Easter

[ezra517]

Sorry' date=' Ezra, but I can't remember where I learned it...could you tell me where you heard they were opposed? I'm very likely wrong on it and willing to admit it, but would be interested to learn what you have. Thanks for enlightening me.[/quote']

I hope that word enlighten didnt bug you too much :lol Currently I have a toothache so I will have to pass for the time being..... When I speak of early days in America I am talking before the 18th century. There was a catholic priest in the Chicago area I think around 1670's who celebrated Christimas with the natives, etc. You might be able to find something on google. Ok, now I am going back to my pain.... keep me in your prayers..

[dadof4]

Romans 14:1-13

1 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.
2 For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.
3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.
4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.
5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.
7 For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself.
8 For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.
9 For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.
10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
11 For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.

Seems to be needless arguing here, just my opinion.

[ezra517]

Good Morning.

As far as who brought Christimas to America it does not really matter. As far as what we spoke about concerning Biblical teachings oh it matters very much. I hope you were refering to our going back and forth about who brought Christmas to America. Because if you were talking about Biblical teachings, it is a Christians job to open their mouth and warn others. And not sit by idle and keep silent because we may offend somone living in error.

[Jerry]

Romans 14 is dealing with the feast days of the OT - last I checked, Easter came from Babylon, not from God.

[Guest Guest]

In response to the OP, we will be holding Easter services (tons and tons of music) on the March date, and not the actual Resurrection Sunday. We will do this because of the confusion it may cause the "Chreasters" (people who only come on Christmas and Easter). We will hold two identical services back to back on Sunday morning.

Our choir will sing six choir songs, and our praise teams and orchestra will also do their part. I love celebrating the victory of Christ, and the victory that He brought to us. :clap:

[JerryNumbers]

I agree, it mattes not who brought such holidays to America, what matter is if they are of God or of man.

We base to many things as being A OK for us to practice because it has been a tradition that our family and friends have practiced all of our life. That means we're letting the world influence us more that God's Word.

The paganism of Halloween, Christmas & Easter, a supernatural Santa Claus, Easter bunny, witches & such are direct conflicts with our God & Savior.

Many of us speak about out against the traditions that the RCC follows, but yet we follow traditions of our own, them many times when someone points this out to us we shun them telling them its OK, it makes no difference and even sometimes we get a bit hostile over it. There is just no way anyone can justify Santa Claus, witches and bunnies brining colored eggs with God's Word.

[Salyan]

This is an interesting post! I never thought before about the difference between Passover and Easter...

Our church does a bit of extra special stuff for Easter, but it's usually not a big day. The various IFB churches in our area take advantage of the Good Friday holiday to have a Bible Conference. The conference really has nothing to do with Good Friday (however misdated that may be); it is officially a Memorial Conference for a missionary pioneer to this area (although practically it's usually callled the Good Friday Fellowship -- we either can't remember the real name or it's too long :lol ). It's a good opportunity for a conference!

[Guest Guest]

This is an interesting post! I never thought before about the difference between Passover and Easter...

The word, "pascha" is the difference.

[JerryNumbers]

Could they have used a better word in Acts 12:4?

Act 12:4 And when he had apprehended him, he put him in prison, and delivered him to four quaternions of soldiers to keep him; intending after Easter to bring him forth to the people.

G3957
?????
pascha
pas'-khah
Of Chaldee origin (compare [H6453]); the Passover (the meal, the day, the festival or the special sacrifices connected with it): - Easter, Passover.

G3957
?????
pascha
Total KJV Occurrences: 29
passover, 28
Mat_26:2, Mat_26:17-19 (3), Mar_14:1, Mar_14:12 (2), Mar_14:14, Mar_14:16, Luk_2:41, Luk_22:1, Luk_22:7-8 (2), Luk_22:11, Luk_22:13, Luk_22:15, Joh_2:13, Joh_2:23, Joh_6:4, Joh_11:55 (2), Joh_13:1 (2), Joh_18:28, Joh_18:39, Joh_19:14, 1Co_5:7, Heb_11:28
easter, 1
Act_12:4

[Salyan]

The word, "pascha" is the difference.

I meant between the dates falling at different times some years. I know the difference in the words. :smile

[ezra517]

:ooops

[zealyouthguy]

Well, ZYG, instead of debating my position, why don't you tell me how this passage fits this issue:

Jeremiah 10:2-3 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.

In the context of idolatrous customs, we are told to have nothing to do with them.

Sorry, haven't been around... but sure, I will comment on that passage, but let's do an actual study on the context, and not try to proof-text to fit our preferences.

Jeremiah 10:1-10 1 Hear ye the word which the LORD speaketh unto you, O house of Israel: 2 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. 3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe. 4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not. 5 They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also is it in them to do good. 6 Forasmuch as there is none like unto thee, O LORD; thou art great, and thy name is great in might. 7 Who would not fear thee, O King of nations? for to thee doth it appertain: forasmuch as among all the wise men of the nations, and in all their kingdoms, there is none like unto thee. 8 But they are altogether brutish and foolish: the stock is a doctrine of vanities. 9 Silver spread into plates is brought from Tarshish, and gold from Uphaz, the work of the workman, and of the hands of the founder: blue and purple is their clothing: they are all the work of cunning men. 10 But the LORD is the true God, he is the living God, and an everlasting king: at his wrath the earth shall tremble, and the nations shall not be able to abide his indignation.

The condemnation is in making false idols... not the practice of putting gold or silver over items. In fact, if you care to read the descriptions for the building of the tabernacle and the Ark, you will see that the children of Israel decked things with silver and gold... they even had silver spread on plates and golden censers, blue and purple clothing. The point is that all of that was the cunning work of men, that men worshiped.

Ascribing worship to a false idol is what is condemned, ascribing deity to the created items/creature and denying the true Creator is exactly what Jeremiah 10 is speaking of.

Notice what verse 3 says... the customs of men are VAIN.

That means that wedding rings are "vain" and yet we use them in churches... are you opposed to those?

Isaiah 40:19 19 The workman melteth a graven image, and the goldsmith spreadeth it over with gold, and casteth silver chains.

What about ear rings on women? Vain... are you opposed to those and their pagan origins?

How about piano's, or musical instruments... Genesis tells us they were created by the Pagan Jubal... are you opposed to them?

Are you opposed to fireworks, because the chinese used them in their ancestor worship and celebrations to pagan gods?

Pagans were the first to shave their faces... are you against razors?

The context is simple and pure. Don't worship false gods. If I thought for a minute that anyone was being led astray by Christmas trees and Easter Eggs, I would be condemn it.

If you want to condemn a false god and pagan way in America... condemn consumerism, because THAT is what truly gets worshiped at Christmas and Easter in America.



I think the truth is that people like to pick and choose what "pagan originated" items they dislike... and of course what value society ascribes to them matters.

Dynamite is dynamite, you can remove stumps with it or blow people up with it, same with guns, same with knives... it doesn't matter a whit to the world at large, WHY they were invented, or what their original use was.

[LindaR]

When I was a new believer attending a Messianic Jewish congregation, I gave our Jewish pastor and his wife an "Easter" card. I almost got my head chewed off!! Apparently, I was ignorant that you don't give your Messianic Jewish brothers and sisters "Easter" cards--you give them "Resurrection Sunday" cards or "Passover" cards instead. I wanted to crawl under a chair and hide!!

I found this tidbit from Friends of Israel Gospel Ministry website concerning Church History. It was written by Renald Showers:

THE PERSECUTED CHURCH (100?313 A.D.)

Spontaneous Roman Persecution. From 100 to approximately 250 A.D. Roman persecution erupts in certain localities. Many Christians become martyrs.

Planned Roman Persecution. From approximately 250 to 311 A.D. government persecution is planned and vigorous. Officials throughout the empire are ordered to arrest Christians and give them an ultimatum: Deny your faith in Jesus Christ, or die. It becomes official policy to destroy Christianity. Vast numbers of Christians refuse to deny Jesus and become martyrs, often as public entertainment in large arenas. Yet the church grows stronger and expands throughout the empire.

Heresies and Divisive Issues. During the persecution, the church faces the heresies of legalism, Gnosticism, Manicheanism, Neo-Platonism, Montanism, and Monarchianism. It also contends with two major, divisive issues: When should Easter be celebrated, and what should be done with professing Christians who deny their faith to escape persecution?

Official End of Roman Persecution. In 311 A.D. Emperor Galerius issues the Edict of Toleration, commanding that Christians be tolerated. This officially ends the Roman persecution. In 313 A.D. Emperor Constantine issues the Edict of Milan, granting Christians total freedom. Now they may meet freely for worship and openly propagate their faith.

Development of Views and Practices. During the persecution, the title Catholic (meaning "universal") is applied to the organized church throughout the Roman Empire. Some leaders begin advocating the concepts of apostolic succession (the idea that the apostles? authority is passed to key church leaders) and the primacy of Peter (the idea that Peter was the foremost apostle). Some leaders in the eastern segment of the church develop the allegorical (as opposed to literal) method of interpreting the Bible. This method and the influence of Greek philosophy cause some leaders to reject and attack chiliasm (the view known today as Premillennialism)?the original eschatological position of the church. Some leaders begin writing and preaching anti-Semitic concepts. A cycle of feast days develop: Easter is observed universally by 300 A.D., some observe Christ?s birthday on December 6, and some begin the practice of Lent. The fish becomes a symbol of Christianity. Some begin baptizing infants. Construction of church buildings begins in the early 300s. Some begin to regard communion as a sacrifice. Some begin praying to dead saints.

Development of Organization. Around 125 A.D. local assemblies begin elevating one elder in authority over others. He is called the monarchal (ruling) bishop of the local church. These bishops are equal in authority with each other. By the 200s, local churches throughout the Roman Empire are grouped into divisions paralleling the diocesan political divisions of the empire. The bishop of the largest local assembly in the largest city of each church diocese receives the title of metropolitan bishop and has authority over the other bishops in his diocese. By 313 A.D. the church is well organized and large (perhaps some sixty million members).

http://sites.silaspartners.com/partner/Article_Display_Page/0,,PTID306608|CHID556136|CIID1397350,00.html

[JerryNumbers]

Sorry, haven't been around... but sure, I will comment on that passage, but let's do an actual study on the context, and not try to proof-text to fit our preferences.



The condemnation is in making false idols... not the practice of putting gold or silver over items. In fact, if you care to read the descriptions for the building of the tabernacle and the Ark, you will see that the children of Israel decked things with silver and gold... they even had silver spread on plates and golden censers, blue and purple clothing. The point is that all of that was the cunning work of men, that men worshiped.

Ascribing worship to a false idol is what is condemned, ascribing deity to the created items/creature and denying the true Creator is exactly what Jeremiah 10 is speaking of.

Notice what verse 3 says... the customs of men are VAIN.

That means that wedding rings are "vain" and yet we use them in churches... are you opposed to those?

Isaiah 40:19 19 The workman melteth a graven image, and the goldsmith spreadeth it over with gold, and casteth silver chains.

What about ear rings on women? Vain... are you opposed to those and their pagan origins?

How about piano's, or musical instruments... Genesis tells us they were created by the Pagan Jubal... are you opposed to them?

Are you opposed to fireworks, because the chinese used them in their ancestor worship and celebrations to pagan gods?

Pagans were the first to shave their faces... are you against razors?

The context is simple and pure. Don't worship false gods. If I thought for a minute that anyone was being led astray by Christmas trees and Easter Eggs, I would be condemn it.

If you want to condemn a false god and pagan way in America... condemn consumerism, because THAT is what truly gets worshiped at Christmas and Easter in America.



I think the truth is that people like to pick and choose what "pagan originated" items they dislike... and of course what value society ascribes to them matters.

Dynamite is dynamite, you can remove stumps with it or blow people up with it, same with guns, same with knives... it doesn't matter a whit to the world at large, WHY they were invented, or what their original use was.

What do you do with Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny?

Does Santa bring the gifts and the Easer Bunny bring the chocolate eggs & or colored eggs?

I suppose somewhere in between those there has to be a tooth fairy.

Them there is the day of the witches and goblins, do you celebrate that day too?

[Jerry]

Zyg is confusing the issues - I posted a verse about the Lord forbidding us from observing idolatrous customs, and he is trying to turn it around and make it look stupid by pointing out other non-idolatrous customs.