God's Soul???

[Pastor Scott Markle]

Some thoughts to ponder:

1.  Does the Lord our God, God the Father, have a soul (even before God the Son was born in human flesh)?

2.  If He does have a soul, what does it mean for Him to have a soul?  What is the function of His soul?

[No Nicolaitans]

Pastor Markle, this is an interesting topic and one I wish I could contribute to; however, as I've thought about it, I find myself in a familiar predicament...

I remember as a child, I would wonder where God came from. When I would wonder that, my mind would just go blank. Other times, I would wonder what (if anything) would exist if there was no God. When I would wonder that, my mind would just be filled with a blurry whiteness (if that makes sense).

I've tried to think of biblical passages that might allude to your thoughts, but I can't think of any off the top of my head...and the more I think about it, the more my mind goes blank like when I was a child. So, although I don't know that I can contribute, I do look forward to seeing what others may say.

[Steve Schwenke]

Inasmuch as we are made in the image of God, and in His likeness, and inasmuch as the three components of our being are, spirit, soul, and body, I would say the answer to the question is yes......I think.

I have taught for many years the following:

God the Father = the Soul of God

God the Son = the body of God

God the Spirit = the spirit of God

 

The last two are without question.  Jesus Christ is referred to several times in the NT as "the image of God," "God manifest in teh flesh."  

God the Father functions as our soul would function.  

Perhaps it is more correlation, I don't know.  There is so many things about God that our finite brains cannot comprehend!

 

[John Young]

13 hours ago, Pastor Scott Markle said:

Some thoughts to ponder:

1.  Does the Lord our God, God the Father, have a soul (even before God the Son was born in human flesh)?

2.  If He does have a soul, what does it mean for Him to have a soul?  What is the function of His soul?

I think its pretty clear that God has a soul and it seems to function in a similar manner as ours. I also believe that before the birth of Jesus it was the Word of God (God the Son) which did all the bodily and verbal appearing in the OT because scriptures tell us no man has seen the Father at any time but that the son hath declared Him (John 1:18; John 5:37). I'm inclined to think with Brother Schwenke that the Father is the Soul of God and functions as such considering how God the Son speaks about the Father. I also believe Jesus has a human soul distinct from God the Father which was made at His conception.....The way God speaks about the coming Christ seems to bare that out (ie. Isaiah 53).

Passages about God's soul:

Leviticus 26:11 And I will set my tabernacle among you: and my soul shall not abhor you.

Leviticus 26:30 And I will destroy your high places, and cut down your images, and cast your carcases upon the carcases of your idols, and my soul shall abhor you

Judges 10:16 And they put away the strange gods from among them, and served the Lord: and his soul was grieved for the misery of Israel.

Job 23:13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.

Psalm 11:5 The Lord trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.

Isaiah 1:14 Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.

Isaiah 42:1 Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.

Jeremiah 5:9 Shall I not visit for these things? saith the Lord: and shall not my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?

Jeremiah 5:29 Shall I not visit for these things? saith the Lord: shall not my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?

Jeremiah 6:8 Be thou instructed, O Jerusalem, lest my soul depart from thee; lest I make thee desolate, a land not inhabited.

Jeremiah 9:9 Shall I not visit them for these things? saith the Lord: shall not my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?

Jeremiah 14:19 Hast thou utterly rejected Judah? hath thy soul lothed Zion? why hast thou smitten us, and there is no healing for us? we looked for peace, and there is no good; and for the time of healing, and behold trouble!

Jeremiah 32:41 Yea, I will rejoice over them to do them good, and I will plant them in this land assuredly with my whole heart and with my whole soul.

Matthew 12:18 Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles.

Matthew 26:37-39 And he took with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee, and began to be sorrowful and very heavy. 38 Then saith he unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death: tarry ye here, and watch with me. 39 And he went a little further, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.

Hebrews 10:38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

[Pastor Scott Markle]

6 hours ago, John Young said:

I think its pretty clear that God has a soul . . .

Passages about God's soul:

Leviticus 26:11 And I will set my tabernacle among you: and my soul shall not abhor you.

Leviticus 26:30 And I will destroy your high places, and cut down your images, and cast your carcases upon the carcases of your idols, and my soul shall abhor you

Judges 10:16 And they put away the strange gods from among them, and served the Lord: and his soul was grieved for the misery of Israel.

Job 23:13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.

Psalm 11:5 The Lord trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.

Isaiah 1:14 Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.

Isaiah 42:1 Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.

Jeremiah 5:9 Shall I not visit for these things? saith the Lord: and shall not my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?

Jeremiah 5:29 Shall I not visit for these things? saith the Lord: shall not my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?

Jeremiah 6:8 Be thou instructed, O Jerusalem, lest my soul depart from thee; lest I make thee desolate, a land not inhabited.

Jeremiah 9:9 Shall I not visit them for these things? saith the Lord: shall not my soul be avenged on such a nation as this?

Jeremiah 14:19 Hast thou utterly rejected Judah? hath thy soul lothed Zion? why hast thou smitten us, and there is no healing for us? we looked for peace, and there is no good; and for the time of healing, and behold trouble!

Jeremiah 32:41 Yea, I will rejoice over them to do them good, and I will plant them in this land assuredly with my whole heart and with my whole soul.

Matthew 12:18 Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles.

Matthew 26:37-39 And he took with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee, and began to be sorrowful and very heavy. 38 Then saith he unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death: tarry ye here, and watch with me. 39 And he went a little further, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.

Hebrews 10:38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

Indeed, when I originally asked my above two questions, I had just completed a study through the entirety of God's Word on the subject of the "soul."  Therefore, I already knew the answer to my first question, since God's Holy Word clearly reveals that the Lord our God does indeed have a soul, as per the passages which Brother Young has shared above.

According to those very passages, God's soul does the following: Abhors, does not abhor, grieves, desires, hates, delights, avenges, separates (departs), loathes, is well pleased, and has no pleasure.  Furthermore, the Lord our God can engage in an activity with His "whole heart" and with His "whole soul."

Yes, I would also agree that the soul of Jesus the Christ, God the Son born in human flesh, is different than the soul of the Lord our God, God the Father.

On the other hand, I am not certain that I would view God the Father as the Soul of the eternal, triune Godhead.  I would have to ponder that a bit more (although, since God's Word does not speak directly concerning this matter, it would require me to enter the realm of human conjecture, which would compel me NOT to engage in much discussion or debate over the matter).

[Heir of Salvation]

On 7/19/2016 at 1:23 PM, Pastor Scott Markle said:

Some thoughts to ponder:

1.  Does the Lord our God, God the Father, have a soul (even before God the Son was born in human flesh)?

2.  If He does have a soul, what does it mean for Him to have a soul?  What is the function of His soul?

I'd be interested in parsing out this discussion............

What's critical is how one defines a "soul".

 

Also, interestingly is a Theological point...

You seem here, to define "God" or "our Father" or the "Lord God" as being the first member of the Trinity ONLY...

That may be a point of contention.

The Father is the 1st member of the Trinity (only because the Theologians describe him as such) and the Son is the "2nd" (because it works) the Spirit the third member of the Trinity (it's a designation which is workable)....etc.

 

My best guess is...the FATHER....on his own, doesn't have a "soul".

 

"God" does, or rather the Trinity does...but my best guess is that the Trinity has a "soul"....perhaps we can make more sense of it if we say "GOD".....or even "Elohim "    has one "soul"....and that "soul" is composed of the three persons in the Godhead.

 

My understanding of the Godhead would be that "God" (meaning the Trinity) has one "soul"....and the individual members of the Trinity are individual persons within the Godhead.....

Much to the dismay of most on this board, the Scriptures aren't going to define these words so completely...some level of Philosophy is necessary to answer them such as:

What is a "person"

What is a "soul"

 

Maybe this is a starting point. 

 

[Heir of Salvation]

On 7/19/2016 at 1:23 PM, Pastor Scott Markle said:

Some thoughts to ponder:

1.  Does the Lord our God, God the Father, have a soul (even before God the Son was born in human flesh)?

2.  If He does have a soul, what does it mean for Him to have a soul?  What is the function of His soul?

"The Lord our God".....isn't "God the Father" IMO (as I understand it)....

Usually, "the Lord our God" would refer to the Father...in the Old Testament...but in Christianity, the mystery of the Trinity is introduced...I'd say that for New Testament Christians "The Lord our God" isn't the "Father" but rather the "Trinity"...or the "Godhead"...

I don't think the "Father" has a "soul" distinct from the other persons of the godhead.

 

I think the Godhead has one "soul" and that "soul" is comprised of three persons......

 

Let the debate begin..lol 

[2bLikeJesus]

Because God created man in "Our image"..Genesis 1:26 (KJV)
²⁶  And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: 

and man is also a three part being consisting of a body, soul, and spirit (though born spiritually dead).  I tend to think of it from how we work.  Our body fulfills the will of our soul to the best of its ability, the soul is the "chooser" or decider of action in the form of a will, the spirit is the power to enable the action to be performed but itself does not choose the action.  If we are indeed patterned after the triune God, then I think it is clear that Jesus is the body of God performing all the physical actions to include the creation of all that is, according to the will of the Soul of God who is the Father, and the Holy Spirit of course is the power provided to perform and carry out the will of the Father who is the soul.  

Bro. Garry

In His will.  By His power.  For His glory.

 

 

[John Young]

12 hours ago, Heir of Salvation said:

"God" does, or rather the Trinity does...but my best guess is that the Trinity has a "soul"....perhaps we can make more sense of it if we say "GOD".....or even "Elohim "    has one "soul"....and that "soul" is composed of the three persons in the Godhead.

My understanding of the Godhead would be that "God" (meaning the Trinity) has one "soul"....and the individual members of the Trinity are individual persons within the Godhead.....

 

11 hours ago, Heir of Salvation said:

Usually, "the Lord our God" would refer to the Father...in the Old Testament...but in Christianity, the mystery of the Trinity is introduced...I'd say that for New Testament Christians "The Lord our God" isn't the "Father" but rather the "Trinity"...or the "Godhead"...

I don't think the "Father" has a "soul" distinct from the other persons of the godhead.

I think the Godhead has one "soul" and that "soul" is comprised of three persons......

I don't think your above thoughts accurately portray the biblical position. I think it is better to say; "God is One and functions as a Trinity". I think that what makes them the same being is that they all share the same spirit, soul, and body in one Glory. I think what makes them separate is that they can function independently in their given realms, yet with the same mind (The mind of the Father).The only difference in God between the OT and NT is the addition of the human aspects of Jesus. The Word of God in the OT was the preincarnate God which could manifest Himself in material form and was considered in the form of and equal with God Himself because He was not yet Jesus (Philippians 2:5-7).

However, Jesus for example was God in the flesh so  by necessity has a human body and human soul, with His own will, but still shares the same Spirit as God and is still the Word of God from before his incarnation. Jesus, as God, followed not his own will but that of His Father which was still in Heaven, showing that the Father functions as His soul in that aspect. We see also that Scriptures say of God "Thou sendest forth thy spirit". The Spirit also does the will of the Father showing the Father functions as His soul. This same Spirit also comes in the name of Christ as well showing that the Holy Ghost functions as the Spirit of Christ. These things I think the Book of John and others bare out.

John 5:21 For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will.

John 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

John 17:22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

Edited July 21, 2016 by John Young

[Pastor Scott Markle]

18 hours ago, Heir of Salvation said:

I'd be interested in parsing out this discussion............

What's critical is how one defines a "soul".

Brother "Heir of Salvation,"

I can agree that how we define "soul" is critical for a Biblical doctrine of the "soul."  However, I do not believe that it is critical to first define "soul" in order to answer the first question of my opening post, since God's Holy Word directly reveals that God has a soul.

 

18 hours ago, Heir of Salvation said:

Also, interestingly is a Theological point...

You seem here, to define "God" or "our Father" or the "Lord God" as being the first member of the Trinity ONLY...

That may be a point of contention.

Indeed, in my first question of the opening post, I did define "the Lord our God" as "God the Father."  However, I did not do this because I believe that the phrase, "the Lord our God," is a specifically doctrinal phrase only for God the Father.  Rather, I did this in order to prevent the use of references to Jesus' "soul" (as God the Son born in human flesh) for the evidence that God has a "soul."  It was my intention to push people into a consideration of the Old Testament references unto God's "soul" (just as Brother Young contributed to the discussion).

Concerning various of these titles for God, I believe that the word "God" is Biblically employed for all three Persons of the eternal, triune Godhead.  I believe that the phrase "Lord God" or just "Lord" is Biblically employed for the first two Persons of the eternal, triune Godhead (primarily because I cannot think of any passages wherein the "Lord" title is employed for the Holy Spirit, although if someone can provide such a passage, I am quite willing to concede on this point).  I believe that the word "Father" is Biblically employed only for the first Person of the eternal, triune Godhead.

 

18 hours ago, Heir of Salvation said:

The Father is the 1st member of the Trinity (only because the Theologians describe him as such) and the Son is the "2nd" (because it works) the Spirit the third member of the Trinity (it's a designation which is workable)....etc.

I would contend that God the Father is doctrinally viewed as the first Person of the eternal, triune Godhead because God's Holy Word indicates that the other two Persons are in roles of submission under Him.  Furthermore, I would contend that God the Son is doctrinally viewed as the second Person of the eternal, triune Godhead because God's Holy Word indicates that He is in a role of submission under the Father, but that God the Holy Spirit is in a role of submission under Him.  Finally, I would contend that God the Holy Spirit is doctrinally viewed as the third Person of the eternal, triune Godhead because God's Holy Word indicates that He is in a role of submission under both the Father and the Son.

 

18 hours ago, Heir of Salvation said:

My best guess is...the FATHER....on his own, doesn't have a "soul".

Matthew 12:18 -- "Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles."

1.  In Matthew 12:18 which Person of the eternal, triune Godhead is the "servant"?
2.  In Matthew 12:18 which Person of the eternal, triune Godhead is expressing that His "soul is well pleased" with His servant?

Edited July 21, 2016 by Pastor Scott Markle
Added the last portion