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    • By 1Timothy115 in Devotionals
         11
      Psalms 119:1-8                                         Sep. 5 - Oct. 2, 2019
      1 ALEPH. Blessed are the undefiled in the way, who walk in the law of the LORD.
      2 Blessed are they that keep his testimonies, and that seek him with the whole heart.
      3 They also do no iniquity: they walk in his ways.
      4 Thou hast commanded us to keep thy precepts diligently.
      5 O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!
      6 Then shall I not be ashamed, when I have respect unto all thy commandments.
      7 I will praise thee with uprightness of heart, when I shall have learned thy righteous judgments.
      8 I will keep thy statutes: O forsake me not utterly.
      The following verse stood out to me...
      5 O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!
      At first glance it seemed to me this person’s soul is poured out with intense desire to have God’s direction in keeping His Word.
      I made a small wood fire in our backyard for my granddaughter, Julia, since she would be staying overnight with us. My wife and Julia stayed outside at the fire for about half an hour. Then, I found myself alone to watch the fire die out on a particularly lovely evening. So I took my verse from above and began to repeat it for memorization. As I repeated the verse, I tried to contemplate the words and apply them to what I was seeing around me. 
      The moon and stars were out now peering through the scattered clouds above.
      [Genesis 1:16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. Genesis 1:17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, Genesis 1:18 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.]
      Thought 1         
      The moon has stayed his course since the day God created him, also the stars, obeying the statutes directed by God from the first day they were created. Can you imagine God’s direction to the Moon and stars, “moon you will have a path through the sky above the earth, stars you will occupy the firmament above the moon and be clearly visible in the cloudless night sky.”
      Then, the trees, grass, even the air we breathe obey the statues God gave them from the beginning. None of these creations have souls, none have hearts, none have intelligence, but they all observe God’s statutes, His instructions for their limited time on earth.
      Thought 2
      What if we were like the moon, stars, trees, grass, or the other creations which have no soul? We would be directed to keep God’s statutes without choosing to keep them. This is not the image of God, there would be no dominion over other creatures, or over the earth. We would not be capable of experiencing the joy and peace of learning the love of God
      Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
      Philippians 4:7 And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.
      Thought 3 (October 2, 2019)
      Is the psalmist pleading God to force God’s statutes to become the man’s ways? No, he is speaking of his own failure in keeping God’s statutes and his desire to keep them, very much like Paul in Romans 7:14-25.
      God doesn’t work through force to turn men from their ways that they would desire His statutes or desire God Himself. Men must reject (repent) put aside his own ways and voluntarily seek God and His statutes.

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@Jim_Alaska @Salyan Do you think it would be better to close this thread and remove the above long post by whisperingsage?  It seems like there has been quite a bit more personal and specific information has been added and may be turning into a gossip thread.  If anyone else from that church were to read it, they would certainly know about whom this is being written.

Edited by Brother Stafford
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3 minutes ago, Brother Stafford said:

@Jim_Alaska @Salyan Do you think it would be better to move this thread into one of the IFB forums or even close it?  It seems like there has been quite a bit more personal and specific information has been added and may be turning into a gossip thread.  If anyone else from that church were to read it, they would certainly know about whom this is being written.

FWIW, no one else in the church attends this site. Otherwise neither of us would mention much of this. The reason we feel comfortable doing it is because I susect we aren't the only ones going through much of these types of things, and are looking for experienced advice and comments. Not to aire dirty laundry.

 

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11 minutes ago, Ukulelemike said:

FWIW, no one else in the church attends this site. Otherwise neither of us would mention much of this. The reason we feel comfortable doing it is because I susect we aren't the only ones going through much of these types of things, and are looking for experienced advice and comments. Not to aire dirty laundry.

I understand and it has not been too specific until the long post by whisperingsage.  It is my opinion that far too much specific information has been divulged regardless of whether of not they see it.  There is a difference between remaining as vague as possible in order to solicit advice/guidance and divulging the information whispering sage has just included.  If a person releases specific information about another person, without their knowledge and that they would not say in that other person's presence, I would consider that gossip.

It reminds me of a few women I worked with at a Church years ago.  They would say things to me like, "I think we need to pray for Cindy Johnson.  I just found out that she has been cheating on her husband and has gotten pregnant by her lover.  I don't know about you, but I think we should pray for her."

They want to gossip, but know that they shouldn't, so they hide their gossip in the guise of prayerful concern.  I am not claiming that this is what is being done here, but it just reminds me of it.  We don't need to publicly get into nitty-gritty specifics in order to know enough to give counsel.  If a solution really requires the nitty-gritty specifics in order to come to a resolution, I believe it should be taken out of a public forum and into private counsel.

It is my opinion that it is a bad practice and is also bad taste to do so.

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On ‎3‎/‎7‎/‎2017 at 10:08 PM, HappyChristian said:

I have had to learn to deal with myself and my natural tendency to be blunt (very often too blunt and with no tact at all)

 

gasp, Say it isn't so!!!    :4_2_109v:  (the big grin emoticon seem to have gone missing)

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Sorry, I just need to beg for some help because Mike's Sending Pastor died and his other older Pastor soon after, the son left the area, and there are no IFB Pastors around here that we could counsel with. I know it sounds like dirty laundry and complaints, who wants to listen to those? But we are at our wits end. Normally we could resolve long term troubled and roubling people with prayer, but these folks are constantly demanding , constantly texting, wanting rides back and forth from the pot growers house on church day, just yesterday to get to church. They live a block from the church meeting house. But somehow managed to get to the pot growers house OK. I have asked DH to put boundaries on their texting times, say, not before 6 am and not after 9 pm. And please not the Saturday before church when he has to do his lesson. But they just don't care. They just violate their agreements all the time.  I used to be able to drive them when DH was at his secular job, but we couldn't afford the fees and couldn't get my Jeep legal, so I have been grounded since November. Now Dear husband has to waste his days off taking people shopping, or they conveniently demand he take them to their dr appointments. For awhile, they would make these appointments during the week and ask him to take a day off from his secular job to take them. recently they have been making their appointments on his day off, Friday. But still, they like to say they don't do this anymore, but then they do. As a matter of courtesy, we take our charges out to breakfast at least, because we need to eat too, and it would indeed be rude to not feed them. But there is no kicking in for gas or helping out with a tip or anything.

I just see this as abusing Mike's good nature- I did this for YEARS before him ( with many people) and finally, all my patience coupons were used up. The book was empty. And I began to say "No" to people like this. But he still has patience coupons in his booklet. And he just thinks it's mean to say no. He thinks it's unbiblical to set boundaries.

22 minutes ago, Brother Stafford said:

I understand and it has not been too specific until the long post by whisperingsage.  It is my opinion that far too much specific information has been divulged regardless of whether of not they see it.  There is a difference between remaining as vague as possible in order to solicit advice/guidance and divulging the information whispering sage has just included.  If a person releases specific information about another person, without their knowledge and that they would not say in that other person's presence, I would consider that gossip.

It reminds me of a few women I worked with at a Church years ago.  They would say things to me like, "I think we need to pray for Cindy Johnson.  I just found out that she has been cheating on her husband and has gotten pregnant by her lover.  I don't know about you, but I think we should pray for her."

They want to gossip, but know that they shouldn't, so they hide their gossip in the guise of prayerful concern.  I am not claiming that this is what is being done here, but it just reminds me of it.  We don't need to publicly get into nitty-gritty specifics in order to know enough to give counsel.  If a solution really requires the nitty-gritty specifics in order to come to a resolution, I believe it should be taken out of a public forum and into private counsel.

It is my opinion that it is a bad practice and is also bad taste to do so.

3

 

 

No names are being used. In the medical field, case studies are referred to all the time, and not using a name is standard and considered a legal and ethical way to teach about how to approach illness or as a Continuing Ed class, or in medical books.

Edited by whisperingsage
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1 hour ago, Brother Stafford said:

@Jim_Alaska @Salyan Do you think it would be better to close this thread and remove the above long post by whisperingsage?  It seems like there has been quite a bit more personal and specific information has been added and may be turning into a gossip thread.  If anyone else from that church were to read it, they would certainly know about whom this is being written.

This thread is in a private forum within a private forum... the odds of anyone from their church finding it is pretty unlikely (and we'd know they were coming!). The purpose of this section is for encouragement and advice... let's give it without nitpicking how it's being asked for or shaming someone for venting a little. If it bothers anyone, they are free to not view this thread.

Let's move on from this now.

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I'm asking for help. I'm dying here. I thought I had my adrenal and thyroid back on track and because of this stress I had to go back on my Adrenal and thyroid pills. I can't function due to the health issues this stress is causing. It's not a simple matter of me being mean to people. I am a nurse. I was a CNA for 10 years, 8.5 years in one nursing home. Dealing with sick people , stroke and dementia patients is really hard, but it helped me develop character. I know how to deal with difficult people, and I know how to love them. Some people, who are more able, don't want help, and there is nothing you can do with them. They make their choices. But in 2003 I became a Pastor's wife and found out I had no voice. I was 41 years old. I am 54 now. If I don't get some decent advice here, I can get sick again, because it will be internalized. That is a real thing.

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2 hours ago, whisperingsage said:

Sorry, I just need to beg for some help because Mike's Sending Pastor died and his other older Pastor soon after, the son left the area, and there are no IFB Pastors around here that we could counsel with. I know it sounds like dirty laundry and complaints, who wants to listen to those? But we are at our wits end. Normally we could resolve long term troubled and roubling people with prayer, but these folks are constantly demanding , constantly texting, wanting rides back and forth from the pot growers house on church day, just yesterday to get to church. They live a block from the church meeting house. But somehow managed to get to the pot growers house OK. I have asked DH to put boundaries on their texting times, say, not before 6 am and not after 9 pm. And please not the Saturday before church when he has to do his lesson. But they just don't care. They just violate their agreements all the time.  I used to be able to drive them when DH was at his secular job, but we couldn't afford the fees and couldn't get my Jeep legal, so I have been grounded since November. Now Dear husband has to waste his days off taking people shopping, or they conveniently demand he take them to their dr appointments. For awhile, they would make these appointments during the week and ask him to take a day off from his secular job to take them. recently they have been making their appointments on his day off, Friday. But still, they like to say they don't do this anymore, but then they do. As a matter of courtesy, we take our charges out to breakfast at least, because we need to eat too, and it would indeed be rude to not feed them. But there is no kicking in for gas or helping out with a tip or anything.

I just see this as abusing Mike's good nature- I did this for YEARS before him ( with many people) and finally, all my patience coupons were used up. The book was empty. And I began to say "No" to people like this. But he still has patience coupons in his booklet. And he just thinks it's mean to say no. He thinks it's unbiblical to set boundaries.

 

 

No names are being used. In the medical field, case studies are referred to all the time, and not using a name is standard and considered a legal and ethical way to teach about how to approach illness or as a Continuing Ed class, or in medical books.

Why do you keep referring to me as "DH"? Just Mike is fine, everyone knows you're my DW, lol. You make me sound like Kim Jong Mike, "Dear Husband". I'll make you call me that at home now.

 

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2 minutes ago, Ukulelemike said:

Why do you keep referring to me as "DH"? Just Mike is fine, everyone knows you're my DW, lol. You make me sound like Kim Jong Mike, "Dear Husband". I'll make you call me that at home now.

I had to look up what "DH" and "DW" meant.  So, whisperingsage is your wife, Brother Michael?

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3 minutes ago, Brother Stafford said:

I had to look up what "DH" and "DW" meant.  So, whisperingsage is your wife, Brother Michael?

That is correct. She filled in some details I had not. She's fed up. This is why we're looking for some resource that she can use to find answers-we disagree in some asp[ects-not in all, maybe the delivery. We have agreed to back off on trying to, I guess, seem like we're trying to run their lives, and I have turned the care of his wife completely to her husband-I told him that she was not our responsibility, outside of training in the church setting through the preaching of the word, and that it is HIS duty to learn well enough to be her spiritual head. So we are making headway. But while he is still ill, (he is awaiting a surgery for a hiatal (sp?) hernia, and is down a lot, he isn't much able to give her much direction, and she's rather like a child in some respects, as she was kept medicated much of her youth so her mother could get disability for her-so she is a stunted in her maturity, and she runs around like a kid without guidance. That's part of what my wife was talking about with the 'pot house', a family who grows pot in the backyard, (another issue we have here: the legalization of marijuana and the questions that arise from that issue). So our deisre is that she can find some preacher's wives who have been in the trenches longer, who have had to deal with and put up with troublesome believers, people you don't want to remove, who aren't in blatant sin, but are just, hard cases, that you want to help, but are growing weary over. I have the patience, she has a harder time with that. But then, I'm called to be the pastor, she's called to be my wife and help, and I'm enough trouble as it is.

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"And whosoever shall give to drink unto one of these little ones a cup of cold water only in the name of a disciple, verily I say unto you, he shall in no wise lose his reward." Matthew 10:42

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On 3/20/2017 at 1:54 PM, Ukulelemike said:

That is correct. She filled in some details I had not. She's fed up. This is why we're looking for some resource that she can use to find answers-we disagree in some asp[ects-not in all, maybe the delivery. We have agreed to back off on trying to, I guess, seem like we're trying to run their lives, and I have turned the care of his wife completely to her husband-I told him that she was not our responsibility, outside of training in the church setting through the preaching of the word, and that it is HIS duty to learn well enough to be her spiritual head. So we are making headway. But while he is still ill, (he is awaiting a surgery for a hiatal (sp?) hernia, and is down a lot, he isn't much able to give her much direction, and she's rather like a child in some respects, as she was kept medicated much of her youth so her mother could get disability for her-so she is a stunted in her maturity, and she runs around like a kid without guidance. That's part of what my wife was talking about with the 'pot house', a family who grows pot in the backyard, (another issue we have here: the legalization of marijuana and the questions that arise from that issue). So our deisre is that she can find some preacher's wives who have been in the trenches longer, who have had to deal with and put up with troublesome believers, people you don't want to remove, who aren't in blatant sin, but are just, hard cases, that you want to help, but are growing weary over. I have the patience, she has a harder time with that. But then, I'm called to be the pastor, she's called to be my wife and help, and I'm enough trouble as it is.

PArtof the problem is that this isn't just a "women's issue" because the husband is as immature as the wife, he won't read his bible either. (she actually has a better brain and memory- she gets most of the question candy because of this, she just can't/won't apply it to herself). Without reading and study he cannot hope to guide his own home. He is great for  asking questions all during,  and even disrupting service, but the nature of most of his questions shows he has very little understanding of a lot of things. He, for example, thought "humble" meant "prideful".  How do we even attempt to correct something so basic?  If he doesn't understand basic English (and he's a white boy born in the USA) how can he ever hope to understand the KJV? I was homeschooled and taught to read at 3 but there was always a drive to read things beyond my comprehension, and if I understood some of it I was pleased. Most people don't/won't/can't do that today. But he doesn't even really try. He may never be capable. Is it fair to put him in charge when he can't even judge rightly for himself? His best "friends" are foul mouthed older men that appear to use him for labor "paying" him an old piece of junk they were going to throw away. That's the nature of his "work" for them.  That can be a treasure as I have done it myself, but again, he's spina bifida and of a weak constitution. He just can't put in the labor that the average bear can do. It can and has hurt him. When I was his age I was stronger than him. I was stronger than him 5 years ago. But the point is he hangs with bad people, with filthy mouths and doesn't grasp that there is something amiss with that person. We can't be around these people 5 minutes without hearing a slough of curse words spewing forth. And yet the couple tell us no, this man doesn't swear...

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15 hours ago, HappyChristian said:

whisperingsage: I totally get where you're coming from regarding internalizing issues. I'm so sorry for the stress this has put on you. I wish I had a solid "this is what you do" answer, but I don't. However, I do have some thoughts. I'd like to share them, but I don't want them to come across as harsh or finger-pointing in any way...and what I'm saying, I'm saying as a wife. Not as a pastor's wife, but as a wife, since that is what we married women are first (after being Christians, I know).  I see from comments that you both are working on this situation, and that is good and necessary.

This is very likely something you've already considered, Mike, but your wife needs pressure removed from her. I think you've made a good first step towards that by placing the reins into the young woman's husband's hands. But there are a few things that concerned me.

First, the texting/phoning. That has to stop, somehow.  It was mentioned that they don't respect boundaries of when to contact you. Those boundaries have to be reinforced, and held firmly by both of you. If this couple texts or calls outside the boundaries you've set up, I would strongly advise that you ignore them. I know that, as a pastor, your ministry is vital. But your marriage is much more so, and your wife's physical/emotional health as well. 

As a wife, I can tell you that it would distress me if people that I knew were simply using my husband were calling and interrupting his much needed sleep or his sermon prep time. And, yes, I internalize things as well, so I know what happens - even if I work hard at NOT reacting or worrying. Shutting down the response to them will cut down on that stress some. I know that it seems rude or possibly neglecting part of your flock to do that, but your wife NEEDS you to do that. Take it from a wife...

None of what I say is meant to criticize in any way, please know that. I admire both your desires to serve the folks of your church - even when it's people who just can't function well. But here's something else that kind of stuck out to me: the dryer. Yes, I know that wsage has it down as to using it. But your wife needs you to fix her dryer. And this might sound like a heretic speaking, but she needs it before you spend more money on something at church. I don't know that she would ever say that to you - and she might not even realize it herself. But I guarantee that's just more stress on her that she's internalizing. Even if she laughs about it or says it's okay. And I don't mean to imply that she's being dishonest. She's being selfless. And that's admirable. But it can also stress a body...

And if there's any way you can get the folks at church to begin giving - the $$ load needs to be removed from you. Because, believe me, that load is carried by your wife as well, even if she's completely in agreement with where your $$ goes. I'm sure you've taught on giving, and I'm not, again, criticizing. Just mentioning some things that stuck out to me.

whisperingsage, it might be a good idea for you not to interact with this young lady right now. Whether on social media, at church, on the phone, etc. I think maybe she knows that she's able to push your buttons and is perversely enjoying it. Sadly, there are people who enjoy making other people crazy. Saying hello to her at church should, IMO, be the limit of your contact with her for now.  I have asked a much wiser head than mine to contact you privately. I'll be praying for you, sage. 

These are just some thoughts that scattered through my brain as I read this. Again, I hope no-one is offended, as nothing was meant to be offensive.

 

Thank you, this is what we need.

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11 hours ago, Rebecca said:

Whisperingsage, since you mentioned you are on facebook, may I recommend the closed group "Independent Baptist Women of Ministry". Perhaps you may find encouragement and advice there as well.

 

Will do.

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