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Would Eric say "Amen" to Hagee's prayer?

John Hagee prays for war in the name of Jesus.

Father, in the name of the Lord Jesus, I pray for our president tonight, to give him the wisdom of Solomon, to lead this nation into war against the enemies of righteousness. I pray for the good men & women of Washingto DC that they will
stand in righteous boldness for this righteous cause. I pray in the name of Jesus that every power & principality of darkness will be brought to confusion when this war begins. I pray God that the enemy shall be destroyed. I pray God that the angels of heaven shall go before the US & British forces bringing deliverance to that part of the world & most assuredly deliverance to Israel.

Eph. 6:10Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.
11Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.
12For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

1 Tim. 2:1I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
2For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

Mat. 5:5Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.
6Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
7Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
8Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
9Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.

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Don't be vulgar.



Oh please.

Take a look at the cartoon in and tell us all why you believe it. A picture says a thousand words, but the only one that fits in this case is "junk."

Calvinism is totally depraved theology, that is not the God of the Bible. Edited by Rick Schworer

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Rick - your posting & your attitude is thoroughly antichristian - frankly VILE - ****.

Mat. 11:25At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.
26Even so, Father: for so it seemed good in thy sight.
27All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.
28Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

John 6:37All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Sally & her parents are welcomed by Jesus with open arms when they come as sinners to him - but not if they don't.

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Sally & her parents are welcomed by Jesus with open arms when they come as sinners to him - but not if they don't.


That's not what you believe. You believe that Sally and her parents can only come if God makes them come to Him.

When you get down to it, Sally has no choice in the matter.

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Already dealt with this in my article on Preterism.

Rick Swearer does not deserve a reply, but for others I will comment.

From his "Preterism" which is an exercise in refutation of his own misunderstandings:

Yes, Jesus said “behold I come quickly” and He said in Revelation 1:3 that the events and prophesy of the book of Revelation were “at hand.”

You know what? That’s not the first time He said something like that.

Duet. 32:35, "To me belongs vengeance and recompense; their foot shall slide in due time: for the day of their calamity is at hand, and the things that shall come on them make haste."

Is. 13:6, 9-10, "Howl ye; for the day of the LORD [is] at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.
9) Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.
10) For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.
20) It shall never be inhabited, neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation: neither shall the Arabian pitch tent there; neither shall the shepherds make their fold there."


The above verses all deal with what Futurists understand to be the Second Advent of Jesus Christ, an event that still hasn’t happened yet. They’re talking about apocalyptic judgments of God and “the day of the Lord” – all things that a Preterist relegates to 70 A.D. If these passages were in the book of Matthew or Revelation, a Preterist would claim that because they used the words “at hand,” “little while,” and “is near, and hasteth greatly” that surely that must mean that the Second Advent happened right after these passages were written.

The problem with that is, they were written hundreds of years before Christ was born.

Deut. 32 is a solemn warning to Israel, & Judges, Kings, Chronicles & the prophets record how often apostasy led to Israel being overwhelmed so soon after settled in the promised land. The LORD was indeed at hand & many calamities befell Israel throughout their history.

Isaiah prophesied before the Babylonian destruction & in Isa. 13-14 he is warning Babylon about the destruction by the Medes, which took place in about 100 years. 17Behold, I will stir up the Medes against them. Swearer's selective quotations amount to a denial of Scripture.

Please, folk, read again the opening chapter of Revelation. It's written first for John's readers & companions in tribulation, then for us, down the ages. Our glorious Lord Jesus is indeed King of kings & Lord of lords & as John declares in Rev. 1, the prince of the kings of the earth..

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Rick Swearer does not deserve a reply, but for others I will comment.


Ha! That was pretty good. :clapping:

I apologize if I have become an offender for a word, which was not a cuss word, but I admit can be perceived as edgy. Perhaps I should have said that the picture in post #96 cuts through all the garbage or it cuts through all the gobilty-goop of Calvinism and put the cookies on the bottom shelf so that everyone can really understand what it teaches about who God is.

Without getting sucked into the minutia of double application prophecy, I’ll just remind you that Haggai said that the Desire of Nations was coming “in a little while.” He didn't show up for over 500 years. Think about that next time you try to use Revelation 1:3 to justify standing the whole rest of the book on its head and robbing dear sweet father Abraham of land grant.

God bless! Edited by Rick Schworer

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I said I was sorry, Vick, now get over it.

You should be more concerned with how your system of soteriology portrays the God of the universe than a single word that a guy on the internet (me in this case) happened to use.

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I said I was sorry, Vick, now get over it.

You should be more concerned with how your system of soteriology portrays the God of the universe than a single word that a guy on the internet (me in this case) happened to use.

How we come across when presenting what we say is biblical truth is very important.

Recall that Scripture teaches that if something like this offends a brother we should willingly set it aside for the sake of Christ. This applies whether we find it offensive, wrong or not.

Also, saying you are sorry and then saying "now get over it", comes off as arrogant and makes the apology seem totally insincere whether you mean it or not.

All our views are much better received, and have more chance to convince, if they are presented in love and kindness.

Myself, I enjoy the discussions dealing with this topic and I try to follow the reasoning of each view presented, compare it with Scripture and see how other views compare and contrast. When the discussions become personal there is great distraction and it becomes difficult to follow the views one is putting forth or refuting.

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You're making me the issue. Sorry if offended anyone here.

The issue isn't me, it's how your theology portrays God.

If you want to keep talking about my bad behaviour it just demonstrates even more how useless Calvinism is.

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You're making me the issue. Sorry if offended anyone here.

The issue isn't me, it's how your theology portrays God.

If you want to keep talking about my bad behaviour it just demonstrates even more how useless Calvinism is.

Actually, your "bad behaviour" presents the idea you are incapable of refuting the other position or are unable to present your view clearly. I'm not saying that's necessarily the case, but when one observes the type of posting you have reverted to, that's an obvious conclusion many draw.

It's been your deviation from attempting to put forth sound refutations of other views or sound presentations of your view that is the issue, and the distraction, not you yourself, and it is you which initiated the distraction. By claiming that those who wish to avoid such aspects are without argument, you are distracting the discussion and offering no sound rebuttal or clarification or enhancement of your view.

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We believe what the bible says, no more, no less.


That's what everyone says, whether your interpretation is true or not is another matter.

I'll say it again: "You believe that Sally and her parents can only come if God makes them come to Him."

You believe Sally has no choice in the matter, and if she goes to Hell it because God wanted it that way. God made her for the special purpose of spending all of eternity in Hell.
The God of the Bible is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. The God of the Bible knows that people will reject Him, He knows that most people will.
But He doesn't force them to reject Him.

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I don't need to enhance my view. I said that the image in post #96 clearly illustrates who God is according to Calvinism.

No one has refuted that.

Actually, I recall at least one post which stated that's not what they believe. While I've encountered some hyper-Calvinists online who might agree with that, I've never encountered anyone else who holds to any sort of what might be called Calvinist viewpoint that holds to such a view.

I also believe Invicta addressed that picture and his view didn't agree with the charge either.

Spurgeons Calvinist views didn't agree with what you said along with the picture either.

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As I have said many times before, I do not follow Calvin. I read scripture and my views are not interpretations, just reading scripture.

Your views are interpretations of scripture, or more correctly refutations.

Rick, my name is David, as some on here know.

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The tribulation is not over and the kingdom age has not started or earth woud be as follows:

Isaiah 65:14–19 KJV
17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
18 But be ye glad and rejoice for ever in that which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy.
19 And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying.

God tells rebellious Israel that she will be judged, and He will call His servants by another name.
Believers in Christ are also called servants. If you are a Christian, you have asked God to forgive your sins. You have humbled yourself before Him and asked Jesus to put His Holy Spirit in you. You now believe that Jesus is the Son of God, who died for the sins of all who will repent. You believe Jesus rose from the dead and is sitting at the right hand of God. When the Devil accuses you before God of sinning, Jesus tells His Father that you are one of His. He will say that He died for your sins, so you are not guilty. All Christian believers are those mentioned in Isaiah 65:15 who are called by another name.

Isaiah 65:20 KJV
20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.

During the kingdom age, people will not die from accidents, diseases, or murders because they will live their full days. The second half of the verse means that the age of accountability will be one hundred years old, which means a person must accept Jesus as Lord before the age of one hundred or they are accounted a sinner and bound for hell. The curse of sin will still be on humankind, so the children of the tribulation survivors must still get saved by faith in Jesus.

214 �� AMERICA’S LAST WARNING

Isaiah 65:21–23 KJV
21 And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant
vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.
22 They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.
23 They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they are the seed of the blessed of the Lord, and their offspring with them.

When people build and plant in the kingdom, no one will take anything from them because Jesus will not allow theft. Notice in verse twenty-two that the lifespan of a person will be as long as a tree’s life span. Think of what that means. People will probably live over nine hundred years, like those before the flood of Noah’s day. Also, notice that verse twenty-three says people will have offspring.
Think about the number of relatives that a person could have if he lives nine hundred years. Since people will live almost as long as the thousand-year kingdom age, most will be alive at its end. Then God will release Satan from the bottomless pit to tempt humankind to revolt against Jesus one last time.

Isaiah 65:24 KJV
24 And it shall come to pass, that before they call, I will answer; and while they are yet speaking, I will hear.

In the book of James, the Bible says that we have not because we ask not. But during the kingdom age, the verse you just read in Isaiah states that before people ask, God will answer. Wow, just think about that! God will meet the needs of the people before they even know they have needs.

Isaiah 65:25 KJV
25 The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent’s meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the Lord.


What a promise! The curse will be removed from the animal world so we will be able to pet tigers, lions, and bears because they will all be tame. We are not in the kingdom age yet!

Edited by Eric Stahl

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As I have said many times before, I do not follow Calvin. I read scripture and my views are not interpretations, just reading scripture.

Your views are interpretations of scripture, or more correctly refutations.

Rick, my name is David, as some on here know.

Actually, many who hold to some "Calvinist" views are not followers of Calvin. In fact, most know little of Calvin. As Spurgeon preached, the aspects of "Calvinism" he held to had nothing to do with Calvin and were found in Christian teaching, as well as in Scripture, long before Calvin came along.

There seem to be very, very few who actually know much of Calvin who would call themselves followers of Calvin. The same could be said with regards to Arminians, or those who hold to some aspects of Arminianism.

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Of course no one wants to admit to believing that picture John, because it's terrible. But the fact remains and will always remain that if God hand picks some for deliverance He also hand picks others for eternal damnation. That's all there is to it, and that's what that picture illustrates very clearly.

Simply saying, "I don't believe that" doesn't prove anything. They do believe it, whether they want to admit it or not.

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Isaiah 6:9 ¶ And he said, Go, and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not.
10 Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed.

Mark 4:11 And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:
12 That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them.

Edited by Invicta

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