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Gasoline grumbling thread


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This is very good news. :lol (especially to a Houstonian driving during the months of June through September)



You've just very accurately described corporate welfare, Jerry -- government helping certain big businesses (the ones with "persistent" lobbyists) with subsidies, etc. True free-market capitalism helps all businesses, not just the big ones.


Free market would help all business, except for one fact. Big business has the Congressmen in their pockets so that really cancels out free market.

In Americas political system, the one who has the money is the one who get the favors. That leaves millions of Americans out in the cold.

Now if our congressmen went to Washington and actually representative their home folks as the originally intentions were, it would be a different story.

Check out our congressman's retirement system.

Also check out their wealth.
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Thanks Jerry! Yeah NJ has cheap GAS tax but they make up for it in everything else!

Wow, all those taxes, and they are complaining about the OIL moguls????? Gracious, talk about a red herring.... if the government would just cut back on all their foolish spending, including millions of dollars of money wasted on .... better not open a can of worms here....anyway....millions of dollars wasted, states could pull gas prices down at least a dollar tomorrow if they really wanted to.

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That's why they are looking into gouging. The investigation has been going on since the fall, but secretly. They just let the cat out of the bag...don't know if anything will come of it. The gouging is not from the oil companies, IMO (although they get plenty).

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Our preacher talked about gas last night in his sermon. He read a verse that mentioned "spoil". He stopped to tell us what "spoil" meant and he said that if two countries went to war and one invaded the other, that all the goods of that land were taken by the invading country. So he said, whether we agree with the war or not, that since we invaded Iraq, the oil should be ours for the taking and we should not be having to "buy" it.

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That's why they are looking into gouging. The investigation has been going on since the fall' date=' but secretly. They just let the cat out of the bag...don't know if anything will come of it. The gouging is not from the oil companies, IMO (although they get plenty).[/quote']

I believe the oil company's profit was only 8%. I know I get more % than that making cakes, although much smaller scale of course! (Too bad! haha)
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Our preacher talked about gas last night in his sermon. He read a verse that mentioned "spoil". He stopped to tell us what "spoil" meant and he said that if two countries went to war and one invaded the other' date=' that all the goods of that land were taken by the invading country. So he said, whether we agree with the war or not, that since we invaded Iraq, the oil should be ours for the taking and we should not be having to "buy" it.[/quote']

That's true, but in this backward world things don't work that way today. It's not considered right for "civilized" nations to take stuff from other countries like that anymore.

Of course, Bush and Company promised that ridding Iraq of Saddam would mean cheaper oil and thus lower gas prices at home. :roll
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Of course' date=' Bush and Company promised that ridding Iraq of Saddam would mean cheaper oil and thus lower gas prices at home. :roll[/quote']

John, not that I'm doubting you, but when was that said? Since we don't get the majority of our oil from Iraq, that seems a little out of the ballpark, KWIM?
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This was very early on. They believed after Saddam was removed that Iraq would welcome Americans with roses and kisses akin to how the French welcomed Americans in 1944. It was expected that Iraq would quickly become democratic and stable, their oil would flow freely and heavily and America would reap the benefits of this. It was also expected the new, stable and democratic Iraq would bring calm to the region and oil prices would drop as a result.

We know that none of this panned out and the Bush Administration was totally unprepared for what happened in post-Saddam Iraq.

I can't quote any sources at this time, I'm just going from memory.
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I for one, I'm glad that Saddam is not murdering his people no longer. He got just what he deserved.

I can't believe some people are so greedy they want America to steal from Iraq, take spoils of war.

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Since when are "spoils of war" stealing? Does that mean that although God said "thou shalt not steal" that he made His people steal when He told them to take the spoils of war?


There were times He gave them permission, and other times He did not. To say the Bible is a pattern to follow of taking spoils of war is to seriously take it out of context, especially here in the age of NT Christianity.
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Since when are "spoils of war" stealing? Does that mean that although God said "thou shalt not steal" that he made His people steal when He told them to take the spoils of war?


Remember, "GRACE."

Do unto others as you which them to do unto you.

Love your enemies.

44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
Matt 5:44-48 (KJV)

If you conquer them, them take everything they have, is that really being loving towards them.

I don't feel the least bit that what Abraham did in the old days is the proper example for us to follow under grace. And I am not saying that Abram did the wrong thing.


14 And when Abram heard that his brother was taken captive, he armed his trained servants, born in his own house, three hundred and eighteen, and pursued them unto Dan.
15 And he divided himself against them, he and his servants, by night, and smote them, and pursued them unto Hobah, which is on the left hand of Damascus.
16 And he brought back all the goods, and also brought again his brother Lot, and his goods, and the women also, and the people.
17 And the king of Sodom went out to meet him after his return from the slaughter of Chedorlaomer, and of the kings that were with him, at the valley of Shaveh, which is the king's dale.
18 And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the most high God.
19 And he blessed him, and said, Blessed be Abram of the most high God, possessor of heaven and earth:
Gen 14:14-19 (KJV)
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Okay. I remember everything that you mentioned, except the idea of lower gas prices (I heard it mentioned by news people and others, but don't remember it coming from the administration, that's why I was wondering!)

I don't think we can claim spoils of war from Iraq - we werent' going in to subjugate them, which is usually what is required for spoils. Remember Jericho - no spoils were allowed, and Israel was cursed because Achan saw, coveted and took.

We are not at war with the Iraqui people, per se. And if we were to take spoils from them, it would be exactly the opposite of what we are trying to do there - rid them of a common enemy and help them to rebuild (which, by the way, is happening well...isn't it interesting that the news media isn't talking about it?).
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Everybody should just take a 3 day sick day on the same day. Stay off the highways, stay away from the supermarkets and malls then sit back and see just how quickly we get the attention of the movers and shakers of our society. Think of it, three days of no factory running, no store selling and no gasoline being bought. Somebody would get the message that we have had enough.

Well hey, these tactics worked for MLK,Jr.

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Beyond gasoline: Prices surge for oil-based goods
By Ron Scherer
Thu Jun 5, 4:00 AM ET

New York - Besides gasoline, the Department of Energy calculates, there are 57 major uses of petroleum ? everything from cosmetics to ballpoint pens, nylons, and even the waxes in chewing gum.

That is why the effect of high oil prices is now spreading well beyond the pump, where gasoline hit another record price of $3.98 a gallon on Wednesday. Now, consumers will have to brace themselves for other higher costs, since businesses such as Kimberly-Clark, Procter & Gamble, and Colgate-Palmolive are raising prices on their products to recoup energy costs.

In brief, this means less money in consumers' pockets in the months ahead. But it also goes beyond consumers. For example, the price of asphalt is up 65 percent so far this year ? and municipalities' and states' road departments are cutting back. This may mean bumpier roads ahead.

"Not quite half of what we consume is energy, food, and other commodities that are significantly affected by the rising cost of petroleum," says Mark Zandi, chief economist at Moody's Economy.com.

On a year-over-year basis, energy prices are up 15.5 percent. Much of the most recent surge in oil prices has yet to be factored into consumer prices. But anecdotal signs are emerging that companies can no longer absorb the higher energy costs.

Last week, for example, Dow Chemical announced a 20 percent across-the-board price increase on its products, which range from antifreeze to cleaning fluids to pharmaceuticals.

Similar moves are expected. "It's just the tip of the iceberg," says Ann Paulins, director of the School of Human and Consumer Sciences at Ohio University in Athens. "The retailers can't absorb it all."

Groceries
That sentiment is echoed by Wegmans, a grocery chain based in Rochester, N.Y., that normally tries to keep price increases to a minimum. Now, however, prices are rising on nearly every shelf.

"We're talking increased raw materials, packaging, transportation, the whole ball of wax," says Jo Natale, a spokeswoman. "We have tried to absorb as many increases as possible to remain competitive, but we have reached the point where retail prices have to go up."

Late this spring, the CEOs of some major consumer-products companies also said they had to start to recoup higher energy costs.

"Through the retailer, they have to pass on to consumers their higher costs," says Ali Dibadj, a securities analyst at Sanford C. Bernstein and Co. in New York. "The price increases are ranging from 4 to 6 to 10 percent."

On April 30, Clayton Daley, chief financial officer of Procter & Gamble, told securities analysts that the company expects to incur about $1.4 billion in higher energy costs this year.

Between May and August, he said, the company would raise prices 4.5 percent on Always and Tampax products, 7 percent on Crest Pro-Health Rinse, 6 percent on Dawn, 8 percent on Swiffer refills, and 11 percent on Oral-B power brushes and refills.

One day later, Larry Peiros, chief operating officer of Clorox, told securities analysts that the company had already raised prices on a number of brands. It had already announced a 13 percent price increase in May on Pine-Sol cleaner.

Later in May, Kimberly-Clark, which makes diapers under the brand name Huggies, said it is increasing prices by 6 to 8 percent from mid-July to late August. The company already increased prices by 4 to 7 percent in February.

On the streets of New York, a mother, Rachel, pushes her two children Daisy and Dillon in a tandem stroller. She thinks some of the companies are reducing the number of diapers in each box, even if the price is not rising. "Everything is going up," she moans.

Even if the prices are not up now, some consumers expect them to rise soon. That's the case with Marc and Silke Lugert of Ottawa, as they push 1-year-old Marla in her stroller around Columbus Circle in New York. "In the next six months, prices will rise," says Mr. Lugert as he holds the hand of his other daughter, 4-year-old Paula.

It's not just the grocery shelves being affected by rising energy costs. To find other price hikes, one need look no further than the road.

Asphalt
The price of asphalt, according to contractors, is up about 65 percent so far this year. Another 10 percent price increase is expected in the next two to three weeks.

The paving material is rising in price in large part because liquid asphalt comes directly from crude oil that's been refined. Asphalt is what is left over after the refiners have made gasoline, kerosene, and other products. It is dense and dirty.

The asphalt business has undergone some changes as the price of oil, as well as diesel, has increased. A growing number of refiners are adding special units that can refine this dense oil into diesel and jet fuel. At the same time, refiners are selling more low-grade oil to ocean freight companies, whose business is booming as US exports rise. The end result: more competition for less supply.

"They are talking shortages in Minnesota," says Steve Hall, CEO of Hardrives Inc., a contractor in Minneapolis. The situation has become so uncertain that asphalt suppliers won't quote prices yet for next year.

State contracts
States are reacting to the higher prices, highway contractors say, by reducing the number of jobs that had been planned. "They are trying to stretch their dollars as much as they can," says Patrick Nelson, special projects manager at Lehman-Roberts Co. in Memphis, Tenn.

Mr. Nelson's company has only one state job to bid on in Tennessee as its Department of Transportation has cut back, he says. If his company bids on the project, he says, it will include an escalation clause to pass on the rising prices.

To stretch dollars, Nelson says, states are resorting to thinner pothole patches and "micro-seals" that wear out faster. "It will catch up with the states," he says.

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Gas dropped 10 cents here yesterday; it's now $3.99. That probably means a big jump is coming because for the past couple of years any time they lower prices, especially more than just a penny or two, a sizable jump occurs.

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I just paid $4.21 a gallon for regular...ethanol added gas. Therefore, I get about 16 miles per gallon if I'm lucky.

Grrr....I told the attendant to stop filling my tank when it hit $70!!


The most expensive vehicle to operate, per mile, is the shopping cart.
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Tenants displaced by fire irked at neighbors
Officials say pair hoarded gasoline to avoid cost hikes

By Jonnelle Marte
Globe Correspondent / June 7, 2008

DARTMOUTH - A couple hoarding gasoline in a closet to avoid rising prices burned deeper holes in their wallets this week, officials said, when gas fumes ignited a fire that ruined their apartment and displaced 15 people in their building.

Neighbors like Karen Pacheco, whose apartment was damaged by water and smoke, were scrambling to find temporary homes yesterday.

"We're staying at a hotel for now," Pacheco said as she moved her belongings out of her smoke-stained apartment. "I'm kind of homeless."

"We don't like the high prices, but that's no way to store gasoline," said Maria Rego, a resident of Ledgewood Commons. "They're endangering the whole community. It's foolish."

The couple, whose names have not been released, illegally stored about 45 gallons of gas in nine water jugs - the kind used for water coolers - in a utility closet in their Ledgewood Commons apartment.

The blaze started about 4:30 p.m. Wednesday, after the gas fumes were ignited by either a natural gas water heater or a propane-fueled cooking appliance, authorities said. There were no serious injuries, but the man who lived in the second-floor unit where the fire started sprained his ankle after jumping from his balcony.

The fire nearly gutted the apartment but was contained by a sprinkler system.

"Firefighters believed that if the sprinklers had not been there the building would have been burned down," said Jennifer Mieth, a spokeswoman for the state fire marshal's office.

The other seven units in the building sustained substantial water and smoke damage, making them unsafe for living until the damage is cleaned up. Pacheco, whose two teenagers were home when the fire broke out, said she was told it may be a few months before she can move back in.

"My things got spared, thank God," she said. "I just can't live here for a while."

Firefighters doused the flames in minutes, according to Dartmouth's Distict 3 Fire Chief Richard Arruda. He said the outcome would have been "catastrophic" if the gas vapors had exploded, and he warned people against storing gas in their homes.

"We'd rather you not store gasoline in any residential structures," Arruda said.

State law limits the amount of gasoline that can be stored in a home, including attached garages, to one quart, Mieth said.

Up to a gallon of gasoline can be kept in a shed or unattached garage that is at least 50 feet away from the home, she said, and all gas must be kept in approved containers.

Mieth said the Dartmouth couple clearly violated the storage laws, but it was not yet known if they will be charged. She expected an investigation to be completed early next week.

The building was cordoned off with yellow police tape yesterday, and several people appeared to be hauling their belongings into moving trucks.

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Subject: FWD: George Carlin's Solution to Save Gasoline

George Carlin's
Solution to Save Gasoline


Bush wants us to cut the amount of gas we use.....

The best way to stop using so much gas is to deport 11 million illegal immigrants!

That would be 11 million less people using our gas. The price of gas would come down.....

Bring our troops home from Iraq to guard the Border...

When they catch an illegal immigrant crossing the border, hand him a canteen, rifle and some ammo and ship him to Iraq ...

Tell him if he wants to come to America then he must serve a tour in the military....

Give him a soldier's pay while he's there and tax him on it.....

After his tour, he will be allowed to become a citizen since he defended this country.....

He will also be registered to be taxed and be a legal patriot...

This option will probably deter illegal immigration and provide a solution for the troops in
Iraq and the aliens trying to make a better life for themselves...

If they refuse to serve, ship them to Iraq anyway, without the canteen, rifle or ammo...

Problem solved...

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One way to handle gas prices: Move
By Steve Hargreaves, CNNMoney.com
Jun 19th, 2008

It may seem a bit drastic, but more and more people are taking what is perhaps the ultimate step in cutting gas prices: They're moving.

Peaches Stevens used to rent an old farm house in southern Indiana. She loved the setting, but her job as a high school science teacher was 62 miles to the north.

Coaching golf after school made carpooling difficult, and even though her Dodge Neon got an impressive 30 miles a gallon, she was still spending upwards of $400 a month on gas.

So she moved. Now Stevens, 49, rents a place eight miles away from school. Plus, she bough a Honda scooter that gets 80 miles a gallon. Now she can get to work and back for about $16 a month.

"I'm doing it all for economic reasons," said Stevens, who figures she'll save enough in gas to pay off the $2,400 scooter in under 7 months. "I loved [the farmhouse], but I do feel like I'm doing the right thing."

Stevens is part of a national trend of high gas prices playing a major role in where people choose to live. Factors like distance from work, access to public transportation, and proximity to shopping are gaining ground on square footage and whether or not the home has a yard and pushing people into more densely packed areas.

"The high cost of gas is cited as a driving factor in increased interest in urban living," said Jim Gillespie, chief executive of Coldwell Banker, a national realty franchise. "Over the past several years we've seen a boom in downtown living all over the country."

It seems like the people actually making the move so far seem to be renters as opposed to owners, as not renewing a lease is obviously much easier than selling a home.

While their wallets may be happy, whether the quality of life is improving for the people who move is debatable.

"I went from a beautiful home with a big back yard to an itty-bitty studio apartment," said Erinn Thomas, who moved from a suburb of Reno, NV, to the downtown area to save on gas. "But it's what I had to do to eat."

So 25-year old Thomas now rents a place just a mile from work.

She says she'll miss the space of the suburbs, but in addition to the $200 a month she hopes to save on gas, she also aims to pocket another $100 a month - and probably improve her health - by staying away from the Drive-thru window at the local fast-food joints.

"I don't have to drive anymore and I can buy a bike," she says.

In addition to personal health, some are also tipping their hat to the health of the planet.

"You cut your carbon footprint, which is pretty cool," said Jason Zulick, a 31- year old human resources manager from Orwigsburg, Penn.

Jason and his wife Tara moved to Orwigsburg from a town 25 miles away. High gas prices weren't the only reason they moved - the couple hopes to start a family and wanted to be closer to relatives in the area.

But they played a big part, and Tara's commute to her teaching job has been cut in half.

"We've saved $150 a month on gas alone just making the switch," said Jason.

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The grass in my yard is getting really tall - I can't afford to get it mowed!


I would expect the cost for getting a yard mowed has gone thru the roof.

I know it cost me about $8.00 of gas every time I mow.
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