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What if someone gets saved but then commits a sin?

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Jerry, what are you referring to when you say "continuely living in sin"?

It would be better to discuss what the passage is referring to. The passage is stating that no true believer is going to continue in sin, ie. an ongoing walk in sin.

Believers sin - but they do not have a lifestyle of sin.

The Bible does not say the gossip will not inherit the kingdom of Heaven - but it does say fornicators, idolators, drunkards, those involved in sorcery, etc. - those are what we would call lifestyle sins.

What happens if a true child of God does not repent of their gossip (or any other sin)? God will chastise them to various degrees until they make that sin right. The last step for the unrepentant believer is death (which the Bible calls "the sin unto death" - ie. the sin that results in their death due to God's chastisement of them).


Please clarify something for me Jerry; I do not wish to assume you are saying something that you are not saying.

I know that you believe "once saved always saved," but are you saying that if a Christian does not repent even after the Lord's chastisement that He (the Lord) will (as a final step) kill the Christians as punishment and that at that time the person will go to heaven?

If that is the case wouldn't it make much more sense to sin in order for the Lord to "take you out" so that you can enjoy heaven, after all, heaven is much better than anything we have here on earth. (I trust we both would agree with that fact: heaven being better)

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There are simply too many passages that prove 1. that obedience (including baptism) is required by God and 2. that one must remain faithful even to the point of death.

1. Baptism is not part of the requirements for salvation - but is a step of obedience afterwards. The thief on the cross was saved and he never got baptized. I was saved BEFORE I got baptized. If a true Christian does not get baptized, then they are not being obedient, but it does not effect their salvation.

2. The Bible does not teach that a believer must be faithful unto death to be saved - but to be rewarded.

Matthew 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

This passage is referring to PHYSICAL SALVATION (which means "deliverance" - the passage will determine what type of "deliverance"/salvation is in view - not all are speaking of salvation from sins - see Psalm 18:3), not spiritual salvation. It is not speaking about the forgiveness of sins or eternal life, but of being spared the destruction and death caused by the Antichrist during the Tribulation period.

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If that is the case wouldn't it make much more sense to sin in order for the Lord to "take you out" so that you can enjoy heaven, after all, heaven is much better than anything we have here on earth. (I trust we both would agree with that fact: heaven being better)

Maybe to a carnal or unsaved person...

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If that is the case wouldn't it make much more sense to sin in order for the Lord to "take you out" so that you can enjoy heaven, after all, heaven is much better than anything we have here on earth. (I trust we both would agree with that fact: heaven being better)

Maybe to a carnal or unsaved person...


I can't help but think about the conversation a coc pastor had with my pastor many years back. He told my pastor, "If I believed as you do, I would go out and do all those things that I want to do."

My pastor asked him, "What things are you talking about?"

The coc pastor replied, "You know, go drinking, chasing women, that is what I would do if I believe I could not lose my salvation."

My pastor replied, "If you would repent, accept Jesus as you Savior, God would make a new man out of you and you would not desire to do such things, but as long as your lost, that's exactly what you will desire to do."

Jerry, think about this, all of those member of the church of Christ living in fear of losing their salvation of which they have never had if, they're trusting in that baptizing for remission of sin to save them.

As for me, I'm not going to debate that topic with the coc, its a foolish thing to do, will not get no where, and that is the only reason he is here, to debate with the hopes of confusing someone enough they will follow his teachings. If I wanted to have such a debate I would go to a coc message board, but I don't do such things, all it causes is strife.

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I apologize if I did. But please explain how I twisted scripture.


Heartstrings, your belief that John 5:24 teaches 1. that simply believing (a knowledge that Christ is the Son of God) will save you is mistaken and 2. that it teaches that we have

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If that is the case wouldn't it make much more sense to sin in order for the Lord to "take you out" so that you can enjoy heaven, after all, heaven is much better than anything we have here on earth. (I trust we both would agree with that fact: heaven being better)

Maybe to a carnal or unsaved person...


Jerry, inspite of your sly dodge, that is the logical conclusion to your assertion. If your death was the ultimate punishment and you could not be lost despite your sin then it would be logical just to sin and allow God to kill you so you could be in heaven which would be so much better than earth.

Of course, I do not agree with your assertion and so I would not recommend anyone sinning since that would cause one to fall away.

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I can't help but think about the conversation a coc pastor had with my pastor many years back. He told my pastor, "If I believed as you do, I would go out and do all those things that I want to do."

My pastor asked him, "What things are you talking about?"

The coc pastor replied, "You know, go drinking, chasing women, that is what I would do if I believe I could not lose my salvation."

My pastor replied, "If you would repent, accept Jesus as you Savior, God would make a new man out of you and you would not desire to do such things, but as long as your lost, that's exactly what you will desire to do."

Jerry, think about this, all of those member of the church of Christ living in fear of losing their salvation of which they have never had if, they're trusting in that baptizing for remission of sin to save them.

As for me, I'm not going to debate that topic with the coc, its a foolish thing to do, will not get no where, and that is the only reason he is here, to debate with the hopes of confusing someone enough they will follow his teachings. If I wanted to have such a debate I would go to a coc message board, but I don't do such things, all it causes is strife.


Jerry, Since I know nothing of this

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There are simply too many passages that prove 1. that obedience (including baptism) is required by God and 2. that one must remain faithful even to the point of death.

1. Baptism is not part of the requirements for salvation - but is a step of obedience afterwards. The thief on the cross was saved and he never got baptized. I was saved BEFORE I got baptized. If a true Christian does not get baptized, then they are not being obedient, but it does not effect their salvation.

2. The Bible does not teach that a believer must be faithful unto death to be saved - but to be rewarded.

Matthew 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

This passage is referring to PHYSICAL SALVATION (which means "deliverance" - the passage will determine what type of "deliverance"/salvation is in view - not all are speaking of salvation from sins - see Psalm 18:3), not spiritual salvation. It is not speaking about the forgiveness of sins or eternal life, but of being spared the destruction and death caused by the Antichrist during the Tribulation period.


Jerry,

Baptism is a requirement in relation to salvation (Acts 2:38, 22:16, 16:30ff, Gal 3;27, Rom 6:3ff, Col 2:12; 1 Peter 3:20-21). As to the thief on the cross: 1. you can not prove that this man was not baptized, of course I can not prove that he was either and 2: what if he was not baptized? He was not a member of the Christian dispensation. Moses and those under the Jewish dispensation were required to make animal sacrifices. Do you make them? I trust that you don't and that you know that you do not have to. Why? Because you are not under that dispensation.

So, one can fail to be faithful unto death and not be lost but will not recieve reward? What reward could possibly be better than getting into heaven? I suggest you look at the passages that I listed for heartstrings. The Bible does not teach that one can sin and not be lost. I suggest you study Isa 59:1-2; 6:23. These passages teach what sin will do; they teach us that we are lost if we sin.

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No sir, the Devil and his angels are doomed to Hell and they know it. They also know the true way to salvation....that's why they influence individuals, such as yourself, to spread false doctrine. I implore you, sir; admit where are at this point, and put your trust in Jesus alone for salvation before its' too late.

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No sir, the Devil and his angels are doomed to Hell and they know it. They also know the true way to salvation....that's why they influence individuals, such as yourself, to spread false doctrine. I implore you, sir; admit where are at this point, and put your trust in Jesus alone for salvation before its' too late.


I am glad that you and I can agree on the fact that the Devil/demons are lost and doomed to hello. That being said, I must say that you are not being consistant. By your argument that belief is enough (which you really don't hold anyway since you add the sinners prayer and other things) the devils would have to be saved. But again, I do not agree with your view nor do I believe that the devils are saved.

I believe you have a misconception of me. I do trust in the Lord. I trust that He gave his life for me (John 10:17-18; Matt 27). I believe that He has provide me with the oportunity to be saved and that He has promised that if I will obey/trust in Him that I am added to his church and thus saved (Matt 7:21-23; Heb 5:8-9; Acts 2:47). I have trusted in Him and have been added to His church.

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No sir, the Devil and his angels are doomed to Hell and they know it. They also know the true way to salvation....that's why they influence individuals, such as yourself, to spread false doctrine. I implore you, sir; admit where are at this point, and put your trust in Jesus alone for salvation before its' too late.


heartstrings, He will try to turn everything you say to what it does not mean, he is here to promote the teachings of the coc, and try to bring others into his false teachings.

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heartstrings, He will try to turn everything you say to what it does not mean, he is here to promote the teachings of the coc, and try to bring others into his false teachings.


Jerry, I am here to promote the Bible, your attacks not withstanding.

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Your doing something that we do not. We respect the coc by not going to their message boards questioning their teaching while promoting ours. Of which your not returning this respect, for that is exactly what your doing.

If I did as you by going to a coc message board, doing there as you are here, I rightly would not expect to be welcomed with open arms.

Mt

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Your doing something that we do not. We respect the coc by not going to their message boards questioning their teaching while promoting ours. Of which your not returning this respect, for that is exactly what your doing.

If I did as you by going to a coc message board, doing there as you are here, I rightly would not expect to be welcomed with open arms.

Mt

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No, COC, we do not desire to discuss your false doctrines on these boards. We are here to teach and discuss Bible doctrines - not cult doctrines.

As far as the thief on the cross went, he placed his faith in Christ while on the cross - therefore any baptism (which you seem to imagine) prior would not have proved anything as the Bible teaches believer's baptism, not just some ritual of getting dunked under water - but the first step of obedience for a new believer.

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Eternal Security In the New Testament

If a person asks Jesus to come into their heart and asks God to forgive their sins and tells others

that they have accepted Jesus as Lord because He died for their sins and rose from the grave,

that person is saved from going to hell when they die. But what happens if that person sins later

in life?


Rom 4:6-8

6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin. KJV

Once you are saved God imputes Jesus righteousness to you forever and will never impute or charge sin to you again.



Rom 7:19-20

19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. KJV



Paul tells us that it is not you, the spirit, that sins but you the old nature and flesh, that is charged

with the sin.



1 Cor 15:50-54

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. KJV



1 Cor 3:10-15

10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.

11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. KJV

Notice in verse 15, that even if you lose all your rewards you yourself will go to heaven and not hell.

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