Culottes are Men's Clothing

[John81]

When it comes to what other Christians wear' date=' most of the time, I couldn't tell you--unless it was outrageous. Honestly, I don't spend my time looking at other people, particularly not in church. When I talk to people and interact with them, I'm interacting with the person, not their appearance. I don't go and analyze their appearance and try and make a judgement call as to what their intentions are/were......it is between them and the Lord. It is our pastor's job to lead the flock, not mine. If I'm in a store in the summertime and some college student or something comes down the aisle half dressed, I avert my eyes and pray for that person...the same is true if I pass someone who is cussing or something as well. (I try to get away, too) (This is not directed at anyone's post....thought I'd better put in that disclaimer because people seem awefully sensitive these days) If somebody did "catch my eye" --I would stop right there and pray. It is a little hard for the devil to tempt you when you are in a conversation with God.[/quote']

:goodpost:

[bzmomo7]

Many women fail to understand, when they dress in a, I shall use this word, sexy manner, this sexy manner of dressing temps the men who see them, they will give account to God for this, for they are tempting that man to stumble.

When it comes to standards, many of us do not like then, not even God's standard. In fact many hate God's standard. Many men and women both are rebelling against God by the way they dress in public.

One thing for sure about the Mennonites is that their women dress modest, also the Muslim women, can't say the same about many Christians women, that is very sad.

Seems the Christians are the ones who are influenced by the world and its evil way.

Exactly, I think you'd be hard-pressed to produce anyone who'd say they didn't dress modestly.....which is why I used them as my example. And I hope you understood from my post, Jerry that I was not talking about women not being accountable for dressing "sexy" as you put it, but that when a woman is dressed in the very highest standards, and a man still looks upon her in a way he shouldn't.......it is not the fault of the woman. Women who dress to show off their body will most definitely be held accountable before the Lord, unfortunately, so will the men who look upon them and lust. We still have to teach our sons to avert their eyes, and flee.

[LindaR]

If what we wear (both men and women) draws attention to our bodies, then it's probably not modest. Our focus needs to be on the Lord, not what we wear. Too many times church has become a style show instead of a place of worshipping God.

As far as the Mennonites go, I respect them for their separateness and obedience to God. However, IMO, I wouldn't include the Muslim women with the Mennonites...they dress the way they do because they are "forced" to do so. I used to live in an apartment complex which included 2 Muslim families, and I saw first hand how the men treat their women. The women are treated like "chattel"/property, not humans in Islam.

Getting back to modesty in apparel: "If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, then it's probably a DUCK" :bonK:

[SimplyComplex]

Exactly, I think you'd be hard-pressed to produce anyone who'd say they didn't dress modestly.....which is why I used them as my example. And I hope you understood from my post, Jerry that I was not talking about women not being accountable for dressing "sexy" as you put it, but that when a woman is dressed in the very highest standards, and a man still looks upon her in a way he shouldn't.......it is not the fault of the woman. Women who dress to show off their body will most definitely be held accountable before the Lord, unfortunately, so will the men who look upon them and lust. We still have to teach our sons to avert their eyes, and flee.

An example of what you are trying to say. I went to a Bible college that in time past had a male staff member who had a problem when he saw the back of a womans foot because it made him think of her leg. So, they made a rule that said girls were not allowed to wear backless shoes (clogs, mules, anything). A girl could wear an ankle length skirt, but be wearing backless shoes and that caused that man to stumble. Was the girl being immodest? or did that guy have a problem that he needed to deal with?

[LindaR]

When it comes to what other Christians wear' date=' most of the time, I couldn't tell you--unless it was outrageous. Honestly, I don't spend my time looking at other people, particularly not in church. When I talk to people and interact with them, I'm interacting with the person, not their appearance. I don't go and analyze their appearance and try and make a judgement call as to what their intentions are/were......it is between them and the Lord. It is our pastor's job to lead the flock, not mine. If I'm in a store in the summertime and some college student or something comes down the aisle half dressed, I avert my eyes and pray for that person...the same is true if I pass someone who is cussing or something as well. (I try to get away, too) (This is not directed at anyone's post....thought I'd better put in that disclaimer because people seem awefully sensitive these days) If somebody did "catch my eye" --I would stop right there and pray. It is a little hard for the devil to tempt you when you are in a conversation with God.[/quote']
:thumb

[282Mikado]

I was trying to understand more about what kind of things your pastor was referring to.....general dress' date=' or other matters of appearance. Does that make more sense? Perhaps not.[/quote']

The gist of my pastors comments were in matters of general dress. Obviously some common sense has to be adhered to. While we do hold to long hair:

Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him? But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering. 1Co 11:14 & 15

How a woman wears it is not an issue I have heard of yet. FYI we hold to men having short hair as well.

Like I said, it is supposed to be a means of checks and balances. It's not that we are to be eyeballing everyone in church trying to find those that may be lewd or lascivious. Only on the off chance it catches our eye. Hopefully if that is the case we can have a civil discussion with our wifes/husbands about the matter (we are one flesh after all (though with some you have to wonder)) :roll and see if it merits a monitoring in our homes.

You know...it's not always an issue of just women. I know of several men that no longer come to our church because they would not conform to proper standards of hair or dress styles. I've been blessed that my children have never fought us on these issues, but that has not been the case in all families. And as I've said before, my wife was actually convicted on the dress issue well before me, but it seems with most things spiritual she is a step ahead of me. God gave me the perfect wife for me! :amen:

[LindaR]

An example of what you are trying to say. I went to a Bible college that in time past had a male staff member who had a problem when he saw the back of a womans foot because it made him think of her leg. So' date=' they made a rule that said girls were not allowed to wear backless shoes (clogs, mules, anything). A girl could wear an ankle length skirt, but be wearing backless shoes and that caused that man to stumble. Was the girl being immodest? or did that guy have a problem that he needed to deal with?[/quote']
That man definitely had a problem! At that point, making a rule because of ONE man's fetish/weakness gets to be legalistic, me thinks!

BTW, I wear clogs most of the time...they are so comfortable.

[SimplyComplex]

Right, that was my opinion too. Plus 90% of my shoes are backless so I really had trouble figuring out what to wear in the morning!

[282Mikado]

That man definitely had a problem! At that point, making a rule because of ONE man's fetish/weakness gets to be legalistic, me thinks!

Agreed!

[bzmomo7]

:lol Well, if you read about the shoe thing that Simply Complex was talking about (which I've heard before or that shoes must be closed toed as well) you can see that for some the matter doesn't stop with pants vs. skirts or hair and how women wear it. There are many other aspects I've heard...from women should not have their ears pierced, to women should not wear make-up and varying degrees in between, let alone the colors that are ok for a woman to wear and those that are not. I was just trying to get a clarification 282, not upset you........if I did, I'm sorry.

Yes, so do we, I have four sons, and their hair is buzzed neatly above the ears and collar, and they are not allowed to have long hair on top, "spikes", or colors in their hair that God didn't give them. The guys in my house wear either a full suit, or shirt and tie with dress pants to church.

It is nice when you hear someone brag on his wife that God gave him the perfect wife for him. Good marriages are hard to find even in Christian circles these days. I have actually had women in the past get very quiet or give me a funny look when I've said that I love to spend time with my husband, and he is my best friend.....been married over 17 years.

[LindaR]

Here's another example of legalism and focusing on appearance (for appearance sake):

I have an online friend who was visiting a church with these restrictions:

No pants on women
Men were to wear only suits with white shirts and ties (no pastel or other colored shirts allowed)
No cowboy boots (for men)
No wire-rimmed/framed glasses
I'm not sure if men were allowed to have beards and mustaches or not. There was a guest speaker there that morning. After the announcement time (after the guest speaker found out what the "rules" were), he went out to his van and changed his clothes. He came back into the sanctuary with a pastel pink shirt and tie, his wire framed glasses and cowboy boots and sat down. They had already invited him to speak so that's what he did. I guess he made their "rules" look pretty ridiculous! :Green

[282Mikado]

I was just trying to get a clarification 282' date=' not upset you........if I did, I'm sorry. [/color']

No offense taken. I come across kinda gruff sometimes. My wife has to keep me in line and she's not here right now. :sad

It is nice when you hear someone brag on his wife that God gave him the perfect wife for him. Good marriages are hard to find even in Christian circles these days. I have actually had women in the past get very quiet or give me a funny look when I've said that I love to spend time with my husband' date=' and he is my best friend.....been married over 17 years.[/quote']

We'll be married 20 years in May and it just keeps getting better! I feel sorry for some of the women in our church. They don't get much help. Of course we have some guys whose wives don't really want any and that is just as bad. I can't think of anyone I'd rather be with here on earth than my wife. It's written that there's no marriage in Heaven. That is the only thing that makes me sad about going.

[bzmomo7]

No offense taken. I come across kinda gruff sometimes. My wife has to keep me in line and she's not here right now. :sad

:smile I know what you mean. I'm glad we'll be leaving all the other junk behind, though.

[Marcus2Israel]

Hmm I saw we almost got on the topic of makeup/earrings i'm not sure about that topic... Good topic for debating though! :lol I'm leaning towards earrings being a bit much becouse of, "1 Timothy 2:9 In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;" Perhaps makeup too.

[bzmomo7]

Hmm I saw we almost got on the topic of makeup/earrings i'm not sure about that topic... Good topic for debating though! :lol I'm leaning towards earrings being a bit much becouse of' date=' "1 Timothy 2:9 In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;" Perhaps makeup too.[/quote']

Well, I'm not overly opinionated on this, there are some people who are. We could talk about it if you want.

I guess the reason I don't take a hard-line stance on make-up and earrings is because that verse you quoted also talks about broided (braided) hair. I've heard it preached that women back in those days would braid their hair with expensive stuff, but I've never studied it out myself. My thinking is nothing outlandish that draws undue attention to yourself. I had a young lady tell one of my daughters her mom wouldn't let her even wear lip gloss because it would draw attention to her lips. I told my daughters (they are your age) that as long as it wasn't screaming red or dark, it was fine for them.........I'd rather have a boy naturally drawn to looking at their face, then elsewhere! Doesn't mean I'll not change my mind on that later, but that's where I am right at the minute. As far as earrings, the women in our family wear them, but nothing large. There is another verse in the Bible some people use to prove the view that women should not have pierced ears. I believe it is the same one the use against tatoos..........I'd have to go grab my concordance in order to be sure.