Members heartstrings Posted February 22, 2016 Members Share Posted February 22, 2016 (edited) I was thinking just yesterday; the nation of Israel with all its high tech defenses, nuclear weapons, and superbly trained personnel has probably the mightiest military for its size in the entire world. In that sense they too are "mighty men" "of renown" surrounded by "giants". Edited February 22, 2016 by heartstrings Pastor Scott Markle 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Jim_Alaska Posted February 22, 2016 Administrators Share Posted February 22, 2016 1 hour ago, heartstrings said: I was thinking just yesterday; the nation of Israel with all its high tech defenses, nuclear weapons, and superbly trained personnel has probably the mightiest military for its size in the entire world. In that sense they too are "mighty men" "of renown" surrounded by "giants". A great example Brother Wayne and very true. But in context this is not "in those days". LOL Sorry, I couldn't help myself. heartstrings and Pastor Scott Markle 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members heartstrings Posted February 22, 2016 Members Share Posted February 22, 2016 12 hours ago, beameup said: Back to the OP [[A Psalm of David.]] The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool. The LORD shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies [Gentiles]. Thy people [Israelis] shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth. The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek. The Lord at thy right hand shall strike through kings in the day of his wrath. He shall judge among the heathen, he shall fill the places with the dead bodies; he shall wound the heads over many countries. He shall drink of the brook in the way: therefore shall he lift up the head. Psalm 110 There's that word with that unconventional meaning again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members beameup Posted February 22, 2016 Author Members Share Posted February 22, 2016 (edited) 13 minutes ago, heartstrings said: There's that word with that unconventional meaning again. There is an old saying in the math & finance world: "if you torture the numbers enough, they will confess to anything". The same basic principle apparently applies to sentences (KJV 8th grade English, in this case). The information is there, in plain easy-to-understand English, in Genesis 6. The Holy Spirit put it there for a good reason. As also in all his [Paul's] epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest [wrestle], as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 2 Peter 3:16 Edited February 22, 2016 by beameup Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pastor Scott Markle Posted February 23, 2016 Members Share Posted February 23, 2016 2 hours ago, beameup said: (KJV 8th grade English, in this case). The information is there, in plain easy-to-understand English, in Genesis 6. The Holy Spirit put it there for a good reason. INDEED. 9 hours ago, Pastor Scott Markle said: Actually, my position IS based upon the simple grammar of the English. "Also AFTER that" means AFTER. Pretty simple English, huh? First, "there were giants in the earth in those days." Then "also AFTER that," "the sons of God" with "the daughters of men" had children who grew up to be "mighty MEN which were of old, MEN of renown." The simple grammar of the English is clear. The "giants" could NOT be the children from "the sons of God" with "the daughters of men" because those "giants" existed "in the earth" BEFORE "the sons of God" had their children with "the daughters of men." Furthermore, the simple English says that the children from "the sons of God" with "the daughters of men" were "mighty MEN," not "giants," and "MEN of renown," not "giants." ALL pretty simple English here. Jim_Alaska 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members heartstrings Posted February 23, 2016 Members Share Posted February 23, 2016 15 hours ago, beameup said: There is an old saying in the math & finance world: "if you torture the numbers enough, they will confess to anything". The same basic principle apparently applies to sentences (KJV 8th grade English, in this case). The information is there, in plain easy-to-understand English, in Genesis 6. The Holy Spirit put it there for a good reason. As also in all his [Paul's] epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest [wrestle], as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 2 Peter 3:16 Bro, does Genesis 6 specifically call the sons of God "angels". If it doesn't, then WHO is wresting the scriptures? Pastor Scott Markle and John Young 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members beameup Posted February 23, 2016 Author Members Share Posted February 23, 2016 1 minute ago, heartstrings said: Bro, does Genesis 6 specifically call the sons of God "angels". If it doesn't, then WHO is wresting the scriptures? In the Old Testament, ben ha'elohiym always refers to angels. But you knew that, didn't you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members heartstrings Posted February 23, 2016 Members Share Posted February 23, 2016 No sir, It means "sons of God", exactly as translated in the King James Bible. If it referred to "angels" it would have said so. That's just some of that "plain easy-to-understand English" you mentioned. John Young 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Ukulelemike Posted February 23, 2016 Moderators Share Posted February 23, 2016 The Greek terminology for 'sons of God', translate to exactly the same as the Hebrew "sons of God": 'Sons" meaning a male child, or generally, children, male AND female, or a people. Of God. So in the NT we are told that Jesus Christ gives us the power to be the sons of God, why would we assume this is any different? There is nothing in the context of Genesis to demand that it is angels, fallen or otherwise, and really, biblically, we have precedence to assume it is NOT angels, since they neither marry nor are given in marriage, and as far as we know, they do not procreate. As well, never do we see ANYWHERE in scripture that fallen angels have any ability to assume physical form as we see the holy angels do, or at least, appearing to have human form. The only dealing with fallen angels/devils that we ever see are spirits who have possessed humans. But even if this were the case, it doesn't mean the children born from a possessed male would be effected in any way, as though they passed on a wicked spirit-we are all already born with a sinful spirit. heartstrings 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pastor Scott Markle Posted February 23, 2016 Members Share Posted February 23, 2016 (edited) 3 hours ago, beameup said: In the Old Testament, ben ha'elohiym always refers to angels. But you knew that, didn't you? And it certainly would not be of any value to consider the following verse, since the Hebrew construction is not exactly the same -- Deuteronomy 14:1 -- "Ye are the children of the LORD your God: ye shall not cut yourselves, nor make any baldness between your eyes for the dead." Edited February 23, 2016 by Pastor Scott Markle John Young 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members heartstrings Posted February 23, 2016 Members Share Posted February 23, 2016 4 minutes ago, Pastor Scott Markle said: And it certainly would not be of any value to consider the following verse, since the Hebrew construction is not exactly the same -- Deuteronomy 14:1 -- "Ye are the children of the LORD your God: ye shall not cut yourselves, nor make any baldness between your eyes for the dead." Would that be like....dividing your unibrow? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pastor Scott Markle Posted February 23, 2016 Members Share Posted February 23, 2016 Well now, that picture scared me! I think I might have to report that posting to the administration as offensive. heartstrings 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members beameup Posted February 24, 2016 Author Members Share Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) 11 hours ago, heartstrings said: No sir, It means "sons of God", exactly as translated in the King James Bible. If it referred to "angels" it would have said so. That's just some of that "plain easy-to-understand English" you mentioned. You mean like this? Now there was a day when the sons of God angels came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them. Job 1:6 Or this? Again there was a day when the sons of God angels came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD. Job 2:1 PS: "sons of God" - bene ha Elohim - were a direct creation of God, like Adam was a direct creation of God. Edited February 24, 2016 by beameup Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members heartstrings Posted February 24, 2016 Members Share Posted February 24, 2016 Not sure I follow you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Jim_Alaska Posted February 24, 2016 Administrators Share Posted February 24, 2016 2 hours ago, beameup said: You mean like this? Now there was a day when the sons of God angels came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them. Job 1:6 Or this? Again there was a day when the sons of God angels came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD. Job 2:1 Are these two verses supposed to prove anything other than your willingness to change the Holy Spirit inspired word of God to suit your own private interpretation? John Young and Invicta 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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