Israel vs. Church Issue

[Alan]

I have a copy.  It was required reading in one of my theology classes.  I have to admit I didn't really pay much attention to it because where I was from I had never heard of covenant theology until I went to Bible college and it wasn't a pressing issue for me.  Now it seems to be EVERYWHERE and it is so easily creeping onto Baptist churches....

You are correct. The prophetic heresies of the Reformers, Roman Catholic Church, Reformed Baptists, are now creeping into the ranks of the independent, Fundamental Baptists.

Alan 

[trapperhoney]

You are correct. The prophetic heresies of the Reformers, Roman Catholic Church, Reformed Baptists, are now creeping into the ranks of the independent, Fundamental Baptists.

Alan 

I think it goes back to what I've brought up before -- discipleship.  The Reformed Theologians are much more prominent today, they are in the public forum and have made quite a name for themselves.  John MacArthur, Max Lucado, John Piper (esp. Piper since he's "Baptist") are very popular.  For a long time I didn't realize Lucado was Reformed.  I stayed away from his stuff because I saw it as largely "fluff" but a friend gave hubby a little book by him for a study the friend wanted to do and something in the bio on the back revealed his Reformed connection. 

My husband had a First Sergeant a few years back who was very vocal about being Christian and was trying to hold his recruiters to Christian standards on the job, but he was not mature at all in the Word.  He would make a statement and claim biblical support, then ask hubby to back him up and hubby would have to defer from answering, because it was very way off base scripturally and to point it out in front of the men would be bad.  We knew the church he went to, it was a good IFB church.  One day, though, he happened to park next to our car and when we were leaving I saw in his backseat a MacArthur Study Bible and was aghast. 

We attend a very good IFB church.  The people love the Lord and are extremely faithful.  We often have more people Wednesday night than Sunday morning!  The men in the church take turns speaking on Wednesday evenings.  Hubby recently started a series on the "basics."  He taught on the character of God a few months ago.  The people in the church raved about the lesson.  I don't think they have every been taught anything like that before.  Last month he touched on the Bible, will follow up on that again next month.  They loved that lesson as well.  Nothing should surprise us anymore, but I have to say that we are quite shocked that people don't seem to know these basics, that they've never been taught before.  People desperately need to be grounded in the fundamentals.  If we try to warn people about all the "bad stuff" out in the world we could never warn them about everything.  When agents are trained to spot counterfeit currency, they are made to memorize genuine bills, not become familiar with all the examples of counterfeits.  If one has the genuine article committed to memory, then a counterfeit will stick out like a sore thumb.  So, teaching the truth, grounding in the basics will help people be prepared to spot the false that is constantly being thrown at them.

And while we may ask others for their thoughts about a topic, or inquire about suggested passages for something, we use those as a springboard for our own research.  We do not simply take anyone's word for anything.  This has caused us to butt heads with a couple different pastors and continually look for new churches.  We've kind of been like vagabonds, going from church to church looking for a good fit.  It is really hard to find a good church nowadays.  Thankfully we have found one and are able to serve there.  God is truly faithful and gracious.

[LindaR]

trapperhoney....

Isn't Max Lucado a Church of Christ pastor?  I didn't realize he was also Reformed!

[John81]

trapperhoney....

Isn't Max Lucado a Church of Christ pastor?  I didn't realize he was also Reformed!

< Return to Famous members of the Church of Christ

 

The Religious Affiliation of Best-Selling Protestant Christian Writer
Max Lucado

 

Max Lucado is a member and preacher in the conservative religious body known as the "Churches of Christ" (or individually as "church of Christ"). Today Max Lucado is the senior minister at Oak Hills Church in San Antonio, Texas. The Oak Hills Church dates back to the early l900s, when it was known as the Grove Avenue Church of Christ. The Oak Hills Church (which now has weekly attendance of about 3,500 people) is affiliated with Stone-Campbell fellowship known as the Churches of Christ. As is typical of websites for Stone-Campbell churches which avoid use of the word "denomination", this site is circumspect about identifying its denominational affiliation, but the site's "Vision" page (http://www.oakhillschurchsa.org/About/Vision/) on which the church's theology is summarized clearly presents a summary of the Churches of Christ doctrines, beliefs and practices.

[John81]

I think it goes back to what I've brought up before -- discipleship.  The Reformed Theologians are much more prominent today, they are in the public forum and have made quite a name for themselves.  John MacArthur, Max Lucado, John Piper (esp. Piper since he's "Baptist") are very popular.  For a long time I didn't realize Lucado was Reformed.  I stayed away from his stuff because I saw it as largely "fluff" but a friend gave hubby a little book by him for a study the friend wanted to do and something in the bio on the back revealed his Reformed connection. 

My husband had a First Sergeant a few years back who was very vocal about being Christian and was trying to hold his recruiters to Christian standards on the job, but he was not mature at all in the Word.  He would make a statement and claim biblical support, then ask hubby to back him up and hubby would have to defer from answering, because it was very way off base scripturally and to point it out in front of the men would be bad.  We knew the church he went to, it was a good IFB church.  One day, though, he happened to park next to our car and when we were leaving I saw in his backseat a MacArthur Study Bible and was aghast. 

We attend a very good IFB church.  The people love the Lord and are extremely faithful.  We often have more people Wednesday night than Sunday morning!  The men in the church take turns speaking on Wednesday evenings.  Hubby recently started a series on the "basics."  He taught on the character of God a few months ago.  The people in the church raved about the lesson.  I don't think they have every been taught anything like that before.  Last month he touched on the Bible, will follow up on that again next month.  They loved that lesson as well.  Nothing should surprise us anymore, but I have to say that we are quite shocked that people don't seem to know these basics, that they've never been taught before.  People desperately need to be grounded in the fundamentals.  If we try to warn people about all the "bad stuff" out in the world we could never warn them about everything.  When agents are trained to spot counterfeit currency, they are made to memorize genuine bills, not become familiar with all the examples of counterfeits.  If one has the genuine article committed to memory, then a counterfeit will stick out like a sore thumb.  So, teaching the truth, grounding in the basics will help people be prepared to spot the false that is constantly being thrown at them.

And while we may ask others for their thoughts about a topic, or inquire about suggested passages for something, we use those as a springboard for our own research.  We do not simply take anyone's word for anything.  This has caused us to butt heads with a couple different pastors and continually look for new churches.  We've kind of been like vagabonds, going from church to church looking for a good fit.  It is really hard to find a good church nowadays.  Thankfully we have found one and are able to serve there.  God is truly faithful and gracious.

This is why I've tried to promote discipleship as much as possible over the years. When we don't disciple others they are left to their own ways of trying to learn and grown. While some may get this right, many more search for help in places that lead them astray without them realizing it. It's not uncommon for even fundamentalists and "conservative" Christians to get teaching from sources such as Lucado, Alcorn, Piper, MacArthur,  or even Hagee and many others.

Many churches offer book studies, which if a solid book were used might be fine, but most often the books aren't biblically solid yet are taught from as if they are; or with very little point made to counter what is off.

This is why I prefer Bible studies and have helped teach and promote these.

Very few Christians are like the Bereans, looking to Scripture to see if what they read or hear is actually what Scripture says. We see the results of this all around us.

[trapperhoney]

This is why I've tried to promote discipleship as much as possible over the years. When we don't disciple others they are left to their own ways of trying to learn and grown. While some may get this right, many more search for help in places that lead them astray without them realizing it. It's not uncommon for even fundamentalists and "conservative" Christians to get teaching from sources such as Lucado, Alcorn, Piper, MacArthur,  or even Hagee and many others.

Many churches offer book studies, which if a solid book were used might be fine, but most often the books aren't biblically solid yet are taught from as if they are; or with very little point made to counter what is off.

This is why I prefer Bible studies and have helped teach and promote these.

Very few Christians are like the Bereans, looking to Scripture to see if what they read or hear is actually what Scripture says. We see the results of this all around us.

Yes, indeed.  My idea of a "book study" is to study a book of the Bible, NOT a book about the Bible....

[Genevanpreacher]

< Return to Famous members of the Church of Christ

 

The Religious Affiliation of Best-Selling Protestant Christian Writer
Max Lucado

 

Max Lucado is a member and preacher in the conservative religious body known as the "Churches of Christ" (or individually as "church of Christ"). Today Max Lucado is the senior minister at Oak Hills Church in San Antonio, Texas. The Oak Hills Church dates back to the early l900s, when it was known as the Grove Avenue Church of Christ. The Oak Hills Church (which now has weekly attendance of about 3,500 people) is affiliated with Stone-Campbell fellowship known as the Churches of Christ. As is typical of websites for Stone-Campbell churches which avoid use of the word "denomination", this site is circumspect about identifying its denominational affiliation, but the site's "Vision" page (http://www.oakhillschurchsa.org/About/Vision/) on which the church's theology is summarized clearly presents a summary of the Churches of Christ doctrines, beliefs and practices.

Which means they will promote baptismal regeneration, a well known heresy against Jesus Christ.

That is what Mr. Stone and Mr. Campbell both espoused.

[No Nicolaitans]

Ah...he's an okay guy. You can't hold a little heresy against him.  After all, he makes those pretty-whimsical paintings!

[LindaR]

Ah...he's an okay guy. You can't hold a little heresy against him.  After all, he makes those pretty-whimsical paintings!

Are you speaking of Max Lucado?

[No Nicolaitans]

Are you speaking of Max Lucado?

I was...but I was being facetious. 

[LindaR]

I was...but I was being facetious. 

[HappyChristian]

Ah...he's an okay guy. You can't hold a little heresy against him.  After all, he makes those pretty-whimsical paintings!

I think you're thinking of Thomas Kincaid. Lucado writes books. Pretty-whimsical ones, though. 

[No Nicolaitans]

I think you're thinking of Thomas Kincaid. Lucado writes books. Pretty-whimsical ones, though. 

Doh!

Perhaps I saw some Thomas Kincaid paintings used on Lucado's books?   

I apologize for telling a lie. 

[HappyChristian]

Doh!

Perhaps I saw some Thomas Kincaid paintings used on Lucado's books?   

I apologize for telling a lie. 

Thirty-one Hail Mary's and you're good to go. Hehe