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    • By 1Timothy115 in Devotionals
         11
      Psalms 119:1-8                                         Sep. 5 - Oct. 2, 2019
      1 ALEPH. Blessed are the undefiled in the way, who walk in the law of the LORD.
      2 Blessed are they that keep his testimonies, and that seek him with the whole heart.
      3 They also do no iniquity: they walk in his ways.
      4 Thou hast commanded us to keep thy precepts diligently.
      5 O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!
      6 Then shall I not be ashamed, when I have respect unto all thy commandments.
      7 I will praise thee with uprightness of heart, when I shall have learned thy righteous judgments.
      8 I will keep thy statutes: O forsake me not utterly.
      The following verse stood out to me...
      5 O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!
      At first glance it seemed to me this person’s soul is poured out with intense desire to have God’s direction in keeping His Word.
      I made a small wood fire in our backyard for my granddaughter, Julia, since she would be staying overnight with us. My wife and Julia stayed outside at the fire for about half an hour. Then, I found myself alone to watch the fire die out on a particularly lovely evening. So I took my verse from above and began to repeat it for memorization. As I repeated the verse, I tried to contemplate the words and apply them to what I was seeing around me. 
      The moon and stars were out now peering through the scattered clouds above.
      [Genesis 1:16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. Genesis 1:17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, Genesis 1:18 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.]
      Thought 1         
      The moon has stayed his course since the day God created him, also the stars, obeying the statutes directed by God from the first day they were created. Can you imagine God’s direction to the Moon and stars, “moon you will have a path through the sky above the earth, stars you will occupy the firmament above the moon and be clearly visible in the cloudless night sky.”
      Then, the trees, grass, even the air we breathe obey the statues God gave them from the beginning. None of these creations have souls, none have hearts, none have intelligence, but they all observe God’s statutes, His instructions for their limited time on earth.
      Thought 2
      What if we were like the moon, stars, trees, grass, or the other creations which have no soul? We would be directed to keep God’s statutes without choosing to keep them. This is not the image of God, there would be no dominion over other creatures, or over the earth. We would not be capable of experiencing the joy and peace of learning the love of God
      Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
      Philippians 4:7 And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.
      Thought 3 (October 2, 2019)
      Is the psalmist pleading God to force God’s statutes to become the man’s ways? No, he is speaking of his own failure in keeping God’s statutes and his desire to keep them, very much like Paul in Romans 7:14-25.
      God doesn’t work through force to turn men from their ways that they would desire His statutes or desire God Himself. Men must reject (repent) put aside his own ways and voluntarily seek God and His statutes.

Requirements for Pastors

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  • Lady Administrators
13 minutes ago, OLD fashioned preacher said:

I think we just had a breakdown in communication. What I disagreed with was the implication that the only way to recognize that 'communication'  involved more than 'vocalization' was via the Greek.

Using just one of the aforementioned verses:

This is obviously far more involved than merely spoken words .

 

And (Though we both know better than to begin a sentence with a conjunction, just as a preposition is something we wouldn't end a sentence with.) if anyone honestly thinks you are bashing, they have a huge chip precariously perched upon their shoulder while standing outside in a hurricane.

Ok - yes, I did misunderstand.  However, I have heard many a preacher who disdains looking anything up in the Greek (but who uses a modern dictionary) teach that those verses are talking about our speech. Yes, context should show that. But, for many people (how's that for making it more generalized? =D ), the only way they know what it truly means is that they are taught the meaning. Some people are taught the meaning of the word from the Greek, while others stick with the modern dictionary, not realizing that modern english is not comparable in many ways to Old English (and the Greek from whence those words come).

 

hehehe - thanks for that, but I did want to specify so that folks don't think I've got an agenda against anyone.

And I guess I didn't bow out, did I? LOL

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18 hours ago, HappyChristian said:

The word for "Children" in the KJB is both singular and plural. And there is NO mandate to have a certain number of children in order to pastor. That is a creation of man, and has become a tradition. It puts an onerous burden on people and is why Christ warned of taking for truth tradition of men.

To tell someone who is called of God to pastor that he is not qualified because GOD (who, anyone who knows anything about the KJB 

knows is  the giver of children) did not give him children (or only gave him 1', or took his children through death) is a cruel, ungodly trick of the devil.

You are taking away from the scriptures and adding to it ma'am.  It says children and it is plainly written as plural.  In denying the obvious, you're then projecting onto me what you yourself are doing.  I also do not believe you've truly read and absorbed each and every word in those passages.  It does say MUST, it's not optional as some have claimed.  If optional, then the pastor could be a brawler and not even the husband of one wife!  Nonsense!

As to your last, if a pastor doesn't have, cannot have or lost his children in the context of those verses, he was NEVER called by God to begin with.  It's nonsensical to say that a man was called by God but since he has no kids, or one kid, we can ignore or redefine the plural definition of the word children into meaning singular.  Child is the singular form of children and if the Lord meant at least one child the translators would have written it to be so.

Edited by swathdiver
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16 hours ago, OLD fashioned preacher said:

Eph_6:1  Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right.
Col_3:20  Children, obey your parents in all things: for this is well pleasing unto the Lord.

So, if these children (always plural) have a parent die (now making it singular) do the children still have to obey?

 

Not trying to be overtly sarcastic (it comes naturally) but you asked if there was anything else that might bolster or detract from said views.

Okay, I'm bowing out lest it begin to look like "bash Swathdiver day"

Huh?  A child has to obey their mother and father; their parents.  Do they have to obey their father if their mother dies are you asking?  Of course, and their dead mother too.  Just because momma told them to clean their room and their dad didn't, doesn't mean they can leave it a mess now that momma is gone and dad hasn't said so himself.  

It says what it says and we cannot add to it or change it without being accursed.  Can you think of any more, "Yeah, but" scenarios?  LOL

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11 hours ago, swathdiver said:

You are taking away from the scriptures and adding to it ma'am.  It says children and it is plainly written as plural.  In denying the obvious, you're then projecting onto me what you yourself are doing.  I also do not believe you've truly read and absorbed each and every word in those passages.  It does say MUST, it's not optional as some have claimed.  If optional, then the pastor could be a brawler and not even the husband of one wife!  Nonsense!

As to your last, if a pastor doesn't have, cannot have or lost his children in the context of those verses, he was NEVER called by God to begin with.  It's nonsensical to say that a man was called by God but since he has no kids, or one kid, we can ignore or redefine the plural definition of the word children into meaning singular.  Child is the singular form of children and if the Lord meant at least one child the translators would have written it to be so.

I'm taking away nor adding nothing. You are ignoring what the wording means in both the Greek and the Old English. In denying that, you are projecting onto me what you yourself are doing. Ergo, it is YOU that are taking away.

As to my not reading and absorbing what's in that passage, you don't know what you're talking about. "MUST" does not mean he "MUST" have children, but that IF he does he MUST have them under control. To try and equate the command not to be a brawler to the command that if one has children they must be under his control is what is nonsense. 

You keep saying the plural definition of the word children. What I find highly amusing is that you are using the MODERN dictionary definition while you claim that you only use the KJV. Sorry, but that word does not always mean multiple kiddos, no matter how you try and twist it.  

To claim that every pastor who's never been given children by God is not actually called to preach is quite a bit of hubris on your part. You are treading on some really dangerous grounds there. 

Not using the Greek to learn what words mean is not any more spiritual than using the Greek is. But refusing to heed what a word actually means in its origin is a kind of stubbornness that is not holiness.

 

(and, by the way - No, no, no, A CHILD does NOT have to obey his/her parents...the only time there needs to be obedience is if there are MULTIPLE children. Because the verse says, "children." If the translators had meant that those children who have no siblings are to obey their parents, they would have said so [please not: that was sarcasm]. THAT's where this type of thinking leads...) 

 

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It's painfully clear that some here are grammatically challenged and like me cannot diagram a sentence, something 4th grade christian children are taught to do (ABeka).  Thankfully, my A+/100 grade earning daughter Julia was happy to oblige her old man and confirm through the rules of grammar what the Holy Ghost had already taught her dad.

 

I shall say no more on this topic at this time.  Only the Holy Ghost, through a submissive heart, can teach things hard to be understood.

 

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If we're going to take the qualifications of the Bishop to the extreme that I am reading, then we have to ask...

"At what point do a Pastor's children cease being his chillren?"

The truth is, they do not cease being the Pastor's children even if they move out and/or get married.

A child that leaves his father and mother does not cease being the child of his father and mother. So, must a Pastor step down from being a Pastor just because his married son, who lives miles away from the Pastor got drunk, or committed some other sin?  Of course not!

But that seems to be the only logical end to the argument that children MUST be in subjection. 

ps... I like the point about Colossians 3:20 saying ""children" are to obey their parents, so a single "child" doesn't have to obey"  It sheds some perspective one what Paul acutally means when he spoke of "children".

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