Members RSS Robot Posted March 13, 2017 Members Share Posted March 13, 2017 Paul Chappell's Son's Contemporary Church Plant Paul Chappell's youngest son, Matt, has started a contemporary church called Rock Hill Church in Fontana, California. Paul ordained him for this work on April 25 last year and is tweeting praise for the new work. In a blog at the founding of Rock Hill, Paul Chappell tweeted, “Thankful to hear from our son Matt tonight how the Lord is already working as they are planting Rock Hill Baptist Church in Fontana, CA.” When Paul tweets or blogs about Matt for his conservative preacher crowd, he shows the young man wearing a tie, but the real Matt... Read More View the full article ... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Jim_Alaska Posted March 14, 2017 Administrators Share Posted March 14, 2017 I have been concerned about this ministry and especially the college part of it that trains men for the ministry. I have seen the results of graduates of this college. The results I speak of first hand are not those of Contemporary leanings, which are important, but rather the danger I see of graduating men that have very little knowledge of critical, traditional Baptist doctrine. There seems to be an emphasis on feel good sermons and the actual teaching ministry of these men lacks sound doctrinal knowledge. As an illustration of a lack of doctrinal knowledge I could give this example. A graduate of west Coast baptist College becomes the pastor of an Independent Baptist Church. He claims to be teaching the book of Acts "verse by verse", yet he leaves out whole portions of Scripture and important doctrines. He is teaching on this portion of Scripture: Acts 19:1 And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, 2 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. 3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. 4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. 5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Here the pastor focuses almost entirely on the Apostle Paul and where he is, as shown by previous verses. He gives a lengthy dissertation on Paul meeting Apollos and the fact that they were both at Ephesus and the people had not heard that there was any Holy Ghost. This is all to the exclusion of an opportunity to teach a valuable lesson regarding Baptism. There is a lot to be taught out of these few verses and yet this recently graduated pastor seems oblivious to important doctrine. This is the real danger that I see regarding today's bible colleges not properly equipping our future pastors. John Young, Alan and Pastor Scott Markle 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Jim_Alaska Posted March 14, 2017 Administrators Share Posted March 14, 2017 In these last days of the church age many Independent Baptist Churches are failing, falling away and even discarding the name Baptist. Some are even straying so far from the Scriptural truths that our forefathers held so dear that they become heretical. Our Bibles warn us that this time will come and in the modern world we live in today we can see this happening before our eyes. 2Tim. 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; Gone are the days of the great revivals, strong, missionary minded churches, churches that will preach the uncompromising truth of God’s Word. Gone are the small local churches that accomplished great things for God and those they served. Gone are the days that produced great preachers and teachers from among the ranks of the local churches. Our Bibles warned us of this time, but many turned deaf ears to God’s solemn warnings. Rev. 3:15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. This falling away did not happen overnight; had it happened quickly, those who were sound and strong in the faith would have seen the danger and moved to correct it. It happened very slowly over time by simply omitting or failing to teach the whole Word of God as laid out by Jesus and His Apostles. In years gone by a successful church was identified by sound preaching and teaching that encouraged its members to hold fast to the truths passed down by faithful servants of God. The Apostle Paul spoke of it in this manner to Timothy: 2Tim. 1:13 Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus. But in our modern world churches are seen as successful simply because of numbers. i.e. The biggest churches are seen as the most successful. Now I am not saying that all large churches are bad, there are some great large churches. But for the ones that are lukewarm or even falling away from the faith once delivered to the saints, their main thrust is numbers. The great numbers of people that make up this kind of church comes at a price. That price is usually manifest in doctrinal weakness, a social Gospel, feel good messages from the pulpit and a general decline in the spiritual strength of a church. The real danger of doctrinal weakness in larger churches is that smaller churches tend to follow their lead. Many times in church services a doctrinal issue is spoken of, but not elaborated on either within the sermon or at other times when it can be taught as a stand alone lesson. For instance, in the course of a sermon you may hear the pastor mention doctrines like; The trinity, the security of the believer, the deity of Christ, Salvation by grace, predestination, election, or the local church. But if these things are not explained, we have not properly grounded our members. It is not enough to simply believe what we hear; we must prove it by God’s Word. We dare not simply assume that our members know what these things mean. So, is there a remedy and if there is, what is it? The answer is yes there is a remedy; unfortunately the remedy is conditional in many cases. It is conditional simply because of the number of churches that have fallen prey to worldly devices, weak teaching institutions and the sheer number of new preachers that have been educated in an environment that focuses on all the wrong things. i.e. Easy believism, a prosperity Gospel, feel good theology, contemporary Christian music and a drawing away from our historical, spiritual roots. Jude 1:3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints. If we fail to pass on what we have learned, there comes a gradual digression simply because future leaders have not learned these things. So then, the remedy is simple and like so many things “Bible”, it is so simple that it is often overlooked. The remedy is this; back to the basics, which is “the truth once delivered to the saints.” 2Tim. 2:2 And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also. Alan, John Young, No Nicolaitans and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 1611mac Posted March 14, 2017 Members Share Posted March 14, 2017 What scares me is "bandwagons..." Pastors are quick to jump onto and then "stay on" a bandwagon. So many churches hold Bro. Chappell in such high regard that one dare not "question" any part of the ministry. His "Striving Together" material is in churches all over the world. His SS books are all over the world. The influence of Bro. Chappell, West Coast Bible College, and Lancaster Baptist Church are great. There are churches that won't even consider calling a pastor unless he is a "West Coast" man. There are pastors that won't consider special speakers if they are not a "West Coast" man. Bandwagons, bandwagons, bandwagons. Sad....... Jim_Alaska, Pastor Scott Markle and Ukulelemike 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Orval Posted March 14, 2017 Members Share Posted March 14, 2017 (edited) I recanted my words and erased the post. my apologies. Should have thought before posting. Edited March 14, 2017 by Orval had second thoughts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Popular Post Jim_Alaska Posted March 14, 2017 Administrators Popular Post Share Posted March 14, 2017 1 hour ago, 1611mac said: What scares me is "bandwagons..." Pastors are quick to jump onto and then "stay on" a bandwagon. So many churches hold Bro. Chappell in such high regard that one dare not "question" any part of the ministry. His "Striving Together" material is in churches all over the world. His SS books are all over the world. The influence of Bro. Chappell, West Coast Bible College, and Lancaster Baptist Church are great. There are churches that won't even consider calling a pastor unless he is a "West Coast" man. There are pastors that won't consider special speakers if they are not a "West Coast" man. Bandwagons, bandwagons, bandwagons. Sad....... Bro. Greg, you mentioned "material and SS books and it reminded me of another issue I have big problems with. The graduates of WCBC seem to overly rely on these materials in their ministry. Rather than using them as a guide or reference material, many times they are used as they were written. Most pastors would deny this, but if you listen to a man and he cannot even pronounce certain words, it becomes obvious that he did not write them. I am always suspicious of lesson series that have these catchy titles to them. I have even seen the very same titles and sermon names on the WCBC website. It is especially obvious that the series has been pre-prepared when the fancy banners appear in your church with the series title on them. I am sorry if my comments on this subject seem harsh, but I consider this to be a subject of the utmost importance. If a man is not properly prepared for the ministry, then his qualifications for pastor are called into question,as they should be. To be fair I would like to say that I believe, for the most part, that these new graduates may be sincere, Godly men. But they fail to understand that it is God that equips a man for the ministry. A total reliance on bible colleges for their pastoral education, to the exclusion of the teaching ministry of The Holy Spirit is a grave mistake. 1Tim 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach; 3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous; 4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity; 5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?) 6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil. Alan, No Nicolaitans, Ukulelemike and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Ukulelemike Posted March 14, 2017 Moderators Share Posted March 14, 2017 2 hours ago, 1611mac said: What scares me is "bandwagons..." Pastors are quick to jump onto and then "stay on" a bandwagon. So many churches hold Bro. Chappell in such high regard that one dare not "question" any part of the ministry. His "Striving Together" material is in churches all over the world. His SS books are all over the world. The influence of Bro. Chappell, West Coast Bible College, and Lancaster Baptist Church are great. There are churches that won't even consider calling a pastor unless he is a "West Coast" man. There are pastors that won't consider special speakers if they are not a "West Coast" man. Bandwagons, bandwagons, bandwagons. Sad....... When I attended a preachers and workers conference at Lighthouse Baptist in San Diego, one pastor preached on 'Camps', basically the same thing you are calling a 'bandwagon'. He showed the diploma he got from an IFB college, though he didn't say which one, and then let drop what was literally attached to the back, a list maybe 6 feet long of IFB churches that, as a graduate of that college, he was NOT allowed to invite to his church, to preach, their evangelists, their graduates, basically, it effectively blackballed a whole host of churches and people of God because they weren't of the right 'camp'. It was shocking, really. He said that if he ever had anything to do with any of them, and the college found out, they would revoke his diploma. Then he tore it up. Camps, Bad stuff. At our church, we judge by what they teach and believe, not so much on having been to the 'right' schools. The only evangelist I have called cold and asked to come out is a man named Johnny Campbell-he went by Johnny The Baptist Campbell. I found him online, went over his site and all his teachings, what pastors' sermons he put up on the site, then contacted him and talked at length with him, and then decided to have him come preach. He was an interesting fellow, but coming to the end of his evangelism work and I could tell he was tired and getting bitter, so he was going to train new young men for the work instead. I have no idea what, if any, college he went to. 1611mac 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 1611mac Posted March 14, 2017 Members Share Posted March 14, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, Jim_Alaska said: Bro. Greg, you mentioned "material and SS books and it reminded me of another issue I have big problems with. The graduates of WCBC seem to overly rely on these materials in their ministry. Rather than using them as a guide or reference material, many times they are used as they were written. I was saved in 1984 and immediately I attended a local "night" Bible Institute where the teachers were all local (within driving distance) pastors. I thank the Lord so much for that grounding. It was there that I learned how to study the Bible. I have always prepared my own lessons and sermons. I've been fortunate that pastors allowed me to teach my own material. Recent events have allowed me to see the Striving Together SS material first hand and to sit in classes where it is used. My personal opinion is that it is overly simplistic and not very challenging. Your analysis of it's use is spot on target I believe. 4 hours ago, Orval said: I recanted my words and erased the post. my apologies. Should have thought before posting. Orval... Don't be afraid to dis-agree. Discussion and defense of a position results in growth. Edit: Assuming everything is respectful of course, and that includes posts from myself. Edited March 14, 2017 by 1611mac ..., Jim_Alaska and Pastor Scott Markle 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Orval Posted March 14, 2017 Members Share Posted March 14, 2017 1 hour ago, 1611mac said: I was saved in 1984 and immediately I attended a local "night" Bible Institute where the teachers were all local (within driving distance) pastors. I thank the Lord so much for that grounding. It was there that I learned how to study the Bible. I have always prepared my own lessons and sermons. I've been fortunate that pastors allowed me to teach my own material. Recent events have allowed me to see the Striving Together SS material first hand and to sit in classes where it is used. My personal opinion is that it is overly simplistic and not very challenging. Your analysis of it's use is spot on target I believe. Orval... Don't be afraid to dis-agree. Discussion and defense of a position results in growth. Edit: Assuming everything is respectful of course, and that includes posts from myself. Brother, I am not opposed to confrontation I appreciate it and understand it has a valid place in discussion. I felt like my comments lacked investigation and felt it better not to post something if I could not defend it with facts. Appreciate your response. 1611mac, Pastor Scott Markle and Jim_Alaska 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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