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EvangAlived

The Epistles of Peter & Jude compared.

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The Epistles of Peter & Jude compared.  The following is a restructured (for the forums, as the original is in a Table, and I apologize for having to re-present it this way, looks better in the Table) comparison of the texts of 1 & 2 Peter with Jude.
 
The structure of Daniel and Revelation may be seen here - http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=04135076578086637053
 
But don't forget to consider this in the light of Prophecy, for while structure is great, understanding from God is needful - http://www.pearltrees.com/awhn/the-loud-cry-revelation-14-12/id5277051
 
1 Peter 1:1
Peter, ...”
 
2 Peter 1:1
Simon Peter, ...”
 
Jude 1:1
Jude, ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 1:1
... an apostle of ...”
 
2 Peter 1:1
... a servant and an apostle of ...”
 
Jude 1:1
... the servant of ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 1:1
... Jesus Christ, ...”
 
2 Peter 1:1
... Jesus Christ, ...”
 
Jude 1:1
... Jesus Christ, and brother of James, ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 1:1
... to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,”
 
2 Peter 1:1
... to them ...”
 
Jude 1:1
... to them that are ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 1:2
Elect ...”
 
2 Peter 1:1
... that have obtained like precious faith with us ...”
 
Jude 1:1
... and called:” [*comes from the end of Jude 1:1]
 
 
*******
 
1 Peter 1:2
... according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, ...”
 
2 Peter 1:1
... through the righteousness of God ...”
 
Jude 1:1
... sanctified by God the Father, ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 1:2
... unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ:”
 
2 Peter 1:1
... and our Saviour Jesus Christ:”
 
Jude 1:1
... and preserved in Jesus Christ, ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 1:2
... Grace unto you, ...”
 
2 Peter 1:2
Grace ...”
 
Jude 1:2
... Mercy unto you, ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 1:2
... and peace, ...”
 
2 Peter 1:2
... and peace ...”
 
Jude 1:2
... and peace, and love, ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 1:2
... be multiplied.”
 
2 Peter 1:2
... be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,”
 
Jude 1:2
... be multiplied.”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 2:11
Dearly beloved ...”
 
Jude 1:3
Beloved, ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 5:1
The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, ...”
 
Jude 1:3
... it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 5:1
... and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed:”
 
Jude 1:3
... when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 5:9
Whom resist stedfast in the faith, ...”
 
Jude 1:3
... that ye should earnestly contend for the faith ...”
 
*******
 
1 Peter 5:9
... knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.”
 
Jude 1:3
... which was once delivered unto the saints.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:1
But there were false prophets also among the people, ...”
 
Jude 1:4
For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:1
... even as there shall be false teachers among you, ...”
 
Jude 1:4
... ungodly men, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:1
... who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, ...”
 
Jude 1:4
... turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:1
... even denying the Lord that bought them, ...”
 
Jude 1:4
... and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:1
... and bring upon themselves swift destruction.”
 
2 Peter 2:2
And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.”
 
Jude 1:5
I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not.”
 
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:3
And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:4
For if God spared not the angels ...”
 
Jude 1:6
And the angels ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:4
... that sinned, ...”
 
Jude 1:6
... which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:4
... but cast them down to hell, and delivered ...”, “... to be reserved ...” [*the second portion comes from the end of 2 Peter 2:4]
 
Jude 1:6
... he hath reserved ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:4
... them into chains of darkness, ...” [*darkness, see also 2 Peter 2:17, “... mist of darkness ...” and Jude 1:13, “... blackness of darkness...”]
 
Jude 1:6
... in everlasting chains under darkness ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:4
... unto judgment;”
 
Jude 1:6
... unto the judgment of the great day.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:5
And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:6
And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, ...”
 
Jude 1:7
Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:6
... making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;”
 
Jude 1:7
... are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:7
And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:”
 
2 Peter 2:8
(For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds;)”
 
Jude 1:7
... giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, ...” [*this is the middle portion of Jude 1:7]
 
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:9
The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:” [* see also 2 Peter 2:4; Jude 1:6, “reserved”]
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:10
But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, ...” [*see also 2 Peter 2:20, “pollutions”]
 
Jude 1:8
Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:10
... and despise government. ...”
 
Jude 1:8
... despise dominion, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:10
... Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.”
 
Jude 1:8
... and speak evil of dignities.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:11
Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, ...”
 
Jude 1:9
Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:11
... bring not ...”
 
Jude 1:9
... durst not bring ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:11
... railing accusation ...”
 
Jude 1:9
... a railing accusation, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:11
... against them ...”
 
Jude 1:9
... against him, ...” [*this goes between 'durst not bring', and 'a railing accusation' in Jude 1:9]
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:11
... before the Lord.”
 
Jude 1:9
... but said, The Lord rebuke thee.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:12
But these, ...”
 
Jude 1:10
But these ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:12
... as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed,  ...”
 
Jude 1:10
... as brute beasts, ...” [*this comes after 'know not: but what they know naturally' in Jude 1:10]
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:12
... speak evil ...”
 
Jude 1:10
... speak evil ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:12
... of the things ...”
 
Jude 1:10
... of those things ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:12
... that they ...”
 
Jude 1:10
... which they ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:12
... understand not; ...”
 
Jude 1:10
... know not: but what they know naturally, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:12
... and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;”
 
Jude 1:10
... in those things they corrupt themselves.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:13
And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, ...”  [*see also 2 Peter 2:15, 'wages of unrighteousness']
 
Jude 1:12
These are spots ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:13
... sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;”
 
Jude 1:12
... in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: ...” [*the latter portion is related to 2 Peter 2:17]
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:14
Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:15
Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, ...”
 
Jude 1:11
Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:15
... following the way ...”
 
Jude 1:11
... and ran ... after ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:15
... of Balaam the son of Bosor, who ...”
 
2 Peter 2:16
But was rebuked for his iniquity: the dumb ass speaking with man's voice forbad ... of the prophet.”
 
Jude 1:11
... of Balaam ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:15
... loved ...”
 
Jude 1:11
... greedily ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:16
... the madness ...”
 
Jude 1:11
... the error ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:15
... the wages of unrighteousness; ...” [*see also 2 Peter 2:13, 'reward of unrighteousness']
 
Jude 1:11
... for reward, ...”
 
*******
 
Jude 1:11
... and perished in the gainsaying of Core.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:17
These are wells without water, clouds ...”
 
Jude 1:12
... clouds they are without water, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:17
... that are carried ...”
 
Jude 1:12
... carried ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:17
... with a tempest; ...”
 
Jude 1:12
... about of winds; ...”
 
*******
 
Jude 1:12
... trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;”
 
 
*******
 
Jude 1:13
Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; ...”
 
*******
 
Jude 1:13
... wandering stars, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:17
... to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.”
 
Jude 1:13
... to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.”
 
*******
 
Jude 1:14
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:18
For when they ...”
 
Jude 1:15
To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:18
... speak great swelling words ...”
 
Jude 1:15
... hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.”
 
*******
 
Jude 1:16
These are murmurers, complainers, ... and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:18
... of vanity, ...”
 
Jude 1:16
... having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:18
... they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, ...”
 
Jude 1:16
... walking after their own lusts; ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:18
... those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.” [*see 2 Peter 2:20, 'escaped']
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:19
While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:20
For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.”
 
2 Peter 2:21
For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.”
 
Jude 1:17
But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;”
 
 
*******
 
2 Peter 2:22
But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.”
 
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:3
Knowing this first, ...”
 
Jude 1:18
How that they told you ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:3
... that there shall come in the last days scoffers, ...”
 
Jude 1:18
... there should be mockers in the last time, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:3
... walking after ...”
 
Jude 1:18
... who should walk after ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:3
... their own ...”
 
Jude 1:18
... their own ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:3
... lusts,”
 
Jude 1:18
... ungodly lusts.”
 
*******
 
Jude 1:19
These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.”
 
*******
 
Jude 1:20
But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,”
 
*******
 
Jude 1:21
Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.”
 
*******
 
Jude 1:22
And of some have compassion, making a difference:”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:7
But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.”
 
2 Peter 3:8
But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.”
 
Jude 1:23
And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:11
Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:12
Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:13
Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:14
Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.”
 
Jude 1:23
... hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:17
Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.”
 
Jude 1:24
Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:18
But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.”
 
Jude 1:25
To the only wise God our Saviour, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:18
... To him be glory ...”
 
Jude 1:25
... be glory and majesty, dominion and power, ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:18
... both now ...”
 
Jude 1:25
... both now ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:18
... and for ever. ...”
 
Jude 1:25
... and ever. ...”
 
*******
 
2 Peter 3:18
... Amen.”
 
Jude 1:25
... Amen.”
Edited by EvangAlived

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On 10/23/2018 at 9:49 AM, No Nicolaitans said:

Sir, may I ask what your purpose is in bringing out this correlation? 

It's neat to see the Holy Ghost inspire two persons to write in so remarkedly the same manner.  I have seen and experienced this myself, as the Holy Ghost brings two persons to the same conclusions, and even to the same passages, though in each case there is uniqueness of relationship. http://www.pearltrees.com/awhn/the-loud-cry-revelation-14-12/id5277051

It also ties into structure as well, consider:

The texts of Jude 1:1-25 have a special chiastic structure (am unbreakable (John 10:35) parallelism in and of themselves, as a for instance, compare:

 
Jude 1:5 - I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not.
 
Jude 1:6 - And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.
 
Jude 1:7 - Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
 
Jude 1:8 - Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.
 
[1]
 
Jude 1:5 - “...  out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not.”
 
[like Dathan, Abiram, and Korah [aka Core], Numbers 16:32, 26:10, etc, these all spoke evil of dignities [against Moses, Aaron and others also later spoke against Joshua]
 
Jude 1:8 - “... speak evil of dignities.”
 
[2]
 
Jude 1:6 - “...  the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation ...”
 
[“first estate” refers to the arch-offices that many of the angels left in following Lucifer, who left his own God-given place and sought the place of the Son of God, hence the word: anti-christ, for they came to despise to be ruled by 'Jesus']
 
Jude 1:8 - “... despise dominion ...”
 
[3]
 
Jude 1:7 - “... Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh ...”
 
Jude 1:8 - “... [filthy] dreamers defile the flesh ...”
 
Also a comparison is to be made with the parallel texts of 2 Peter 2:1-22 and its own chiasm.  Only two brief comparisons will be made at this time.  The full comparison between the two Epistles may be seen in the Appendix 1 – The Epistles of Peter & Jude compared.
 
For instance, compare 2 Peter 2:10 with Jude 1:8:
 
2 Peter 2:10 - But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.
 
Jude 1:8 - Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.
 
[1]
 
2 Peter 2:10 - “... chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness ...”
 
Jude 1:8 - “... these filthy dreamers defile the flesh ...”
 
[2]
 
2 Peter 2:10 - “... despise government ...”
 
Jude 1:8 - “... despise dominion ...”
 
[3]
 
2 Peter 2:10 - “... Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.”
 
Jude 1:8 - “... speak evil of dignities.”
 
For instance, compare:
 
2 Peter 2:11 - Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord.
 
Jude 1:9 - Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.
 
[1]
 
2 Peter 2:11 - “... angels ...”
 
Jude 1:9 - “... archangel ...”
 
[2]
 
2 Peter 2:11 - “... bring not railing accusation ...”
 
Jude 1:9 - “... not bring … railing accusation ...”
 
[3]
 
2 Peter 2:11 - “... against them ...”
 
Jude 1:9 - “... against him ...”
 
[4]
 
2 Peter 2:11 - “... the Lord.”
 
Jude 1:9 - “... the Lord ...”
Notice that each verse is a completely separate event,
 
Jude 1:5 - Egypt (Earth),
 
Jude 1:6 - Heaven (Heaven),
 
Jude 1:7 - Sodom and Gomorrah (Earth),
 
etc, but only tied to Judgment, and none of which mention Noah or the Flood and its events.
 
Jude 1:8 actually seals this Chiasm in its singular verse by covering again those events in individual reverse order.
 
Notice of Jude 1:8:
 
"dreamers defile the flesh" Jude 1:8 [C2] - compare to Jude 1:7 [C1] [as those in Sodom/Gomorrah]
 
"despise dominion" Jude 1:8 [B2] - compare to Jude 1:6 [B1] [as the Angels despised God and their God-given place]
 
"speak evil of dignities" Jude 1:8 [A2] - compare to Jude 1:5 [A1] [as they did to Moses]
 
Therefore Jude's Chiasm reveals that the words "defile the flesh" [vs 8 C2] have nothing to do with and are not applied to the Angel passage and those who "kept not their first estate" and having "left their habitation" [vs 6 B1], but rather refers directly to the passage dealing with Men of "Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them" who "gave themselves over to fornication" and "going after strange flesh" [vs 7 C1].
 
ps.  "sir" means 'lord'.  Please do not call me that.  "Brother" works, or if you desire you can simply use EvangAlived, or even "EA".
Edited by EvangAlived

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Please excuse me if this seems presumptuous, but this is my simple way of thinking and responding. There is simply no way I, personally, am going to wade though that much reference just to see a point. I am a simple man and these extremely loooooong posts that you have been making only tend toward making people pass over them. No one wants to read  a whole book, especially when thy have to manually go look up all those verses just to be able the read a post that they may want to reply to.

No offence meant, I just wanted you to know how I see things of this nature.

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12 minutes ago, Jim_Alaska said:

Please excuse me if this seems presumptuous, but this is my simple way of thinking and responding. There is simply no way I, personally, am going to wade though that much reference just to see a point. I am a simple man and these extremely loooooong posts that you have been making only tend toward making people pass over them. No one wants to read  a whole book, especially when thy have to manually go look up all those verses just to be able the read a post that they may want to reply to.

No offence meant, I just wanted you to know how I see things of this nature.

The problem with this is that many people will just pass over the top and in doing so false teaching can be hidden and slyly inserted, so that a later reader may assume that it is acceptable to the board in general.

That is a common tactic for those who flood a board with long posts, hoping to overwhelm the mods and guardians with volume so that it is basically impossible to keep up.

Let's face it - these lengthy posts are NOT designed to promote discussion - how can there be any discussion when in some cases we have three or more lengthy posts posted in quick succession? There is simply not enough time for anyone to question or discuss a particular point before other points are layered on top of the previous.

And then the questions that are posted in some places are ignored in favour of posting yet more lengthy posts.

Can I ask Evangalived, are these original posts for this forum or are you just doing cut and past from another place?

The volume of information you are posting suggests the latter rather than the former, and I have to ask why it is then that you are doing so?

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On 10/24/2018 at 1:50 AM, Jim_Alaska said:

Please excuse me if this seems presumptuous, but this is my simple way of thinking and responding. There is simply no way I, personally, am going to wade though that much reference just to see a point. I am a simple man and these extremely loooooong posts that you have been making only tend toward making people pass over them. No one wants to read  a whole book, especially when thy have to manually go look up all those verses just to be able the read a post that they may want to reply to.

No offence meant, I just wanted you to know how I see things of this nature.

Well brother Jim, I had cited in quotation that which was necessary to see between the Epistles of Peter and Jude.  I admitted in the OP that it looks better in chart format, but that cannot be done in a forums setting, and so re-formatted my personal study for forum posting - http://www.pearltrees.com/awhn/the-loud-cry-revelation-14-12/id5277051

The general idea is that the Epistles of Peter and Jude align nearly word for word (with some exception and specially cited texts).

This is important for studies which draw upon those Epistles, for instance, on the Creation, Flood, Angels, Judgment, etc.

Please allow me to re-cite just one example from the OP for demonstration:

2 Peter 2:17

“... to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.”

Jude 1:13

“... to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.”

Nearly identical in thought and in word.  The difference in being the human through whom the Holy Ghost inspired.

Then, in further reply I showed the structure of Jude, in a miniature sense:

Jude 1:5 - I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not.

Jude 1:6 - And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

Jude 1:7 - Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Jude 1:8 - Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.

Jude 1:5 parallels with Jude 1:8C, Jude 1:6 parallels with Jude 1:8B, Jude 1:7 parallels with Jude 1:8A

Since that is so, this helps in refuting a heretical doctrine 'of angels mating with humans' (which comes from the apocryphal so-called 1st book of Enoch).

Edited by EvangAlived

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On 10/24/2018 at 2:13 AM, DaveW said:

And then the questions that are posted in some places are ignored in favour of posting yet more lengthy posts.

Can I ask Evangalived, are these original posts for this forum or are you just doing cut and past from another place?

The volume of information you are posting suggests the latter rather than the former, and I have to ask why it is then that you are doing so?

Could you show me an example of the first sentence?  I have attempted to answer every question presented to me in all truth.

Sure you can ask.  :)

The posts are original in a sense, since I have to reformat each for this forum from my own personal documents, and in many cases, add new material, delete material not pertinent, re-arrange material, re-colour, etc.  I mean why would I want to have to re-write such?  Kinda like a sermon, I keep my old notes around. - http://www.pearltrees.com/awhn/the-loud-cry-revelation-14-12/id5277051

If you consider the OP for this thread, I wrote:

" The Epistles of Peter & Jude compared.  The following is a restructured (for the forums, as the original is in a Table, and I apologize for having to re-present it this way, looks better in the Table) comparison of the texts of 1 & 2 Peter with Jude"

That clearly stated that the material was coming from a pre-written source.  That source is on my own HD (500 gig SSD), TD (64 gig dual port USB 3.0) and external HD (5TB USB 3.0), as well as from other mirrored drives (5TB) I have given away.

As stated in my 'introduction' OP, I have stated that I share a lot, and in other places, such as the Apologiz-ing to Muslims thread, that I have personally researched and have 1,000's of pages on said religion.  The same goes for that which is in the Bible.

Edited by EvangAlived

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9 minutes ago, EvangAlived said:

The posts are original in a sense, since I have to reformat each for this forum from my own personal documents, and in many cases, add, new material, delete material not pertinent, re-arrange material, re-colour, etc.

Seriously, this is doubletalk - I was very plain with my question and you are giving a convoluted, redefined answer.

The correct answer is that no, they are not original for this forum - the formatting is a side-issue - the material is pre-prepared and then just spammed on here - you have no interest in discussion, you are only looking for a place to present your pre-prepared teaching.

As far as the ignoring bit is concerned - how about the matter of your affiliation (or not) with SDA's.

You acknowledged the question but refused to answer it, and then ignored the responses.

And it is not as though you did not have time to see and answer - you posted several new posts since they were posted.

Therefore you have chosen to ignore them in favour of posting more, non-discussable information.

If you were genuinely interested in discussion, you would not just layer more and more lengthy posts on several different subjects all over the place.

On any forum I have ever been a part of, such actions would be deemed at the very least impolite.

It is hardly strange that I missed your statement about it being pre-written information - it only serves to evidence the point that you are laying out so much information that it is impossible to keep up, and that indicates that you are not interested in discussion, you are only interested in pushing your own barrow......

Edited by DaveW

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On 10/24/2018 at 2:54 AM, DaveW said:

the material is pre-prepared

Some surely is, some surely not.  I stated that at the beginning of the OP.  You have never posted pre-prepared material brother DaveW?  Surely I can easily find out if this is so. - http://www.pearltrees.com/awhn/the-loud-cry-revelation-14-12/id5277051

Edited by EvangAlived

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Are these questions and line of questioning, which seem to stalk me, because I stated I am not IFB, neither Baptist?  Or is it because I have asked a question in another thread regarding the 1000 years (such as the Epistle of Peter mentions), or is there some other area where there is disagreement and this is causing friction?, my style of forums use, colours, other? or is it because I do not have share the same heart toward Seventh-day Adventist that some seem to carry here? (it would be better to simply start a new thread on the subject of SDA, and remain there, but if one expects me to participate therein, I expect to be read in response on why I differ)

This may be of help to you - http://www.pearltrees.com/awhn/the-loud-cry-revelation-14-12/id5277051

I have called you brethren and mean it.

Edited by EvangAlived

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3 minutes ago, EvangAlived said:

Some surely is, some surely not.  I stated that at the beginning of the OP.  You have never posted pre-prepared material brother DaveW?  Surely I can easily find out if this is so.

Now see here you go again, misrepresenting.....

I never said there was anything wrong with posting pre-prepared material.

What I do have a problem with is when you answer in doubletalk to confuse an issue instead of answering plainly.

I have indeed posted a small amount of pre-prepared material.

I have never joined a forum with the intent of overwhelming that forum  with huge amounts of material which cannot be easily perused and examined because of the pure weight of volume.

I have not joined a forum with the apparent motive of taking that forum over.

I have not a joined a forum with the apparent motive of posting so much information that I would able to hide false teaching amongst it.

All of these things seem to be applicable to you simply by the manner of your posting.

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On 10/24/2018 at 4:05 AM, DaveW said:

All of these things seem to be applicable to you simply by the manner of your posting.

Then it seems to be a simple matter of difference of personality.  I am not you brother DaveW, and my methods may not be yours (especially in cases you mention).

On 10/24/2018 at 4:05 AM, DaveW said:

I have not a joined a forum with the apparent motive of posting so much information that I would able to hide false teaching amongst it.

Let's try one thing at a time then.  In this thread, specifically, is there any 'false teaching' 'hid(den)' 'amongst it'.  I will ask you to please point it out to me by scripture.  For if I am in error upon any point in this thread, I expect to be shown from scripture (KJB) in the mouth of two or three witnesses.  Therefore, please consider reading the material, take your time, no rush, and let me know when you have so completed reading the material.  It would be very much appreciated.

http://www.pearltrees.com/awhn/the-loud-cry-revelation-14-12/id5277051

Apologizes for the merged response, this forum seems to do that.  Not sure what to do about that.

Edited by EvangAlived

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3 minutes ago, EvangAlived said:

Then it seems to be a simple matter of difference of personality.  I am not you brother DaveW, and my methods may not be yours (especially in cases you mention).

Let's try one thing at a time then.  In this thread, specifically, is there any 'false teaching' 'hid(den)' 'amongst it'.  I will ask you to please point it out to me by scripture.  For if I am in error upon any point in this thread, I expect to be shown from scripture (KJB) in the mouth of two or three witnesses.  Therefore, please consider reading the material, take your time, no rush, and let me know when you have so completed reading the material.  It would be very much appreciated.

I like how you restrict it to "this thread".

To be honest, I was responding to Jim's post, and I have not looked into the detail of your original post to see if there is false teaching herein - partly because it seems like irrelevant comparison to make, and not of any use.

But I have pointed out in another thread about your false teaching of the AD31 issue relating to the cessation of the sacrifice and oblation.

I did so with Scripture, to which you replied that I am not ready to receive it. In other words, you don't actually care what the Bible actually says.

In fact for you to restrict it to just this thread in fact is 100% against the post I made, as it is precisely the fact of flooding the forum with posts that hides such false teaching. Of necessity some posts would have no false teaching in order to hide the false among the true.

The things I said in that post are general and not specific to this particular thread, and are absolutely my impression and opinion.

 

As far as reading your material - I have seen you make misrepresentations of members here, and I have seen you avoid any sort of discussion about your predisposed views, and I have seen you teach clearly against Scripture and ignore the subsequent challenge - why then should I accept your teaching in way shape or form?

 

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On 10/24/2018 at 4:22 AM, DaveW said:

I like how you restrict it to "this thread".

I did say 'one thing at a time' and since such was mentioned in this thread, then the first place to begin is here.

On 10/24/2018 at 4:22 AM, DaveW said:

I have seen you make misrepresentations of members here

Where brother?  Be specific please.

http://www.pearltrees.com/awhn/the-loud-cry-revelation-14-12/id5277051

Edited by EvangAlived

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No, you wanted to restrict it to this thread so that your plain false teaching elsewhere would not be brought up.

As to misrepresentation - the way tried to make it appear that Alan was not willing to compare Scripture with Scripture you made a partial quote and phrased your response to it in such a way as to make it appear as though Alan was against using Scripture to support Scripture.

And even in this thread you partially quoted me in order to make it appear as though I have something against pre-prepared material.

"the material is pre-prepared " is what you quoted.

This is a misrepresentation - Taking the partial quote is misrepresenting my words so that you can accuse me of posting pre-prepared material, even suggesting that you would do a search to find it and  (implying) to expose some sort of imagined hypocrisy on my part.

50 minutes ago, EvangAlived said:

Some surely is, some surely not.  I stated that at the beginning of the OP.  You have never posted pre-prepared material brother DaveW?  Surely I can easily find out if this is so. 

This is clearly designed to try to discredit me - but as the full post clearly says, it is not the posting of pre-prepared material, but the flooding of the forum using pre-prepared material that was the point.

 

1 hour ago, DaveW said:

The correct answer is that no, they are not original for this forum - the formatting is a side-issue - the material is pre-prepared and then just spammed on here - you have no interest in discussion, you are only looking for a place to present your pre-prepared teaching.

So there you go - two separate instances of you misrepresenting posters on this forum in order to discredit them.

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