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President Unity Continues to Divide Us

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I work for the federal government, civil service, have for 18 years and 10 years military before that.

Today, they have updated the mask mandates for the base, and I assume, all government entities: Vaccinated, no masks, unvaccinated, have to wear the mask. With this being the rule all over, as well, there are severe issues already coming about because of it, some angry the mask wearing has been lessened, some angry they have to wear one, while others don't, many angry that we are setting aside Heppa laws by having to reveal to strangers any aspect of our health information. Personally, I'm a bit angry that now, what is considered necessary PPE for some, is not longer necessary for all. After all, if vaccines work, then those vaccinated are safe from those who aren't. Just a massive piece of control, that a large amount of the population is buying into wholesale, and those who see through it are being set upon for it.   

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1 hour ago, Ukulelemike said:

I work for the federal government, civil service, have for 18 years and 10 years military before that.

Today, they have updated the mask mandates for the base, and I assume, all government entities: Vaccinated, no masks, unvaccinated, have to wear the mask. With this being the rule all over, as well, there are severe issues already coming about because of it, some angry the mask wearing has been lessened, some angry they have to wear one, while others don't, many angry that we are setting aside Heppa laws by having to reveal to strangers any aspect of our health information. Personally, I'm a bit angry that now, what is considered necessary PPE for some, is not longer necessary for all. After all, if vaccines work, then those vaccinated are safe from those who aren't. Just a massive piece of control, that a large amount of the population is buying into wholesale, and those who see through it are being set upon for it.   

"Just two weeks to flatten the curve."

 

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How come our government doesn't believe in science? If they did, they would also include those that had Covid-19 that have the antibodies to fight off the virus in removing the masks. It seems from studies that the natural antibodies are more effective than that vaccine.

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13 hours ago, Ukulelemike said:

I work for the federal government, civil service, have for 18 years and 10 years military before that.

Today, they have updated the mask mandates for the base, and I assume, all government entities: Vaccinated, no masks, unvaccinated, have to wear the mask. With this being the rule all over, as well, there are severe issues already coming about because of it, some angry the mask wearing has been lessened, some angry they have to wear one, while others don't, many angry that we are setting aside Heppa laws by having to reveal to strangers any aspect of our health information. Personally, I'm a bit angry that now, what is considered necessary PPE for some, is not longer necessary for all. After all, if vaccines work, then those vaccinated are safe from those who aren't. Just a massive piece of control, that a large amount of the population is buying into wholesale, and those who see through it are being set upon for it.   

It is not a given that because a person has had two shots they are immune from COVID. Many are, but not all are. Several Yankee baseball players had the shots but became ill with COVID: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/05/17/yankees-covid-outbreak-vaccines-work/

 

As a Christian are we not to be concerned about the welfare of others? Does this not place a responsibility on us to do what we can to ensure we do not put others in danger? Does the 'golden rule' no longer apply if it impinges on us in any way? 

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43 minutes ago, Bouncing Bill said:

As a Christian are we not to be concerned about the welfare of others? Does this not place a responsibility on us to do what we can to ensure we do not put others in danger? Does the 'golden rule' no longer apply if it impinges on us in any way? 

Even with a mask you are still putting others in "danger". It may be less of a  danger, but it still is danger as masks are not 100% effective. So do you go out at all?

How is me not wearing a mask putting others in danger? Your Biblical logic only works if I am aware that I'm sick and purposely go out in public.

BTW. All 8 of the NY Yankees players did not show any symptoms and would not have known they had it if they didn't get tested. 

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As I posted before the vaccine will cause the illness this explains why people are getting sick with the bolognavirus after the vaccine as happened recently to a singer of a famous Rock band.

There's no doubt now they were working on a biological weapon in Wuhan. How it got out is up to debate. 

Back in '78 I came down with the Russian flu which "accidentally" got out of a lab in the Soviet Union. Even though it was a H1N1 virus the symptoms were similar. That one killed 700,000 worldwide but there was never any lockdowns nor masks. Life went on.

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20 minutes ago, PastorMatt said:

Even with a mask you are still putting others in "danger". It may be less of a  danger, but it still is danger as masks are not 100% effective. So do you go out at all?

How is me not wearing a mask putting others in danger? Your Biblical logic only works if I am aware that I'm sick and purposely go out in public.

BTW. All 8 of the NY Yankees players did not show any symptoms and would not have known they had it if they didn't get tested. 

If you have any disease that can be spread through droplets, i.e. Influenza, Group A streptococcus, Meningococcal disease, Tuberculosis (airborne spread), you will be less likely to spread that disease to others if you wear a mask. Even more effective is if both you and others are wearing masks. So, wearing a mask both protects you from others and others from you. To me wearing a mask imposes no severe restrictions on the wearer. 

Concerning the Yankee baseball players. Thankfully they were not seriously ill. But for people who are immune compromised it could well become a serious, life-threatening disease. 

Are we not to be our brother's keeper? If we say no than we are really saying, "I don't care about you. I care only about me." 

I believe we have placed too much emphasis on our own individual rights while ignoring our individual responsibilities toward others. 

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Concerning the Yankee baseball players. Thankfully they were not seriously ill. But for people who are immune compromised it could well become a serious, life-threatening disease. 

That is the way all virus have worked since the beginning of time. The flu hospitalizes me every year and puts my life in jeopardy, while others don't even know they have it. If that's the case, and each year there are thousands like me, then should the mask mandate never end?

 

22 minutes ago, Bouncing Bill said:

If you have any disease that can be spread through droplets, i.e. Influenza, Group A streptococcus, Meningococcal disease, Tuberculosis (airborne spread), you will be less likely to spread that disease to others if you wear a mask. Even more effective is if both you and others are wearing masks. So, wearing a mask both protects you from others and others from you. To me wearing a mask imposes no severe restrictions on the wearer. 

Are we not to be our brother's keeper? If we say no than we are really saying, "I don't care about you. I care only about me." 

What I highlighted in bold seems like a contradiction. According to your statement, wearing a mask still puts others at some risk, to be a brothers keeper should we all use something that 100% going to protect others? 

My question to you would be, where do you draw the line? Each one of us not knowingly puts someone's life in jeopardy every day with driving, operating equipment, preparing food and so forth

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8 minutes ago, PastorMatt said:

That is the way all virus have worked since the beginning of time.

If there is time (and time is short - shorter than ever before),

 

see what Moderna (big pharma) published about the computer program they developed to inject into people.   It is meant to re-program the complex system inside a person,  in a way that disables their natural immunity,  and makes it susceptible to new viruses, contagions, diseases from then on (from the time a person gets the immunization for the rest of their life).

 

As for any '19' virus,   apparently it was fabricated, made up,  has never been proven in a medical or scientific laboratory.   When vitamins were shown, long ago, to provide perfect protection against the so-called virus,  they were hushed up,  not promoted,  pushed to a back shelf or out of sight,

until the 'new' shots , meant to program from the inside out ,  could be administered ,  at the peril of everyone who gets one.

13 minutes ago, PastorMatt said:

What I highlighted in bold seems like a contradiction. According to your statement, wearing a mask still puts others at some risk, to be a brothers keeper should we all use something that 100% going to protect others? 

My question to you would be, where do you draw the line? Each one of us not knowingly puts someone's life in jeopardy every day with driving, operating equipment, preparing food and so forth

During the plagues,  there was not only a remedy , used, and effective,

but the only ones who went into the streets (without a mask) to bring in the hopeless sick children TO THEIR OWN HOMES,  and help them

were the followers of Jesus.

Note that every study of wearing masks has shown that it doubles the rate of infection in the sick,  even for surgeons and doctors in hospitals.  (see 1981 published private study for best un-edited example).

To protect others ?   Obey God.  Do not fear nor be afraid nor even anxious for anything.

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36 minutes ago, Bouncing Bill said:

If you have any disease that can be spread through droplets, i.e. Influenza, Group A streptococcus, Meningococcal disease, Tuberculosis (airborne spread), you will be less likely to spread that disease to others if you wear a mask. Even more effective is if both you and others are wearing masks. So, wearing a mask both protects you from others and others from you. To me wearing a mask imposes no severe restrictions on the wearer. 

Concerning the Yankee baseball players. Thankfully they were not seriously ill. But for people who are immune compromised it could well become a serious, life-threatening disease. 

Are we not to be our brother's keeper? If we say no than we are really saying, "I don't care about you. I care only about me." 

I believe we have placed too much emphasis on our own individual rights while ignoring our individual responsibilities toward others. 

Let just wear masks forevermore. Heck, let's go all the way and mandate biohazard suits for everyone.

Life must go on as it always has.

17 minutes ago, PastorMatt said:

That is the way all virus have worked since the beginning of time. The flu hospitalizes me every year and puts my life in jeopardy, while others don't even know they have it. If that's the case, and each year there are thousands like me, then should the mask mandate never end?

 

What I highlighted in bold seems like a contradiction. According to your statement, wearing a mask still puts others at some risk, to be a brothers keeper should we all use something that 100% going to protect others? 

My question to you would be, where do you draw the line? Each one of us not knowingly puts someone's life in jeopardy every day with driving, operating equipment, preparing food and so forth

Yup. I was diagnosed with asthma at 4 years of age. The flu takes a toll on me but I will not live in a bubble. 

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Like I mentioned before. I've had the flu and Covid. The flu hospitalized me, but Covid did nothing to me. To some, they say I was lucky, to them I say they are then lucky that the flu does not hospitalize them.  

Our presidents language during all of this is nothing more than to divide us rather than unite us.  I just wish they would believe in science.

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Well, more conversation here than I expected. Thanks all for the input-I know it gets crazy and we need to vent.

Masks-even Faucci initially said that masks wouldn't do any good, and really, they don't. How many who have gotten sick, and even died, were regular mask wearers? Last number I saw, a while back, was roughly 70%! And hundreds, probably more, fully vaccinated people have gotten the virus, and thousands who have been vaccinated have died from the vaccine. Israel is the most vaccinated country in the world, but they're about the worst with cases and deaths even now. 

Eat right, take your supplements, vitamins and minerals, keep off the sugar and sodas, eat as clean as you can, and your immune system will be strong and even if you get wick, you'll probably be just fine. God gave us a wonderful immune system, and yes, we live in a world full of a curse and sin, so we're going to get sick, and someday, even die. So live for Christ today while you can, and leave the details to Him.

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Second paragraph ... wrong question. The correct question is how many more would have gotten sick and died if they had not been wearing masks?

Your comment is like saying, doesn't do any good to stop smoking. They died 40 years later anyway.

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36 minutes ago, Bouncing Bill said:

Second paragraph ... wrong question. The correct question is how many more would have gotten sick and died if they had not been wearing masks?

Your comment is like saying, doesn't do any good to stop smoking. They died 40 years later anyway.

I'm confused and that could just be because I'm getting old. What's the correlation between smoking and masks?

Could you please explain in more details? Thank you for your time.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, PastorMatt said:

I'm confused and that could just be because I'm getting old. What's the correlation between smoking and masks?

Could you please explain in more details? Thank you for your time.

In that regardless of whether we are talking about masks, tobacco, alcohol or something else, the underlying idea in your reply was, IMHO, faulty in its approach to the topic. Yes, some who wore masks may have gotten ill with COVID. That does not negate the benefits of wearing a mask for others who did not catch COVID because they were wearing masks. Masks are beneficial. We do not through out something good simply because it is not 100% effective. 

Two compelling case reports also suggest that masks can prevent transmission in high-risk scenarios, said Chin-Hong and Rutherford. In one case, a man flew from China to Toronto and subsequently tested positive for COVID-19. He had a dry cough and wore a mask on the flight, and all 25 people closest to him on the flight tested negative for COVID-19. In another case, in late May, two hair stylists in Missouri had close contact with 140 clients while sick with COVID-19. Everyone wore a mask and none of the clients tested positive.

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/417906/still-confused-about-masks-heres-science-behind-how-face-masks-prevent

Edited by Bouncing Bill
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Am I missing something? I still am not understanding your correlation with smoking, drugs, and masks. Even more effective than wearing masks is staying home and not having any human contact...Science shoes that 100% effective. Unless one is staying home 100% of the time one is still putting a life at risk with covid. Makes no difference if you put one person at risk or 100. Life is all equal. I've always found in ironic that some people say that people that don't wear masks are putting peoples life in jeopardy, when mask are not 100% effective and they know it, but still stand there and talk to me knowing they are putting me at risk. 

During the flue season, every single person I come in contact with puts my life in jeopardy and I in no way expect others to conform to me. God gave me a brain to use personal discretion. 

We can share news stories all day long that show how effective masks are and also how ineffective they are.  Example... All 8 of the Yankees that tested positive wore masks and where vaccinated. That's a real high percentage for one team.  Even Texas lifted  it's mask mandate last month, had just recorded its first day since March with no deaths.

To sum it all up, I believe that we can do a better job of controlling our personal health than the government. After all, if our politicians cared so much about our health, why are we not on the same health care plans as them? Covid (Masks) is another example of government failed policies on us where they do not have to follow unless in front of a camera.

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5 hours ago, PastorMatt said:

Am I missing something? I still am not understanding your correlation with smoking, drugs, and masks. Even more effective than wearing masks is staying home and not having any human contact...Science shoes that 100% effective. Unless one is staying home 100% of the time one is still putting a life at risk with covid. Makes no difference if you put one person at risk or 100. Life is all equal. I've always found in ironic that some people say that people that don't wear masks are putting peoples life in jeopardy, when mask are not 100% effective and they know it, but still stand there and talk to me knowing they are putting me at risk. 

During the flue season, every single person I come in contact with puts my life in jeopardy and I in no way expect others to conform to me. God gave me a brain to use personal discretion. 

We can share news stories all day long that show how effective masks are and also how ineffective they are.  Example... All 8 of the Yankees that tested positive wore masks and where vaccinated. That's a real high percentage for one team.  Even Texas lifted  it's mask mandate last month, had just recorded its first day since March with no deaths.

To sum it all up, I believe that we can do a better job of controlling our personal health than the government. After all, if our politicians cared so much about our health, why are we not on the same health care plans as them? Covid (Masks) is another example of government failed policies on us where they do not have to follow unless in front of a camera.

I agree, we should try to control our personal health. That seems a given to me. Also, I believe we have a responsibility to protect other people and their health. 

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