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Alan

Clarence Larkin - Revelation

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Brother Alan, I would very much be interested in a book review on Clarence Larkin's "The Spirit World".
I've not (yet) read it myself, not knowing it existed... but have now found a free copy online and plan to read it (God willing). 

It would be a very timely study, since spiritual warfare is a major issue in the life of believers. (Eph.6:12). I just started the first chapter, and it looks to be an excellent read. 

Maranatha! 

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I recently started to read Larkin's Dispensational Truth and was interested to note that he said that Dispensationalism was taught by Jesuits in the 16th century, then wonderfully revived in the Protestan church in the early 19th century. 

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Invicta,

Very glad to hear that you reading Larkin's 'Dispensational Truth.'

Brethren,

I would recommend all of the brethren to read, and study closely, Clarence Larkin's, 'Dispensational Truth.' As with his other works, there are some notable sections that I disagree with. But, by and large, we can learn a lot from his material. 

In the book by Larkin, Dispensational Truth, on Page 6, Larkin gives a fair analysis of the three different "Schools of Interpretation," concerning prophecy. Under, the "Futurist School," (which Invicta noted some of Larkin's thoughts), Larkin also stated, "This view [the Futurist School], while it dates in modern times only from the close of the Sixteenth Century, is really the most ancient of the three. It was held in many of its prominent features by the primitive Fathers of the Church, and is one of the early interpretations of scripture truth that sunk into oblivion with the growth of Papacy, and that has been restored to the Church in these last times."

Regards,

Alan

 

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Thanks Alan  

I did read that and his comments about the primitive Fathers of the church.  I did not include that because it just isn't true.  The primitive Fathers of the church were premilenial but not pre trib. They mostly taught that the Antichrist would follow the fall of the Roman Empire. Most thought that the temple in the book of Revelation referred to the church and the 144,000 were Christian virgins according to Tertullian and probably others.  Some thought that Christ died in the midst of the 70th week, but I don't think they knew what to do the the other ½ week, one thought it was separate.  

You may well profit from Elliott's History of Apocalyptic interpretation.  You will find it here, most of it anyway.  He splits it into various periods from The ECF to the 'present day' the day he wrote it, various editions from 1844 to about 1860. I have not read the later periods, just the earlier ones.    You can get a reprint on Amazon. Or on the trail of Blood forum, here

http://www.trailofblood.com/forum/index.php?topic=606.msg5035;topicseen#new

There are numerous footnotes but as most are in Latin or Greek they have not been shown.

Edited by Invicta

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Thank you for the information. I fully understand the different beliefs that the early church fathers had. As this thread is what Clarence Larkin taught, and his comments (which I consider appropriate and correct), we will leave this discussion for another thread on the church fathers and their different beliefs concerning prophecy.

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John Young,

I noticed that you 'liked' numerous subjects in the study on the, "Clarence Larkin - Revelation, study." I would like to thank you. I appreciate you reading the study.

I also noticed, after reviewing this study, and unless I missed something, you were not a member of OnLineBaptist when the study was active.

Therefore, I do not mind discussing the material found in Larkin's "Revelation" commentary with you, or anybody else, if you have a comment, question, thoughts, or something on your mind, as not all of the contents of the book was discussed.

I would like to add the following caveat to all concerned:

I do ask though that whoever comments that we remain civil and if we cannot agree on a particular aspect of the book, or passage, that we drop the subject. I do not intend to allow this thread to turn into a verbal hassle.

Also, I will ask the moderators not to allow any criticism of Clarence Larkin, his ministry, his personal life, on this thread.

God bless.

Alan
 

Edited by Alan
grammar

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50 minutes ago, Alan said:

I noticed that you 'liked' numerous subjects in the study on the, "Clarence Larkin - Revelation, study." I would like to thank you. I appreciate you reading the study.

I also noticed, after reviewing this study, and unless I missed something, you were not a member of OnLineBaptist when the study was active.

I joined in January 13, 2015 but had problems longing in at the time of the study so I was a member but hadn't been able to participate or read it. While I was familiar with Larken's teaching and charts, I left off studying Revelation commentaries until after I was confident of the general order of things from my own study. Particularly when it comes to Revelation, everyone and their dog seems to have an interpretation and news paper in hand and early on in my study it just seemed to confuse the topic. For that reason I didn't even take the Revelation class in college as I didn't want to get caught up in anything that might be wrong. So in looking over the review of his book and charts its nice to see that we are generally on the same track and that it confirms what I have studied on my own. I'm about halfway done reading the study and will let you know if I have any questions.

Edited by John Young

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On 10/16/2015 at 5:13 PM, Alan said:

In order to know the book of Revelation the student of scripture must have a thorough knowledge of the Old Testament Law, Ordinances, Statutes, the Covenants given to the Patriarch’s and the prophesies of the prophets.

I think this is the main reason a lot of theologies get the events of Revelation wrong. Instead of searching the scriptures for specific answers to a difficult passage or term, they appeal to "logic", allegory, some event of history or current event that "seems to fit", or some other arbitrary idea or application. I'm convinced that every term and event presented in Revelation can be found in the OT scriptures and that we do not need to go outside of them in order to discern what is meant in Revelation.

Luke 24:27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

Galatians 1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

Revelation 19:10d for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Edited by John Young

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On 10/22/2016 at 12:56 AM, JohnBaptistHenry@yahoo.com said:

Bro. Alan, I don't have Larkin's book on Revelation, but I have heard this teaching before, concerning 12 OT and 12 NT saints in Revelation 4.  I do believe Revelation 4 is the Judgment Seat of Christ (2 Cor. 5:10-11; 1 Cor. 3:11-15).  However, if I understand the teaching correctly, that it represents OT saints also, it does not ring true to me.  Here's why:

Hebrews 11:40:  "God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect."

Hebrews 12:22-24:  "But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,  23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel."

Who are the "us" and "they" of Hebrews 11:40?  Hebrews 11 speaks strictly of OT saints until the last verse, v. 40, where it uses the word "us" meaning NT saints.  It appears that "the general assembly" and "church of the firstborn" of Hebrews 12 are all of the saved of this Church Age, "the general assembly" being those outside of NT churches.  These have been "made perfect," that is, they have received their glorified bodies; whereas "the spirits of just men made perfect" represent OT saints who will not be raised until after the last week of Daniel (cf. Rev. 6:9-11):

Daniel 12:11-13:  "And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.  12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.  13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days."

Job 19:25-27:  "For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth26 And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God 27 Whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another; though my reins be consumed within me."

 

I have not yet read what Larkin teaches on the 24 elders, so someone can let me know if this lines up with his teachings or not. We do know that they represent the Israel and the Apostles because OLD and NEW Testament saints together make up the New Jerusalem saints. They without us were not made perfect because Christ had not yet redeemed them from Hell until he died, went to Hell for them and brought them to Heaven. They are NOW in Christ just as we are and have all the rewords of a NT believer in addition to those of Israel. The 12 tribe fathers and the 12 apostles of the Lamb (David's Household leaders) were all promised thrones to rule over the twelve tribes of Israel. Daniel 12:11-13 and Job 19:25-27 are not referring to the resurrection specifically (as we all receive our resurrected bodies at the rapture) but more specifically to their inheritance of land on the earth in the Kingdom which happens at the decent of New Jerusalem after the tribulation period. Israel's tribal fathers will rule the world, Jerusalem Apostles will rule the nation of Israel, and Christ will rule Jerusalem.

Numbers 1:44 These are those that were numbered, which Moses and Aaron numbered, and the princes of Israel, being twelve men: each one was for the house of his fathers.

Numbers 7:2a that the princes of Israel, heads of the house of their fathers, who were the princes of the tribes, and were over them that were numbered...

Psalm 122:3-5 Jerusalem is builded as a city that is compact together: 4 whither the tribes go up, the tribes of the Lord, unto the testimony of Israel, to give thanks unto the name of the Lord. 5 For there are set thrones of judgment, the thrones of the house of David.

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Deuteronomy 32:7-9 Remember the days of old, consider the years of many generations: ask thy father, and he will shew thee; thy elders, and they will tell thee. 8 When the most High divided to the nations their inheritance, when he separated the sons of Adam, he set the bounds of the people according to the number of the children of Israel. 9 For the Lord’s  portion  is his people; Jacob is the lot of his inheritance.

Edited by John Young

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John Young asked, "I have not yet read what Larkin teaches on the 24 elders, so someone can let me know if this lines up with his teachings or not. We do know that they represent the Israel and the Apostles because OLD and NEW Testament saints together make up the New Jerusalem saints."

Concerning the 24 elders in Revelation 4:4, on page 38 of the Clarence Larkin book, brother Larkin writes, "The "Elders" then must be representatives of the Old and New Testament Saints, that have been redeemed by the BLOOD OF CHRIST. This will be made more clear as we consider their position, dress and song."

Alan

Edited by Alan
changed 14 to 24

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I was able to find a PDF copy of Larkin's Revelation work here for anyone who would like to read it: http://www.earnestlycontendingforthefaith.com/Books/Clarence Larkin/Revelation/ClarenceLarkinTheCompleteBookOfRevelation.pdf

This copy probably has a variant page structure then your hard copy as the section on the 24 elders started on page 31 in the PDF.

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