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What are Your Thoughts on Effeminate Men in the Name of Christ


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As the world seeks to blur the lines between men and women, it seems that Christians are often found to be following suit with the world on this matter. Christians that seek to justify their position in doing this are often found to be toting a false bible version that blatantly changes God's words in order to make God Himself effeminate. In the KJV, Genesis 1:27 clearly separates the creation of man in His image from the creation of "them" as it pertains to the creation of two genders. Again, in 1 Corinthians 11:7, the bible clearly separates the man's creation in the image and glory of God from the woman, which is the glory of the man. 

i am now seeing men teach from the KJV that they are both created in the image of God. Christian churches, including baptists, have seemingly succumb to the idea that a Christ like man should appear to be weak, quoting verses of meekness. While, surely, we must come to Christ in meekness, as a little child, and entreat the brethren with such an spirit, is there no other attribute by which Christ is manifest, for what shall we say, that Christ beareth the sword and the key to hell in vein? 

What of the prophets of old, who were commanded to cry aloud and spareth not? Was John the baptist sought out by the multitudes for his soft raiment and easy words? Was he not a voice that crieth out in the wilderness? Are we to perform better in meekness than Christ Himself, sparing the volume of words which He spake concerning false prophets and teachers of hypocrisy? 

As for myself, I hear better when a voice is raised from the pulpit. My ears, which are dull at times, receive the message as if it were not a light thing. My heart is pricked by words as of a trumpet sounding, but when loud words out of context flow abundantly, I perceive that it is not right, yet when no words ever trumpet out from the pulpit, I perceive there to be no zeal, at least not according to knowledge.  

It is as though man was created in the image of God for the purpose of leadership. What do I perceive when I hear a woman preach, or her voice trumpeted in a congregation or a home? Is the man to remain silent, being held in obedience as if it were of the law? I've been to two baptist churches in as many weeks where the women gave the message, and when I spoke of it, was yelled at by women while the men remained silent.

I have encountered many men who would otherwise speak as men, but when speaking of the things of God soften their voice, and loosen their shoulders. They then speak in a smooth voice that can only be likened to that of a meek and mild woman. They can go from normal speech and demeanor to an instant smile of happiness and joy speaking in the voice of a woman.  If these men speak as such all of the time, it only fosters thoughts of doubt in me concerning their manhood. 

If a man turns this effeminate demeanor on and off, it appears to be fake, and if it is never off, it appears as sinful effeminacy. An effeminate christ has been promoted for centuries, beginning at least with Catholic idols and pictures of Christ with long flowing hair, and wearing a skirt rather than breaches. Even if we reject these idols and images as fundamental baptists, are we projecting a false image of Christ in our mannerisms? Do we err on one side due to fearful offense to others when another side of Christ is revealed? 

Is not wrath in His power as much as grace? If we speak of His wrath lightly, and quietly, who then shall hear us but those who have already heard? Who, being dull of hearing, shall see the fullness of the power of God through those who claim to have His spirit in them? Are we to cast off the spirit of Alias, John the baptist, or even Christ himself when he rebuked the false prophets, calling them vipers, and hypocrites with the the jot of exclamation? Do we speak of hell fire as much as Jesus did, being more than that of heaven? 

Jude 22  And of some have compassion, making a difference: And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh. If some have compassion, and some save with fear, who are those today which are saving with fear? If we all save with compassion only, what saith the Spirit of fear, or what saith you of it? What doth even nature tell you that a woman would most likely do? Would she tend to save with fear, or compassion? What saith even nature concerning the man in this matter? 

As God created man in His image, so therefor should men speak, and to that which God hath given unto the woman, let her also speak of it. 

 

God bless,  

 

 

Edited by Paul Christian
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Being around an effeminate man just makes my skin crawl.  But that's totally different from being "Meek". As Brother Jim says "meekness" is power under control. There were times like when the Lord physically drove the money changers from the Temple but another place where it says He "wept". In both instances He was "meek and lowly in heart". We need more weeping; we need more weeping from the pulpit too. There are times to "cry aloud" but there should always be love and compassion. Too many seem to think that being a man involves asserting authority and control when we should really do everything with the heart of a servant.

Edited by heartstrings
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12 hours ago, Pastor Scott Markle said:

Ok, to me the opening post is a bit confusing. 

Might it be clearly listed -- What specifically are the characteristics (by demeanor and behavior) that are specifically that of the female, by which the male should never be characterized?

I don’t have all the answers on what it means to be effeminate, because the Bible doesn’t go into great detail. It seems like something that we should understand by nature, which is getting harder to discern as we have all probably been influenced by the world to have a slightly skewed view.

I think that God wants us wearing clothes that are clearly different than women. I also think that men should speak differently, according to how we were created. As we know, a women should not be permitted to speak in the church, but rather be under obedience, as also saith the law. 
Speaking from humility and meekly is good for the man as well, but unlike the woman, not always. The men are not the weaker vessel, and thus are responsible for exuding the authoritative leadership role as it pertains to the image of God. 
 

If a man is not feared on some level, neither is he respected, especially by other men. A righteous man who preaches hard against sin causes other men to fear him, because they get a picture of God’s anger through him. It makes it real for them in a sense. 
If all they ever see is love, joy, and peace in a man, they know by nature what is common to man, and that there is something missing. A man should be angry, and not sin, but if he is never angry, then there seems to be something wrong. 
There certainly are men out there who sound and act like a homosexual man, but are not. Certainly that is the clear sinful effeminacy mentioned in the Bible.

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3 hours ago, Paul Christian said:

If a man is not feared on some level, neither is he respected, especially by other men.

Bible reference for this please?

Actually Bible reference for any of it please?

(And note that I am not necessarily saying any part of what you are saying is wrong, but EVERYTHING we do need to be Bible based.)

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6 hours ago, DaveW said:

Bible reference for this please?

Actually Bible reference for any of it please?

(And note that I am not necessarily saying any part of what you are saying is wrong, but EVERYTHING we do need to be Bible based.)

I would say Romans 13. I would say that our fathers, pastors, police, judges, and even military, should be people who are respected with some level of fear, and women should not play a role in any of these. We should fear these people because of the power they have, both physical and spiritual, which is given of God.

Did Paul not rebuke those which he called his children, even unto threatening to bring a rod with him when he came? No matter the nature of the rod, it was a tactic of fear. 
He who spareth the the rod hateth his son. 
1 Peter 3 tells the women to have a meek and “quiet” spirit, but not the men. Isaiah 58:1 is an example of a man preaching against sin, and God sent the prophets to many nations to do so. 
Obviously, there is a balance to be kept, but the balances should be leveled. There is much more negative to preaching the whole council of God than there is positive. 


 

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2 hours ago, Paul Christian said:

I would say Romans 13. I would say that our fathers, pastors, police, judges, and even military, should be people who are respected with some level of fear, and women should not play a role in any of these. We should fear these people because of the power they have, both physical and spiritual, which is given of God.

Did Paul not rebuke those which he called his children, even unto threatening to bring a rod with him when he came? No matter the nature of the rod, it was a tactic of fear. 
He who spareth the the rod hateth his son. 
1 Peter 3 tells the women to have a meek and “quiet” spirit, but not the men. Isaiah 58:1 is an example of a man preaching against sin, and God sent the prophets to many nations to do so. 
Obviously, there is a balance to be kept, but the balances should be leveled. There is much more negative to preaching the whole council of God than there is positive. 


 

That's why we are to study the whole Bible. Because many other scriptures do and, like I said above, the Lord is meek too.  https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=meekness&t=KJV#s=s_primary_0_1

There is a time for "the rod" and a time for "meekness": but a steady diet of just one of the two is very unhealthy.

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9 hours ago, Paul Christian said:

I would say Romans 13.

What verse?

Remember that you suggested that fear AS WELL AS respect are required.....

So which verse supports that?

I can't see anything in Roman's 13 that stands out as saying what you are saying, so help me out a bit here.

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44 minutes ago, DaveW said:

What verse?

I suppose in regards to the Christian, towards other men, fear is on the part of the servant who has not been perfected by love. We see fear from young Christians towards Paul and Timothy when they had to be corrected and also when the servant was instructed by the Apostles to fear their master or men the government in general. However I do not see fear of any man as being a good attribute in scripture. For the perfected Christian, who is not motivated by fear of man but rather only of God. Some verses that come to mind would be...

Romans 13:7 Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.

2 Corinthians 7:15 And his inward affection is more abundant toward you, whilst he remembereth the obedience of you all, how with fear and trembling ye received him.

Ephesians 6:5 Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in singleness of your heart, as unto Christ;

Colossians 3:22 Servants, obey in all things your masters according to the flesh; not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but in singleness of heart, fearing God:

1 Timothy 5:20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.

2 Timothy 1:7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

Hebrews 13:6 So that we may boldly say, The Lord is my helper, and I will not fear what man shall do unto me.

1 Peter 2:17 Honour all men. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honour the king.

1 John 4:17-18 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world. 18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

Edited by John Young
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Who has been made complete, or perfect? I certainly have not, because I have not been resurrected, only Christ has as the first fruits of the resurrection. My spirit cannot sin, yet I have a flesh that cannot be made complete until the resurrection. Because of my flesh, I do that which I ought not, and what I ought, that I do not, therefor it is not I, but sin which dwells in my members. 
Because of this, God has appointed rulers over me who bear not the rod or the sword in vein. 
I do not understand why Christians don’t think that this applies to them, as if being saved makes them sinless in the flesh, and negates God’s law when their flesh sins. 
God did not give us the “spirit” of fear, but He did give us the powers that be to scourge the flesh. Should we say that God does not chasten and scourge every son which He receiveth with the powers that He put in place? Why would we not fear those powers themselves, when they are the flesh that scourges flesh? 
When people say that you have to repent of your sin and live a good life to be saved, they have the same problem as people that think all fear is bad. They both fail to understand that he that is born of God doth not commit sin, for His seed remaineth in him, and he cannot sin. 
That seed is not subject to fear, nor is a spirit of fear, but our members which sin should fear the higher powers. Those powers are supposed to be “men”, who were created in the image of God for such a purpose, not women. The law bounds the woman in obedience to the man, and when the man looks and sounds like an obedient woman he is not right with God. Even nature tells us that it is a shame unto a man to have long hair, and the woman’s hair is given for a covering. Our heads are not supposed to be covered, and our voices are not to be silenced in the congregation. 
Itching ears seek for a soft voice, and when the man of God provides it, it won’t be long before the woman is speaking in the congregation, because there is so little difference.
 

I’m not listing all the scripture because I have been out of town going to a good church, and have to use my phone. 

Edited by Paul Christian
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I would like to say that fear, honor, and respect are all synonyms of one another in the Bible. I don’t view “fear” as meaning “shaking in your boots” here, although you certainly can find that in the Bible. I fear my pastor because he is a righteous man put in authority that I know will rebuke, correct, and exhort me if needs be, and he has tools that could go as far as exposing my sin before the congregation, or even kicking me out of church. His authority is from the Lord, but he is the one who would do it.

Our government is becoming a terror to good works, but by and large, they still bear the sword for me if I were to be tempted to break a righteous law. I do not have a spirit of fear toward them, but if sin were to lay at the door, I would fear them, just as I would my earthly father, or a pastor in authority over me. 
This is a good fear to have available to my flesh. When my members betray my spirit, God has provided for an earthly solution, that has nothing to do with my eternal life.

I am blessed with a wife who fears God, and seeks to be in quit obedience even unto her husband, but in our culture today, hard preaching from the pulpit is ultimately what settled it for her. Hard preaching without apology is what drove it home for her, and she has great respect for those preachers. The soft preaching on it, that was usually accompanied with an almost apologetic dialogue, never drove it home for her until it was preached hard without apology. 
I have no doubt that hard preaching is what many people need, and will prick the hearts of the hearers even unto being fearful of disobeying. 
Soft voices do not penetrate thick skulls. When people hear righteous indignation protruding from the man of God, created in His image, it can move God’s people toward repentance. 

Edited by Paul Christian
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On 11/10/2019 at 1:34 PM, Paul Christian said:

If a man is not feared on some level, neither is he respected, especially by other men

No sorry - YOU are the one who distinctly separated fear and respect, and now you are being evasive when asked to support your proposition with Scripture.

It shouldn't be that hard if it is biblical.

 

Verses to support your claim please.

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10 minutes ago, DaveW said:

No sorry - YOU are the one who distinctly separated fear and respect, and now you are being evasive when asked to support your proposition with Scripture.

It shouldn't be that hard if it is biblical.

 

Verses to support your claim please.

Yeah, you are correct. There is no scripture. It was all just my own understanding.

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