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I've heard wonderful things about the math in Abeka, but I agree with the others that Saxon seems to be the best for 5th grade math. I don't have any kids yet, but I have been a tutor since middle school. One of the keys to math is repetition. Practice, practice, practice. Math is usually harder for most people than other subjects because you can't just memorize most of it, you have to understand it too. If she is having problems, don't give her summers off from it because this will just lead to forgetting some of the things she did know. Has she always struggled in math or is this new? If it's new it could be that before much of the math skills learned were just straight memorization. 4th and 5th grade are the big transition years in math where students go from needing to memorize their math tables to really needing to understand the concepts. If she is having trouble with the concepts, you may just need to spend more time on why the answer is what it is. Some people need to see math in more concrete ways. For example, if she is having trouble with long division because she gets the steps mixed up, then you could write it out in a clear and concise way how to do long division with a step 1...., step 2...., etc.

Is the score from the test broken down to show where she is struggling most? If not, is there a number listed on the results? A lot of testing places will be able to tell you where she needs work and where she is fine. I would couple the curriculum with homemade math drills. If she is struggling with multiplication or larger numbers, make her practice and do a worksheet a day of it. Use flash cards to strengthen memory of times and division tables. If she is struggling with fractions, add them into everyday activities (have her bake with you, have her divide the snack equally among everyone in the house, use toys and have her put 1/2 of her toys in one area, have a table in one room with a group of things and divide them into a different fraction each day [2/3 on the left, 1/3 on the right for one day...] etc). You can make your own color by numbers too, those were always my favorite things. Take a picture and break it up into sections. For each section put a math problem, with certain answers equaling the color for that area. Put whatever she is having trouble with for the problems. If she is having trouble reducing fractions, put that in there (example...color anything that reduces to 1/2 brown... in one spot put the fraction 2/4, etc).

Another thing to consider is this... If she tested at a third grade math level, you may need to take a couple steps back and return to your 3rd grade math workbooks. Get her solid in the third grade level before moving on, then get her solid in the 4th grade level. If she's at a 3rd grade level, the 5th grade material may be a little too hard for her causing her to give up before she starts. If you do this you don't need to do the old workbooks and material day by day or lesson by lesson. You can see where she needs to spend more time and where she is already solid enough to skip.

I found this website when looking at 5th grade math and it seems to have a lot of great worksheets on it (I haven't spent much time looking at any of these worksheets so I apologize if there's anything bad on them... It's for schools and parents so I don't think there is, but just in case).
http://www.internet4classrooms.com/skills_5th_math.htm

This website has a lot of free worksheets too, for all grades
http://www.tlsbooks.com/fifthgradeworksheets.htm

Here's another
http://www.helpingwithmath.com/by_grade/gr5_worksheets.htm

Is there anyone at your Church who is good at math that could help? Sometimes with young children just having a young adult who is closer to their age explain it makes all the difference.

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My son wasn't the greatest in Math - that was the lowest score in any of his tests, including his ACT. But that was basically because he isn't interested in it. It bored him, and he just didn't want to take the time to figure it out. When he applied himself, he would get everything right. He even helped people with their homework. :loco His strengths have always been history and language arts - like his mom. :cool

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I've heard wonderful things about the math in Abeka' date='ABeka was the start of her troubles. The kids in her class at school were extremely bright (she included) so that when she began to get behind in math, they couldn't hold everyone back to get her caught up. We worked at home, but she got discouraged and never really caught up.
Is the score from the test broken down to show where she is struggling most? It is broken down and she messed up on all of it. We thought she was going to have some improvement because her confidence really sky-rocketed at home this year...and as I checked her work at home, there seemed to be a correllation.Another thing to consider is this... If she tested at a third grade math level, you may need to take a couple steps back and return to your 3rd grade math workbooks. Get her solid in the third grade level before moving on, then get her solid in the 4th grade level.I've looked at the LifePacs and I think she could go back into the 4th grade of those and be fine. The 3rd grade LifePacs are things she doesn't struggle with.


Is there anyone at your Church who is good at math that could help? Sometimes with young children just having a young adult who is closer to their age explain it makes all the difference.


As for anyone at church, due to some issues at home, that may not be an option right now. Sorry I can't go into details.
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While I have not experienced it, I have heard that Saxton Math is great. I don't necessarily agree that repetition is the key to math. I have taught Abeka, ACE, and BJU. Of those 3, I like BJU for its logical this is why we do this approach. The memorizing of facts happens naturally later on. ACE is a close second to BJU, as they semi use this approach. I would recomend giving her the online test from ACE and catching her up that way. I haven't been on the site in awhile, but it used to be that this test would show the weak areas and tell what paces to order for the weakness only. Each pace reviews previously learned things, so she would still be reviewing what she does know.

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We have used both Saxon and Abeka and I will never recommend Saxon to anyone. Saxon math is at least two years behind Abeka. My kids hate math, but they have traditionally scored 2 to 3 grades above where they are with the Abeka.

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I don't necessarily agree that repetition is the key to math. ....... ..... I like BJU for its logical emphasis' date=' this is why we do this approach. The memorizing of facts happens naturally later on. [/quote']
This is also my thinking as well.

Few things are more discouraging and nauseating than to be forced to memorize lists of rules and procedures without knowing the concepts behind them.

I've been down this road many times with struggling math students in the elementary and secondary grades. The procedure that worked best for my students was to show them my College Algebra textbook so they could see the following things:::::

***Mathematics always builds on itself.

***mathematical principles never change.

***Mathematics is here to stay and is an integral part of life.

***Mathematics can be made to be fun and enjoyable.

When my students finally got convinced that the high-level laws of advanced algebra were the very same simple and basic rules that they have already been using, but just didn't know it, they breathed a sigh of relief.

Some examples::::

All operations are actually forms of addition.

***Subtraction is tens-complementary addition.

[ex.#1. Subtract 4 from 8::: take the tens-complement of the 4 and we get 6. Add 8 and 6 and we have 14. Since we "spilled-out" into the tens column, we know the answer is positive. At that point we truncate the "1" in the tens column and stop. The answer is the +4 left over.]

[ex.2. Subtract 7 from 3::: take the tens-complement of 7 and we have 3. Add 3 and 3 and we have 6. We have no tens spill-out, which tells us that our answer is negative so we have to complement again. The tens complemenet of 6 is 4. Our answer is -4.]

***Multiplication is multiple addition. [ex. Multiply 6 and 3::: add 6 to an accumulator 3 times. i.e. Enter 6 into an empty accumulator and we have 6. Add another 6 and the accumulator shows 12. Add the third 6 and we now have 18.]

***Division is multiple subtraction, and subtraction is complementary addition.

***Square Roots::: This operation is simply specialized division.

I never cease to be amazed how quickly kids learn when they discover that math can be fun. Learning is already a natural process. It is identical to eating and/or seeing. It's the way God made us. If we have to strain our eyes to see something far away we use a telescope. If we are straining to chew something (e.g a piece of steak) then the bite is too large, and needs to be broken down smaller. Likewise is the study of mathematics. The problems have to first be made "visible" and then have to be broken down into tiny bite-size pieces so that the student can easily "chew" on them his own way. All of learning is self-teaching. The teacher/tutor/instructor can present the information and even help to break down the concepts, but the student has to take them and assimilate them, himself. We teachers need to find creative ways to make learning enjoyable.
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There is one more thing I need to add:::::::::

There are things in our society today that literally wage war against our students' abilities to learn and understand intricate, multi-step mechanical concepts. Mathematics is very mechanical and multi-step, besides being rather intricate at times. The worst offenders are rock music and television programming. Those two things will absorb a child's creativity and learning abilities like a sponge and turn his mind to mush. My wife and I kept the TV out of the house until both our kids were old enough to have their study habits and techniques fully established. Instead we went to the library and got books to read. Both our kids' final achievement test scores were stellar and off the charts. In third grade our son scored beyond the limits of the test which stopped at the ninth grade level.

The very first thing I would ask the parents of the kids who were coming to me for tutoring is how badly they wanted this instruction. If they were exceedingly serious and willing to pull out all the stops, then they needed to put the TV in the attic, or just give it away if it was too much temptation.

This is also why I wrote my own math curriculum. Video based curricula spoon-feed the mind and can even lull the brain into laziness, whereas a study method designed to get the student to read and "experiment" with intricate concepts will stimulate creativity processes.

I believe that God is no respector of persons. What He did for us He can and will do for you.

My advice::: Get rid of the TV and write your own curricula. :Green

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We have used both Saxon and Abeka and I will never recommend Saxon to anyone. Saxon math is at least two years behind Abeka. My kids hate math' date=' but they have traditionally scored 2 to 3 grades above where they are with the Abeka.[/quote']

That was the exact opposite of our experience!!
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This is also why I wrote my own math curriculum. Video based curricula spoon-feed the mind and can even lull the brain into laziness, whereas a study method designed to get the student to read and "experiment" with intricate concepts will stimulate creativity processes.

My advice::: Get rid of the TV and write your own curricula. :Green


:Bleh We don't watch tv...and if I were to write my own math curriculum, you would die laughing at my idiocy. My husband can do all sorts of math and he believes it is inherent in our beings...but he doesn't have the patience to teach them school subjects.

He can take them out to learn to ride bikes, shoot guns, throw frisbees, catch balls, and run lathes and mills...
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:Bleh We don't watch tv...and if I were to write my own math curriculum, you would die laughing at my idiocy. My husband can do all sorts of math and he believes it is inherent in our beings...but he doesn't have the patience to teach them school subjects.

He can take them out to learn to ride bikes, shoot guns, throw frisbees, catch balls, and run lathes and mills...

I'm sorry to hear that. :sad

It isn't my place to criticize your hubby, but my firmest conviction from waaaaaay back before my sweet, beautiful bride and I ever had any kids was simply that we agreed early on to teach them the things we individually enjoyed. My wife is a literary genius but she dislikes math. I'm not that way at all. I thoroughly enjoy math but linguistics leave me in the dust. Proof of that, just look at how I (CAN'T :Bleh ) write. :lol::lol::lol: Consequently, she teaches readin' and writin' and I teach 'rithmetic. :Green She and I make a good team. :thumb Our most important investment is/was our kids' education. We knew we would never pass this way again.

God richly blessed our efforts beyond our wildest dreams. Both kids went off the charts with awards:::

***Both kids were valedictorians of their respective graduating classes

***One was a National Merit Finalist.

***One was a Presidential Scholar Semi-finalist

***One was a American High School Math Exam Awardee.

***One Graduated PCC with Highest Honors (Summa Cum Laude)

***One Selected to represent PCC in Who's Who in American Colleges and Universities.

***Both had the highest ACT and SAT scores in the history of the school. Their records are still unbroken and unmatched.

Needless to say we give all the Honor and Glory to God, and He is no respector of persons. What He did for us He can do for you.
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ABeka's philosophy of education dates back to the 1600's where reading, writing, and arithmetic were the foundation of an education. It is true that math builds on itself, but if the foundation is not built, you cannot build on it. Abeka is the only curriculum that stresses this very point. Not all schools and homeschoolers actually do the drill necessary. My son's 1st grade teacher did not do any drill and he was behind where his sister was. Same curriculum, different teacher.

Schooling requires 3 things
1. An excellent curriculum
2. A teacher who knows how to use the curriculum
3. Structure and discipline to make surethe child stays focused

Unfortunately, most schools and parents don't fit #2. Curriculums like ACE, Alpha Omega and Landmark remove the teacher from the equation and force the student to learn on their own. BJU's curriculum might as well be a public school curriculum with it's worldly philosophies.

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