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What if someone gets saved but then commits a sin?


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John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Suppose that 5 minutes ago, you heard "my word"(the Gospel) for the first time, and you "beleiveth on him" for those 5 minutes. What did you have for those 5 minutes....until you had an evil thought and got lost again? It says you...
#1 "hath everlasting life"...what kind of life was that? everlasting? for 5 minutes? hmmmm
#2 "shall not come into condemnation" what does "shall not" mean?
#3 "passed from death unto life" ....after you pass from death unto life can you pass back again?

So let's reword it so that it is possible to lose your salvation.....

John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life (until he sins), and shall not come into condemnation(unless he sins); but is (tentatively) passed from death unto life.

Who wrote first and second Peter? The same man who cussed and swore in the gospels.
The Bible says that God "scourgeth" every son whom He receiveth. He does not let his children get by with sin. So please don't say eternal security is a license to sin.

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Jerry,

You have not shown me that one can not be lost once one is saved. You have not explained the passages that I provided for you in light of your claim.

Also, you said that just as we are not saved by water baptism, we are always saved once we are saved.

If we are not saved by water baptism then please explain 1 Peter 3:21 which in fact says that we are saved by baptism. (Please note that I have not said that we are saved by baptism alone. The Bible also teaches that we are saved by faith which we have seen in many many verses but not by faith alone either as we see in James 2:24 and right here as well.)

I am accused of trashing the Bible, attacking salvation, ignoring what is written, not believing God or the Bible and yet I am not the one that is making statements that directly contradict explicit statements within the Bible. I might add that we are not talking about a matter of one saying a verse means one thing and another says it means something else. It directly states something.

I have had a person on this very site, who by the way has made personal attacks on me, state that the Bible does not say "he that believes and is baptized will be saved," while the Bible states that explicitly in Mark 16:16. That same person also said that the Bible says that we are saved by faith only. Yet the Bible explicitly states that we are not justified (saved) by faith only (James 2:24). Now Jerry, you tell me that we are not saved by water baptism and yet the Bible explicitly states that we are saved by baptism.

Who am I to believe? People or the Bible? I choose to believe the Bible.

Now, if what I have said has offended anyone or if people are not comfortable with me being here then I suppose that those who over see this site are free to run me off, but the truth is the truth and no matter how upsetting it is, that is not going to change.

You know, you would think that people who profess to have faith in the word of God would not feel so threatened by one person. Imagine if there were 100 of us or 1000 or more.

To Everyone:

Please, do not think I am trying to argue with you or attack you or be hateful to you. I believe in opening up the Bible and studying it. I believe in sharing the word of God with others. I have come on here with a desire to do just that, open up the Bible and share it with others as we together look at the word of God. Though others have felt the need to attack me, I have not done so in kind.

In Christ,

Robert


The question really is not can you lose your salvation. The question is who does the saving? You nor I or anyone else saved themselves, do you agree? Since not one of us saved ourselves then not one of us keep's ourselves saved. It is a work of the Lord! This mean's the saving is of the Lord as well as the keeping. You and I cann't save ourselves nor do we keep ourselves saved. This is The Lord's work from beginning to the end! in Christ. His by Grace
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Jesus said, "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me." (John 10:27)

That is the acid test, right there. The Lord's sheep just may sin, but that is not going to be the continuous pattern of their life. All struggle with the flesh (that is not saved,) but those who are his do not live in continuous, unrepented of, sin. If they can, then they are not his sheep. If the Lord is not calling with "his voice" to "his sheep" to repent and walk again with the fold, then someone needs to do some serious introspection.

One is to make their calling and election sure (no Calvinism here, just honesty in one's call to holiness and obedience.) No one is going to be completely free of the struggle of the sin nature, but likewise, no one who has been born again, from above, is going to be the same as they used to be. The Lord helps his own. Instead of worrying about "Can I lose it?" one should make sure, "If they got it!" He does the keeping.

Jesus went on to say, "And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of my hand." (John 10:27)

Don't jump to the knee jerk reaction to say, "Yes, but I can jump out of his hand!" This, dear one, is humanism. Salvation does not find it's origin in the human,

"Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." (John 1:13)

Fall down before the Mighty God, and wrestle like Jacob of old until you can get up and say, "I am saved!" Then, walk in the confidence he promised:

"And this is the confidence that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, he heareth us:" (I John 5:14)

"The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. (2 Peter 3:9)

What is needed again in our land is old fashioned repentance. Once someone wrestles with God until they have come clean before the Lord in repentance, they can arise and walk in victory. We have too much, 123 say this prayer stuff. I've watched it for 24 years and it doesn't produce much lasting fruit. Also, the Arminian error of falsely teaching someone that they "now" have to keep their salvation.

God did the calling unto repentance,
God does the saving,
He holds the papers in his safe keeping
He gives the safety deposit of the Spirit of God until he redeems the purchased product...you!

"That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

In whom ye also [trusted], after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory. " (Eph. 1:12-14)

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Skimming through the last couple of pages, I realize no one tackled answering this verse:

1 Peter 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

The word "save" means "deliverance." For example:

Psalms 18:3 I will call upon the LORD, who is worthy to be praised: so shall I be saved from mine enemies.

The context states what someone is being saved from. The verse in 1 Peter is not speaking about being saved from sins, but from a guilty conscience. Baptism is the first step of obedience for the new believer - if he or she refused to follow the Lord in this step, their conscience would be convicting them; however, when they obey, their conscience is good and does not bother them (so the act of believer's baptism saved them from a guilty conscience).

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Do you realize what happened to the people in the water during the flood? They weren't saved from destruction.


Right - but those in the ark certainly were.

There are many uses of the word "saved" or "salvation" in Scripture - but the context will always show what type of salvation/deliverance is in view. The cults and false teachers want to confuse everyone and make them think that saved always refers to salvation from sins, but as you stated, it does not.
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Not a Biblical Christian - more like a member of a cult, which the Church of Christ is. They teach they must add their good works and baptism to what Jesus has done and that you can lose your salvation; which explains some of this person's responses on these boards.

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Works have no effect on our salvation whatsoever; if they do not save us, neither can they "lose" us.

If the Lord saved us "while we were yet sinners" (Rom. 5:8) how can be worse than "yet sinners"? We would have to be worse than that to lose our salvation.

Consider Phil 1:6, the Lord has begun a work in us, and it will continue until the end.
also Romans 11:29, where "the gifts and calling of God are without repentance" is not salvation by faith a gift? (Eph 2:8)


One poster mentioned "what happens if we die with unconfessed sin" or something to that effect. I would like to ask him if his sin is is forgiven at Calvary, or at the moment he confesses it? To teach that we willl go to hell if we die with unconfessed sin on our hearts, is to ignore the power of Calvary and the atoning blood of Christ. Our sins are gone forever, else he would need to be crucifed daily to forgive them! Common sense. We do not get forgiveness through confession now, we restore fellowship with the Lord. that is what 1 John 1:9 is all about.

Speaking of 1 John, I might as well add that we no longer can sin! that ought to be a shocker, but it is true. We cannot sin if we are born of God (1 Jn. 3:4-9) Let me explain: sin is in two parts, as we are all aware of, transgression (which is referred to in the text of 1 John) and trespass. Transgression is sin against God directly (the first four commandments) while trespass is against man (and therefore against God--the last six of the Ten Commandments). I am not saying we keep the law to be saved, but the distinction was made way back in the law that there was certain sacrifices for certain sins. remember Christ asked in his model prayer, "forgive us our trespasses"...those are the sins we have today, sins that are against humanity and self, and not directly against God.

In the eyes of God (because of the blood of Christ) we cannot sin any longer--the blood is already applied for that; in the eyes of Christ, we have a relationship through him, and an obligation to one another (trespass) and are not to encroach on our brothers person or property. ("No trespassing"!) This is why the Christian stands before Christ and not God for his sin (works of the flesh). We cannot lose our salvation because our eternal God does an eternal work. He is not temporal, nor does he do that which is temporal concerning our souls. they are too precious, and costly, to Him.

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Sorry Irishman, I really think you are misunderstanding 1 John 3.

All our sin is still against God first and foremost.

1 John 3 uses the present tense - ongoing - in other words, the true child of God will not CONTINUE in sin, ie. will not live a lifestyle of sin - it is not saying a child of God will not sin at all, or these passages in the same book would contradict:

1 John 1:8-10 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

1 John 2:1-2 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

Here is chapter 3 - the verbs that are present tense have "eth" or "th" endings:

1 John 3:4-10 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin. Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him. Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

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Sorry Irishman, I really think you are misunderstanding 1 John 3.

All our sin is still against God first and foremost.

1 John 3 uses the present tense - ongoing - in other words, the true child of God will not CONTINUE in sin, ie. will not live a lifestyle of sin - it is not saying a child of God will not sin at all, or these passages in the same book would contradict:

1 John 1:8-10 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.


I have seen the phrases I have bolded used around here a lot and I am a bit confused by their usage. You say we make God a liar if we say we have not sinned because God has said that we all sin. How does this make God a liar and not just us being wrong? If you say "I have a red car" (and your car is in fact red) and I say, "no, you have a blue car" I am not making you a liar, I am just wrong, or mistaken, concerning the color of your car. How can we make God, or anyone else for that matter, a liar?

As far as the second phrase, "and his word is not in us," what does that mean? Are you using "word" to mean the New Testament or "Word" to mean Christ? And in either case, would a person again just not merely be mistaken? If a person is confused or wrong regarding scripture, does that mean that they do not have the Holy Spirit within them? Or does it just mean that they don't understand (or agree with your interpretation of) scripture?

I apologize if I am missing something, but it seems a little confusing to me.
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