Jump to content
  • Welcome Guest

    For an ad free experience on Online Baptist, Please login or register for free

The Rapture in the Bible


Recommended Posts

  • Moderators
4 hours ago, Hugh_Flower said:

The Church does not take the place of Israel, covenant theology is heresy. Not all Jews will be saved either, only 144,000 during the tribulation 

 

 

1: I never said the church has taken the place of Israel-they remain in their place.

2: never said all Jews will be saved, however, more than the 144,000 will be saved. After all, who do you think they are witnessing to? As well, the events of Zechariah tell a different story, in that Jesus will return bodily to Jerusalem and those alive in the city will believe and be saved. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
1 hour ago, Ukulelemike said:

1: I never said the church has taken the place of Israel-they remain in their place.

2: never said all Jews will be saved, however, more than the 144,000 will be saved. After all, who do you think they are witnessing to? As well, the events of Zechariah tell a different story, in that Jesus will return bodily to Jerusalem and those alive in the city will believe and be saved. 

 

I know you weren’t. The 144,000 are witnessing the Lord to the world, how ever only 144,000 of the Jews will be believers. I believe the others will die away as unbelievers before Jesus returns to Jerusalem.

( also where does it say ALL of Israel will be believers ? Not all of Israel is even Jewish at this time) 

Edited by Hugh_Flower
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
6 hours ago, Jim_Alaska said:

Romans 11:26 (KJV) And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

All means all, and that is all that all means.

I can't agree this is the sense of this one scripture, alone by itself.  I believe 1 Corinthians 1:21-25 and Romans 10:1-4 are to the contrary.  

But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven. [Matthew 10:33] Far too many Jews denied Christ. 

17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree; 18 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. 19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. 20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: 21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. [Romans 11:17-21] emphasis added

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Administrators

It is true that Israel past and present denied Him. But the Scripture I posted speaks to the future coming of Christ, when not only all Israel, but all the world will see him.

Revelation 1:7 (KJV) Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Another Scripture with the word "all" in it. this would include Israel. Israel will at that time realize that He was The Christ that they denied. "and they also which pierced him"  And so, all Israel will be saved.

The Scripture in Romans that I posted is not my interpretation; it is what Scripture says.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
9 hours ago, Hugh_Flower said:

I know you weren’t. The 144,000 are witnessing the Lord to the world, how ever only 144,000 of the Jews will be believers. I believe the others will die away as unbelievers before Jesus returns to Jerusalem.

( also where does it say ALL of Israel will be believers ? Not all of Israel is even Jewish at this time) 

The 144,000 are those who are sealed. There will be other Jews who get saved. If it were only the 144,000 there would be no women Jewish women or children saved.

"All Israel shall be saved," is the remnant. The true "Israel of God". 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
2 hours ago, SureWord said:

The 144,000 are those who are sealed. There will be other Jews who get saved. If it were only the 144,000 there would be no women Jewish women or children saved.

"All Israel shall be saved," is the remnant. The true "Israel of God". 

That makes sense. I am wrong! 
 ( but I do still not think ALL Jews at this time will be saved ) 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
16 minutes ago, Hugh_Flower said:

That makes sense. I am wrong! 
 ( but I do still not think ALL Jews at this time will be saved ) 

Yes, you are correct. "All Israel" refers to the remnant. Remember, Jesus said to the Pharisees that God could raise up children of Abraham from the stones indicating that being a Hebrew doesn't equal being a child of God. 

Edited by SureWord
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Moderators
12 hours ago, Hugh_Flower said:

I know you weren’t. The 144,000 are witnessing the Lord to the world, how ever only 144,000 of the Jews will be believers. I believe the others will die away as unbelievers before Jesus returns to Jerusalem.

( also where does it say ALL of Israel will be believers ? Not all of Israel is even Jewish at this time) 

Zechariah 14:

"1Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

2For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

3Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

4And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee."

Clearly, this is speaking of Jerusalem and Judah, and speaks of those if Israel that will be currently living in and defending it from the armies of the earth.

Zechariah 12: 

7The LORD also shall save the tents of Judah first, that the glory of the house of David and the glory of the inhabitants of Jerusalem do not magnify themselves against Judah.

8In that day shall the LORD defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; and he that is feeble among them at that day shall be as David; and the house of David shall be as God, as the angel of the LORD before them.

9And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

10And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.

11In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.

12And the land shall mourn, every family apart; the family of the house of David apart, and their wives apart; the family of the house of Nathan apart, and their wives apart;

13The family of the house of Levi apart, and their wives apart; the family of Shimei apart, and their wives apart;

14All the families that remain, every family apart, and their wives apart.

Again, clearly here speaking of the return of Christ to Jerusalem and the saving of the "House of David", and them receiving the "spirit of grace and supplication". Sounds like they'll be saved.

Today the Israel we see is not, clearly, just Israel, though many area, and from many of the tribes. Today they are the valley of dry bones, with flesh, but without yet the Spirit of life breathed into them-that will happen when Christ returns, as seen in the verses above. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...
  • Members
On 4/19/2021 at 4:33 PM, PastorMatt said:

... Like I mentioned in the earlier post I care more about what Scripture says than terminology, that's why I was interested in knowing what event you believe 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 is talking about.

This event will take place at the end of the Millennium. The rapture of the "Church of the first born" (Heb. 12:23) will take place in less than a month.

"September 18, 2020 is the starting point for a new period of time, lasting 50 prophetic years. This date corresponds to the first day of the first month in the prophetic reckoning of years. In the tenth chapter of the book of Ezra, Scripture speaks of the events that will take place in the Tabernacle of heaven after Church of the first born is gathered there. Notice, Scripture uses a new count of time.

And they “sate downe in the first day of the tenth moneth to examine the matter” (Ezra.10:16)

If we count 270 days (nine prophetic months) from the date of September 18, 2020, then the next (271 days) will be “the first day of the tenth moneth” - June 15, 2021, this is the day when the Church of the first born will enter the heavenly Tabernacle for the first time. It is said: And they “sate downe …”

And the meeting will make an important decision after three months:

“And they made an ende, with all the men that had taken strange wiues, by the first day of the first moneth” (Ezra.10:17)

The first day of the first month (already the next prophetic year) will be Monday, September 13, 2021. By this day, on the eve of it, the command “to restore and to build Ierusalem” will be issued (Dan.9:25). Here we are talking about making an important decision - building the Temple not made with hands. In the ninth chapter of the book of Daniel (Dan.9:25), continuing to count the years unto the Messiah the Prince, Scripture confirms the correctness of the specified date.

“from the going foorth of the commandement to restore and to build Ierusalem, vnto the Messiah the Prince, shall be seuen weekes” (Dan.9:25)

Christ will become the Messiah the Prince on the DAY of Pentecost, December 28 - 29, 2069. The 49 prophetic years contain 17640 days. After counting down the days, we find that the commandment “to restore and to build Ierusalem” will be issued on Sunday, September 12, 2021. 49 prophetic years are counted from this date “vnto the Messiah the Prince”..." 

May © 2021

http://www.lordway.ru/English/otrasl/otrasl_2.htm

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
1 hour ago, Konstantin said:

This event will take place at the end of the Millennium. The rapture of the "Church of the first born" (Heb. 12:23) will take place in less than a month.

"September 18, 2020 is the starting point for a new period of time, lasting 50 prophetic years. This date corresponds to the first day of the first month in the prophetic reckoning of years. In the tenth chapter of the book of Ezra, Scripture speaks of the events that will take place in the Tabernacle of heaven after Church of the first born is gathered there. Notice, Scripture uses a new count of time.

And they “sate downe in the first day of the tenth moneth to examine the matter” (Ezra.10:16)

If we count 270 days (nine prophetic months) from the date of September 18, 2020, then the next (271 days) will be “the first day of the tenth moneth” - June 15, 2021, this is the day when the Church of the first born will enter the heavenly Tabernacle for the first time. It is said: And they “sate downe …”

And the meeting will make an important decision after three months:

“And they made an ende, with all the men that had taken strange wiues, by the first day of the first moneth” (Ezra.10:17)

The first day of the first month (already the next prophetic year) will be Monday, September 13, 2021. By this day, on the eve of it, the command “to restore and to build Ierusalem” will be issued (Dan.9:25). Here we are talking about making an important decision - building the Temple not made with hands. In the ninth chapter of the book of Daniel (Dan.9:25), continuing to count the years unto the Messiah the Prince, Scripture confirms the correctness of the specified date.

“from the going foorth of the commandement to restore and to build Ierusalem, vnto the Messiah the Prince, shall be seuen weekes” (Dan.9:25)

Christ will become the Messiah the Prince on the DAY of Pentecost, December 28 - 29, 2069. The 49 prophetic years contain 17640 days. After counting down the days, we find that the commandment “to restore and to build Ierusalem” will be issued on Sunday, September 12, 2021. 49 prophetic years are counted from this date “vnto the Messiah the Prince”..." 

May © 2021

http://www.lordway.ru/English/otrasl/otrasl_2.htm

June 15th?! That's the day our nutty Governor here in VA drops the mask mandate and I'm gonna miss out on that! ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Administrators

Konstantin, You have been told before that this website requires that scripture quotes be posted from the KJV. Your most recent post is not KJV. This requirement is clearly posted in the website rules.

If you continue to post scripture that is not KJV it will be deleted.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.



×
×
  • Create New...