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Revelations


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I really have mixed feeling about the Revelation of the end of the world. I mean why would God want to end the world if he loves us all? Sure we make mistakes, bug mistakes but I thought forgiveness is the best thing we got in Christianity. Im confused. Any thoughts to help me out?

Brian
Fontana

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I really have mixed feeling about the Revelation of the end of the world. I mean why would God want to end the world if he loves us all? Sure we make mistakes, bug mistakes but I thought forgiveness is the best thing we got in Christianity. Im confused. Any thoughts to help me out?

Brian
Fontana


There are no bible passages that teach that the world will come to a state of non-existence in the context that Jesus had used. The word world "cosmos" is often translated as age (Matt.13:39,40; 24:3; 28:20). But the earth will be purged of all sinfulness to make way for a new earth where righteousness with rule.

Ephesians 3:21 - Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen.

Ecclesiastes 1:4 - One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.

Love,
Madeline
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The present state of the world system will be destroyed, sin and the wicked will be judged - but the world will still exist.

No offense, but we need to make sure we accept ALL of the Bible - it all fits together and tells the same story. The reason Jesus came to earth was to deal with our sin, and those who reject Him will be judged. The end times show a whole world (overall) in rebellion against God.

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I really have mixed feeling about the Revelation of the end of the world. I mean why would God want to end the world if he loves us all? Sure we make mistakes, bug mistakes but I thought forgiveness is the best thing we got in Christianity. Im confused. Any thoughts to help me out?

Brian
Fontana


If you read the whole Bible, get rid of that preconceived "God loves everybody all the time" idea, and get to know the REAL God of the Bible, then you'd understand the book of Revelation. :smile


Even if you start in Genesis... first 7 chapters, you'll learn of how much God hates sin and how He destroyed the whole world (except 8 people) because of it.
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God is a God of love and mercy, yes, but He is also a God of judgment and wrath. God's plan throughout history has always been for man to live with God in a sinless state, where He can have fellowship with mankind. However, because of man's sin, God had no choice but to destroy the planet once (the Flood; wiped the earth clean and drastically changed its climate and physical makeup), and 2 Peter teaches that He will once again cleanse the earth, but this time it's complete and utter annihilation followed by a recreation.

This may seem harsh, but what else is a Holy, righteous God supposed to do with a willfully disobedient creation? And in the end, God is God; He does what He wants, and you and I have no place to question what He does.

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There are no bible passages that teach that the world will come to a state of non-existence in the context that Jesus had used.


"Psalm 75:3 The earth and all the inhabitants thereof are dissolved: I bear up the pillars of it. Selah."

"Isaiah 24:19-20 The earth is utterly broken down, the earth is clean dissolved, the earth is moved exceedingly. The earth shall reel to and fro like a drunkard, and shall be removed like a cottage; and the transgression thereof shall be heavy upon it; and it shall fall, and not rise again."

"Isaiah 51:6 Lift up your eyes to the heavens, and look upon the earth beneath: for the heavens shall vanish away like smoke, and the earth shall wax old like a garment, and they that dwell therein shall die in like manner: but my salvation shall be for ever, and my righteousness shall not be abolished."

"Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."

"Matthew 24:35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away."
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This may seem petty at first, but it will make sense (I hope) when I'm done. You titled this topic "Revelation[b]s[/b]" with an "s" at the end as if there are many, but it is called, "The Revelation" singular. The point I'm making is this, the greatest blessing that God could bestow upon mankind besides our salvation (which is eternally splendid!) is to bless us with His returen and bring this corruptable existance, planet and all, to an end. Though the events leading to the end will be tribulation indeed, the wonderful appearing will be worth it all trillions of times over.

[color=#4000FF]The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified [it] by his angel unto his servant John: Rev 1:1

Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; Titus 2:13[/color]

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[quote="PreacherBen"]This may seem petty at first, but it will make sense (I hope) when I'm done. You titled this topic "Revelation[b]s[/b]" with an "s" at the end as if there are many, but it is called, "The Revelation" singular. The point I'm making is this, the greatest blessing that God could bestow upon mankind besides our salvation (which is eternally splendid!) is to bless us with His returen and bring this corruptable existance, planet and all, to an end. Though the events leading to the end will be tribulation indeed, the wonderful appearing will be worth it all trillions of times over.

[color=#4000FF]The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified [it] by his angel unto his servant John: Rev 1:1

Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; Titus 2:13[/color][/quote]

:amen:

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[quote="Seth Doty"]"Psalm 75:3 [color=#0000FF] The earth and all the inhabitants thereof are dissolved[/color]: I bear up the pillars of it. Selah."

"Isaiah 24:19-20 The earth is utterly broken down, the earth is clean dissolved, the earth is moved exceedingly. The earth shall reel to and fro like a drunkard, and shall be removed like a cottage; and the transgression thereof shall be heavy upon it; and it shall fall, and not rise again."

"Isaiah 51:6 Lift up your eyes to the heavens, and look upon the earth beneath: [color=#0000FF] for the heavens shall vanish away like smoke, and the earth shall wax old like a garment,[/color] and they that dwell therein shall die in like manner: but my salvation shall be for ever, and my righteousness shall not be abolished."

"Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, [color=#0000FF] Till heaven and earth pass[/color], one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."

"Matthew 24:35 [color=#0000FF] Heaven and earth shall pass away[/color], but my words shall not pass away."[/quote]

The current heavens (ie. atmosphere, and perhaps outer space as we know it) and the current earth will be destroyed - (ie. burned up, with all trace of sin removed). This time it will be by fire - and we see some of this destruction in the book of Revelation, especially chapter 20. Then comes the new heaven and new earth - which will be a renovated heaven and earth (it will still be the same earth - ie. globe - as God's promises to Abraham and his descendants include possessing the land forever, and Jesus ruling forever from Jerusalem.

2 Peter 3:5-13 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: [b]But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment[/b] and perdition of ungodly men. But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. But the [b]day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.[/b] Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

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(it will still be the same earth - ie. globe - as God's promises to Abraham and his descendants include possessing the land forever, and Jesus ruling forever from Jerusalem.


In light of this quote, I am curious what you think of this passage, after all this temple was destroyed... I know my opinion, but what do you think? :wink


"1 Kings 9:3 And the LORD said unto him, I have heard thy prayer and thy supplication, that thou hast made before me: I have hallowed this house, which thou hast built, to put my name there for ever; and mine eyes and mine heart shall be there perpetually."
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Perpetually means continually - it does not mean forever - though certainly God's eyes will be on the land of Israel/Jerusalem forever, as that is where Jesus will rule from. Find a verse that says forever where forever is not in view.

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Perpetually means continually - it does not mean forever - though certainly God's eyes will be on the land of Israel/Jerusalem forever, as that is where Jesus will rule from. Find a verse that says forever where forever is not in view.


It does say "to put my name there for ever;" Also it was speaking of that temple in particular not the land of israel. It does say "I have hallowed this house, which thou hast built" after all, so that would seem clear it is speaking of Solomons temple which did pass away... In my opinion, there can be two meanings of "for ever" in scripture, one is the meaning you are thinking of, but also I believe there are times that "for ever" means untill the completion of a thing. If you like I will provide more verses that would lend support to the second option.
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Forever means forever - God has put His name in Israel/Jerusalem forever - so that does not contradict that passage in any way.


Again, that verse is speaking of the house Solomon built for the Lord, it is not speaking of israel as a whole. "For ever" does not always mean eternally. Here are a few verses to illustrate that.

"1 Samuel 1:22 But Hannah went not up; for she said unto her husband, I will not go up until the child be weaned, and then I will bring him, that he may appear before the LORD, and there abide for ever. "

This is speaking of his life time of service in the temple, not eternally, he did die.

"1 Samuel 2:30 Wherefore the LORD God of Israel saith, I said indeed that thy house, and the house of thy father, should walk before me for ever: but now the LORD saith, Be it far from me; for them that honour me I will honour, and they that despise me shall be lightly esteemed."

This verse shows that "for ever" is not always eternal. :wink

"1 Samuel 28:2 And David said to Achish, Surely thou shalt know what thy servant can do. And Achish said to David, Therefore will I make thee keeper of mine head for ever."

Again, speaking of lifetime.

"1 Kings 8:13 I have surely built thee an house to dwell in, a settled place for thee to abide in for ever."

Scripture mentions the Glory of the Lord leaving the temple latter, so it would not seem to mean eternal.

"1 Chronicles 23:13 The sons of Amram; Aaron and Moses: and Aaron was separated, that he should sanctify the most holy things, he and his sons for ever, to burn incense before the LORD, to minister unto him, and to bless in his name for ever."

This type of thing was done away with in the NT.

"2 Chronicles 2:4 Behold, I build an house to the name of the LORD my God, to dedicate it to him, and to burn before him sweet incense, and for the continual shewbread, and for the burnt offerings morning and evening, on the sabbaths, and on the new moons, and on the solemn feasts of the LORD our God. This is an ordinance for ever to Israel."

Again,in the NT, Paul says that these things were done away with.

"Ecclesiastes 2:16 For there is no remembrance of the wise more than of the fool for ever; seeing that which now is in the days to come shall all be forgotten. And how dieth the wise man? as the fool."

Scripture says that the righteous will be established and that the name of the wicked shall rot so this is not speaking of the eternal. "For ever" in this passage means on earth.

There are more examples but this is enough for now. In a nut shell due to all the verses about the earth being destroyed, passing away, etc. I think the verses that promise the land of Israel "for ever" are speaking only as far as it will exist.
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