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The Rapture


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The "dead in Christ" are only those who "believe in christ", those who enter the trib do so because they are not believers "IN CHRIST" at the time of the rapture, but become believers during the tribulation.

the "First Resurrection" will included "ALL BELIEVERS", Church and Israel, however the Rapture is only for those who are "IN CHRIST" (the body of Christ/church) at the time of the rapture.

Israel was never promised a "rapture", that was a "mystery" along with Jesus/church that wasn't revealed to them, but they were promised a "Resurrection".


Paul was teaching that there would be christians alive at the 2nd coming. The dead in Christ rise first at that coming. Those left alive are caught up to the Lord to be changed as we will be like the angels of God at that time. It is a matter of restoring the "Kingdom" to Israel. That kingdom includes many offspring of the children of Abraham if that kept the faith. (Acts 21:20) It is not a matter of replacement. It is a matter of a new covenant, which included both gentiles and children of abraham from the start. There are many christians already in Israel now.

Randy
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wow, what a diverse bunch of opinions.

There are two resurrections in the Bible, that's it.

Acts 24:15 And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.

Revelation 20:5-6 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.


Just like at the end of a season there is ONE harvest season, but several pickings.

In fact the OT is rife with imagery concerning The FIRSTFRUITS.

Christ's resurrection, along with the saints that were resurrected when he was were the firstfruits.

Matthew 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,


1 Corinthians 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.



Please remember that Heaven and God will still be separated from the millennial kingdom, and even though life times (of those who enter the kingdom having come through the tribulation in their sinful physical bodies will live longer, they WILL die. When they do, they will go to heaven. At the end of the millennial reign the final portion of the resurrection of the just will take place.
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Christ's resurrection, along with the saints that were resurrected when he was were the firstfruits.

1 Corinthians 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.


Actually, the verse teaches that Christ is the firstfruits. Those that resurrected when He died were not raised immortal and would have died again.

Please remember that Heaven and God will still be separated from the millennial kingdom, and even though life times (of those who enter the kingdom having come through the tribulation in their sinful physical bodies will live longer, they WILL die. When they do, they will go to heaven. At the end of the millennial reign the final portion of the resurrection of the just will take place.


The Bible teaches that only the lost will die during the Millenium:

Isaiah 65:19-20 And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying. There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.

So we can see that the lost person - while still a child in comparison to the length of lives lived during that time - will die at one hundred if they have not gotten saved by that point in time.
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The Bible teaches that only the lost will die during the Millenium:


I'd have to disagree with you on this point, here's why?

God told Adam "IN THE DAY", you sin you die,

Spiritually, Adam "died" the instance he sinned, BUT,

Physically, He lived 930 years, but God's statement is still true,

A "DAY" with God is a "Thousand years",

since all have sinned, no person has lived a thousand years since sin enter the world,

all have died "IN THE DAY" they sinned.

In order to live a thousand years, a whole day, and not die, one must be totally sinless,

Only those who are "resurrected" with Jesus will have "Glorified bodies" (no sin) during the MK,

those who "physically" survive the trib and enter/born during the MK will still be "Conceived in sin" (flesh) and still have the "Sins of the flesh" attached to them, saved or lost,

Consequencely, they must die with---IN THE DAY.

the "VERY LAST" enemy conquered is "DEATH".

1Co 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
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1 Corinthians 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
Actually, the verse teaches that Christ is the firstfruits. Those that resurrected when He died were not raised immortal and would have died again.


I don't have a whole lot of time to go over this, but you can't back that up scripturally. I can point out that this is a fulfillment of prophecy of Isaiah 26:19 Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.

And in my opinion, I agree with what John Gill says in his commentary to some extent:

And the graves were opened,? Which were near the city of Jerusalem: this was a proof of Christ's power over death and the grave, by dying; when he through death, destroyed him that had the power of it, and abolished death itself; and became the plague of death and the destruction of the grave, taking into his hands the keys of hell and death:

and many bodies of saints which slept, arose: not that they arose at the time of Christ's death: the graves were opened then, when the earth quaked, and the rocks were rent; but the bodies of the saints did not arise, till after Christ was risen, as appears from the following verse; but because the other event now happened, they are both recorded here: these were saints, and such as slept in Jesus; and of whom he is the first fruits that now rose; and not all, but many of them, as pledges of the future resurrection, and for the confirmation of Christ's, and the accomplishment of a prophecy in Isa 26:19. And they rose in the same bodies in which they before lived, otherwise they could not be called their bodies, or known by those to whom they appeared: but who they were is not to be known; some have thought them to be the ancient patriarchs, as Adam, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, etc. In the Septuagint on Job 42:17, Job is said to be one of them, and a tradition is there recorded, which runs thus:

"it is written, that he rose with whom the Lord rose.

But it should seem rather, that they were some later saints, such as Zechariah, the father of John the Baptist, John the Baptist himself, good old Simeon, Joseph the husband of Mary, and others, well known to persons now alive. Some think they were such, as had been martyrs in the cause of religion; and so the Persic version renders the words, "and the bodies of many saints who suffered martyrdom, rose out of the graves".


The Bible teaches that only the lost will die during the Millenium:

Isaiah 65:19-20 And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying. There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.

So we can see that the lost person - while still a child in comparison to the length of lives lived during that time - will die at one hundred if they have not gotten saved by that point in time.


I am totally clueless to your exegenesis, but Isaiah 65:20... death mean death and that's all death means. The "hundred years old" is obviously for comparison purposes not a hard fast number of when the wicked should die.
Here is what Family Bible Notes say:
Family Bible Notes
Isa 65:20
An infant of days; whose life is only a few days.
An old man that hath not filled his days; one who, though he has reached an advanced age, yet dies prematurely.

The child shall die a hundred years old; one who dies at that age shall be considered as dying in childhood.

The sinner being a hundred years old shall be accursed; shall be accursed by being prematurely cut off at the age of a hundred years. Compare Isa 65:22. But we need not interpret the words of this verse literally. They may be understood as a promise of great spiritual vigor under the figure of extreme longevity.


Here is what Matthew Henry says:
II. There shall be new life, Isa 65:20. Untimely deaths by the sword or sickness shall be no more known as they have been, and by this means there shall be no more the voice of crying, Isa 65:19. When there shall be no more death there shall be no more sorrow, Re 21:4. As death has reigned by sin, so life shall reign by righteousness, Ro 5:14,21. 1. Believers through Christ shall be satisfied with life, though it be ever so short on earth. If an infant end its days quickly, yet it shall not be reckoned to die untimely; for the shorter its life is the longer will its rest be. Though death reign over those that have not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, yet they, dying in the arms of Christ, the second Adam, and belonging to his kingdom, are not to be called infants of days, but even the child shall be reckoned to die a hundred years old, for he shall rise again at full age, shall rise to eternal life. Some understand it of children who in their childhood are so eminent for wisdom and grace, and by death nipped in the blossom, that they may be said to die a hundred years old. And, as for old men, it is promised that they shall fill their days with the fruits of righteousness, which they shall still bring forth in old age, to show that the Lord is upright, and then it is a good old age. An old man who is wise, and good, and useful, may truly be said to have filled his days. Old men who have their hearts upon the world have never filled their days, never have enough of this world, but would still continue longer in it. But that man dies old, and satur dierum--full of days, who, with Simeon, having seen God's salvation, desires now to depart in peace. 2. Unbelievers shall be unsatisfied and unhappy in life, though it be ever so long. The sinner, though he live to a hundred years old, shall be accursed. His living so long shall be no token to him of the divine favour and blessing, nor shall it be any shelter to him from the divine wrath and curse. The sentence he lies under will certainly be executed, and his long life is but a long reprieve; nay, it is itself a curse to him, for the longer he lives the more wrath he treasures up against the day of wrath and the more sins he will have to answer for. So that the matter is not great whether our lives on earth be long or short, but whether we live the lives of saints or the lives of sinners.


Matthew Poole says:
Ver. 20. Whereas God hath made many promises of long life to the Jews, they should all be fulfilled to God's people among them, so as there should be rare abortions among them, Ex 23:26; few infants should be carried out to burial, nor but few that should not have filled up their years; those that were now children should die at a great age; yet none of these things should be of any advantage to wicked men, but if, any of them should live to be.a hundred years old, yet they should die accursed. This seemeth to be the plain sense. If any desire to read more opinions of these words, he may find enough in the English Annotations.


John Wesley says:
Verse 20. An infant - Those that were now children, shall die at a great age. But - Yet none of these things shall be of any advantage to wicked men, but if any of them shall live to be an hundred years old, yet they shall die accursed.


Even folks who believe there to be an error in the TR (those who say "well the LXX says...) say that death means death.

And it reads pretty straight forward to me.
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Please show me from the Bible where any righteous person is raised from the dead once the Millenium starts. There is none. All the righteous that ever lived are resurrected at the start of the Millenium (at the latest - most of the righteous throughout history resurrected at the rapture, and those righteous who died during the Tribulation were resurrected at the start of the millenium) - but the only mention of any resurrections after that point in time are referring to the wicked dead, the second resurrection - hence only the wicked will die during those 1000 years. See Revelation 20.

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Please show me from the Bible where any righteous person is raised from the dead once the Millenium starts. There is none. All the righteous that ever lived are resurrected at the start of the Millenium (at the latest - most of the righteous throughout history resurrected at the rapture' date=' and those righteous who died during the Tribulation were resurrected at the start of the millenium) - but the only mention of any resurrections after that point in time are referring to the wicked dead, the second resurrection - hence only the wicked will die during those 1000 years. See Revelation 20.[/quote']

When Jesus returns, only the "LIVING" are separated, "WHEAT/TARES", angels casting living unsaved into hell with previous unsaved dead to await Judgment at the GWT.

The "Righteous" enters the MK to "live/reign" over those who "Physically" survived the trib and produce all the "children".

At the GWT, both the unsaved dead, from all ages, and those who lived/died during the trib will be "judged", this is the "SHEEP/GOAT" separations.

The "Righteous" who enter the MK will have already been Judge, this is why this "second death" (Judgment) has no power over them.

Mt 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:

33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

The point is, when Jesus returns to the earth to start the MK, there is no resurrections of the UNsaved dead at that time, to be Judged as "GOATS", the unsaved are cast into hell by the Angels until the "GWT".

The "Wheat/Tares" only separates those "ALIVE" at the time,

The "Sheep/Goat" separations is both "dead and living", (from the MK) at the GWT.
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Perhaps we need to establish who exactly enters the millennial kingdom first.

Do you believe that only the armies of Rev. 19 will be killed by the Lord or the remaining wicked and evil.

I assume you believe that many people will escape through the tribulation that are NOT saved and God will allow them into his Millennial Kingdom, and that they will be the ones to populate (with children who rebel against the very present and physical King Jesus) the earth?

Will these people be ones who took the mark of the beast and will be living in the Millennial Kingdom with the Mark?

Or will these be people who avoided the mark, but still refused Christ?

Or are you saying saints with perfect, resurrected bodies will be able to have children during the Millennial Kingdom?

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Matthew 25 describes the separating of the sheep and goat nations which takes place at the end of the Tribulation, before the Millenium starts. Then the first resurrection takes place, and all the righteous dead (who died in the tribulation period) are resurrected) - see Revelation 20:4-6. So with the rapture and the first resurrection, every righteous person who ever died is resurrected. At the end of the Millenium, at the Great White Throne judgment, only the wicked dead are resurrected (this is the resurrection of damnation) - there are no righteous resurrected at this time, as no righteous have died since the first resurrection took place - only the wicked.

The Great White Throne judgment is not the second death - being cast into the lake of fire is the second death.

Only those who are saved and have survived the tribulation enter the Millenium - those who rejected Christ will be cast into Hell. That is what Matthew 25:31-46 teaches. Now these righteous with mortal bodies will have children, and not all their children will get saved. If not saved, they will die at 100. At the end of the 1000 years, Satan will gather all the remaining unsaved (the final generation of them, if you will), and bring them together against Jerusalem and God's people, where God will destroy them.

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Only the church and the Tribulation martyrs will enter the Millenium in perfect resurrection bodies - the saved Jews and Gentiles that survived the tribulation will enter the Millenium in mortal bodies, which will be able to age and bear children.

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Only the church and the Tribulation martyrs will enter the Millenium in perfect resurrection bodies - the saved Jews and Gentiles that survived the tribulation will enter the Millenium in mortal bodies' date=' which will be able to age and bear children.[/quote']
So... when do they die? What keeps them from dying in the Millennium Kingdom? Will they be Sin-Free? If not they aren't Death free either. Do they lose their salvation if they sin in the Millennium Kingdom? When do they get their glorified bodies? What about those who are LOST, sin a sin that has consequences (perhaps a sexual sin that would bring about a disease?) then get saved? Will they die? Or are all children born to the saved jews and gentiles bound for eternal Hell and will refuse to submit to God? Will there be anyone saved during the MK? If not, why do all these saved Jews and Gentiles have children that don't have a chance to be saved? Or do you believe in a different dispensation of salvation that won't depend on grace during the MK?

Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:


Simply put, the reason the book of life is present at the END Rev. 20, is that those saved (who died during the MK) will be resurrected at that point, and those not found in the book of life get tossed into the lake of fire.
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So... when do they die? What keeps them from dying in the Millennium Kingdom? Will they be Sin-Free? If not they aren't Death free either. Do they lose their salvation if they sin in the Millennium Kingdom? When do they get their glorified bodies? What about those who are LOST' date=' sin a sin that has consequences (perhaps a sexual sin that would bring about a disease?) then get saved? Will they die? Or are all children born to the saved jews and gentiles bound for eternal Hell and will refuse to submit to God? Simply put, the reason the book of life is present at the END Rev. 20, is that those saved (who died during the MK) will be resurrected at that point, and those not found in the book of life get tossed into the lake of fire.[/quote']

Isaiah 65 indicates that it is those who are accursed (unsaved) who die at 100 years old - there are no other references to death anywhere in the Bible in regards to that time period. Plus, Revelation 20 makes it very clear that only the unsaved are resurrected at the Great White Throne Judgment - that is the second resurrection:

Daniel 12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

John 5:28-29 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation

These two resurrections are separated by 1000 years. There is no mention of any righteous being resurrected anytime after the Millenium starts - and the Bible makes it quite clear that these are two completely separate resurrections.

Revelation 20:11-15 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

No one here is judged based on whether they were saved or not - but all present were judged on their works (ie. their sin, what they did wrong).



I believe ALL salvation, in every dispensation, has been by grace through faith in the Messiah. Yes, I believe there will be those who get saved during the Millenium. As far as diseases go, and any consequences for sin, the Bible is silent on that part - and it is foolish for any of us to make doctrine or interpret doctrine by what we don't know. Zechariah does teach that those nations who do not go to Jerusalem during the feast of Trumpets (such as Egypt) will not have rain for a time.
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