Jump to content
Online Baptist Community
  • Newest Sermon Entry

    • By 1Timothy115 in Devotionals
         11
      Psalms 119:1-8                                         Sep. 5 - Oct. 2, 2019
      1 ALEPH. Blessed are the undefiled in the way, who walk in the law of the LORD.
      2 Blessed are they that keep his testimonies, and that seek him with the whole heart.
      3 They also do no iniquity: they walk in his ways.
      4 Thou hast commanded us to keep thy precepts diligently.
      5 O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!
      6 Then shall I not be ashamed, when I have respect unto all thy commandments.
      7 I will praise thee with uprightness of heart, when I shall have learned thy righteous judgments.
      8 I will keep thy statutes: O forsake me not utterly.
      The following verse stood out to me...
      5 O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!
      At first glance it seemed to me this person’s soul is poured out with intense desire to have God’s direction in keeping His Word.
      I made a small wood fire in our backyard for my granddaughter, Julia, since she would be staying overnight with us. My wife and Julia stayed outside at the fire for about half an hour. Then, I found myself alone to watch the fire die out on a particularly lovely evening. So I took my verse from above and began to repeat it for memorization. As I repeated the verse, I tried to contemplate the words and apply them to what I was seeing around me. 
      The moon and stars were out now peering through the scattered clouds above.
      [Genesis 1:16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. Genesis 1:17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, Genesis 1:18 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.]
      Thought 1         
      The moon has stayed his course since the day God created him, also the stars, obeying the statutes directed by God from the first day they were created. Can you imagine God’s direction to the Moon and stars, “moon you will have a path through the sky above the earth, stars you will occupy the firmament above the moon and be clearly visible in the cloudless night sky.”
      Then, the trees, grass, even the air we breathe obey the statues God gave them from the beginning. None of these creations have souls, none have hearts, none have intelligence, but they all observe God’s statutes, His instructions for their limited time on earth.
      Thought 2
      What if we were like the moon, stars, trees, grass, or the other creations which have no soul? We would be directed to keep God’s statutes without choosing to keep them. This is not the image of God, there would be no dominion over other creatures, or over the earth. We would not be capable of experiencing the joy and peace of learning the love of God
      Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
      Philippians 4:7 And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.
      Thought 3 (October 2, 2019)
      Is the psalmist pleading God to force God’s statutes to become the man’s ways? No, he is speaking of his own failure in keeping God’s statutes and his desire to keep them, very much like Paul in Romans 7:14-25.
      God doesn’t work through force to turn men from their ways that they would desire His statutes or desire God Himself. Men must reject (repent) put aside his own ways and voluntarily seek God and His statutes.

After the Tribulation

Rate this topic


Matthew24
 Share

Recommended Posts

  • Members

Those interested in Bible prophecy must see this. It exposes the pretrib rapture for the fraud that it is. The bible is clear, the Day of the Lord is the 2nd coming/Rapture....and it all occurs after the tribulation (Matt 24:29). Pretribbers have no clear bible verses saying it happens before the tribulation. This lie has been made mainstream by the zionist funded commentary of CI Scoefield, which has also confused christians on who is the seed of Abraham. You will learn that wrath and tribulation are 2 different things. Christians aren't appointed to wrath, but throughout the bible we are appointed to tribulation. Open your mind, take off the blinding pretrib glasses and feel a renewed faith in the bible as you begin to understand the book of revelation. You will learn that it is in chronological order. Ch. 1-11 and Ch. 12-22. Throughout the bible the events always go tribulation, Rapture, Wrath.

book_of_revelation_chart.jpg

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Moderators

Okay, let's try this ONE LAST TIME.

You want to fellowship, discuss, etc? Start in the intro area and give your testimony of salvation.

I think there is probably a discussion on this that's not locked (if you want to comment on it [after reading it] and can't find it, ask and someone can probably find it for you).

You want to come right out of the blocks with "setting everyone straight", your stay is extremely limited in time. Got it?

 

Is this in retaliation to a pre-wrath position? Nope, it will be the consequences of your approach and attitude if you persist. BTW, FWIW -- one of our mods is pre-wrath (be sure to mention that if you get banned and decide to tirade elsewhere about your treatment here.)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

1 Thessalonians 5:9 (KJV)
For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

I take comfort in the fact that, as a saved and sealed Believer in Jesus Christ, I will not be here when God's wrath is poured out on mankind.  Yes, Jesus does say we will have tribulation in the Gospel of John, chapter sixteen.  However, He clearly identifies that tribulation to be coming from the world,... not from God.

When God's wrath is poured out on this Earth, we are told that there will be no place to hide.  Both bond and free will cry out for the mountains to hide them from God's wrath, yet they shall not escape.  This means that everyone will experience God's wrath, no exceptions.  Yet, once again, I take comfort in the fact that, as a saved and sealed Believer in Jesus Christ, I will not be here when God's wrath will be poured out on mankind.

 

He has assured me of this in His Word.  I rest in Him.  He is faithful who promised.  I may see tribulation in this world, but I will not see this world as it goes through God's wrath.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

1 Thessalonians 5:9 (KJV)
For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

I take comfort in the fact that, as a saved and sealed Believer in Jesus Christ, I will not be here when God's wrath is poured out on mankind.  Yes, Jesus does say we will have tribulation in the Gospel of John, chapter sixteen.  However, He clearly identifies that tribulation to be coming from the world,... not from God.

When God's wrath is poured out on this Earth, we are told that there will be no place to hide.  Both bond and free will cry out for the mountains to hide them from God's wrath, yet they shall not escape.  This means that everyone will experience God's wrath, no exceptions.  Yet, once again, I take comfort in the fact that, as a saved and sealed Believer in Jesus Christ, I will not be here when God's wrath will be poured out on mankind.

 

He has assured me of this in His Word.  I rest in Him.  He is faithful who promised.  I may see tribulation in this world, but I will not see this world as it goes through God's wrath.

Since the OP separates, or differentiates tribulation from wrath, does this reply really address their premise?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

The entire 7 year period of tribulation (aka Daniel's 70th week--Dainiel 9:24-27 and Time of Jacob's Trouble) is GOD'S WRATH.  Who is opening the seal judgments in Revelation 6---man or God? 

Revelation 6:1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see.

The last two verses of Revelation 6 define the very beginning of this period as GOD'S  (the Lamb's) WRATH.

 Revelation 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
Revelation 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

The trials and tribulations Christians go through IN THIS WORLD are not the same as God's wrath during the Time of Jacob's Trouble.  This period of 7 years (Daniel's 70th Week) does not include the Church. 

Hebrews 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

John 16:33 These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Since God's wrath will be poured out during the seven year tribulation period, (the greater wrath during the last half) I believe it does address it.

It is clear that the OP has a post-trib, post-wrath view.

I understand your point, but given he's saying Christians will go through tribulation but not wrath, your response didn't cover that.

Some contend (I don't know if this person does or not) that Christian will go through the tribulation but be spared the effects of God's wrath as Israel was when God poured His wrath out upon Egypt. Some also point to the similarities between the plagues against Egypt and some of those mentioned in Revelation.

I'm not arguing the merit of your post, only whether it clearly addresses the OP's specific premise.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

The OP stand is that of pre wrath it appears from his little chart. The chart shows a 3.5 year Rapture.

Sadly all the research and eloquence in the world won't erase the simple facts of Matthew 24 and repeated in Luke:

    36, But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
    37, But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
    38, For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
    39, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
    40, Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
    41, Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
    42, Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
    43, But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.
    44, Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

All saved will know when the Great Tribulation begins and would certainly know the Seals so any thoughts of a rapture mid or post is just not "how can I say kindly" intelligent.

I don't care what big shot wrote what book. The big shots should be serving God in their local church. It just may be them who are supposed to lead the last few to the Lord before any of this will occur anyway and what are they doing? This?

Edited by wretched
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

There have been some in the past, and are some today who speculate if this or that going on is a part of God's wrath. They question which one from Revelation such might be.

Some effected by the New Madrid earthquakes in 1811-1812 thought the wrath of God was being poured out. Similar speculation from some during the "year without summer" in 1816. Those impacted greatly by the American Civil War, WWI, Great Depression, WWII.

During these and countless other times there have been those declaring the rapture has to happen very soon now, or this has to be the wrath of God being poured out.

Too much speculation in this area, too little actual living for Christ.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Those interested in Bible prophecy must see this. It exposes the pretrib rapture for the fraud that it is. The bible is clear, the Day of the Lord is the 2nd coming/Rapture....and it all occurs after the tribulation (Matt 24:29). Pretribbers have no clear bible verses saying it happens before the tribulation. This lie has been made mainstream by the zionist funded commentary of CI Scoefield, which has also confused christians on who is the seed of Abraham.

Could you please elaborate on  why you said that the C.I. Scofield was a Zionist Funded Commentary. Please give specific reasons and references.

Alan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

"The heart of him that hath understanding seeketh knowledge: but the mouth of fools feedeth on foolishness." Proverbs 15:14

Your statement concerning C.I. Scofield and a Zionist funded commentary was vague, ambiguous and tended to make the casual reader think you are anti-Semitic.

In order to have full understanding, and seek knowledge in your posting we need more information concerning your posting. Could you please answer my above post, and the following two questions, with clear, precise and referenced answers. These three questions are important to understand your posting and reasoning.

1. Are you referring to the C. I. Scofield Reference Bible as a Zionist funded commentary?

2. Is anything financed by a Jew, or a Zionist organization, inherently bad? or evil? or unscriptual?

3. Please define, "Zionist."

Please give appropriate scriptual answers and specific, clear answers with references that can be checked and verified.

Alan

Edited by Alan
sentence clarification
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Brethren,

I just finished watching the movie that Matthew 24 posted. The one hour and 53 miniutes of the movie was actully one hour and 53 minutes listening to  the hereitic Steven Anderson lambasting those who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture.

The movie is not a movie; it is a series of sermons and  lectures by Pastor Steven anderson and his co-host Pastor Roger Jimenez. On occasion they have brother Kent Hovind. What respect that I had for Kent Hovind is totally gone. I feel sorry for kent. 

Also I listened to the anti-Semitic rant of Pastor Anderson on another audio clip that is on his website. Pastor Anderson is anti-semitic to the core.

The lecture / movie is a series of twisted logic and interpretation  derived from Matthew 24 and Revelation. Andersons interpretation of 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 and  2 Thessalonians chapter 2 is also pathetic and a waste of time.

During the entire video he completely ignores all of the Old Testament references to the time of, "Jacoob's Trouble," or, "The 7 year Tribulation period," and totally ignores the promises of God pertaining to the Jews in the time of, "Jacob's trouble." Also, it is very obvious that Pastor Anderson belives in, "Replacement theology," and that the nation of Israel in not, I repeat, not the "elect," nor or ever will be.

Although Anderson slanders Darby and Scofield he praises Luther and Calvin. "Birds of a feather flock together."

His hatred, yes hatred, of the pre-tribulation rapture is evident throughout the entire video.

Besides making snide remarks, slandering, and belittling those who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture here are a few cholce words that he gave to those brethren who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture:

1. Anderson says the pre-tribulation rapture is a False Doctrine.

2. Based on Tradtion (Darby and Scofield). Not on the Bible.

3. The pre-tribulation rapture is, and I quote Andersons own words, "A fairy tale."

4. Anderson plainly says that those who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture, "Do not believe the Bible."

5. Anderson plainly says that those who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture, "Have no heart for God."

6. Anderson plainly says that those who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture, "Are brainwashed."

Also, Anderson plainly states that those mistaken brethren who believe in the pre-tribulation rapture are comparable to the Muslims, Buddhists, the Dali lama, and the Jews. In fact, Anderson says that those who believe in the pre-tribulation rapture will receive the anti-christ as Jesus coming again.

In my estimation Pastor Anderson is anti-Semitic, cannot rightly divide the scriptures, a false teacher, and is causing harm to the independent Baptist fundamental movement.

Alan

 

 

:goodpost:  Amen Bro. Alan!   The sequel to this documentary, Marching To Zion, is more of the same anti-semitic rhetoric as After The Tribulation.  It would be a waste of time to watch it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Already knowing of Anderson I didn't bother to watch the video but I do appreciate Alan taking the time to do so and give his review. Even where he's right he's often wrong in his approach and manner as well as style and presentation. He tends to attract those who want to think of themselves as being on a higher level of Christianity than others, possessing special understanding and a call to be crude and brash.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

matthew24,

I would still like for you to answer the questions about Scofield. In the video it openly called C.I. Scofield and apsotate. Do you think that C.I. Scofield was an apostate? If so, why?

John81,

I will try and be better in my approach and presentation.

Alan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I may be wrong Alan, but if I were you I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for and answer.

Jim,

Wouldn't surprise me a bit if I never received a clear response; or even a response. Sad though. It really pains my heart what is happening in the fundamentalist movement.

All of the great men of God, Holy Spirit filled, great soul-winners, that left the modernistic churches in the early part of the 1920's-1950's and were mightily used of God, almost to the man, were pre-tribulation rapture. Now, Pastor Anderson, and his followers, besides calling Scofield apostate, are calling men who  believed the pre-tribulation rapture: men like J. Frank Norris, Oliver B. Greene, G. B. Vick,  Pastor Dowell, Pastor Robertson, Lehman Strauss, and other mighly men of God, apostates and the other slanderous names that I heard on Pastor Andersons lecture video.

 

 

 

 

Edited by Alan
addition
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Wow,

I feel the love. lol. I feel like Daniel in the lions den. I listen to Anderson quite a bit and I feel like for the most part people hear bits of his sermons and are quick to paint him as anti-Semitic, hateful, and like to compare him to Fred Phelps. He doesn't think pretrib is even close to the most important doctrine. Scofield invented dispensations, he believes people in the old testament were saved by their works. What is an everlasting gospel?       Those who seek truth will find it. http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Wolves/scofield.htm

This is just one....I just googled it and there it is. Google doesn't lie, lol. The man that runs this website is even a pretrib guy who hates Anderson, but I agree with most things he has on it. I'm not going to address the disagreements with eschatology other than Matthew 24:29, mark 13:24....both say AFTER. Is this only to Jews? Mark 13:37 WHAT I SAY UNTO I SAY UNTO ALL, WATCH. I enjoyed a sermon by Sam Adams on Scofield. The hardest part to stop believing in the pretrib was just how many ppl believe in it, but once you come out of the closet (lol) you find out there is many more than you once thought.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Brethren,

I just finished watching the movie that Matthew 24 posted. The one hour and 53 miniutes of the movie was actually one hour and 53 minutes listening to the hereitic Steven Anderson lambasting those who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture.

The movie is not a movie; it is a series of sermons and  lectures by Pastor Steven Anderson and his co-host Pastor Roger Jimenez. On occasion, they have Brother Kent Hovind. What respect that I had for Kent Hovind is totally gone. I feel sorry for Kent. 

Also I listened to the anti-Semitic rant of Pastor Anderson on another audio clip that is on his website. Pastor Anderson is anti-semitic to the core.

The lecture / movie is a series of twisted logic and interpretation derived from Matthew 24 and Revelation. Andersons interpretation of 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 and 2 Thessalonians chapter 2 is also pathetic and a waste of time.

During the entire video he completely ignores all of the Old Testament references to the time of, "Jacob's Trouble," or, "The 7 year Tribulation period," and totally ignores the promises of God pertaining to the Jews in the time of, "Jacob's trouble." Also, it is very obvious that Pastor Anderson believes in, "Replacement theology," and that the nation of Israel in not, I repeat, not the "elect," nor or ever will be.

Although Anderson slanders Darby and Scofield, he praises Luther and Calvin. "Birds of a feather flock together."

His hatred, yes hatred, of the pre-tribulation rapture is evident throughout the entire video.

Besides making snide remarks, slandering, and belittling those who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture here are a few choice words that he gave to those brethren who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture:

1. Anderson says the pre-tribulation rapture is a False Doctrine.

2. Based on Tradition (Darby and Scofield). Not on the Bible.

3. The pre-tribulation rapture is, and I quote Andersons own words "A fairy tale."

4. Anderson plainly says that those who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture "Do not believe the Bible."

5. Anderson plainly says that those who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture "Have no heart for God."

6. Anderson plainly says that those who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture "Are brainwashed."

Also, Anderson plainly states that those mistaken brethren who believe in the pre-tribulation rapture are comparable to the Muslims, Buddhists, the Dali lama, and the Jews. In fact, Anderson says that those who believe in the pre-tribulation rapture will receive the anti-Christ as Jesus coming again.

In my estimation Pastor Anderson is anti-Semitic, cannot rightly divide the scriptures, a false teacher, and is causing harm to the independent Baptist fundamental movement.

Alan

 

 

Pretrib Believers are looking for Jesus. BTW, same as Islam and Jews....why wouldn't they take the mark? I don't believe the elect will, but the many unsaved "Christians" who blindly follow Hollywood will *BTW I have heard Anderson say that the elect will not be deceived...so obviously, he is contradicting himself, or you misunderstood.  I am looking for the antichrist first and the falling away. Why is it bad that Anderson hates Pretrib? lol. The elect are the saved. The thought of blessing a nation, that to become a citizen, one must denounce Jesus, is simply unbelievable. You think I am misguided(crazy) because I don't believe we should bless a nation who teaches Jesus was the son of a roman soldier named Pantera. Anderson believes all people are the same and wants to see all Jews saved. I wouldn't call anyone a false teacher who is 100% right on the gospel.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Who's Online   1 Member, 0 Anonymous, 40 Guests (See full list)

×
×
  • Create New...