Psalm 119:44

[trapperhoney]

Our church is currently working through Psalm 119 as our Bible study on Wednesday evenings. 

Psalm 119:44
So shall I keep thy law continually for ever and ever.

It pays to look up every word! I work my way through each word in the verse, checking the Hebrew words to see what they mean. In English we use the phrase "forever and ever" to just mean ongoing, to just emphasize that we mean "always." So, I went to look up the first "ever" and assumed they would both be the same Hebrew word. They weren't.
ever = H5769 "olam" properly, concealed; that is, the vanishing point
ever = H5703 "ad" (as in ad infinitum) properly a (peremptory) terminus; that is (by implication) duration,  in the sense of perpetuity
 

So when I looked up both words it indicates that the distance/time period talked about here it to the point that can no longer be seen, and past that, it keeps going, which immediately brought to mind Buzz Lightyear in Toy Story where his call to arms is "To Infinity and Beyond!"

I will always see "for ever and ever" in scripture now as "To Infinity and Beyond" lol. 

It's the little things that make scripture meaningful and memorable.

[Jim_Alaska]

I have always thought that the word "ever", when used after the word "forever" multiple times, was redundant and uncalled for. Forever is just what it says and adding the word "ever" multiple times does not and cannot make the time span longer.

As an example, I once heard a preacher say it this way trying to make the point in his sermon: 

"Forever and ever and ever and ever and ever." To me repeating the word "ever" in no way makes forever a longer time period; you are only repeating the word "ever", which is not a length of time.

But that's just me being "picky".

[trapperhoney]

31 minutes ago, Jim_Alaska said:

I have always thought that the word "ever", when used after the word "forever" multiple times, was redundant and uncalled for. Forever is just what it says and adding the word "ever" multiple times does not and cannot make the time span longer.

But that's just me being "picky".

in English that is true, and if I had just gone on that assumption I would have missed this new insight that really made it come more alive for me.

[Hugh_Flower]

I always thought it as “from ever to ever”. Omega and Alpha, etc. I do think the English is proficient enough to understand it. I see no real use for the Hebrew or greek

My church is also going through psalm 119 on Wednesday

Edited September 14, 2021 by Hugh_Flower

[trapperhoney]

10 minutes ago, Hugh_Flower said:

My church is also going through psalm 119 on Wednesday

 

that is awesome!

[SureWord]

"Forever" is how Americans write it. 

"For ever" the Brits.

Edited September 14, 2021 by SureWord

[farouk]

16 hours ago, trapperhoney said:

Our church is currently working through Psalm 119 as our Bible study on Wednesday evenings. 

Psalm 119:44
So shall I keep thy law continually for ever and ever.

It pays to look up every word! I work my way through each word in the verse, checking the Hebrew words to see what they mean. In English we use the phrase "forever and ever" to just mean ongoing, to just emphasize that we mean "always." So, I went to look up the first "ever" and assumed they would both be the same Hebrew word. They weren't.
ever = H5769 "olam" properly, concealed; that is, the vanishing point
ever = H5703 "ad" (as in ad infinitum) properly a (peremptory) terminus; that is (by implication) duration,  in the sense of perpetuity
 

So when I looked up both words it indicates that the distance/time period talked about here it to the point that can no longer be seen, and past that, it keeps going, which immediately brought to mind Buzz Lightyear in Toy Story where his call to arms is "To Infinity and Beyond!"

I will always see "for ever and ever" in scripture now as "To Infinity and Beyond" lol. 

It's the little things that make scripture meaningful and memorable.

@trapperhoneySome helpful thoughts there indeed!

[trapperhoney]

7 hours ago, farouk said:

@trapperhoneySome helpful thoughts there indeed!

Thank you!

[farouk]

16 hours ago, SureWord said:

"Forever" is how Americans write it. 

"For ever" the Brits.

@SureWordInteresting distinction; and I'm reminded of the hymn: 'For ever with the Lord! Amen! so let it be', etc.

[Jerry]

Here is a word that is translated "ever" 24 times, usually in the phrase "for ever." Twice it is translated "strength."

1 Samuel 15:29 And also the Strength of Israel will not lie nor repent: for he is not a man, that he should repent.

Interesting that the word Strength in the verse above has this meaning:
“from 5329; properly, a goal, i.e. the bright object at a distance travelled towards… usually (adverbially), continually (i.e. to the most distant point of view).”
Strong’s # 5329 has this definition:
“properly, to glitter from afar, i.e. to be eminent… to excel, be bright, be preeminent, be perpetual, be overseer, be enduring.”

The picture that comes to my mind is that of travelling towards a city and seeing the bright lights off in the distance, knowing that those lights bring you closer and closer to your destination, your home. The Lord Jesus Christ is the Strength of Israel - He’s the bright object in the distance, dwelling with Him forever in Heaven is the goal we are travelling towards. Our eternal home is in Him.

[SureWord]

3 hours ago, Jerry said:

Here is a word that is translated "ever" 24 times, usually in the phrase "for ever." Twice it is translated "strength."

1 Samuel 15:29 And also the Strength of Israel will not lie nor repent: for he is not a man, that he should repent.

Interesting that the word Strength in the verse above has this meaning:
“from 5329; properly, a goal, i.e. the bright object at a distance travelled towards… usually (adverbially), continually (i.e. to the most distant point of view).”
Strong’s # 5329 has this definition:
“properly, to glitter from afar, i.e. to be eminent… to excel, be bright, be preeminent, be perpetual, be overseer, be enduring.”

The picture that comes to my mind is that of travelling towards a city and seeing the bright lights off in the distance, knowing that those lights bring you closer and closer to your destination, your home. The Lord Jesus Christ is the Strength of Israel - He’s the bright object in the distance, dwelling with Him forever in Heaven is the goal we are travelling towards. Our eternal home is in Him.

If that is the case then why translate it as "strength" and not "light". Is it because "strength" makes more sense in the verse and this is how the translators were inspired...er...I mean led to translate the word?

The root word for the English word "ever" means "vital force" i.e strength.

 

 

[trapperhoney]

13 hours ago, Jerry said:

Here is a word that is translated "ever" 24 times, usually in the phrase "for ever." Twice it is translated "strength."

1 Samuel 15:29 And also the Strength of Israel will not lie nor repent: for he is not a man, that he should repent.

Interesting that the word Strength in the verse above has this meaning:
“from 5329; properly, a goal, i.e. the bright object at a distance travelled towards… usually (adverbially), continually (i.e. to the most distant point of view).”
Strong’s # 5329 has this definition:
“properly, to glitter from afar, i.e. to be eminent… to excel, be bright, be preeminent, be perpetual, be overseer, be enduring.”

The picture that comes to my mind is that of travelling towards a city and seeing the bright lights off in the distance, knowing that those lights bring you closer and closer to your destination, your home. The Lord Jesus Christ is the Strength of Israel - He’s the bright object in the distance, dwelling with Him forever in Heaven is the goal we are travelling towards. Our eternal home is in Him.

That is interesting, but it has no connection to the word used as "for ever" in this verse and therefore doesn't fit in with the passage and doesn't really add to the conversation.

[Jerry]

It is another word translated as forever. I was reading the definition a couple of days ago and thought it was interesting.