Baptism required for church membership

[Joe Chandler]

I don't know how your church practices baptism, but in every church that I have joined, the candidate must present a public profession of faith. Then the pastor says, "Upon your profession of faith in Christ, I baptize you, my brother, in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. Buried in the likeness of his death and raised to walk in newness of life."

Baptist churches have always admitted only regenerate members. Other institutional and state churches killed Baptists for this practice. Church discipline handled the problems and the restoration of ill-behaved members. This is the way to ensure that unregenerate people cannot become members with voting rights. This is only one of the Baptist distinctives that I agree with.

[BrotherTony]

16 minutes ago, Joe Chandler said:

I don't know how your church practices baptism, but in every church that I have joined, the candidate must present a public profession of faith. Then the pastor says, "Upon your profession of faith in Christ, I baptize you, my brother, in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. Buried in the likeness of his death and raised to walk in newness of life."

Baptist churches have always admitted only regenerate members. Other institutional and state churches killed Baptists for this practice. Church discipline handled the problems and the restoration of ill-behaved members. This is the way to ensure that unregenerate people cannot become members with voting rights. This is only one of the Baptist distinctives that I agree with.

I hate to disagree here, but many IFB churches have allowed unregenerate people into the membership of the church because they said ita 1,2,3, pray after me type prayer with no evidence of repentance. Sad, but so very true.

[Joe Chandler]

1 minute ago, BrotherTony said:

I hate to disagree here, but many IFB churches have allowed unregenerate people into the membership of the church because they said ita 1,2,3, pray after me type prayer with no evidence of repentance. Sad, but so very true.

You are not disagreeing with me, you are agreeing with me. I just didn't make a clear distinction between a genuine profession and a false one. Your comments are always welcome.

[MikeWatson1]

I got baptised by immersion twice.  The first time as a charismatic youth in a methodist church.  Later when I found an independent Baptist church, I got re-baptised to make sure, because we weren't sure if the first baptism had the right authority from that kind of charismatic, methodist church.  I also wasn't clear on what the baptism meant in my teens. 

This re-baptism, with baptism as a pre requisite to join one of God's churches is related to defining what 'the church' is. 

 

 

Edited May 19 by MikeWatson1

[Joe Chandler]

5 hours ago, MikeWatson1 said:

I got baptised by immersion twice.  The first time as a charismatic youth in a methodist church.  Later when I found an independent Baptist church, I got re-baptised to make sure, because we weren't sure if the first baptism had the right authority from that kind of charismatic, methodist church.  I also wasn't clear on what the baptism meant in my teens. 

This re-baptism, with baptism as a pre requisite to join one of God's churches is related to defining what 'the church' is. 

 

 

That is the policy of any decent Baptist church. That is why we were literally killed for it in the past. I have a cousin that attends a Baptist church in New Hampshire, but he is Methodist. He cannot understand why he cannot be a member until he is re-baptized. I show him Bible, but he values his tradition more.

[MikeWatson1]

1 hour ago, Joe Chandler said:

That is the policy of any decent Baptist church. That is why we were literally killed for it in the past. I have a cousin that attends a Baptist church in New Hampshire, but he is Methodist. He cannot understand why he cannot be a member until he is re-baptized. I show him Bible, but he values his tradition more.

Well, if they believe the church is all redeemed, then membership in a local body is a foreign concept. 

[Jim_Alaska]

1 hour ago, Joe Chandler said:

That is the policy of any decent Baptist church. That is why we were literally killed for it in the past. I have a cousin that attends a Baptist church in New Hampshire, but he is Methodist. He cannot understand why he cannot be a member until he is re-baptized. I show him Bible, but he values his tradition more.

Hopefully since he is attending a Baptist church the Holy Spirit will convict and teach him the truth about baptism and its prerequisites. That is, of course, if it is a sound Baptist Church.

[BrotherTony]

Coming from another denomination fraut with so much error and the true gospel not being taught these days in many of their churches, I hope he has a true salvation testimony. Still, if he does he would need to be re baptized in most Baptist churches that I know of.

[Joe Chandler]

4 hours ago, MikeWatson1 said:

Well, if they believe the church is all redeemed, then membership in a local body is a foreign concept. 

Please explain.

[MikeWatson1]

1 hour ago, Joe Chandler said:

Please explain.

Well.. I believe the body of Christ is purely local.  That is 'the church'.  Matt 16:18 Has Jesus building His church that is Him and His disciples.  It's local because Matt 18:20 is also local. 

The time the church will be all redeemed is in the New Jerusalem.  We haven't got there yet.

All redeemed is in the Family of God. Not the body of Christ. Which is local.

So... A methodist would call the church all redeemed (universal, invisible). Church membership is not a doctrine they would believe in, seeing 'the church' for them is not local. 

And if they see at as both local and universal.. well most who have this don't do church membership either.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Joe Chandler]

3 hours ago, MikeWatson1 said:

Well.. I believe the body of Christ is purely local.  That is 'the church'.  Matt 16:18 Has Jesus building His church that is Him and His disciples.  It's local because Matt 18:20 is also local. 

The time the church will be all redeemed is in the New Jerusalem.  We haven't got there yet.

All redeemed is in the Family of God. Not the body of Christ. Which is local.

So... A methodist would call the church all redeemed (universal, invisible). Church membership is not a doctrine they would believe in, seeing 'the church' for them is not local. 

And if they see at as both local and universal.. well most who have this don't do church membership either.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you for your reply. I see what you are saying now. I'm not a universal church guy either. I believe as you do, which is why I asked for an explanation. I was espousing believers' baptism for membership in a local church.

Acts 2:41   Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

So being saved is a prerequisite to being baptized into a local assembly. Ideally, this would lead to a regenerate congregation. Church discipline/the Lord's supper should ensure that we live our faith. I also know that some make false professions, but I don't know what to do about that except to pray for folks that don't seem genuine and continue to preach the Word.

[SureWord]

On 5/18/2023 at 4:19 PM, Joe Chandler said:

I don't know how your church practices baptism, but in every church that I have joined, the candidate must present a public profession of faith. Then the pastor says, "Upon your profession of faith in Christ, I baptize you, my brother, in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. Buried in the likeness of his death and raised to walk in newness of life."

Baptist churches have always admitted only regenerate members. Other institutional and state churches killed Baptists for this practice. Church discipline handled the problems and the restoration of ill-behaved members. This is the way to ensure that unregenerate people cannot become members with voting rights. This is only one of the Baptist distinctives that I agree with.

Maybe I'm misreading you but are you saying every time I want to join a new church I need to be re-baptized?

[BrotherTony]

Just now, SureWord said:

Maybe I'm misreading you but are you saying every time I want to join a new church I need to be re-baptized?

That shouldn't happen when transferring from one Baptist Church to another.

[Joe Chandler]

3 minutes ago, SureWord said:

Maybe I'm misreading you but are you saying every time I want to join a new church I need to be re-baptized?

Good question. You are not misreading me, but I did fail to mention moving by letter from a sister church of like faith and practice since I was focusing on the biblical method of baptizing a new convert. Does that clear things up?

[SureWord]

3 minutes ago, BrotherTony said:

That shouldn't happen when transferring from one Baptist Church to another.

So I need references?

I think a profession of faith in the blood of Christ should suffice.

Anything else is Baptist Briderism.

[BrotherTony]

1 minute ago, SureWord said:

So I need references?

I think a profession of faith in the blood of Christ should suffice.

Anything else is Baptist Briderism.

I disagree. I've seen other denominations baptism being accepted into Baptist churches, and vice versa, but only after investigation into the doctrinal closeness to what Baptists preach and believe. I've also gone from one church to another by just a statement of faith because the former church didn't like losing another family to another local church. Nothing nefarious about the practice.

[MikeWatson1]

13 minutes ago, BrotherTony said:

That shouldn't happen when transferring from one Baptist Church to another.

 

Yeah... People should do a letter of transfer from one to another

[BrotherTony]

5 minutes ago, MikeWatson1 said:

 

Yeah... People should do a letter of transfer from one to another

True. Most do. But some are just being hard to get along with when they refuse to do so.

[Jim_Alaska]

49 minutes ago, SureWord said:

So I need references?

I think a profession of faith in the blood of Christ should suffice.

Anything else is Baptist Briderism.

A profession oi faith is and has been acceptable in Baptist churches if a letter of good standing is not available from your previous church. So-called Briderism has nothing to do with it.

[Joe Chandler]

1 hour ago, SureWord said:

So I need references?

I think a profession of faith in the blood of Christ should suffice.

Anything else is Baptist Briderism.

First of all, I realize that you are responding to BrotherTony and not to me, so I hope you will forgive my intrusion. I personally belive that there are other saved people that are not members of Baptist churches. I have met some Church of God folks in the prison ministry whose profession in Christ seemed genuine. They had the same concern for souls that I have, etc. I have met Free Will Baptists that also profess to trust Christ for salvation, yet both believe that someone could lose their salvation under certain conditions. Could some of these be saved? I don't see why not. Can they visit my church? Yes. Could they join my church while believing that they can lose their salvation? No.

My original purpose in espousing believers' baptism as a prerequisite to local church membership is a question of purity of doctrine not as a condition of salvation. My thought process goes something like this; baptism ensures a regenerate membership, the Lord's supper (self examination) ensures a godly membership, and church discipline (external examination) removes the leaven from the membership. Since we are dealing with real people in an imperfect world, all of the above named biblical practices can be abused by individuals or churches or certain church leaders.

I already gave my reasons and thinking on baptism, so I will not reiterate here. I hope that I am not opening up a whole new can of worms!  

Self examination.

2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?
1 Corinthians 11:27-32 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. 28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. 29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. 30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep. 31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged. 32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.
 

External examination.

1 Corinthians 5:7-13 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: 8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. 9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators: 10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. 11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. 12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? 13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.