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"Forced to Watch"


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The subject of being "forced to watch" was brought up in another thread and it reminded me of the time I heard our former pastor teaching on that. He said something to that effect, also, that God would bring us out to some overlook and make us watch the carcasses of those down in Hell. But I don't know of such a scripture unless someone can point me to it. I do know of the following passage but it says nothing about God "forcing" us to do anything". it simply says "they shall go forth" .......

Isaiah 66

22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.

23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

 

 

Edited by heartstrings
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Oh I bet there will be many "surprises" for my sorry rump up in Glory. I think I will answer for much wasted time after salvation and I think I will be very rudely enlightened about all I knew I should be doing down here and couldn't let go of the world enough to do it.

Ever felt regret over a decision, action or inaction you have done (or not done). I try to imagine the regret I will feel once there., I think I will finally understand what that word really means.

I bowlegged the word surprises above because I won't truly be surprised at my Judgement. Shocked and dissappointed at myself - ABSOLUTELY but I know what I should have been doing all along anyway, the Scripture and Spirit tells me constantly.

There will be a 1000 years of complete and vivid memory for all of us with many reminders IMO. Living with regret for 10, 20, 50 years is bad enough...try to imagine 1000. IMO there will be hierarchy during this time (maybe forever), those whose physical life for Christ faithfully mattered as best they could and then the vast majority of us who quenched the Spirit to grievance accepting our fleshly excuses as truth.

Once again, Scripture taken as a whole and some thought put into it consistent with Scripture as a whole. No particular verse.

If you don't get it, study and pray harder; If you "won't" get it, shame on you; if you do get it, you have from today forward to change it.

 

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The Great White Throne Judgement does occur after the millennial reign and God indicates the wiping away of all tears after the Great White Throne in Rev 21 also. It makes sense to me that we would have full memory throughout.

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So we will have glorified bodies for a thousand years that are tainted with the effects of sin?

I don't understand, How would the taints of sin in your old physical body have anything to do with your soul being intact, IE, your mind, emotions and personality? You will still be you yet without sin. I have never seen anything that hints at memories being erased prior to the Great White Throne. I think we will be fully aware of self and our past, family, friends, acquaintances.

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I don't understand, How would the taints of sin in your old physical body have anything to do with your soul being intact, IE, your mind, emotions and personality? You will still be you yet without sin. I have never seen anything that hints at memories being erased prior to the Great White Throne. I think we will be fully aware of self and our past, family, friends, acquaintances.

There is a difference between having memories and being haunted, tortured by or feeling pain (however one wishes to term it) by memories of past sins.

While in our current state here on earth it can be difficult at times to accept the reality that once our sins are forgiven there is no longer any guilt, no condemnation. However, once glorified the fullness of our forgiveness and the cleansing of our sins will be clear so we won't feel guilt or regret. Those are the sort of things which will haunt and torture those in hell as they continually recall the many opportunities they had to come to Christ, as they recognize their true sinfulness, as they regret mocking the one who shared the Gospel with them, as they feel the full weight of their own sin and understand their condemnation to hell.

At the time of judgment by fire upon our works there may be room for sorrow or joy but this for a moment only. The one who is to spend eternity with Christ having been born again but producing no good works will live in that eternity loved of God just as the one(s) who have the most good works which survive the fire. There is no indication of second class or third class citizens in heaven.

There is also no indication we will spend a thousand years in our glorified bodies regretting our bad decisions. Such a condition could be much worse than that which we deal with in this fallen world in our corrupt bodies.

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There is a difference between having memories and being haunted, tortured by or feeling pain (however one wishes to term it) by memories of past sins.

While in our current state here on earth it can be difficult at times to accept the reality that once our sins are forgiven there is no longer any guilt, no condemnation. However, once glorified the fullness of our forgiveness and the cleansing of our sins will be clear so we won't feel guilt or regret. Those are the sort of things which will haunt and torture those in hell as they continually recall the many opportunities they had to come to Christ, as they recognize their true sinfulness, as they regret mocking the one who shared the Gospel with them, as they feel the full weight of their own sin and understand their condemnation to hell.

At the time of judgment by fire upon our works there may be room for sorrow or joy but this for a moment only. The one who is to spend eternity with Christ having been born again but producing no good works will live in that eternity loved of God just as the one(s) who have the most good works which survive the fire. There is no indication of second class or third class citizens in heaven.

There is also no indication we will spend a thousand years in our glorified bodies regretting our bad decisions. Such a condition could be much worse than that which we deal with in this fallen world in our corrupt bodies.

It appears that your timeline is off John. The event you reference of no more crying, sorrow, etc. is what I am talking about and it clearly occurs in Rev 21:4 which is after the Great White Throne and (once again) after the 1000 year earthly reign. There is no logical explanation for the tears, crying and sorrow to be wiped away at this point in the future if it occurs immediately upon a Christian's death or the Rapture. And where do you get this anyway? Sure the Bible does teach that at some point in the future we are wiped clean and have glorified bodies but nowhere does it state exactly at what point this occurs.

I think it is a grave error to believe that we will suffer no shame once the Judgement Seat is finished. I believe the exact opposite. Bible clearly says we will be judged for both good and bad done in the body after salvation and goes on to clearly record the timeline for future events through the 1000 years, the Great White Throne and the New Jerursalem and ONLY THEN will the tears be wiped away, the crying, sorrow and pain no more. Not one second sooner.

Are we condemned for sin, absolutely not. Are we judged for our actions and inactions in the body after salvation - Absolutely. Part of our judgement will be the sorrow we will endure for over 1000 years IMO. If God chastises and even kills Christians who ignore Him on earth, it is consistent to believe we will not be happy go lucky campers initially in Heaven.

Your line of thought is dangerously the same as the easy believism types (rock and roll rick warren) half Gospel types. They think salvation is a one time agreement and then you go on about your fleshly pursuits without consequence. I don't think you actually believe that but your line of thinking here marries with it.

Any line of thought that takes away the Fear of the Lord is of Satan (especially in regards to believers).

I think even the Godliest of beleivers will crumble in shame before Him, prostate and unable to even lift their eyes. This will be the first time we will really feel regret, when we realize for the first time what He actually did for us and how we repaid Him by spitting in His face at every turn down here.

 

 

 
 
 
 
 
Edited by wretched
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You have yet to put forth any biblical evidence that once glorified we will carry around guilt, regret, shame, and the like.

I stated it as opinion with an understanding of Scripture as a whole. No one verse but many overall that point to it.

Happy go lucky, mind-erased bliss is indicated absolutely no where in Scripture. That way of thinking motivates one to do nothing for the Lord and certainly never to lose your life, pick up your cross and follow Jesus.

Do you really think you will be mindless? Everything that made up your soul will be erased? Yes a new body but never a new soul, what are you thinking with this??

This even smacks of calvin worship but in a different way. So we have no mind or free will in Heaven but we do here on earth or both? The Bible teaches NEITHER.

 

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I stated it as opinion with an understanding of Scripture as a whole. No one verse but many overall that point to it.

Happy go lucky, mind-erased bliss is indicated absolutely no where in Scripture. That way of thinking motivates one to do nothing for the Lord and certainly never to lose your life, pick up your cross and follow Jesus.

Do you really think you will be mindless? Everything that made up your soul will be erased? Yes a new body but never a new soul, what are you thinking with this??

This even smacks of calvin worship but in a different way. So we have no mind or free will in Heaven but we do here on earth or both? The Bible teaches NEITHER.

 

I can accept this is your opinion. Nothing wrong with that.

You do seem to have calvin on the mind for some reason as I see you bring that up in almost every thread lately.

I've not said anything about being mindlessness, but once we have been glorified it wouldn't seem to be near as wonderful if we are then so understanding of the holiness of God, yet not so understanding of our totally forgiven condition and the fact our sins are totally washed away, that we suffer guilt, regret, grief over our sinful lives on earth.

We will know fully of this matter one day. Until then...

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