Is praying for your sick children enough

[JerryNumbers]

Parents who believe they are acting in the best interests of their children are not evil - even if they make heartbreaking mistakes. Drug addicts and alcoholics are not acting in the best interestes of their children - they act for themselves. There is a major difference between the parents of this little girl and truly evil parents.

Jerry8 - I am glad that your sister was taken out of that home. But one big difference - it was not her parents who were abusing her. It is a fine line that we walk in this area. The problem is that with what you are advocating, that the government has the right to step in and order medical care, it will not stop there. It will have the same effect that allowing Social Services to take a child away has had. Many, many children are taken away on a whim of a social worker, unjustly. That is a horrible, life-scarring thing to happen - to both the child and the family. A book that was written back in 1986 that has some interesting facts in it is The Child Abuse Industry by Mary Pride. http://www.amazon.com/Child-Abuse-Indus ... 0891074015 The book was written over 20 years ago, but things have not gotten any better. I would highly recommend this book to everyone. It is a real eye-opener.

CowboyPreacher - I am so sorry that happened to your brother's kids. God is merciful, and He can help them. I know you know this, but I have sen God heal people who have been in that type of situation.

Anyone can develop any illness and die quickly...whether there is intervention or not.

Oh but they were her legal guardians who had the same rights as a set of parents with their very own child, so don't try and pull that one, you would have set back and said, no those parents are not evil, they're her legal guardians, they can do anything they want to her, no one has the right to get between that little girl and her legal guardian.

But it would be the same thing if it had been her real parents, you would have said, oh no, no one has no right to tell those parents what not to do to their own child, we have to leave them along, no matter what they do to her, surely isn't a Christ like attitude to have when young helpless children are suffering and dying in the hands of their parents.

By the way, just because someone prays does not mean they are not evil.

It seem to many of you brand people, "great wonderful people," only if they pray.

And everyone who prays does not necessarily pray to God, only those who are saved by grace thru faith are really saved and that is the only ones that God hears prayers from. For instant, the Publican prayed to hisself.

But even one of them, if they are living in unconfused sin, God does not hear their prayers.

18 If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:

Psalms 66:18 (KJV)

31 Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.

John 9:31 (KJV)

15 And when ye spread forth your hands, I will hide mine eyes from you: yea, when ye make many prayers, I will not hear: your hands are full of blood.

Isaiah 1:15 (KJV)

I can just see it. Your neighbors has a young girl. One day that young girl comes to your house and says, please help me, my father is sexually abusing me, every time mother leave us home along he does it again, just now he was attempting to do it again. Please help me, he hurts me so bad. Your advice, go back to your parents, they are your parents, honor and respect them just like the Bible tells you to, no one can come between you and your parents.

I can just see it, the young 17 year old boy comes from the neighboring house, he tells you that his baby brother who is 10 year old is deadly sick, his parent want take him to a doctor, all they do is pray for him. Please help before my baby brother dies. Your advice of course would be. Go back home, mind you father and mother, no one can come between your sick dying brother and your parents, even if he is on death bed.

A young boy come running to your house, he tells you his father is sexually abusing him. Please help me. Your advice. Young boy go back home, honor your father and mother, you must mind your parents, no one can come between you and your parents.

The 15 year old girl comes to your house, she tells you that her baby sister fell down and broke a glass and it cut her real bad, she is bleeding very bad, but all her parents will do is pray for her, but the blood keeps right on running out of her baby sisters body. Please help us Your advice, go back home, honor you father and mother, no one can come between you parents and you baby sister who is bleeding to death.

[Anon]

You are really taking this one too far.

[John81]

You are really taking this one too far.

Agreed.

[HappyChristian]

Oh but they were her legal guardians who had the same rights as a set of parents with their very own child' date=' so don't try and pull that one, you would have set back and said, no those parents are not evil, they're her legal guardians, they can do anything they want to her, no one has the right to get between that little girl and her legal guardian. Please don't put words in my mouth or assume what I would have or maybe even HAVE said in cases like this, okay? There is a world of difference between taking children that have not been abused from parents who love them and from taking a child out of a non-biological home because of abuse.

But it would be the same thing if it had been her real parents, you would have said, oh no, no one has no right to tell those parents what not to do to their own child, we have to leave them along, no matter what they do to her, surely isn't a Christ like attitude to have when young helpless children are suffering and dying in the hands of their parents. Sarcasm really doesn't become you, Jerry7! I know that you are sick at heart over what happened to that girl, and I am too. But it isn't scriptural for the government to take away their other kids. It just isn't right. God did not give government that authority...our government has taken it upon themselves and we have allowed it. Instead of stepping into a situation like that as Christians, we sit back and let the government do it. That is wrong!!

By the way, just because someone prays does not mean they are not evil. Never said they were, and neither did anyone else.

It seem to many of you brand people, "great wonderful people," only if they pray. don't believe anyone said these were great wonderful people.

And everyone who prays does not necessarily pray to God, only those who are saved by grace thru faith are really saved and that is the only ones that God hears prayers from. For instant, the Publican prayed to hisself. AMEN!

But even one of them, if they are living in unconfused sin, God does not hear their prayers.

18 If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:

Psalms 66:18 (KJV)

31 Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.

John 9:31 (KJV)

15 And when ye spread forth your hands, I will hide mine eyes from you: yea, when ye make many prayers, I will not hear: your hands are full of blood.

Isaiah 1:15 (KJV)

I can just see it. Your neighbors has a young girl. One day that young girl comes to your house and says, please help me, my father is sexually abusing me, every time mother leave us home along he does it again, just now he was attempting to do it again. Please help me, he hurts me so bad. Your advice, go back to your parents, they are your parents, honor and respect them just like the Bible tells you to, no one can come between you and your parents. Um, no. Again, don't put words in my mouth or assume actions that I wouldn't do.

I can just see it, the young 17 year old boy comes from the neighboring house, he tells you that his baby brother who is 10 year old is deadly sick, his parent want take him to a doctor, all they do is pray for him. Please help before my baby brother dies. Your advice of course would be. Go back home, mind you father and mother, no one can come between your sick dying brother and your parents, even if he is on death bed. Ditto

A young boy come running to your house, he tells you his father is sexually abusing him. Please help me. Your advice. Young boy go back home, honor your father and mother, you must mind your parents, no one can come between you and your parents.

The 15 year old girl comes to your house, she tells you that her baby sister fell down and broke a glass and it cut her real bad, she is bleeding very bad, but all her parents will do is pray for her, but the blood keeps right on running out of her baby sisters body. Please help us Your advice, go back home, honor you father and mother, no one can come between you parents and you baby sister who is bleeding to death.

Just stop assuming this, please, Jerry8. It doesn't speak well of you.

[JerryNumbers]

But is that not what you all have said you would do? Let such things happen and not do one thing about it? Never get involve between parents and children no matter what takes place?

I can see why you would not want to come face to face with the reality of it.

[lettheredeemedsayso]

The government should not be involved in how we care for our sick children. If it is abuse or neglect that is one thing. God in no way advocates any Christian abusing or neglecting their children. Praying is always essential. Whether a person takes their child to the doctor is up to them. Luke was a physician.

[Colin Stolzer]

But is that not what you all have said you would do? Let such things happen and not do one thing about it? Never get involve between parents and children no matter what takes place?

I can see why you would not want to come face to face with the reality of it.

Since I have seen the gov'ts answer face to face.
I like you to tell me who should be held accountable for the damage done to my brothers family?

C

[Anon]

But is that not what you all have said you would do? Let such things happen and not do one thing about it? Never get involve between parents and children no matter what takes place?

I can see why you would not want to come face to face with the reality of it.

The reality is that you are not trying very hard to understand where most of us are coming from here. You are only looking at one side of a very multi-faceted situation here in America. You and CowboyPreacher have, I think, alot to talk about.

[HappyChristian]

But is that not what you all have said you would do? Let such things happen and not do one thing about it? Never get involve between parents and children no matter what takes place?

I can see why you would not want to come face to face with the reality of it.

No, Jerry, that isn't what I said I would do, nor did anyone else. I do believe in intervention. But I believe in doing it as a Christian. I have faced the reality of it, and I have seen some situations that are heartbreaking. And I have done what I could to help. I never, nor did anyone else, say never get involved between parents and children. I cannot say that, because I have done it. My personality is such that I want to fix everything, so I have to be careful of sticking my nose in too far!

I will stick with the fact that government should keep their long arm out...if we sit back and allow them to do this, it will only hurt all of us in the long run. Christians need to be more proactive in situations like this. Of course, there aren't Christians everywhere this type of thing happens, but we need to work on that!!

[rancher824]

I thought about this at work today. One thing came to my mind. I know a little boy. He is a very loving boy. He always has a smile. He gets excited about lots of things. You could not find anyone who could love any more than he does. Why am I mentioning him. Well, when his mother was preganent with him, she had complications. His head and mind did not develop correctly. The doctor saw ahead that this was happening. He told the mother the best thing for her and the "fetus" was just to terminate the pregnancy (AKA murder the baby). If we put things where the govt and doctors decide what is best for a child rather than the parents, would they require abortions for all the wonderful children such as the one I know and love???

[Anon]

I was looking up things online to double check that my fussy baby is teething (rather than anything else) and it was interesting, I noticed on a site that listed signs of teething and it said near the end: "don't give your baby any medicine without consulting with your doctor as your doctor knows what is best for your child."

I know doctors are smart...but if I want to give my kid some tylenol I will...and I know what is best for my child!!!!

[John81]

I was looking up things online to double check that my fussy baby is teething (rather than anything else) and it was interesting, I noticed on a site that listed signs of teething and it said near the end: "don't give your baby any medicine without consulting with your doctor as your doctor knows what is best for your child."

I know doctors are smart...but if I want to give my kid some tylenol I will...and I know what is best for my child!!!!

Today, parents are assumed to be ignorant, stupid, uninformed, uncaring and unable to take care of children. The government and "professionals" are to be consulted and relied upon for all things and if parents are not doing that then they must be mistreating their children and intervention is needed!

Oh, and never foget that those who are of the Fundamentalist, KJB, take-the-Bible-literally, sort of folks are obviously in need of psychiatric attention and should probably have their children removed as soon as possible. (Yes, some outright believe that, some even advocate such, and the fact of it will probably happen in the not too distant future :sad )

[matie-k]

Sounds like America is becoming more and more like China!

[JerryNumbers]

I thought about this at work today. One thing came to my mind. I know a little boy. He is a very loving boy. He always has a smile. He gets excited about lots of things. You could not find anyone who could love any more than he does. Why am I mentioning him. Well' date=' when his mother was preganent with him, she had complications. His head and mind did not develop correctly. The doctor saw ahead that this was happening. He told the mother the best thing for her and the "fetus" was just to terminate the pregnancy (AKA murder the baby). If we put things where the govt and doctors decide what is best for a child rather than the parents, would they require abortions for all the wonderful children such as the one I know and love???[/quote']

It seems some doctors makes mistakes, that is not the governments fault that doctors makes such mistakes, its the doctors fault.

I've noticed that some doctor make up their mind before any test are ever done, such doctors as these will always mess up and make a wrong call.

I know of one man who was in a bad wreck, the doctor call the family in and said he was brain dead, we need to take him off the respirator. The family wanted a bit of time to think this over. A few hours later the doctors call them back in, said it was time for them to make the decsion to unhook him. The family did so reluctantly.

The doctors unhooked him, 6 months later he walked out of the hospital on his own.

All the while the doctors declared they made no mistakes.

So please, don't blame the goverment for the doctors mistakes.

But, I also wonder, with such things happening, is it really the doctors mistake or is it a miracle intervention of God.

I just figure sometimes it has to be the work of our gracious God.

[rancher824]

I agree that we must accept that people make mistakes. But, with all due respect, who do you think the govt would put in charge of overseeing that parents give proper medical care to their children. It would be the doctor they are seeing. It would become a case of a parent would have to take their child in for regular checkups. And whatever the doctor decided would have to be followed. Yes there could be a possibility for a second oppinion, but not in the case of an emergency. The lady I mentioned, when she had her complications she was rushed to the hospital. Had it not been for immediate medical care she would have lost the baby!!! Had it been up to the doctor she got, he would have aborted the baby for it's own good. There was no time for a second oppinion.