You just can’t make this stuff up.

[wretched]

3 hours ago, Ronda said:

 

The thief on the cross was not teaching the gospel, was not proclaiming to be a pastor, and was not leading others with false doctrine.  Jesus Himself is the one who told the man "Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise."   Jesus made that pronouncement, He knows the hearts and minds of all people.  We, as humans, and not the Son of God,  do not have the divine ability to pronounce upon anyone that same statement.  We are told to: 

"Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine."  (2nd Timothy 4:2) 

I am leaving alone the previous line of discussion to address what Rhonda is saying here. She is exactly right but I want to mention something else about the thief.

This one example, which by the way, is the only example in Scripture of a person being born again without any evidence of the new birth. DUH, he died shortly thereafter and just as Rhonda said, GOD Almighty was right there knowing his heart. I guarantee you if he had lived, he would have went on to baptism, and displayed the Scriptural evidence of the new birth.

This one example is the text verse for all the easy believism laziness going on IFB churches worldwide. They want to claim to be soulwinning without any real effort or prayfulness and certainly without any real fruit and they site this one and only example as their proof-text over and over without any clue what they are talking about. It is truly sad and it sends people to hell on a shutter.

Back in the day, Christians used to live by Luke 11: 1-13, now we go the easy way without real prayer and power and in the flesh, reporting our own increases and not real ones from God. 

Closing the vent, sorry.

 

Edited December 1, 2015 by wretched

[Ukulelemike]

4 hours ago, Ronda said:

 

The thief on the cross was not teaching the gospel, was not proclaiming to be a pastor, and was not leading others with false doctrine.  Jesus Himself is the one who told the man "Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise."   Jesus made that pronouncement, He knows the hearts and minds of all people.  We, as humans, and not the Son of God,  do not have the divine ability to pronounce upon anyone that same statement.  We are told to: 

"Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine."  (2nd Timothy 4:2) 

Indeed, but as far as I know, this woman's teaching of the gospel is not in question, is it? Or did I miss that part? 

[Ronda]

4 hours ago, Ukulelemike said:

Indeed, but as far as I know, this woman's teaching of the gospel is not in question, is it? Or did I miss that part? 

Earlier you stated: "And to this, I agree. Everyone can be an example, even if its a bad example, and this lady pastor is, indeed, a bad example, saved or not. We can surely use this to take heed to ourselves and to the doctrine, and be sure that the gospel we preach is not 'another gospel', which is, of course, no gospel. And here, I will leave it, as well." 

So what exactly are YOU saying? You just said you didn't think this woman's teaching of the gospel was in question. (or did you "miss that part"?) your words, not mine. When earlier you tied in the bad example of this woman preacher, her (lack of) doctrine, and the gospel "we" preach.  

 

[Ukulelemike]

17 hours ago, Ronda said:

Earlier you stated: "And to this, I agree. Everyone can be an example, even if its a bad example, and this lady pastor is, indeed, a bad example, saved or not. We can surely use this to take heed to ourselves and to the doctrine, and be sure that the gospel we preach is not 'another gospel', which is, of course, no gospel. And here, I will leave it, as well." 

So what exactly are YOU saying? You just said you didn't think this woman's teaching of the gospel was in question. (or did you "miss that part"?) your words, not mine. When earlier you tied in the bad example of this woman preacher, her (lack of) doctrine, and the gospel "we" preach.  

 

Other than her comment about doctrine, either because she misunderstands what doctrine is, or because she, like so many others, actually believes that because doctrine divides, and she has an unbiblical view of Christian unity, and so is opposed to it, I have no idea as to what she believes about the gospel, personally.  Now, the ABC organization, as a denomination, states this about the gospel, (specifically about evangelism), Evangelism is the joyous witness of the People of God to the redeeming love of God urging all to repent and to be reconciled to God and each other through faith in Jesus Christ who lived, died, and was raised from the dead,": That is off their website, so its the official 'doctrine' of salvation. Now, its is a bit vague in some respects, ie, what do they believe concerning repentance, or do they consider salvation to be eternally secure, I can't say, but taken at face value, if she believes and teaches the same as the website says, then her gospel, it would appear, is correct, (though I don't know what "and each other" means in the context, maybe that we become tied to one another as brethren in Christ, I don't know). 

But the bottom line is, as we have had this 'conversation' about this woman, not know what she believes on the gospel, outside of her denomination's beliefs, it affords us the opportunity to take heed to ourselves. We have so little to specifically judge this woman on outside of what she had said or done, but let it spur us to judge ourselves, so that we be not judged. Judgment first begins in the house of God. When question of doct4rine comes up, I try to use it as an opportunity to once again remind myself of what I believe and teach, and WHY I believe it. I can't say what she does, with only a couple exceptions, or why, but I do know what I believe. I can't change what she does, save to pray for her, but I CAN let it inspire me to inspect me.

That's all I'm saying.