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LindaR

Is Repentance Necessary For Salvation?

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Many resist the outward testimony of scripture because it is only external, but the inward irresitable call is when one is regenerated by the effectual power of God. Paul was # 1 Born again on the road to damascus 1cor 15

8And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.

Now , anyone knowing scripture understands that one is born exactly on the day and hour predetermined by God !

Also paul testifies that in due season God converted Him gal 1

15But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace,

16To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:

You believe God was trying to convert paul before his appointed time, how silly...lol !

When it was time for paul to be converted, God exerted His power and worked effectually as He does with all His elect..

eph 7Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.


Paul was born out of due time, the scripture says what it says but while you have charged others here for not reading in context, you need to read this in context. "Due time" was with reference to the sequence of eyewitnesses of Christ's resurrection by the disciples and apostles and has nothing to do with your assertion of Paul's irresistible conversion.

(1Cor 15:4-8)
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
5 And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:
6 After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.
7 After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.
8 And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.

Yes, he states that he was ultimately converted. The word means "untimely birth" and the next verse tells us why:

1Cor 15:9* For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.

It was untimely because right up to his conversion on the Damascus road, he was a persecutor of the church. The scripture also mentions that the Lord Jesus Himself told Paul that he was kicking against the pricks of his own conscience.

God was calling him to grace, you on the other hand conveniently substitute calling for conversion. That's subtle, but that's not good bible teaching I'm afraid.

Eph 3:7 that you quote - God made Paul a minister, one who serves and in this case, he served by preaching the gospel. This is not a conversion testimony by Paul. Totally out of context and twisted to teach you intend.

No minister can minister that without the grace of God. It isn't even optional.

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This is one problematic topic. I thought that repentance is necessary for salvation, firstly, a person must realize that he/she is a sinner.
Recently, I've read some articles and listened to some sermons online which promote the idea that repentance is heresy. I don't know what to believe anymore because there are some verses like act.16:31:"And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shall be saved, and thy house" and "Ro10:13: "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the LORD shall be saved."
It seems like this pastor is in agreement with Steve Anderson, Curtis Hudson and some others on the repentance issue. I personally believe that a person must come to Jesus the way he/she is, but she must be willing to give up their sins before putting their faith in Jesus. Repentance is a change of mind (willingness to turn from sin) that results in a change of life (in time). Please let me know where you stand on this issue as fundamental baptists.

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Steve Anderson is a die-hard heretic on many issues. I have spoken with him personally as he was my sister's pastor a couple of years ago.

This is pretty clear:

Luke 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Perish means to spend eternity in Hell - as John 3:16 shows the way out of perishing. Only a lost person can perish; therefore this verse is stating that without repentance, someone is going to Hell after they die.

Acts 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

Isaiah 55:6-7 Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near: Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

The book of Jonah shows a whole city repenting and getting saved:

Matthew 12:41 The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.

While the Bible doesn't use the phrase, "Repent of your sins," it certainly teaches the concept, and does use other similar phrases about turning from wickedness and iniquity.

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Steve Anderson is a die-hard heretic on many issues. I have spoken with him personally as he was my sister's pastor a couple of years ago.

This is pretty clear:

Luke 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
Perish means to spend eternity in Hell - as John 3:16 shows the way out of perishing. Only a lost person can perish; therefore this verse is stating that without repentance, someone is going to Hell after they die.

Acts 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

Isaiah 55:6-7 Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near: Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

The book of Jonah shows a whole city repenting and getting saved:

Matthew 12:41 The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.

While the Bible doesn't use the phrase, "Repent of your sins," it certainly teaches the concept, and does use other similar phrases about turning from wickedness and iniquity.




Very clear indeed, and a hearty Amen from the stix.......... :amen:

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Thank you for the answer. You are right, the verses are clear.
I remembered my colleague who believes that Jesus Christ died for his sins but he also told me that he will never give up hinduism, he just wants to have both and it cannot be done.

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Thank you for the answer. You are right, the verses are clear.
I remembered my colleague who believes that Jesus Christ died for his sins but he also told me that he will never give up hinduism, he just wants to have both and it cannot be done.

Acts 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Sadly, your Hindu friend is still lost and needs to get saved. He merely took on Christ as his perceived fire insurance from Hell, but never repented nor did he ever renounce his idols and multitude of Hindu gods.

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Thank you for the answer. You are right, the verses are clear.
I remembered my colleague who believes that Jesus Christ died for his sins but he also told me that he will never give up hinduism, he just wants to have both and it cannot be done.

I had a Hindu friend at work named Latha and I would witness to her...she just could not believe that you could have a personal relationship with your God. It was the hardest thing for her to comprehend. I hope that one day Latha will get saved.

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Let me ask you a question. It's not hypothetical in anyway, as all of this has happened to me or is happening to me right now

I was saved about 7 years ago. I was reading a gospel tract, and was heavily convicted of sins and cried out to God to save me. I was sick of living the way I had been and knew it was wrong. I cried and sorrowed over my sins, and prayed and asked Christ to save me.

A few weeks later, I was doing the same things again. I don't know if I hated them, or felt guilty about them. I don't remember.

However, I began to look for a church. I found a church (not a bible believing church), and was glad to have found it. I hated sin and struggled with it. Eventually, I had a relationship with a girl and ended up becoming a fornicator (something I did NOT do before I was saved).

About 2003, I stopped drinking. I stopped watching violent movies and things that I shouldn't have been. However, all throughout, and even up to now, I have struggled with pornography.

In 2004, I found a Bible believing church, and still struggled with it, praying constantly to be rid of it. I had full assurance of salvation based on God's word.

I have struggled with it to the extent that I have no joy anymore in God, but am slowly gaining ground. Where it used to be almost a daily thing, the battles are now monthly, or more(hopefully never again) . And yet I feel my heart has hardened over time. I use to have joy in God's word and preaching, but now find it condemning towards me.

So - with that very brief account - Am I saved or not? I didn't quit sinning after salvation, and in fact, did things after salvation that I hadn't done before. Do I need to now repent and be saved again? Remember this is not a hypothetical question, so don't accuse me of building a strawman or anything. I have no ready made reply. I am honestly asking.

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Repentance is a change of mind about your sin - it will affect your life. Repentance in itself is not changing your life though - you may fail in that, but still be repentant of those sins. How we get victory over sin is through meditating on the Word of God, claiming Bible promises, walking in the power of the Holy Spirit, being accountable to other believers, etc.

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But that doesn't help.. how do I know if I have repented. I believe repentence is required for salvation - but how do I know I have done it.

Let me be frank - I am not one of these people who say "I prayed a prayer therefore I am saved" and I don't believe that. I have deep angst over my sins, contrition, and hatred for it, but I haven't forsaken it, and even at times, have enjoyed doing it, even though I knew it was wrong.

I believe Jesus Christ died for my sins. I believe Jesus Christ is LORD, and I want him to also be Lord of my life in every area, but there are still areas I struggle with in my walk with Him. Because of my sins, I have often thought that I have gone too far, and that I am now BEYOND repentance, and cannot repent anymore, seeing as God gave me all those chances to do so in the past with conviction of sins, and now that I actually want to come back to Him wholly, He is refusing me.

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Only God knows your heart, but from what you have stated here I would think you are saved and you have repented.

If you had not truly been saved there would likely not be the various bad feelings you are having about this continued sin in your life. It's also likely you have truly repented, which is why it bothers you so much when you continue in this sin.

Remember that just because we are born again doesn't mean we never sin again or that there are not one or more sins that we may struggle with for months or years. We will battle sin as long as we live in these fallen bodies in this fallen world. We will experience complete victory over some sins (praise God!) and we will experience temporary victory over others.

The fact you recognize what you are doing as sin, as wrong, and that you feel guilty about this is a very good sign that your new man in Christ is attempting to resist the old sin nature. You have expressed that you have experienced some measure of victory over this sin. That's something to be thankful for and something to build upon. The fact you have been able to stand against this sin, even if only for a matter of weeks or a month or so, is evidence of growth towards victory.

The fact is, victory over sin requires effort. We must saturate ourselves DAILY with the Word of God. We must be in CONSTANT DAILY prayer. We must consciously submit ourselves to the leading of the Holy Ghost, to the Lordship of Christ in our lives. When we do sin, even those "small" sins, we must be quick to confess them to God in prayer and to repent of them and call upon the Lord to strengthen us (we can do ALL things through Christ who strengthens us!) and purposefully walk in the Spirit and not in the flesh.

We also need to be aware of those things which may trigger us to sin or make us more likely to sin. This may be a certain place, a program or movie, a certain time of day or night, something on the internet, a friend, a mood, or something else. Whatever we discover to be a "trigger" for our sin we must pray about this and strive to avoid the trigger even if that means making major changes in our lives.

Trust God, don't allow the past to drag you down (Satan loves to try to weigh us down with our past!), and continually press on for the prize which awaits us at the Lord's coming.

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Post subject: Re: Is Repentance Necessary For Salvation?

But that doesn't help.. how do I know if I have repented. I believe repentence is required for salvation - but how do I know I have done it.

Let me be frank - I am not one of these people who say "I prayed a prayer therefore I am saved" and I don't believe that. I have deep angst over my sins, contrition, and hatred for it, but I haven't forsaken it, and even at times, have enjoyed doing it, even though I knew it was wrong.

I believe Jesus Christ died for my sins. I believe Jesus Christ is LORD, and I want him to also be Lord of my life in every area, but there are still areas I struggle with in my walk with Him. Because of my sins, I have often thought that I have gone too far, and that I am now BEYOND repentance, and cannot repent anymore, seeing as God gave me all those chances to do so in the past with conviction of sins, and now that I actually want to come back to Him wholly, He is refusing me.



It is written:

"Proverbs 24:16 For a just man falleth seven times, and riseth up again: but the wicked shall fall into mischief."

Anyone can fall into sin, but the Christian cannot be comfortable there. Your statements would lead me to believe you are not comfortable with it. If you are saved sin will bother you and you will desire to get out of it. I can't tell you if you are saved or not but I can tell you that God will not refuse Godly sorrow that bringeth repentance no matter if it is the first or the thousandth time.... As far as repeated failure in a particular area or areas the only way a Christian is going to get out of that is by constantly abiding in Christ. Read the Word of God as much as you can, memorize lots of verses, medatate and think on the scriptures you read throughou the day, listen to Godly music, Godly preaching, be honest about your failings(as you have been here) and pray for grace to do what you already know to be right. Once you are "hooked" on some sin you simply MUST draw closer to God to get out of it.

It is written:

"James 4:8 Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded."

Drawing nigh to God is how we sinners can "cleanse our hands" and purify our hearts. We can't do it alone.


As we get closer to God the desire to sin will fade... If we don't draw nigh to God the devil will have even we who are Christians in a helpless, powerless state.

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"There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death." Prov 14:12; 16:25. Not until I repented of trying to get to Heaven (or get forgiveness for my sins) my way did I (or would I) come to Christ (trust Him, ask Him, receive Him - I'm not getting into a rhetorical battle on terminology). "Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended:" Phil 3:13 " For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I." Rom 7:15 I still sin, I actually enjoy it, I even pre-plan it sometimes. "But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons." Heb 12:8, there is a major killer to that short term enjoyment. " Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin" Heb 12:4, we can still get victory. "Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you." Jam 4:7. Sounds to me like you are most definately NOT running around with a seared conscience unable to obtain repentance and strength - just weary in well doing.

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Good post, John - the battle proves there is a changed man. A lost man will not fight sin or struggle with it - he will just give in to it.

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Acts 17:30-31 says, "And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent: Because He hath appointed a day, in the which He will judge the world in righteousnes by that man whom He hath ordained; whereof He hath given assurance unto all men, in that He hath raised Him from the dead."

Jesus Christ taught repentance, Paul taught it, and Peter taught it along with the apostle John. The Lord said it, I believe it, and it is true!

:clap: :clap:

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So,

How many more of the Sword's promoted 'preachers' and featured author's are in line with Hutson??
( on repentance, that is)

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[size=150]Conviction...the Holy Spirit[/size]
[i]And when he is come, he will reprove the world of[b] sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment[/b]: John 16:8[/i]

[size=150]SIN[/size]
It takes the Spirit of God, the Holy Ghost, to convict a person of sin, righteousness and judgement. When I was convicted by the Word of God, over my sorryness, I began to be brokenhearted over my sin. The Bible says that Godly sorrow worketh repentence. If you pretend to repent, thinking "I'm not too bad of a guy" in any amount, that is not repentence. I think repentence is coming to the end of your self....seeing your rotten sin as God sees it....not with the same magnitude He does but in the manner of "yes God, you are right and I am wrong".

[size=150]Righteousness[/size]
The Bible says that God IS love. The Bible says that He is Holy and righteous. There is no spot or evil in Him at all. He is right and just and has absolutely no faults. You must believe this. God is a GIVER. God loved the world...and you...so much that he gave His only Son to die on Calvary for your sin and mine. You must believe that God exists and you must believe on His Son Jesus as the only way. When you realize that God is Holy, Righteous, but at the same time merciful and full of grace. You must see yourself as totally unrighteous, before a totally righteous God. You must put your trust in Jesus and His righteousness. He is worthy.

[size=150]Judgement[/size]If you go to Hell, it's not God's fault. He is loving and gracious...waiting to extend his mercy. But he cannot tolerate sin. It's your choice. For a person to be "saved", he must realize there is something to be saved FROM. He must realize that he is a hateful, vile, rotten, evil sinner, bound for Hell and deserving to go there. He must see that God is Holy and righteous and he is wrong. The alternative is the righteous judgement of God. If you go to Hell, it's your fault, not God's.

I heard the Word of God....from the 23rd Psalm, Sunday morning, Mothers Day 1985. The preacher was preaching, full of the Holy Ghost. I was convicted, I knew what I was and what I deserved. JESUS was right there before me in the churchhouse. All I needed was Jesus. I called on the name of the Lord Jesus and he mercifully, lovingly and gloriously saved me. He lives in my heart. Yes, you ,must repent.

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So,

How many more of the Sword's promoted 'preachers' and featured author's are in line with Hutson??
( on repentance, that is)


Hmm, I don't really know who they all are, but I suspect over 50% are. I might be wrong since every preacher is his own person, but that's common among SOTL and the Hyles-style churches.

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