I suppose they needed them. Me, never carried one, never needed one but of course I did not go to their hangouts.


Myself, I've never carried a gun as a weapon, only for hunting.

Were not the early Christians greatly persecuted? Were they not often beaten and robbed? Were their homes not violated? Were not many put to death? Does not the NT record their reactions for our edification?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would have no problem with someone taking a piece to church. I personally don't do it mostly because I don't own a handgun. I would prefer if maybe the ushers carried and not every member was packing or maybe the pastor had his iron in the pulpit. Larger churches could maybe hire a security team. Remember that lady that saved her church out there in Colorado when a man came in with a bunch of guns blazing. She was a memeber who also worked security and was hired to protect the church.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Myself, I've never carried a gun as a weapon, only for hunting.

Were not the early Christians greatly persecuted? Were they not often beaten and robbed? Were their homes not violated? Were not many put to death? Does not the NT record their reactions for our edification?


Some of them were but many also protected themselves. As I mentioned before the Pilgrims went to church with a bible in one hand and a gun in the other.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've not heard of anything like this in Australia, praise the Lord I live in a country where it is not needed. Given the times though I'm sure it won't be long.

Blossom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


While I understand what you are trying to say, this example doesn't equate. In the case of Nehemiah this was a nation coming back to rebuild their capital and they were threatened by other nations.

Better to look at how the NT Christians dealt with such things. How did Christians in the New Testament deal with such matters? What did 1st century Christians do? What is the Bible example given to NT Christians?


Yes, I understand your thoughts. Many times Christ taught to turn the other cheek, pray for those who despitefully use you, and be meek and humble. Nehemiah was building the city of God which is the primary purpose of a pastor preaching the gospel.

Christ never discouraged the Apostles from carrying their weapons. He made Peter put away his sword but, Christ was about to fulfill His earthly ministry. A good study question might be why were the Apostles carrying their weapons? Was it to protect the shepherd, the shepherd's flock or, maybe both? Maybe they carried swords just to hunt rabbits :wink ?

If the pastor is concerned and organizes a security team to protect the services of our church I would not hesitate to volunteer. I don't like the possibility of some lunatic or terrorist threatening my church family or my own family but, we live within a perverse nation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Yes, I understand your thoughts. Many times Christ taught to turn the other cheek, pray for those who despitefully use you, and be meek and humble. Nehemiah was building the city of God which is the primary purpose of a pastor preaching the gospel.

Christ never discouraged the Apostles from carrying their weapons. He made Peter put away his sword but, Christ was about to fulfill His earthly ministry. A good study question might be why were the Apostles carrying their weapons? Was it to protect the shepherd, the shepherd's flock or, maybe both? Maybe they carried swords just to hunt rabbits :wink ?

If the pastor is concerned and organizes a security team to protect the services of our church I would not hesitate to volunteer. I don't like the possibility of some lunatic or terrorist threatening my church family or my own family but, we live within a perverse nation.


Mat 26:52 Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.

Why did Christ say they that take the sword shall perish by the sword.

Let me reword it just for clarification purpose only, all they that take the gun shall perish with the gun.

Seems to nearly say those who take their gun to church shall perish by their gun.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Article Categories

About Us

Since 2001, Online Baptist has been an Independent Baptist website, and we exclusively use the King James Version of the Bible. We pride ourselves on a community that uplifts the Lord.

Contact Us

You can contact us using the following link. Contact Us or for questions regarding this website please contact @pastormatt or email James Foley at jfoley@sisqtel.net

Android App

Online Baptist has a custom App for all android users. You can download it from the Google Play store or click the following icon.

×
×
  • Create New...