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Heir of Salvation

One "Contemporary" song with lyrics that beats your hymnal any day

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Other HORRID un-Scriptural songs leveled upon us by these horrid "Contemporary artists.

lyrics here:

The Christian counselor wrote, quote
"Who is the only humane choice ahead
If you can't support it
Why don't you abort it instead?"

You say you pray to the sky
Why? When you're afraid to take a stand down here
'Cause while the holy talk reads like a bad ad lib
Silence screams you were robbing the crib

Say it ain't none of my business, huh?
A woman's got a right to choose
Now a grave digger, next you pull the trigger what then?
Whatever happened to sin?

I heard the reverend say
"Gay is probably normal in the Good Lord's sight
What's to be debated?
Jesus never stated what's right"

I'm no Theology nut
But the Reverend may be a little confused
For if the Lord don't care and he chooses to ignore, ah
Tell it to the people of Sodom and Gomorrah

Call it just an alternate lifestyle, huh?
Morality lies within
Consciences are restin', please repeat the question again
Whatever happened to sin?

When the closets are empty and the clinics are full
When your eyes have been blinded by society's wool
When the streets erupt in your own backyard
You'll be on your knees praying for the National Guard

If you don't care now how the problems get solved
You can shake your head later, that you never got involved
'Cause the call came a ringing from the throne of gold
But you never got the message, never got the message
'Cause your mind's on hold

A politician next door
Swore he'd set the Washington Arena on fire
Thinks he'll gladiate them
But they're gonna make him a liar

Well, he's a good ole boy who was born and raised
In the buckle o' the Bible Belt
But remember when you step into your voting booth
He'll never lie, he'll just embellish the truth

Promises were made to be broken, right?
You've gotta play the game to win
When you need support, tell them that you born again



Granted.....it's not....."In the Garden"..............or anything..........

but, it's more relevant and Biblical, so, I'll take it.

Edited by Heir of Salvation

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5 hours ago, Ronda said:

Exactly who does that worship and bring praise to?

 

It mostly convicts Christians or, is designed to of course.  

 

Q. Who, exactly, does the hymn "I'll fly away" worship and bring praise to?.  

A. No one really...........it makes the flock feel better and gives them hope and encouragement, but it doesn't really "bring praise" to anyone does it.

Edited by Heir of Salvation

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26 minutes ago, Heir of Salvation said:

It mostly convicts Christians or, is designed to of course.  

 

Q. Who, exactly, does the hymn "I'll fly away" worship and bring praise to?.  

A. No one really...........it makes the flock feel better and gives them hope and encouragement, but it doesn't really "bring praise" to anyone does it.

Actually "I'll fly away" brings glory to God because it shows our faith in His salvation He supplied us with and it edifies and encourages  believers. And.it has better music.

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7 hours ago, Heir of Salvation said:

Beat that with "Mansion over the Hilltop" or "Day by Day"...

 

 

Maybe his light would be brighter if he stopped using Laodicea's music. CCM is the music if the one world church, given to us by writers.and artists who desire to break down denomination walls and just gather everyone together, casting aside the doctrines that divide. 

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1 hour ago, Ukulelemike said:

Actually "I'll fly away" brings glory to God because it shows our faith in His salvation He supplied us with and it edifies and encourages  believers. And.it has better music.

Sure it "brings glory to God".  All those songs "bring glory to God".  No one is arguing otherwise.  One has to look rather deeper than the elementary and non-sensical images in the lyrics to see it, but, it does well enough.  One could argue that "Mansion over the Hilltop" does too, I suppose, despite it's false Theological suggestions, wrong view of what heaven is about, and it's vapid imagery........but good for Mr. Miles.  If the Saints are edified by it, than so be it.  God is glorified by the heart-felt singing of his saints.............Even when their songs are stupid......like "I'll fly away". 

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Get rid of the beat and it is actually a nice song. (the first video, NOT the second!)

I think CCM gets a bad 'review' from most conservative Christians because the beat sounds like worldly music. And most conservative Christians stay far away from worldly music no matter whether they be doctrinal or not.

The second was just plain stupid.

Edited by Genevanpreacher

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2 hours ago, Genevanpreacher said:

 (the first video, NOT the second!)

The second was just plain stupid.

LOL....:lol:Steve Taylor is erm...........definitely an acquired taste. ^_^ His songs are all satyrical and weird.  He wrote legit songs that are popular and often sung in churches today, but, his solo music career always involved weird tunes that aren't meant to be taken too seriously.  Double that with the fact that it was meant to be weird even in the 80's......and you've got a real oddball. :rolleyes:

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On 11/26/2015 at 11:56 PM, Heir of Salvation said:

O.k. then.....it's then perfectly fair to say that "A Mighty Fortress" is the music of a barely reformed Catholic who persecuted Baptists and hated Jews.

Fair enough?

If not, why not?

Perhaps, but I have not known anyone who became a Lutheran from singing that, while many Christians AND churches turn to carnal, worldly CCM music and eventually, a worldly church as a whole, through the use of CCM music.

CCM is the music of the one world church, because one of the oft-stated designs is to break down doctrinal and denominational walls-this is why they can be sung before Catholics, Baptists, Presbyterians, Mormons, etc-they WANT to 'unify' everyone, but not in a biblical way, "Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; One Lord, one faith, one baptism, One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all." This is the biblical unity that is the very least we must have for fellowship of any sort, but when CCM performers seek to unify everyone who claims to be 'christian', and purposely disregards these things, it is unscriptural and unholy. In these I cannot even find real unity with pentecostals, with catholics, with presbyterians, indeed, with virtually any protestants at all, because we disagree in one or more of these. And such is the danger of ANY movement in the churches that seeks to bypass what the word of God has said, indeed, what GOD has said, and do things a different way. CCM does exactly that. 

“Sometimes we don’t see eye to eye/ WE DON’T AGREE; WE DON’T KNOW WHY/ BUT JESUS PRAYED THAT WE’D BE ONE/ For the sake of God’s own Son/ CAN WE PUT AWAY OUR DIFFERENCES/ LAY DOWN OUR PRIDE/ It’s time we start turning the tide” (Joel Lindsey and Regie Hamm, “Gather at the River,”)

This song pretends that the doctrinal divisions between Christians are the result of pride (“lay down our pride”) and ignorance (“we don’t agree; we don’t know why”). This conveniently overlooks the Bible’s commands about defending the faith and separating from error.

“Have you ever seen a bunch of young people (be they Lutheran, Presbyterian, or Baptist, charismatic or evangelical) setting aside their religious idiosyncrasies to jump and shout when Petra walks on stage?... The shared experience will send them back to their own churches LESS THEOLOGICALLY EXCLUSIVE. From that moment on, they are ‘not of this world’ with all of its petty ecclesiastical divisions” (Bob Larson, Contemporary Christian Music Magazine, December 1985).

Bob Larson is a sad example-I used to listen to him on the radio in the 80's-he was a big voice against the New Age, as well as the burgeoning CCM movement, but what I thought was strange was his glowing words for secular rock and roll, having been a roadie for a couple heavy metal bands, and I suspected it wouldn't go well for him. Apparently he fell right for it, and now thinks the ecumenical spirit of CCM is a great thing, despite its forays into the new age.

Bill Gaither illustrates the ecumenical philosophy of Contemporary Christian Music. In recent decades Gaither has bridged the wider Contemporary Christian Music world with that of Southern Gospel, and he has stirred his ecumenical philosophy into the mix. The Gaither group provided the music one evening at Indianapolis ‘90, a large ecumenical charismatic gathering I attended with press credentials. One-half of the 25,000 participants were Roman Catholics and the other half represented roughly 40 different denominations, Baptist, Presbyterian, Lutheran, Pentecostal, you name it. A Catholic mass was held each morning during the conference, and a Catholic priest delivered the closing message. The Gaithers appeared to be perfectly at home in this unscriptural gathering and entertained the mixed multitude with their jazzy music.  (David Cloud "Why We Are Opposed to CCM)

The National Catholic Register mentioned these in an article in the March 8-14, 1998, issue, stating that THEY ARE USING THEIR MUSIC TO “EVANGELIZE” EVANGELICAL YOUNG PEOPLE INTO THE CATHOLIC FAITH.
KATHY TROCCOLI has been nominated five times as the Gospel Music Association female vocalist of the year. She is a national spokesperson for Chuck Colson’s Prison Fellowship. In an interview with
CCM Magazine in 1997 she said: “But I’d been very judgmental toward the Catholic church for years, and I’ve recently been able to go back to it without having a chip on my shoulder. I now have a much greater capacity for--as the album says--Love and Mercy.”

Yes, CCM IS the music of the coming one-world church. It is intended and used to attract and draw believers into a false unity with other faiths, to teach them to disregard holiness and separation and godliness in excange for an ungodly union with false prophets and wolves. Like it or not, they admit it, not perhaps in so many words, but they admit to desire for unity above all else, and that is unscriptural and ungodly and unholy.

 

 

On 11/28/2015 at 10:23 AM, Nobody ever said:

Get rid of the beat and it is actually a nice song. (the first video, NOT the second!)

I think CCM gets a bad 'review' from most conservative Christians because the beat sounds like worldly music. And most conservative Christians stay far away from worldly music no matter whether they be doctrinal or not.

The second was just plain stupid.

You are absolutely correct-it is worldly, carnal music, mixed with sometimes very good words-and this is exactly the sort of thing we are told to keep separate from one another. It is, by definition, unholy.

 

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On ‎11‎/‎25‎/‎2015 at 3:45 PM, Heir of Salvation said:

Other HORRID un-Scriptural songs leveled upon us by these horrid "Contemporary artists.

lyrics here:

The Christian counselor wrote, quote
"Who is the only humane choice ahead
If you can't support it
Why don't you abort it instead?"

You say you pray to the sky
Why? When you're afraid to take a stand down here
'Cause while the holy talk reads like a bad ad lib
Silence screams you were robbing the crib

Say it ain't none of my business, huh?
A woman's got a right to choose
Now a grave digger, next you pull the trigger what then?
Whatever happened to sin?

I heard the reverend say
"Gay is probably normal in the Good Lord's sight
What's to be debated?
Jesus never stated what's right"

I'm no Theology nut
But the Reverend may be a little confused
For if the Lord don't care and he chooses to ignore, ah
Tell it to the people of Sodom and Gomorrah

Call it just an alternate lifestyle, huh?
Morality lies within
Consciences are restin', please repeat the question again
Whatever happened to sin?

When the closets are empty and the clinics are full
When your eyes have been blinded by society's wool
When the streets erupt in your own backyard
You'll be on your knees praying for the National Guard

If you don't care now how the problems get solved
You can shake your head later, that you never got involved
'Cause the call came a ringing from the throne of gold
But you never got the message, never got the message
'Cause your mind's on hold

A politician next door
Swore he'd set the Washington Arena on fire
Thinks he'll gladiate them
But they're gonna make him a liar

Well, he's a good ole boy who was born and raised
In the buckle o' the Bible Belt
But remember when you step into your voting booth
He'll never lie, he'll just embellish the truth

Promises were made to be broken, right?
You've gotta play the game to win
When you need support, tell them that you born again



Granted.....it's not....."In the Garden"..............or anything..........

but, it's more relevant and Biblical, so, I'll take it.

This song has no better theology or biblical truth to it than some country western patriotic song written and performed by a god ol boy looking to make a buck off of the cultural situations of the day. Might as well be talking about 'the man upstairs' for all that the Lord is identified here.

As for 'In the Garden', while I agree it isn't a particularly 'scriptural' song, what it is, is a representation of the peace and fellowship a believer has in His Saviour. It isn't meant to mean anything more than this. Your song there spits out things that are wrong and complains about them, but really, gives no resolution to it, offers no hope, and in fact, in the last verse, seems to intimate that being 'born again' is just a convenient lie used by politicians. And while in cases that is surely the case, where is the resolution? Where is the hope? Where is the offer of REAL salvation in Jesus Christ? It's 'relevant', but it is whiney and offers no solution.

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I actually know of some and have read of others who have been influenced to different churches based upon learning more about writers of their favorite hymns. The whole argument that people will learn of CCM artists online and be badly influenced but won't do the same with other song writers doesn't hold water. With the internet it's just as easy to learn of the beliefs, church preferences and such of older song writers as it is new ones.

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13 hours ago, Ukulelemike said:

This song has no better theology or biblical truth to it than some country western patriotic song written and performed by a god ol boy looking to make a buck off of the cultural situations of the day. Might as well be talking about 'the man upstairs' for all that the Lord is identified here.

 

That's simply not true........at all.

No one who reads those lyrics and listens to that song could come to that conclusion.

That's....just well, frankly, either a lie or someone wittingly deceiving themselves.

That song, lyrically at least........strikes directly at the heart of abortion, homosexuality and sin and in absolutely THOSE TERMS  naming it as such, and calling it such, in precise and undeniable terms..............

Hate it all you want, but to say that it's just akin to "any" other country Westerns song is simply a lie Mike................

It isn't Country Western or Patriotic as such at all.

If you wanna support that absurd thesis....show me anyone from George Jones to Tracy Adkins to Patsy Cline to Toby Keith that puts lyrics like that out there, and you'll demonstrate your point.

 

Otherwise, you have simply your nefarious and non-disprovable assertion that all "CCM" is somehow attached to a world-wide Universal Church Ecumenicism Theory which frankly can't be argued and can't be debated proved or disproved.

But those lyrics are CLEARLY straight Bible, straight to the point and are NOTHING like "good ol' boy" music.

There's a million "good ol' boys" who do "Amazing Grace" (and other beloved hymns you do weekly) Mike.

Show me any with THESE LYRICS:

I heard the reverend say
"Gay is probably normal in the Good Lord's sight
What's to be debated?
Jesus never stated what's right"

I'm no Theology nut
But the Reverend may be a little confused
For if the Lord don't care and he chooses to ignore, ah
Tell it to the people of Sodom and Gomorrah

 

 

none of them do songs with lyrics like this.  Neither does the hymnal.

 

 

 

Edited by Heir of Salvation

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For the most part the debates and arguments over what is called CCM is futile. Only a tiny few on each side will ever change their positions and typically such changes are long in coming and come about not from persuasive arguments of the other side.

Looking over the course of Christian history we see battle after battle over the years regarding various aspects of music. Psalms only, hymns are worldly, a few hymns are okay, forget the psalms we'll just use hymns now, no instruments, some instruments, no piano or organ for they are too worldly, never mind those are okay now, none of that Moody and Sankey music it's of the world until a few Fundamentalists decided they liked it and now it's okay, stay away from Lutherans, Methodists and Universalists except when we decide we like some of their songs and then it's okay to put them in our hymnals and sing them.

Regardless of what any of us think the fact is some of what is called CCM is becoming accepted music even in some IFB churches. Eventually it's likely every IFB church will have hymnals with CCM songs in them and the congregations will sing certain CCM songs without a thought of them being anything other than a song of worship in their services.

Songs by the Gaithers, Gettys and others are already in some of the hymnals in IFB churches.

Just as some look back today and wonder at the arguments over pianos or hymns in churches, future generations will have the same thoughts when looking back at the battles over CCM songs.

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Want to know my biggest beef with CCM?  Because this is inevitably what it turns a church into. These are all worship services. Notice what's missing? WORSHIP! Replaced by "worship music', something biblically non-existent. I didn't have to work to find these images-and there are a lot more, small, large, all contemporary, and based around the music. This is what happens with CCM in churches. Sometimes faster than others, but it is inevitable.   The last picture, by the way, is from the formerly IFB college, Tennessee Temple University-here they are 'worshipping', no pastor, no preacher, no pulpit in sight, all brought together under CCM. This is why it will never broach our church.

Contemporary-Service-56-med.jpg christ-church-1200-seat-nexo-s12-arrays-

600_3885.jpg   IMG_8239.jpeg 

OpenMeetingExpectationsChurch.jpg  938773106_img_9954_edit.jpg IMGP4839-437x234.jpg  5523dd0ba3752.image.jpg?resize=760%2C507

Ford012011_2.jpg

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I don't believe it's the CCM that makes the churches this way, it's the leadership and congregation that chooses to take that path. A church can play a CCM song on a piano just like they do a hymn or they can choose to have a band just like some do for their hymns too. If their leaning is towards emotionalism, excitement or entertainment that church is going to head in that direction whether they choose to ramp up the playing and singing of hymns or they choose to ramp up some CCM, Southern Gospel or Spirituals.

There is a church here I've been watching very closely for many years now which uses what some call adapted CCM. This church has been using some of this in their services now for going on 16 years. The church has no band, no light show, no concert atmosphere. Typically they sing one or two "adapted CCM" songs and two or three hymns during the course of the service. The pastor still preaches strong Bible sermons; the sermons are still the main point of the service; they still have modest dress standards; they still preach the Gospel, soul win and disciple. Using CCM songs hasn't turned this church into a crowd of rockers, watered down Christians or liberals.

Each church will take whatever position they choose on this issue. Regardless of their decision some of these churches will grow weak, some will stay strong. If things continue as they have been it's likely that within our lifetime virtually every IFB church will have accepted some CCM.

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4 hours ago, John81 said:

I don't believe it's the CCM that makes the churches this way, it's the leadership and congregation that chooses to take that path. A church can play a CCM song on a piano just like they do a hymn or they can choose to have a band just like some do for their hymns too. If their leaning is towards emotionalism, excitement or entertainment that church is going to head in that direction whether they choose to ramp up the playing and singing of hymns or they choose to ramp up some CCM, Southern Gospel or Spirituals.

There is a church here I've been watching very closely for many years now which uses what some call adapted CCM. This church has been using some of this in their services now for going on 16 years. The church has no band, no light show, no concert atmosphere. Typically they sing one or two "adapted CCM" songs and two or three hymns during the course of the service. The pastor still preaches strong Bible sermons; the sermons are still the main point of the service; they still have modest dress standards; they still preach the Gospel, soul win and disciple. Using CCM songs hasn't turned this church into a crowd of rockers, watered down Christians or liberals.

Each church will take whatever position they choose on this issue. Regardless of their decision some of these churches will grow weak, some will stay strong. If things continue as they have been it's likely that within our lifetime virtually every IFB church will have accepted some CCM. And this is the problem. And eventually few will be any different than any of those above.

 

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7 hours ago, Ukulelemike said:

And this is the problem. And eventually few will be any different than any of those above.

Maybe, maybe not, that depends upon the heart of each church. If a church is going to drift they are going to do so with or without CCM. If their heart is set on following Christ they can and will do so whether they have only a piano and sing "In Christ Alone" or "It Is Well With My Soul".

There are churches which reject "modern music" yet they have chose to "pump up" the songs in their hymnals so they come forth sounding much like modern music.

We shouldn't have a rock show in the church but we also shouldn't seem to be in a coma or singing a funeral dirge during services either. Both types of churches have problems. It's not the music that is the problem, it's the state of their hearts which is being manifest in the music.

As always there will be continual separation in churches, among churches and Christians in general.

We don't read or hear much about it today but when Moody was touring here and abroad there was a lot of uproar over the music Sankey played at their meetings. The conservative churches of that day denounced the music as worldly, inappropriate for church, and too emotional. As we know, most churches eventually adopted that music and today conservative churches use it and uphold it as very good. Some of the churches which took up this music were already falling away, others fell away afterward and others continued on in the Lord. The same is the current case with CCM and one day this fight regarding CCM will mostly be forgotten as new battles over music will arise and the conservative churches at that time will stand by the CCM which they have accepted just as we do with past music today. The telling point will be whether the church chooses to follow Christ or drift away from Christ.

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A church that starts messing with CCM by altering it and using only traditional instruments will soon desire more and more of the real thing.  This has been happening for decades and every church that has let CCM (Satan) inside, has gone emerging within a generation or two.  Soon as the music standards drop, then goes dress standards and then goes separation standards and then the KJV, God's preserved Word in the English gets tossed out for the Egyptian bible.  

Those pictures Mike posted look little different from worldly heathen rock-n-roll concerts, for they are the same thing with the same goals, to entertain the foolish.  Satan is a master of deceit and he has those foolish people doing his dirty work, separating people from God, saved and lost.

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I would say in most cases those who bring in CCM will eventually take such to an extreme but I don't believe it's because of CCM, it's because of the state of their heart and that's the direction they choose to go. Only a small percentage of CCM songs are of the type or written for church services. It's typically the other CCM songs which are made for radio play or the fringe which drifting churches choose because their hearts are into show, not substance.

While it's only one church, I do know that in the particular church I've been watching closely they have been using "adapted" CCM for nearly 16 years now and their hearts are still set on Christ as before. The CCM songs they use are used in the same way they do the hymns. They have not formed a band, introduced multi-media theatrics, began to dress worldly or watered down their preaching.

 

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On ‎2016‎年‎1‎月‎5‎日 at 2:36 AM, Ukulelemike said:

Want to know my biggest beef with CCM?  Because this is inevitably what it turns a church into. These are all worship services. Notice what's missing? WORSHIP! Replaced by "worship music', something biblically non-existent. I didn't have to work to find these images-and there are a lot more, small, large, all contemporary, and based around the music. This is what happens with CCM in churches. Sometimes faster than others, but it is inevitable.   The last picture, by the way, is from the formerly IFB college, Tennessee Temple University-here they are 'worshipping', no pastor, no preacher, no pulpit in sight, all brought together under CCM. This is why it will never broach our church.

Ukelememike,

Amen and amen! You are entirely correct.

Thank you very much for your posting.

21 hours ago, swathdiver said:

A church that starts messing with CCM by altering it and using only traditional instruments will soon desire more and more of the real thing.  This has been happening for decades and every church that has let CCM (Satan) inside, has gone emerging within a generation or two.  Soon as the music standards drop, then goes dress standards and then goes separation standards and then the KJV, God's preserved Word in the English gets tossed out for the Egyptian bible.  

Those pictures Mike posted look little different from worldly heathen rock-n-roll concerts, for they are the same thing with the same goals, to entertain the foolish.  Satan is a master of deceit and he has those foolish people doing his dirty work, separating people from God, saved and lost.

Swathdiver,

Amen and amen! Keep on preachin'. CCM music is worldly, decitful, sensual, and of the devil. As you correctly pointed out the fools are being entertained by the clowns called by the Devil.

Alan

 

Edited by Alan
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