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Well, Paul and the Apostles were defintiely called by God into their ministries. We see in scripture people all the time being called by God to certain things. I think our way pof looking at them all, like the OT prophets and such, were always like, God knocks and the door and stands there in person speaking audibly. While that DID sort of happen at times, like the OT prophets and others, other times I suspect it wasn't so clear.

When Paul and Barnabas were sent by God into the minisitry from the church at Antioch, I would surmise from the context that it was much as some are called today, by the Spirit speaking to those who need to know. When I believe I was called to preach, it isn't in a way that I can clearly put into words, I just knew the need was there and I could not run from it, not for the next ten years until I stepped into my first pastorate. Everywhere I went that call followed me, every church I went to pastors felt inclined to ask me to preach or teach, more and more.

So yes I do believe men are called into certain ministries. However, in others I believe ALL are called without having to have a 'calling', like into soulwinning, giving, praying, and seeking a ministry of some sort within a local church-and out of those they may eventually be formally called into something else.

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IMSO, all callings, visions, dreams, gifts of the Spirit, etc.. ended at the completion of God's Word. All childishness done away with now that the Spirit was poured out and the written Word complete.

The Epistles seem quite clear that no man is "called" extra Biblically into anything. No prophets or Apostles needed qualifications as bishops and deacons do. And if a man desires the office of bishop, he desires a good work. Key word is his own desire and not God's direct calling.

Only God chose Prophets and Apostles but according to the NT, men now choose pastors and deacons. 

If God still called men as He previously did, those passages would not be included in the Epistles. As a matter of fact Paul and Barnabas were the last two men "called" directly of God to do anything.

Any and all callings are written out for us now in the Word. All are called to be disciples and in order to be a disciple you must lose your life, care and ambitions of this world. Leave all and follow Him.

Not 10% and 3 times a week but ALL OF IT.

Since 1985, 17 states, 4 countries and 22 different IFB churches I have only met 2 men (one was a pastor, the other a deacon) who actually were following Christ. They had no interest in the world, or sports or golf or fishing, etc. (and yes, they previously did before they really got into the Word). All their free time was devoted to worship and witness from that point on.

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4 hours ago, Brother Stafford said:

If you are referring to examples in which God calls people in the way in which I was describing is claimed by others, could you point me to some of those scriptures?  That would help me a great deal.

This is precisely what I am asking about.  I hear this subject explained with examples just like the one you gave.  It sounds like you were just being obedient in seeing the need and filling it.  However, the way in which you describe it makes it sound like a subjective experience.  

For example, If I am working at a restaurant and someone drops a glass and it breaks, none of us employees need to wait to be asked to clean up the mess.  We all know what needs to be done and whomever is closest or fastest or doesn't have their hands full at the moment, does what is necessary and completes the needed task.  The owner doesn't need to come out to choose someone to clean up the mess when he has already covered that subject in the employee manual.

This is an example of human beings requesting that you preach.

This illustrates what I said above:

For instance, as long as a man meets the criteria of 1 Timothy 3, does he need to be "called" to preach?  If there is a community that has no biblically sound church and a man meets the criteria, even though he does not wish to be a preacher, oughtn't he take up the reigns in obedience in the same way that a soul-winner would?  I have known women that honestly feel "called" to preach and may even be very skilled in it, but 1 Timothy 2:12 forbids it.

I am interested in objective Scripture that commands, allows or forbids what we are to do.

All fine and good, however, I didn't see a need and stepped up to fill it, I was at a meeting where the issue had not come up, but for the entire week it was on my mind, not letting me alone. No one had asked, no preacher had preached about it, but I could not get it off my mind and had never given it much thought before myself. BUt it was so heavy on me that I sought out a pastor for counseling on it during that week. I didn't want to be a preacher or a pastor-I am a singer a musician, and that was what I desired to use for the Lord, but I can tell you, at the last meeting of the week I went forward and gave myself into service. You know how people tell of when the Spirit got hold of them for salvation and they just could not but step up and fall down and seek salvation? That is what I went through. And over the next ten years, though I tried to 'reneg' on that, my life fell completely out of control, and everything I went through, y choice or not, (and there was a lot I went through that was not my choice) all led me to where I am now-the people I met, the places I lived. I had never as much as been asked to teach a class, now pastors were asking me to preach, to go into various leadership positions. The only time music fell into it was as the hymn leader in one small church, EVEN THOUGH music was what I planned to do for my ministry.

So please don't seek to tell me this was all just somehow MY idea, MY plan, because I can tell you with assuredness, if I had my druthers, I would not be a pastor. And if I didn't KNOW I was called to it, I certainly would not be continuing in it, because it breaks my heart on a regular basis. NO man in his right mind would, I suspect, do this, for no pay, for no earthly benefit, unless they were called to it, unless they are simply lovers of pain. You know how much easier my life would be if I wasn't a pastor? I could put more effort into advancement at my job and make more money and give my wife a more comfortable life, but my time goes toward the work, not the job, but I can't imagine NOT preaching.

But apparently in your opinion God nevber speaks to His people in any way anymore, I guess. The Spirit doesn't lead? Does speak to us about the Lord? No longer leads us into all truth? Wouldn't that include the truth of a call from the Lord into some work? God doesn't 'call' to us to be saved? I know we are not to be seeking outside revelation of things not in scripture, but, well, when we pray for guidance in certain situations, do we just NOT expect anything because that would be extra-biblical revelations? john 16:13 says "Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come." So if the Spirit speaks the things He is told to us, would that not include a call to ministry? Apparently God speaks to us through the Spirit. What does He say?  Not feeling; conviction.  

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I do apologize, I did get snippy and that was unbecoming and wrong. I apologize. Ever just have something press your button, a button you never even knew you had?

I guess it's just difficult to explain, to find words for. I don't see it as an 'experience' or a 'feeling', and certainly not one or the other was I seeking. Eph 4:11&12 says " And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ " These are gifts given  for the use of the churches. SO my question would be, does God wait for us to decide, on our own, to seek a position, as a pastor, evangelist, etc, and then, following essentially our lead, He then gives us the gift necessary to fulfill what we chose to do, or does He seek those He knows will have a willing heart, and convicts us to the work, essentially calls us, and give us those gifts necessary according to His will? Does He follow us in the gifts, or do we follow Him? 

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For what it's worth, although I hate to think about Benny Hinn and Todd Bently and the froth and poison they stir up, I don't see anywhere in scripture or in my experience that "that which is perfect has come", for that is when those spiritual gifts "shall be done away", the phrase in 1Cor 13:10 "that which is perfect has come" is key and is also used in a similar context in Eph 4:13 in the phrase "unto A PERFECT man" so as I see it the gifts will pass away when the WHOLE church is COMPLETELY mature in a way which it never has been, and then I guess we will also see Him face to face. Wretched although you seem to have a well sown up case "Only God chose Prophets and Apostles but according to the NT, men now choose pastors and deacons. If God still called men as He previously did, those passages would not be included in the Epistles ", The electing of deacons and elders and bishops does not exclude God calling men to ministry. I think it is easy to prove a point or a whole theological system and claim it to be 'bible doctrine', but when we know fully we shall be fully known, and it will be all over as it were, and heaven will have begun, I believe we are being led into all truth, we don't have all truth, we have scripture which is all true, but until we can reconcile all scripture honestly without leaving some parts out or twisting some, then we aren't perfect.

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Verses pertaining to people being called of God for specific purposes.

 Ac 13:2 As they ministered to the Lord, and fasted, the Holy Ghost said, Separate me Barnabas and Saul for the work whereunto I have called them. 

Ga 1:15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, 
 16 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:

 1Co 7:24 Brethren, let every man, wherein he is called, therein abide with God.

 1Co 1:1 Paul, called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother,

 Ro 1:1  Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,

 2Ti 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

 1Pe 1:15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;

God does not call audibly, as in the Old Testament, he calls people by impressing on their mind and heart what he wants them to do. He so burdens their heart with his purpose for them that they come to understand his will for them. Many times he uses scripture, lessons, sermons, and hymns. I speak mainly regarding a man's call to preach, but I also believe, as some of the scriptures I provided show, that God also calls his own to specific tasks or even vocations and manners of life.

 

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3 hours ago, Jim_Alaska said:

Verses pertaining to people being called of God for specific purposes.

 Ac 13:2 As they ministered to the Lord, and fasted, the Holy Ghost said, Separate me Barnabas and Saul for the work whereunto I have called them. 

Ga 1:15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, 
 16 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:

 1Co 7:24 Brethren, let every man, wherein he is called, therein abide with God.

 1Co 1:1 Paul, called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother,

 Ro 1:1  Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,

 2Ti 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

 1Pe 1:15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;

God does not call audibly, as in the Old Testament, he calls people by impressing on their mind and heart what he wants them to do. He so burdens their heart with his purpose for them that they come to understand his will for them. Many times he uses scripture, lessons, sermons, and hymns. I speak mainly regarding a man's call to preach, but I also believe, as some of the scriptures I provided show, that God also calls his own to specific tasks or even vocations and manners of life.

 

Jim, There is nothing specific about pastors in these passages however. There is no direct calling from God (however manifested) to be a Bishop in God's Word, it is a personal, not-God given but free-will, desire. And that is the leaning of the OP IMO. These passages address salvation and are commands primarily and have little to do with the OP and they have little if anything to do with what you mention. I have heard these ideas hundreds of times but they are not in the NT. The first passage has been acknowledged already as the last true calling from God. In addition all that mention Paul are included in that acknowledgment.

Having the talent, desire and ambition to be a pastor is not the same as a direct call from God. The call God wrote for all true Christians is to be a disciple before anything. Jesus spoke much of it in the Gospels. The first church in Acts knew all about it

Hard to find a pastor these days that even knows what that means.

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Think what you will wretched, you are certainly entitled to your opinion. When and if God ever calls you to preach or pastor, you will see the validity of what I wrote at the bottom of my reply.

I stand by my post as one that has experienced the call of God first hand. If you have never experienced it, there is no way you could understand second hand what it is like to be on the receiving end of this call.

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7 hours ago, Brother Stafford said:

Where are the verses that tell us that we will know His calling when we feel it?

 

7 hours ago, Brother Stafford said:

Where are the verses that tell us that we will know His calling when we feel it?

Brother Stafford, we cannot manufacture scripture to suit our preconceived questions. If there is no scriptural support to answer a specific question, we can't make scripture say what we want.

I did not say, nor do I believe that they are subjective experiences. The call to preach or do this or that is something that is intensely personal between God and that one specific person. There are things that are only understood or experienced by faith. This is one of them because there is going to be no audible voice from heaven calling us to a specific task.

I gave scripture showing that God calls men, like Paul, who was called be an Apostle.

In my case preaching was NOT what I desired  at all. At that time of my life it was probably the farthest thought from my mind as far as desire goes. I cannot actually explain this part of the process, even now forty three years later. I can tell you that when God began to speak to my heart about preaching, there was no doubt in my mind what was being asked or who was doing the asking. I had no desire to preach, was terrified of speaking in public, knew nothing about the process of becoming a preacher and.......I ran from it!

When I say I ran, I mean it literally. I sold my house and moved way out in the wilds of Alaska, away from my church where I had been saved. Why you might ask? Simply because I knew in my heart what was wanted of me and rebelled, it was not what I wanted at all. At the time I did not think of it as rebellion, I was just scared to death and couldn't seem to find a way to get around the heavy burden that God had placed on my heart.

So, at least in my case the part you addressed to Bro. Mike about following a desire on our part did not exist for me. No one had even talked to me about preaching, or asked me to even fill in for them, I was a baby Chirstian, only saved for about a year. There were other things that only I know about and do not wish to go into here that I thought were valid reasons to not answer God's call in an affirmative manner.

My acceptance or "surrender" to God's call as some call it, came about simply because no matter how far I ran I could not escape God without totally denying and rejecting him. When I counselled with my pastor about what I believed God was calling me to do, one piece of advice he gave me proved invaluable. That advice was simply this; if you believe that God is calling you to preach and you can do anything else, then it may be wise to do something else. It may not have been those exact words, but words to that effect.

Bro. Mike said that the answer you were seeking would be difficult for him, it is difficult for me also, and perhaps for anyone else, simply because as I said before, this is intensely personal between a  man and his God. I can tell you this; when God imparts his desire for your life to you, you will know it beyond a shadow of a doubt.

I hope this helps a bit, may God richly bless you as you seek to serve him.

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As i said to you before Wretched, you are free to believe what you like. I respect your convictions even if I do not agree with them.

As I told Bro. Stafford, my call is something intensely personal between my God and I and no man will ever convince me that what I experienced was not real and that my God no longer directly influences the lives of his people.

I truly feel sorry for you if what you described as your being a deacon in large churches. If that is what goes on in these large churches I want no part of it. What you described is the reason that you cannot understand the direct call of God to the ministry, simply because you have never experienced it as I said in the beginning.

I will no longer brace this subject with you because it is unprofitable and you could never understand it unless it actually happened to you.

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